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This new voting removal procedure...

Zarroette
Posts: 2,951
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2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.
Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,036
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2/26/2015 12:39:07 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

I agree. It also allows for further transparency between moderator actions and the public. I think it was indeed a step in the right direction moderation-wise.
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Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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2/26/2015 5:15:40 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

Ya, whoever came up with the idea is pure unrivalled genius who deserves to be worshipped....
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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2/26/2015 10:06:10 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 5:15:40 AM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

Ya, whoever came up with the idea is pure unrivalled genius who deserves to be worshipped....

VTL Shaun

But really, it was a great idea.
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah
imabench
Posts: 21,230
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2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
VTL Shaun for role claim
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Maikuru
Posts: 9,112
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2/26/2015 11:17:55 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Had this been around a few months ago, we might still have drafterman.
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
- lamerde

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Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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2/26/2015 11:26:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 11:17:55 AM, Maikuru wrote:
Had this been around a few months ago, we might still have drafterman.

I doubt it.
My work here is, finally, done.
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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2/26/2015 1:46:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM, imabench wrote:
VTL Shaun for role claim

Shaun: 2/6 (JMK, bench)

I'd rather VTL him for death, though. Perhaps we should pressure thett.
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah
AngelofDeath
Posts: 2,953
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2/26/2015 5:27:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 1:46:30 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
At 2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM, imabench wrote:
VTL Shaun for role claim

Shaun: 2/6 (JMK, bench)

I'd rather VTL him for death, though. Perhaps we should pressure thett.

thett's not even in this thread, wtf??
I may or may not be a cat
ESocialBookworm
Posts: 14,373
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2/26/2015 5:28:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 5:27:00 PM, AngelofDeath wrote:
At 2/26/2015 1:46:30 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
At 2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM, imabench wrote:
VTL Shaun for role claim

Shaun: 2/6 (JMK, bench)

I'd rather VTL him for death, though. Perhaps we should pressure thett.

thett's not even in this thread, wtf??

I'm tempted to bus you just so I can 'hammer' you, baby. ;)
Solonkr~
I don't care about whether an ideology is "necessary" or not,
I care about how to solve problems,
which is what everyone else should also care about.

Ken~
In essence, the world is fucked up and you can either ignore it, become cynical or bitter about it.

Me~
"BAILEY + SOLON = SAILEY
MY SHIP SAILEY MUST SAIL"

SCREW THAT SHIZ #BANNIE = BAILEY & ANNIE

P.S. Shipped Sailey before it was cannon bitches.
AngelofDeath
Posts: 2,953
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2/26/2015 5:30:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 5:28:58 PM, ESocialBookworm wrote:
At 2/26/2015 5:27:00 PM, AngelofDeath wrote:
At 2/26/2015 1:46:30 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
At 2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM, imabench wrote:
VTL Shaun for role claim

Shaun: 2/6 (JMK, bench)

I'd rather VTL him for death, though. Perhaps we should pressure thett.

thett's not even in this thread, wtf??

I'm tempted to bus you just so I can 'hammer' you, baby. ;)

Hammer me all you want babe, i'll take it with pleasure
I may or may not be a cat
ESocialBookworm
Posts: 14,373
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2/26/2015 5:31:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 5:30:13 PM, AngelofDeath wrote:
At 2/26/2015 5:28:58 PM, ESocialBookworm wrote:
At 2/26/2015 5:27:00 PM, AngelofDeath wrote:
At 2/26/2015 1:46:30 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
At 2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM, imabench wrote:
VTL Shaun for role claim

Shaun: 2/6 (JMK, bench)

I'd rather VTL him for death, though. Perhaps we should pressure thett.

thett's not even in this thread, wtf??

I'm tempted to bus you just so I can 'hammer' you, baby. ;)

Hammer me all you want babe, i'll take it with pleasure

In that case- why don't we make you lynchproof, and I'll just keep hammering, and hammering, and hammering... ;)
Solonkr~
I don't care about whether an ideology is "necessary" or not,
I care about how to solve problems,
which is what everyone else should also care about.

Ken~
In essence, the world is fucked up and you can either ignore it, become cynical or bitter about it.

Me~
"BAILEY + SOLON = SAILEY
MY SHIP SAILEY MUST SAIL"

SCREW THAT SHIZ #BANNIE = BAILEY & ANNIE

P.S. Shipped Sailey before it was cannon bitches.
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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2/26/2015 5:35:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 5:27:00 PM, AngelofDeath wrote:
At 2/26/2015 1:46:30 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
At 2/26/2015 11:06:48 AM, imabench wrote:
VTL Shaun for role claim

Shaun: 2/6 (JMK, bench)

I'd rather VTL him for death, though. Perhaps we should pressure thett.

thett's not even in this thread, wtf??

I thought he was, to be fair....I need a nap...

But, as a general rule of thumb, you can't go wrong with pressuring the Texan.
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah
airmax1227
Posts: 13,245
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2/26/2015 7:06:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

I appreciate that you and others appreciate the new procedures.

The current presidential administration; Ore_ele and debatability, and Bluesteel, the Voting issues moderator, deserve a lot of credit for these changes. Envisage should get credit too for making a well organized and reasonable case for it.

So far I think things are going well, but it's worth keeping in mind that this, like everything, is a work in progress. I talk to Bluesteel daily about reported votes, and will continue to have discussions with him, and Ore_ele/Debatability about how to improve things. Every member should also feel free to offer their ideas or to contact me, Bluesteel, Ore_ele, or Debatability to discuss anything they like about this or anything else.

To address the issues you brought up regarding the negatives, it's not really an additional burden on Bluesteel to post the review results in the comments since every vote I submit to him requires a reason for deletion already. In the week prior to the current policy, he would already provide his thoughts on why the vote should be deleted, and then I would take action based on that. We did this systematically so that we could deal with the votes quickly and effectively while also keeping detailed records. The only difference now is that those reasons for deletion are now shared publicly, which certainly was a good idea and does make the system better. Naturally, this process does take some time, though as has always been the case, almost every reported vote is reviewed within 24 hours. So far we've been able to continue to do this, and post the result within the same time frame. So while the process does require me to go through the vote reports, submit the relevant votes to Bluesteel for review, and then take action based on his review, this is all still able to be done within the same time frame. Bluesteel deserves a lot of credit for that, and I'm hoping we can maintain that kind of quickness and quality. As things change though, we will adjust to make sure procedures can continue to run as smoothly, and as I said above, we will continue to work on improving things and having both private and public discussion so that we can improve things even more.
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Zarroette
Posts: 2,951
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2/27/2015 3:15:19 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 12:39:07 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

I agree. It also allows for further transparency between moderator actions and the public. I think it was indeed a step in the right direction moderation-wise.

I don't know about the other moderators, but Max does a great job despite not exactly being seen in the public eye. I think the transparency is less important from someone like Max, but yeah, it's a step in the right direction.
Zarroette
Posts: 2,951
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2/27/2015 3:16:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 5:15:40 AM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

Ya, whoever came up with the idea is pure unrivalled genius who deserves to be worshipped....

Haha alright. Well done, Mr Envisage =)
Zarroette
Posts: 2,951
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2/27/2015 3:21:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/26/2015 7:06:25 PM, airmax1227 wrote:
At 2/26/2015 12:16:15 AM, Zarroette wrote:
...is excellent. Telling voters why their votes are being removed (and I assume that they are being directly contacted about their votes) should go a long way to helping the site not only have better votes, but helping the voter and the onlookers create better votes in the future by giving them examples of what not to do. I think the only negative is that bluesteel has to write out a reason for removal (and probably has red-tape in getting Airmax's approval first), which requires effort and time.

Overall, a clever and practical idea, imo.

I appreciate that you and others appreciate the new procedures.

The current presidential administration; Ore_ele and debatability, and Bluesteel, the Voting issues moderator, deserve a lot of credit for these changes. Envisage should get credit too for making a well organized and reasonable case for it.

So far I think things are going well, but it's worth keeping in mind that this, like everything, is a work in progress. I talk to Bluesteel daily about reported votes, and will continue to have discussions with him, and Ore_ele/Debatability about how to improve things. Every member should also feel free to offer their ideas or to contact me, Bluesteel, Ore_ele, or Debatability to discuss anything they like about this or anything else.

To address the issues you brought up regarding the negatives, it's not really an additional burden on Bluesteel to post the review results in the comments since every vote I submit to him requires a reason for deletion already. In the week prior to the current policy, he would already provide his thoughts on why the vote should be deleted, and then I would take action based on that. We did this systematically so that we could deal with the votes quickly and effectively while also keeping detailed records. The only difference now is that those reasons for deletion are now shared publicly, which certainly was a good idea and does make the system better. Naturally, this process does take some time, though as has always been the case, almost every reported vote is reviewed within 24 hours. So far we've been able to continue to do this, and post the result within the same time frame. So while the process does require me to go through the vote reports, submit the relevant votes to Bluesteel for review, and then take action based on his review, this is all still able to be done within the same time frame. Bluesteel deserves a lot of credit for that, and I'm hoping we can maintain that kind of quickness and quality. As things change though, we will adjust to make sure procedures can continue to run as smoothly, and as I said above, we will continue to work on improving things and having both private and public discussion so that we can improve things even more.

It's good to know that it isn't too much of a strain on you and bluesteel. I remember how bladerunner tried to make sure that every debate on this site got a vote, and now look at how that turned out. I was just hoping that this new system wasn't too idealistic, and it doesn't seem to be so, hence the praise I gave it. Keep up the good work, Max and everyone =)
YoshiBoy13
Posts: 96
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2/27/2015 7:52:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Indeed. If accounts are hacked (very possible), then validated accounts could end up spamming with unhelpful comments in the voting, and skew the results unfairly.
- Just because you're narrow-minded doesn't mean you're always right.