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Thread ELO restrictions?

Ragnar
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9/14/2014 11:47:33 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
(yes I'm aware there is a suggestions thread, I'm gathering feedback on the idea to decide if it should be posted there)

So I had a religious question today, and I firmly expect forum trolls to crap all over it... Yet an idea popped into my head, what if when making a thread we could set an ELO minimum needed to reply?

Merits: Protection on intelligent discussion; Mikal could win a last post wins thread.
Flaws: Elitism; and some users dropping out of threads after losing debates.

What does everyone think?

---

A side idea would be allowing an ELO maximum to be set, yet I see a lot of potential for harm, as a reverse elitism could take hold, not allowing anyone who's dared to debate on this site to post. If anyone thinks it would actually be beneficial, by all means state why.
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dynamicduodebaters
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9/14/2014 11:51:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/14/2014 11:47:33 AM, Ragnar wrote:
(yes I'm aware there is a suggestions thread, I'm gathering feedback on the idea to decide if it should be posted there)

So I had a religious question today, and I firmly expect forum trolls to crap all over it... Yet an idea popped into my head, what if when making a thread we could set an ELO minimum needed to reply?

Merits: Protection on intelligent discussion; Mikal could win a last post wins thread.
Flaws: Elitism; and some users dropping out of threads after losing debates.

What does everyone think?

---

A side idea would be allowing an ELO maximum to be set, yet I see a lot of potential for harm, as a reverse elitism could take hold, not allowing anyone who's dared to debate on this site to post. If anyone thinks it would actually be beneficial, by all means state why.

I don't Like. It would seem that that would kinda exclusive and it is not true that because you have a higher elo you are more intelligent or whatever.
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ESocialBookworm
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9/14/2014 11:54:09 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
STALIN will then win those threads, not Mikal.
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YYW
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9/14/2014 12:29:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Thread ELO restrictions would keep a lot of bad members out.

They would also keep a lot of good members who don't have high ELO's out, like esocial, TheGreatAndPowerful (drafterman), Lannan, BossyBurrito, etc. out.
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bladerunner060
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9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/14/2014 11:47:33 AM, Ragnar wrote:
(yes I'm aware there is a suggestions thread, I'm gathering feedback on the idea to decide if it should be posted there)

So I had a religious question today, and I firmly expect forum trolls to crap all over it... Yet an idea popped into my head, what if when making a thread we could set an ELO minimum needed to reply?

Merits: Protection on intelligent discussion; Mikal could win a last post wins thread.
Flaws: Elitism; and some users dropping out of threads after losing debates.

What does everyone think?

---

A side idea would be allowing an ELO maximum to be set, yet I see a lot of potential for harm, as a reverse elitism could take hold, not allowing anyone who's dared to debate on this site to post. If anyone thinks it would actually be beneficial, by all means state why.

Forums aren't debates. I think the best case scenario would still see a lot more troll debates just to start messing with folks's Elo.

What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
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SamStevens
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9/14/2014 1:55:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/14/2014 12:29:23 PM, YYW wrote:
Thread ELO restrictions would keep a lot of bad members out.

They would also keep a lot of good members who don't have high ELO's out, like esocial, TheGreatAndPowerful (drafterman), Lannan, BossyBurrito, etc. out.

It would also exclude me from these discussions.

I do not like this idea.
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
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YYW
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9/14/2014 2:03:10 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/14/2014 1:55:35 PM, SamStevens wrote:
At 9/14/2014 12:29:23 PM, YYW wrote:
Thread ELO restrictions would keep a lot of bad members out.

They would also keep a lot of good members who don't have high ELO's out, like esocial, TheGreatAndPowerful (drafterman), Lannan, BossyBurrito, etc. out.

It would also exclude me from these discussions.

I do not like this idea.

Yeah, that's why Ragnar's idea is generally bad. He's definitely a unique member, both in the way he votes on debates and the way he thinks the forums ought to operate. He reads and votes on a lot of debates, but when he votes I don't think he understands the debates or that he reads closely enough.

He also tends to do things in voting that are in poor taste, like refuse to vote for the winner of a debate because he thinks the resolution was biased. That's not to say he's a bad person, but most of the ideas he proposes are neither practical nor good.
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phantom
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9/15/2014 11:03:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
It'd be simpler just to ban half the current population of the religion forum. If only...
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YYW
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9/15/2014 11:04:36 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/15/2014 11:03:48 PM, phantom wrote:
It'd be simpler just to ban half the current population of the religion forum. If only...

Now that is a good idea.
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bsh1
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9/15/2014 11:35:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
ELO =/= ability to contribute.

It would be a sad day when STALIN could post in a thread but not Bossy...
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Ragnar
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9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?
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Ragnar
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9/16/2014 1:35:55 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/14/2014 2:03:10 PM, YYW wrote:
[Ragnar] also tends to do things in voting that are in poor taste, like refuse to vote for the winner of a debate because he thinks the resolution was biased. That's not to say he's a bad person, but most of the ideas he proposes are neither practical nor good.
Your talent at making random off topic ad hominem attacks is impressive.
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AnDoctuir
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9/16/2014 1:37:22 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Nice idea that gets all caught up in your ego and wanting to show off your autismally accrued accolades and all, but in case you haven't noticed, this site is dead as f*ck, and so...uh, limit threads to no posts? Sounds good.
TheGreatAndPowerful
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9/16/2014 8:53:47 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/14/2014 11:47:33 AM, Ragnar wrote:
(yes I'm aware there is a suggestions thread, I'm gathering feedback on the idea to decide if it should be posted there)

So I had a religious question today, and I firmly expect forum trolls to crap all over it... Yet an idea popped into my head, what if when making a thread we could set an ELO minimum needed to reply?

Merits: Protection on intelligent discussion; Mikal could win a last post wins thread.
Flaws: Elitism; and some users dropping out of threads after losing debates.

What does everyone think?

---

A side idea would be allowing an ELO maximum to be set, yet I see a lot of potential for harm, as a reverse elitism could take hold, not allowing anyone who's dared to debate on this site to post. If anyone thinks it would actually be beneficial, by all means state why.

If you want to have a regulated conversation with members of a specific ELO, that's what the debates are for.

The entire point of a forum is that it is open for all.

Also, there is precisely no relationship between one or the other. People can excel in forum conversations but suck in debates and vice versa. You might as well say people can only post in forums if they've eaten a certain number of apples that day. No connection.
Jonbonbon
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9/16/2014 11:29:54 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM, Ragnar wrote:
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?

Well I think he's referring to something like the Reddit comment karma. Basically, when you make any comment, people can up vote or down vote it. Your comment karma is basically that if you get a bunch of good karma (up votes) then you're viewed positively by the community as a contributor to discussion, but if you get a bunch of bad karma (down votes) you're viewed negatively as a contributor. It's a sort of silent and also non silent peer pressure to not be an idiot when commenting.

The only problem with comment karma is that while it deters bad trolls (because after a certain amount of bad karma is reached your comment gets removed), it can also scare away members who are still learning and could later on be convinced to change views or something via intellectual discussion (which is especially true on this site). It also takes away incentive to say something useful after a certain comment except that lots of people just want to one up the last guy. It also minority deters people from saying things that may be unpopular because it would reflect negatively on them as a person even though they're just saying something that could be legitimate but most people disagree with.

There's positives and negatives to it, although on a site like DDO it's probably best not to do comment karma.
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TheGreatAndPowerful
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9/16/2014 11:49:47 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 11:29:54 AM, Jonbonbon wrote:
At 9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM, Ragnar wrote:
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?

Well I think he's referring to something like the Reddit comment karma. Basically, when you make any comment, people can up vote or down vote it. Your comment karma is basically that if you get a bunch of good karma (up votes) then you're viewed positively by the community as a contributor to discussion, but if you get a bunch of bad karma (down votes) you're viewed negatively as a contributor. It's a sort of silent and also non silent peer pressure to not be an idiot when commenting.

The only problem with comment karma is that while it deters bad trolls (because after a certain amount of bad karma is reached your comment gets removed), it can also scare away members who are still learning and could later on be convinced to change views or something via intellectual discussion (which is especially true on this site). It also takes away incentive to say something useful after a certain comment except that lots of people just want to one up the last guy. It also minority deters people from saying things that may be unpopular because it would reflect negatively on them as a person even though they're just saying something that could be legitimate but most people disagree with.

There's positives and negatives to it, although on a site like DDO it's probably best not to do comment karma.

There are some things to be clarified here. First, extremely negative karma does not result in comments being removed. Rather it results in comments being hidden, based on user preferences.

Second, karma is more than just an expression of who likes or dislikes what. Rather the fundamental principle of reddit is that karma affects what content is given preference over other content. DDO, content is purely time based. Threads with the most recent activity are at the top, comments on those threads are ordered in chronological order, with no comment threading.

Reddit combines time with karma in an algorithm that orders comment. Stuff that is popular is put at the top, yes, but also fades with time (regardless of activity). The same with comments, which have threading (each comment is basically its own threaded conversation).
Jonbonbon
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9/16/2014 11:55:47 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 11:49:47 AM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 11:29:54 AM, Jonbonbon wrote:
At 9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM, Ragnar wrote:
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?

Well I think he's referring to something like the Reddit comment karma. Basically, when you make any comment, people can up vote or down vote it. Your comment karma is basically that if you get a bunch of good karma (up votes) then you're viewed positively by the community as a contributor to discussion, but if you get a bunch of bad karma (down votes) you're viewed negatively as a contributor. It's a sort of silent and also non silent peer pressure to not be an idiot when commenting.

The only problem with comment karma is that while it deters bad trolls (because after a certain amount of bad karma is reached your comment gets removed), it can also scare away members who are still learning and could later on be convinced to change views or something via intellectual discussion (which is especially true on this site). It also takes away incentive to say something useful after a certain comment except that lots of people just want to one up the last guy. It also minority deters people from saying things that may be unpopular because it would reflect negatively on them as a person even though they're just saying something that could be legitimate but most people disagree with.

There's positives and negatives to it, although on a site like DDO it's probably best not to do comment karma.

There are some things to be clarified here. First, extremely negative karma does not result in comments being removed. Rather it results in comments being hidden, based on user preferences.

Well I guess it depends. I forgot it actually just gets a mod's attention. Some comments are deleted and some are hidden. The main problem is that it hides unpopular opinions.

Second, karma is more than just an expression of who likes or dislikes what. Rather the fundamental principle of reddit is that karma affects what content is given preference over other content. DDO, content is purely time based. Threads with the most recent activity are at the top, comments on those threads are ordered in chronological order, with no comment threading.

Well, people use it for likes or dislikes on there. It's gotten far away from the fundamental principles, and that's basically how it would be on here.

Reddit combines time with karma in an algorithm that orders comment. Stuff that is popular is put at the top, yes, but also fades with time (regardless of activity). The same with comments, which have threading (each comment is basically its own threaded conversation).

That would actually be a decent idea to implement into DDO (more the time thing with links going away after a while).
The Troll Queen.

I'm also the Troll Goddess of Reason. Sacrifices are appreciated but not necessary.

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Go vote on one of my debates. I'm not that smart, so it'll probably be an easy decision.

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TheGreatAndPowerful
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9/16/2014 12:04:17 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 11:55:47 AM, Jonbonbon wrote:
At 9/16/2014 11:49:47 AM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 11:29:54 AM, Jonbonbon wrote:
At 9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM, Ragnar wrote:
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?

Well I think he's referring to something like the Reddit comment karma. Basically, when you make any comment, people can up vote or down vote it. Your comment karma is basically that if you get a bunch of good karma (up votes) then you're viewed positively by the community as a contributor to discussion, but if you get a bunch of bad karma (down votes) you're viewed negatively as a contributor. It's a sort of silent and also non silent peer pressure to not be an idiot when commenting.

The only problem with comment karma is that while it deters bad trolls (because after a certain amount of bad karma is reached your comment gets removed), it can also scare away members who are still learning and could later on be convinced to change views or something via intellectual discussion (which is especially true on this site). It also takes away incentive to say something useful after a certain comment except that lots of people just want to one up the last guy. It also minority deters people from saying things that may be unpopular because it would reflect negatively on them as a person even though they're just saying something that could be legitimate but most people disagree with.

There's positives and negatives to it, although on a site like DDO it's probably best not to do comment karma.

There are some things to be clarified here. First, extremely negative karma does not result in comments being removed. Rather it results in comments being hidden, based on user preferences.

Well I guess it depends. I forgot it actually just gets a mod's attention. Some comments are deleted and some are hidden. The main problem is that it hides unpopular opinions.

I can't say whether or not mods are notified if a comment gets negative karma and, if they did, that'd seem redundant with the ability to report comments to the mod. Most of the time that I've seen, mods remove comments because they violate the rules of the sub. That said, there are plenty of downvoted comments to see and view.

For example, this (last time I checked) was the most downvoted comment in all of reddit:

http://www.reddit.com...

Funnily enough, it is a comment made by a mod of that subreddit and yet, there it is, for all to see.

As far as the hiding, again, this is based upon user preferences. YOU decide whether or not YOU want to see comments of a given karma. And they aren't really hidden, but rather the tree originating from that comment is collapse. You see there is a comment there, but you don't see what that comment is or the replies to it - unless you manually expand that comment tree, and it's there.

Second, karma is more than just an expression of who likes or dislikes what. Rather the fundamental principle of reddit is that karma affects what content is given preference over other content. DDO, content is purely time based. Threads with the most recent activity are at the top, comments on those threads are ordered in chronological order, with no comment threading.

Well, people use it for likes or dislikes on there. It's gotten far away from the fundamental principles, and that's basically how it would be on here.

Reddit combines time with karma in an algorithm that orders comment. Stuff that is popular is put at the top, yes, but also fades with time (regardless of activity). The same with comments, which have threading (each comment is basically its own threaded conversation).

That would actually be a decent idea to implement into DDO (more the time thing with links going away after a while).

I disagree. The time thing is regardless of activity. So if implemented here on DDO, threads like "Last Comment Wins" would be gone from the front page. Yeah, it'd eliminate necroposting but necroposting could be eliminated by automatically locking threads after a certain period of inactivity.
Jonbonbon
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9/16/2014 12:15:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 12:04:17 PM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 11:55:47 AM, Jonbonbon wrote:
At 9/16/2014 11:49:47 AM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 11:29:54 AM, Jonbonbon wrote:
At 9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM, Ragnar wrote:
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?

Well I think he's referring to something like the Reddit comment karma. Basically, when you make any comment, people can up vote or down vote it. Your comment karma is basically that if you get a bunch of good karma (up votes) then you're viewed positively by the community as a contributor to discussion, but if you get a bunch of bad karma (down votes) you're viewed negatively as a contributor. It's a sort of silent and also non silent peer pressure to not be an idiot when commenting.

The only problem with comment karma is that while it deters bad trolls (because after a certain amount of bad karma is reached your comment gets removed), it can also scare away members who are still learning and could later on be convinced to change views or something via intellectual discussion (which is especially true on this site). It also takes away incentive to say something useful after a certain comment except that lots of people just want to one up the last guy. It also minority deters people from saying things that may be unpopular because it would reflect negatively on them as a person even though they're just saying something that could be legitimate but most people disagree with.

There's positives and negatives to it, although on a site like DDO it's probably best not to do comment karma.

There are some things to be clarified here. First, extremely negative karma does not result in comments being removed. Rather it results in comments being hidden, based on user preferences.

Well I guess it depends. I forgot it actually just gets a mod's attention. Some comments are deleted and some are hidden. The main problem is that it hides unpopular opinions.

I can't say whether or not mods are notified if a comment gets negative karma and, if they did, that'd seem redundant with the ability to report comments to the mod. Most of the time that I've seen, mods remove comments because they violate the rules of the sub. That said, there are plenty of downvoted comments to see and view.

For example, this (last time I checked) was the most downvoted comment in all of reddit:

http://www.reddit.com...

Funnily enough, it is a comment made by a mod of that subreddit and yet, there it is, for all to see.

Well yeah it has to violate rules to get removed :P

As far as the hiding, again, this is based upon user preferences. YOU decide whether or not YOU want to see comments of a given karma. And they aren't really hidden, but rather the tree originating from that comment is collapse. You see there is a comment there, but you don't see what that comment is or the replies to it - unless you manually expand that comment tree, and it's there.

It's still significant though that unpopular comments would be hidden and popular comments wouldn't be. It's a small but noticeable bias, and on DDO that can't happen since this is about creating discussion about conflicting views.

Second, karma is more than just an expression of who likes or dislikes what. Rather the fundamental principle of reddit is that karma affects what content is given preference over other content. DDO, content is purely time based. Threads with the most recent activity are at the top, comments on those threads are ordered in chronological order, with no comment threading.

Well, people use it for likes or dislikes on there. It's gotten far away from the fundamental principles, and that's basically how it would be on here.

Reddit combines time with karma in an algorithm that orders comment. Stuff that is popular is put at the top, yes, but also fades with time (regardless of activity). The same with comments, which have threading (each comment is basically its own threaded conversation).

That would actually be a decent idea to implement into DDO (more the time thing with links going away after a while).

I disagree. The time thing is regardless of activity.

I know, so we just disagree then :P I mean it would have to be amended to fit what the DDO community needs, but the general idea is decent.

So if implemented here on DDO, threads like "Last Comment Wins" would be gone from the front page. Yeah, it'd eliminate necroposting but necroposting could be eliminated by automatically locking threads after a certain period of inactivity.
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I'm also the Troll Goddess of Reason. Sacrifices are appreciated but not necessary.

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Go vote on one of my debates. I'm not that smart, so it'll probably be an easy decision.

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bossyburrito
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9/16/2014 12:21:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
It seems like it would be much better to just make thread-makers able to make a list of members that aren't allowed to post in their threads.
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TheGreatAndPowerful
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9/16/2014 12:29:38 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 12:15:48 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:

Funnily enough, it is a comment made by a mod of that subreddit and yet, there it is, for all to see.

Well yeah it has to violate rules to get removed :P

Well, that's my point. You're saying if a comment merely gets enough negative karma, a mod is notified and it's removed. I'm saying that's wrong. That is an inaccurate statement.

As far as the hiding, again, this is based upon user preferences. YOU decide whether or not YOU want to see comments of a given karma. And they aren't really hidden, but rather the tree originating from that comment is collapse. You see there is a comment there, but you don't see what that comment is or the replies to it - unless you manually expand that comment tree, and it's there.

It's still significant though that unpopular comments would be hidden and popular comments wouldn't be. It's a small but noticeable bias, and on DDO that can't happen since this is about creating discussion about conflicting views.

Except if you want to see and respond to such comments, you just set your preferences thusly. If you don't want to see comments, then forcing them to be displayed on your screen isn't going to make you respond to them. You'll just skip over them. All the user preference does is make it easier for you to do something you want to do anyway. Again it's not a big deal. We're not talking censorship here.

Second you are conflating "unpopular" with "controversial." Controversial opinions have lots of up AND down votes, resulting in pretty much neutral karma. Unpopular opinions are those with significantly more down votes than up votes, and have negative karma.

Lastly, none of that deters or prevents discussion. There are entire subreddits who's entire existence is finding these types of comments and having discussions about them! People respond to these comments all the time, for better or for worse. IF what you suggested was even remotely true, then comments with negative karma would be conversational dead-ends. They aren't.
YYW
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9/16/2014 12:37:46 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 12:29:38 PM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 12:15:48 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:

Funnily enough, it is a comment made by a mod of that subreddit and yet, there it is, for all to see.

Well yeah it has to violate rules to get removed :P

Well, that's my point. You're saying if a comment merely gets enough negative karma, a mod is notified and it's removed. I'm saying that's wrong. That is an inaccurate statement.

As far as the hiding, again, this is based upon user preferences. YOU decide whether or not YOU want to see comments of a given karma. And they aren't really hidden, but rather the tree originating from that comment is collapse. You see there is a comment there, but you don't see what that comment is or the replies to it - unless you manually expand that comment tree, and it's there.

It's still significant though that unpopular comments would be hidden and popular comments wouldn't be. It's a small but noticeable bias, and on DDO that can't happen since this is about creating discussion about conflicting views.

Except if you want to see and respond to such comments, you just set your preferences thusly. If you don't want to see comments, then forcing them to be displayed on your screen isn't going to make you respond to them. You'll just skip over them. All the user preference does is make it easier for you to do something you want to do anyway. Again it's not a big deal. We're not talking censorship here.

Second you are conflating "unpopular" with "controversial." Controversial opinions have lots of up AND down votes, resulting in pretty much neutral karma. Unpopular opinions are those with significantly more down votes than up votes, and have negative karma.

Lastly, none of that deters or prevents discussion. There are entire subreddits who's entire existence is finding these types of comments and having discussions about them! People respond to these comments all the time, for better or for worse. IF what you suggested was even remotely true, then comments with negative karma would be conversational dead-ends. They aren't.

This.

I think if one want a Reddit-type situation, then Reddit is the place to go.
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TheGreatAndPowerful
Posts: 3,012
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9/16/2014 12:42:00 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 12:21:38 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
It seems like it would be much better to just make thread-makers able to make a list of members that aren't allowed to post in their threads.

Like.... a PM?
TheGreatAndPowerful
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9/16/2014 12:43:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 12:37:46 PM, YYW wrote:
At 9/16/2014 12:29:38 PM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 12:15:48 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:

Funnily enough, it is a comment made by a mod of that subreddit and yet, there it is, for all to see.

Well yeah it has to violate rules to get removed :P

Well, that's my point. You're saying if a comment merely gets enough negative karma, a mod is notified and it's removed. I'm saying that's wrong. That is an inaccurate statement.

As far as the hiding, again, this is based upon user preferences. YOU decide whether or not YOU want to see comments of a given karma. And they aren't really hidden, but rather the tree originating from that comment is collapse. You see there is a comment there, but you don't see what that comment is or the replies to it - unless you manually expand that comment tree, and it's there.

It's still significant though that unpopular comments would be hidden and popular comments wouldn't be. It's a small but noticeable bias, and on DDO that can't happen since this is about creating discussion about conflicting views.

Except if you want to see and respond to such comments, you just set your preferences thusly. If you don't want to see comments, then forcing them to be displayed on your screen isn't going to make you respond to them. You'll just skip over them. All the user preference does is make it easier for you to do something you want to do anyway. Again it's not a big deal. We're not talking censorship here.

Second you are conflating "unpopular" with "controversial." Controversial opinions have lots of up AND down votes, resulting in pretty much neutral karma. Unpopular opinions are those with significantly more down votes than up votes, and have negative karma.

Lastly, none of that deters or prevents discussion. There are entire subreddits who's entire existence is finding these types of comments and having discussions about them! People respond to these comments all the time, for better or for worse. IF what you suggested was even remotely true, then comments with negative karma would be conversational dead-ends. They aren't.

This.

I think if one want a Reddit-type situation, then Reddit is the place to go.

Pretty much. No reddit-style implementation is compatible with how things are now, unless you simply reduce up and down votes to the equivalent of "Facebook Likes."

There are plenty of comments I'd like to upvote here, I really don't see the purpose.
YYW
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9/16/2014 12:46:34 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 12:43:18 PM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 12:37:46 PM, YYW wrote:
At 9/16/2014 12:29:38 PM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
At 9/16/2014 12:15:48 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:

Funnily enough, it is a comment made by a mod of that subreddit and yet, there it is, for all to see.

Well yeah it has to violate rules to get removed :P

Well, that's my point. You're saying if a comment merely gets enough negative karma, a mod is notified and it's removed. I'm saying that's wrong. That is an inaccurate statement.

As far as the hiding, again, this is based upon user preferences. YOU decide whether or not YOU want to see comments of a given karma. And they aren't really hidden, but rather the tree originating from that comment is collapse. You see there is a comment there, but you don't see what that comment is or the replies to it - unless you manually expand that comment tree, and it's there.

It's still significant though that unpopular comments would be hidden and popular comments wouldn't be. It's a small but noticeable bias, and on DDO that can't happen since this is about creating discussion about conflicting views.

Except if you want to see and respond to such comments, you just set your preferences thusly. If you don't want to see comments, then forcing them to be displayed on your screen isn't going to make you respond to them. You'll just skip over them. All the user preference does is make it easier for you to do something you want to do anyway. Again it's not a big deal. We're not talking censorship here.

Second you are conflating "unpopular" with "controversial." Controversial opinions have lots of up AND down votes, resulting in pretty much neutral karma. Unpopular opinions are those with significantly more down votes than up votes, and have negative karma.

Lastly, none of that deters or prevents discussion. There are entire subreddits who's entire existence is finding these types of comments and having discussions about them! People respond to these comments all the time, for better or for worse. IF what you suggested was even remotely true, then comments with negative karma would be conversational dead-ends. They aren't.

This.

I think if one want a Reddit-type situation, then Reddit is the place to go.

Pretty much. No reddit-style implementation is compatible with how things are now, unless you simply reduce up and down votes to the equivalent of "Facebook Likes."

There are plenty of comments I'd like to upvote here, I really don't see the purpose.

Yeah. I also don't want a karma-system on DDO, because that would discourage people from posting controversial stuff. It would also make DDO more of a "groupthink" type situation, than it is. The diversity of perspectives here is one of the things that makes this site as good as it is, whereas the Reddit type architecture would discourage that kind of pluralism in favor of views that were held by the most people.
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bladerunner060
Posts: 7,126
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9/16/2014 12:57:53 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 9/16/2014 1:30:59 AM, Ragnar wrote:
Thank you all for the feedback. As stated, this was not even refined into a site suggestion yet, merely the discussion of an idea.

At 9/14/2014 1:48:45 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:
What I'd like to see if I had my 'druthers would be a karma system.
Please explain, or link it if you've made a post on such before?

I have not posted on it before. Karma systems are implemented in various ways.

This touches on it super briefly:
http://en.wikipedia.org...

Here's one example (vbulletin):
http://www.vbulletin.com...

And actually, there's a bunch, so I'ma throw in a bunch of examples (these are mostly overviews of the systems on various websites. It's relatively common these days. They're all pretty similar, but, again, it's all in the implementation)

KDE forum's version:
https://forum.kde.org...

Mobileread's:
http://www.mobileread.com...

Reddit uses a karma system:
http://www.reddit.com...

Yahoo does too:
https://answers.yahoo.com...

And OpenLearning:
https://www.openlearning.com...

------------------------------------

It's way too much work to expect any time in the foreseeable future, of course, and a lot of thought would have to go into specific implementation. Some systems automatically hide "low karma" posts, unless a user chooses to expand them. That system might be nice...But, a problem with it is that it can be used punitively, though the damage any one user can usually do to another is relatively limited. So, lots of work, hence, "If I had my 'druthers".
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bladerunner060
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9/16/2014 1:00:44 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Would help if I read the rest of the thread when I see I got replied to--reddit's already come up for discussion.

But there really are a myriad of karma systems out there, y'know...
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