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My Debate With Bsh1...

xXCryptoXx
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6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!
Nolite Timere
Subutai
Posts: 3,172
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6/5/2014 10:52:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Actually, Bobert can vote on your debate. His ELO is over 3000.
I'm becoming less defined as days go by, fading away, and well you might say, I'm losing focus, kinda drifting into the abstract in terms of how I see myself.
xXCryptoXx
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6/5/2014 10:53:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2014 10:52:14 PM, Subutai wrote:
Actually, Bobert can vote on your debate. His ELO is over 3000.

Oh that's fortunate
Nolite Timere
YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 7:48:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!

How many people did you ask not to vote via PM?
Tsar of DDO
xXCryptoXx
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6/6/2014 11:44:24 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 7:48:53 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!

How many people did you ask not to vote via PM?

Nobody. I posted that the voting period was up here so that voting would be clearly open to all public members of 3000+ ELO.
Nolite Timere
YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 11:46:12 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 11:44:24 AM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 6/6/2014 7:48:53 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!

How many people did you ask not to vote via PM?

Nobody. I posted that the voting period was up here so that voting would be clearly open to all public members of 3000+ ELO.

I think we both know that's nonsense, lol
Tsar of DDO
xXCryptoXx
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6/6/2014 11:48:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 11:46:12 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:44:24 AM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 6/6/2014 7:48:53 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!

How many people did you ask not to vote via PM?

Nobody. I posted that the voting period was up here so that voting would be clearly open to all public members of 3000+ ELO.

I think we both know that's nonsense, lol

It's not. The only person I personally pm'd about the debate was you.
Nolite Timere
YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 11:54:57 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 11:48:16 AM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:46:12 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:44:24 AM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 6/6/2014 7:48:53 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!

How many people did you ask not to vote via PM?

Nobody. I posted that the voting period was up here so that voting would be clearly open to all public members of 3000+ ELO.

I think we both know that's nonsense, lol

It's not. The only person I personally pm'd about the debate was you.

So the answer to that question is one person, not nobody.
Tsar of DDO
Zaradi
Posts: 14,124
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6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?
Want to debate? Pick a topic and hit me up! - http://www.debate.org...
TN05
Posts: 4,492
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6/6/2014 12:00:12 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

YYW better be objective, I have to face bsh in DDO Tier tournament and he 's a voter. :P
xXCryptoXx
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6/6/2014 12:01:43 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 11:54:57 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:48:16 AM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:46:12 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:44:24 AM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 6/6/2014 7:48:53 AM, YYW wrote:
At 6/5/2014 10:21:18 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
Is now in the voting period!

The Conjugal View of Marriage is Philosophically Valid

http://www.debate.org...

Voting is open only to members with 3000+ ELO (Sorry Bobert)

The reason I am posting it here instead of the Unvoted Debate forum is because i would like plenty of votes on the debate, and not have the debate be decided by 1-3 votes.

Thank you in advance to anyone who voters! Remember to try to remain unbiased and right a solid RFD!

How many people did you ask not to vote via PM?

Nobody. I posted that the voting period was up here so that voting would be clearly open to all public members of 3000+ ELO.

I think we both know that's nonsense, lol

It's not. The only person I personally pm'd about the debate was you.

So the answer to that question is one person, not nobody.

Oh whoops, I thought you asked how many people I asked to vote. You're the only person I asked not to vote.
Nolite Timere
YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 12:08:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Of course his concern is understandable. I am involved with Bsh1. I like him a lot. I am also gay. This is a debate about gay marriage. That's two strikes... if anyone's counting.

When I taught college students, this was an issue that came up with some regularity. I am very, very liberal. The stuff I taught was of a distinctly political character. When essays would come back and students who had a conservative perspective complained that I slighted them because I was biased, the first time it bothered me. The second time, it bothered me. Then, I went and spoke to my advisor about it -who, btw. was a libertarian. He read the essays, and graded them more harshly than I did.

The thing that students don't account for is the extent to which their perception of the quality of what they write diverges from how good it actually is because of self serving cognitive biases. I've been talking to Crypto about this via PM. It's hard to overcome, because to overcome it requires looking at what someone said as a third party -which is really hard to do if you're the person who wrote something.

One takeaway from this is that people tend to overestimate how good they write/debate/do anything, if they think they're good at the thing that they're doing. Another take away from this is that just because someone disagrees with you, doesn't mean that they're biased against you.

Now, there have been some really egregious cases of bias against debaters on this site. Most of them stem from personal animosity. But I like Crypto, as a person, even if he doesn't like me. lol... I think that I liked his profile picture (the lion) when he was Intrepid more than the weird red color of his picture now, but that's it.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

That depends on what "being safe" means. If it means that we're going to send out PM's requesting people not to vote, than no. Being safe means that a lot of people can weigh in on something, and see how it's going to go from there.
Tsar of DDO
YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 12:09:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 12:00:12 PM, TN05 wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

YYW better be objective, I have to face bsh in DDO Tier tournament and he 's a voter. :P

I am objective, and you're a good debater. Bsh1 is also a good debater. I cannot say who will win, though, without reading the debate that you two will have.
Tsar of DDO
Zaradi
Posts: 14,124
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6/6/2014 12:16:53 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 12:08:13 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Of course his concern is understandable. I am involved with Bsh1. I like him a lot. I am also gay. This is a debate about gay marriage. That's two strikes... if anyone's counting.

When I taught college students, this was an issue that came up with some regularity. I am very, very liberal. The stuff I taught was of a distinctly political character. When essays would come back and students who had a conservative perspective complained that I slighted them because I was biased, the first time it bothered me. The second time, it bothered me. Then, I went and spoke to my advisor about it -who, btw. was a libertarian. He read the essays, and graded them more harshly than I did.

The thing that students don't account for is the extent to which their perception of the quality of what they write diverges from how good it actually is because of self serving cognitive biases. I've been talking to Crypto about this via PM. It's hard to overcome, because to overcome it requires looking at what someone said as a third party -which is really hard to do if you're the person who wrote something.

One takeaway from this is that people tend to overestimate how good they write/debate/do anything, if they think they're good at the thing that they're doing. Another take away from this is that just because someone disagrees with you, doesn't mean that they're biased against you.

Now, there have been some really egregious cases of bias against debaters on this site. Most of them stem from personal animosity. But I like Crypto, as a person, even if he doesn't like me. lol... I think that I liked his profile picture (the lion) when he was Intrepid more than the weird red color of his picture now, but that's it.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

That depends on what "being safe" means. If it means that we're going to send out PM's requesting people not to vote, than no. Being safe means that a lot of people can weigh in on something, and see how it's going to go from there.

If we had a reputation of debates getting lots and lots of votes I'd agree with you. But since we don't, the best possible way to avoid a potential scandal is to prevent it from being a possibility in the first place.
Want to debate? Pick a topic and hit me up! - http://www.debate.org...
TN05
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6/6/2014 12:17:56 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 12:09:13 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 12:00:12 PM, TN05 wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

YYW better be objective, I have to face bsh in DDO Tier tournament and he 's a voter. :P

I am objective, and you're a good debater. Bsh1 is also a good debater. I cannot say who will win, though, without reading the debate that you two will have.

I appreciate that. :)
YYW
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6/6/2014 12:28:57 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 12:16:53 PM, Zaradi wrote:
At 6/6/2014 12:08:13 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Of course his concern is understandable. I am involved with Bsh1. I like him a lot. I am also gay. This is a debate about gay marriage. That's two strikes... if anyone's counting.

When I taught college students, this was an issue that came up with some regularity. I am very, very liberal. The stuff I taught was of a distinctly political character. When essays would come back and students who had a conservative perspective complained that I slighted them because I was biased, the first time it bothered me. The second time, it bothered me. Then, I went and spoke to my advisor about it -who, btw. was a libertarian. He read the essays, and graded them more harshly than I did.

The thing that students don't account for is the extent to which their perception of the quality of what they write diverges from how good it actually is because of self serving cognitive biases. I've been talking to Crypto about this via PM. It's hard to overcome, because to overcome it requires looking at what someone said as a third party -which is really hard to do if you're the person who wrote something.

One takeaway from this is that people tend to overestimate how good they write/debate/do anything, if they think they're good at the thing that they're doing. Another take away from this is that just because someone disagrees with you, doesn't mean that they're biased against you.

Now, there have been some really egregious cases of bias against debaters on this site. Most of them stem from personal animosity. But I like Crypto, as a person, even if he doesn't like me. lol... I think that I liked his profile picture (the lion) when he was Intrepid more than the weird red color of his picture now, but that's it.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

That depends on what "being safe" means. If it means that we're going to send out PM's requesting people not to vote, than no. Being safe means that a lot of people can weigh in on something, and see how it's going to go from there.

If we had a reputation of debates getting lots and lots of votes I'd agree with you. But since we don't, the best possible way to avoid a potential scandal is to prevent it from being a possibility in the first place.

If we were talking about any old debate, I'd agree with you. But this one's kind of significant: it's been advertised in Crypto's signature and it's got a thread devoted to it on the main forum. Therefore, it's more likely to get more votes than an average debate, which is rather at odds with your point. Moreover, if there was a controversy surrounding it, wouldn't that increase the probability that the debate would get votes? That's what happened with WriterDave and Contradiction's debate. You've got to think this through...

But again, I'd encourage you to vote on it (even though I already think I know how you would vote), and anyone else who wants to, to do so. There are some people who, no matter what, are going to going to cast votes arbitrarily (either because they are incapable of voting in favor of a position with which they disagree or because their RFD's have no basis in what actually happened in the debate -but because of some whimsical inclination/assumption outside the scope of the debate) and there are people who are going to actually take the time to read the debate and vote on it prudently.

We'll let the other judges decide. And I predict there will be more of them, since this has become something of a minor controversy. Controversy, btw. is good, in that sense and shouldn't necessarily be avoided.
Tsar of DDO
Zaradi
Posts: 14,124
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6/6/2014 3:27:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 12:28:57 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 12:16:53 PM, Zaradi wrote:
At 6/6/2014 12:08:13 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 11:58:26 AM, Zaradi wrote:
To be fair YYW, his concern is understandable. As much as I trust your objectivity, you do have a history of voting for Bsh. Whether he really won them or not is unknown, I didn't read the debates, but given you two's involvement you have to realize what it looks like.

Of course his concern is understandable. I am involved with Bsh1. I like him a lot. I am also gay. This is a debate about gay marriage. That's two strikes... if anyone's counting.

When I taught college students, this was an issue that came up with some regularity. I am very, very liberal. The stuff I taught was of a distinctly political character. When essays would come back and students who had a conservative perspective complained that I slighted them because I was biased, the first time it bothered me. The second time, it bothered me. Then, I went and spoke to my advisor about it -who, btw. was a libertarian. He read the essays, and graded them more harshly than I did.

The thing that students don't account for is the extent to which their perception of the quality of what they write diverges from how good it actually is because of self serving cognitive biases. I've been talking to Crypto about this via PM. It's hard to overcome, because to overcome it requires looking at what someone said as a third party -which is really hard to do if you're the person who wrote something.

One takeaway from this is that people tend to overestimate how good they write/debate/do anything, if they think they're good at the thing that they're doing. Another take away from this is that just because someone disagrees with you, doesn't mean that they're biased against you.

Now, there have been some really egregious cases of bias against debaters on this site. Most of them stem from personal animosity. But I like Crypto, as a person, even if he doesn't like me. lol... I think that I liked his profile picture (the lion) when he was Intrepid more than the weird red color of his picture now, but that's it.

Not that I'm accusing you of anything. Like I said, I trust your objectivity. But better to be safe right?

That depends on what "being safe" means. If it means that we're going to send out PM's requesting people not to vote, than no. Being safe means that a lot of people can weigh in on something, and see how it's going to go from there.

If we had a reputation of debates getting lots and lots of votes I'd agree with you. But since we don't, the best possible way to avoid a potential scandal is to

But again, I'd encourage you to vote on it

I only have internet access when I'm at my friend's house right now and the last thing I want to do at my friend's house is judge a debate. If I were to do a judging it would have to be on my phone and f*ck that.

(even though I already think I know how you would vote),

Oh?
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YYW
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6/6/2014 3:36:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 3:27:45 PM, Zaradi wrote:
(even though I already think I know how you would vote),

Oh?

And now, knowing that I know how you're going to vote, are you going to vote the opposite of what you thought I thought you would do to prove me wrong? (I knew you would ;)

lol
Tsar of DDO
Zaradi
Posts: 14,124
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6/6/2014 3:39:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 3:36:02 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:27:45 PM, Zaradi wrote:
(even though I already think I know how you would vote),

Oh?

And now, knowing that I know how you're going to vote, are you going to vote the opposite of what you thought I thought you would do to prove me wrong? (I knew you would ;)

lol

#mindblown
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YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 3:41:19 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 3:39:04 PM, Zaradi wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:36:02 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:27:45 PM, Zaradi wrote:
(even though I already think I know how you would vote),

Oh?

And now, knowing that I know how you're going to vote, are you going to vote the opposite of what you thought I thought you would do to prove me wrong? (I knew you would ;)

lol

#mindblown

lol

But silliness and mind games aside, there is no reason why I shouldn't have voted on that debate. There is an ethic to voting; it requires that we all check our prejudices at the door, and judge the debate based on all and only that which transpired in the debate. That's what I did. There really isn't much more to say.
Tsar of DDO
Zaradi
Posts: 14,124
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6/6/2014 5:07:40 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 3:41:19 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:39:04 PM, Zaradi wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:36:02 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:27:45 PM, Zaradi wrote:
(even though I already think I know how you would vote),

Oh?

And now, knowing that I know how you're going to vote, are you going to vote the opposite of what you thought I thought you would do to prove me wrong? (I knew you would ;)

lol

#mindblown

lol

But silliness and mind games aside, there is no reason why I shouldn't have voted on that debate. There is an ethic to voting; it requires that we all check our prejudices at the door, and judge the debate based on all and only that which transpired in the debate. That's what I did. There really isn't much more to say.

Well I wouldn't know because I didn't even open the link to the debate, so I guess I just kinda have to say "okay" to everything and leave it at that.
Want to debate? Pick a topic and hit me up! - http://www.debate.org...
YYW
Posts: 36,252
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6/6/2014 6:05:42 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/6/2014 5:07:40 PM, Zaradi wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:41:19 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:39:04 PM, Zaradi wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:36:02 PM, YYW wrote:
At 6/6/2014 3:27:45 PM, Zaradi wrote:
(even though I already think I know how you would vote),

Oh?

And now, knowing that I know how you're going to vote, are you going to vote the opposite of what you thought I thought you would do to prove me wrong? (I knew you would ;)

lol

#mindblown

lol

But silliness and mind games aside, there is no reason why I shouldn't have voted on that debate. There is an ethic to voting; it requires that we all check our prejudices at the door, and judge the debate based on all and only that which transpired in the debate. That's what I did. There really isn't much more to say.

Well I wouldn't know because I didn't even open the link to the debate, so I guess I just kinda have to say "okay" to everything and leave it at that.

lol
Tsar of DDO