Total Posts:34|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

The Fallacy Police

UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
Ragnar
Posts: 1,658
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:08:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
If you are legitimately making Ad Hominem attacks instead of an argument, I see no issue with them dismissing it as such. While it can cross the line into a fallacy itself, it's often a space efferent way to refute a line of reasoning.
Unofficial DDO Guide: http://goo.gl...
(It's probably the best help resource here, other than talking to people...)

Voting Standards: https://goo.gl...

And please disable Smart-Quotes: https://goo.gl...
Vox_Veritas
Posts: 7,068
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:20:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

ThIS tHReaD eEs a LOgiCAL fAlLACiES!
Call me Vox, the Resident Contrarian of debate.org.

The DDO Blog:
https://debatedotorg.wordpress.com...

#drinkthecoffeenotthekoolaid
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:22:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

I'm sorry but you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy", just because someone is committing a fallacy fallacy, doesn't mean all their points are moot.
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:23:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:08:58 PM, Ragnar wrote:
If you are legitimately making Ad Hominem attacks instead of an argument, I see no issue with them dismissing it as such. While it can cross the line into a fallacy itself, it's often a space efferent way to refute a line of reasoning.

You suck at logic and your writing is ugly.

Debunked.
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:25:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

Do you use fallacies to argue? If not than explain to them how what you are saying is not a fallacy.

Some people do not understand fallacies correctly. For example some people believe every slippery slope argument is a fallacy, which is incorrect. Just point out why your slippery slope argument (or insert other perceived fallacy) is not a fallacy in that instance.

I'd attempt to refrain from calling them intellectually lazy as well.
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:26:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:22:17 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

I'm sorry but you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy", just because someone is committing a fallacy fallacy, doesn't mean all their points are moot.

You are committing the " fallacy fallacy fallacy fallacy" I didn't mean that the fallacy police made an invalid point because he used a fallacy I am just pointing out the irony.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
philochristos
Posts: 2,614
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:28:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I've seen a lot of people misidentify fallacies. For example, an ad hominem fallacy is only a fallacy if whatever attack you're making against a person is meant to cast dispersions on their point of view. But if you're just attacking the person to attack the person, then that's not an ad hominem. Not all insults are ad hominem, and not all ad hominems are insults.

Most informal fallacies have exceptions, and some people don't seem to get that, so they go about calling anything a fallacy that so much as resembles one. For example, the fallacy of composition has exceptions. While it may be a fallacy to reason that because each part of a house is inexpensive that therefore the whole house is inexpensive, it is not a fallacy to reason that because each pixel on the screen is read that therefore the whole screen is red.

So yeah, I do sometimes see people who have a vague understanding of logical fallacies go about labeling various arguments fallacies without any explanation of how it commits that fallacy. I think that's just lazy and shows a lack of critical thinking skills.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:28:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:20:47 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

ThIS tHReaD eEs a LOgiCAL fAlLACiES!

0h noez!!!!!!!!!!!!!! u KN0j4; 2 muCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111!!!!!!!!
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 6:29:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:28:03 PM, philochristos wrote:
I've seen a lot of people misidentify fallacies. For example, an ad hominem fallacy is only a fallacy if whatever attack you're making against a person is meant to cast dispersions on their point of view. But if you're just attacking the person to attack the person, then that's not an ad hominem. Not all insults are ad hominem, and not all ad hominems are insults.

Most informal fallacies have exceptions, and some people don't seem to get that, so they go about calling anything a fallacy that so much as resembles one. For example, the fallacy of composition has exceptions. While it may be a fallacy to reason that because each part of a house is inexpensive that therefore the whole house is inexpensive, it is not a fallacy to reason that because each pixel on the screen is read that therefore the whole screen is red.

So yeah, I do sometimes see people who have a vague understanding of logical fallacies go about labeling various arguments fallacies without any explanation of how it commits that fallacy. I think that's just lazy and shows a lack of critical thinking skills.

exactly.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,077
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 7:13:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:26:55 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:22:17 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

I'm sorry but you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy", just because someone is committing a fallacy fallacy, doesn't mean all their points are moot.

You are committing the " fallacy fallacy fallacy fallacy" I didn't mean that the fallacy police made an invalid point because he used a fallacy I am just pointing out the irony.

THIS IS CIRCULAR REASONING. AND IF YOU SAY I'M USING A FALLACY FALALCY THEN THAT"S A FALLACY FALLACY FALALCY WHICH IS CIRCULAR REASONING. AND THIS IS CIRCULAR TOO S OWE"RE ALL SCREWED
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 7:18:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Yeah, there are some people who overzealously look for fallacies, and accuse you of fallacies that you're not really committing.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

Follow the DDOlympics
: http://www.debate.org...

Open Debate Topics Project: http://www.debate.org...
sadolite
Posts: 8,836
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 10:20:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:22:17 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

I'm sorry but you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy", just because someone is committing a fallacy fallacy, doesn't mean all their points are moot.

On DDO if you even spell a word wrong all of your points and arguments are all moot until the end of time. You are no longer even considered human. You are some kind of pre evolution primate. Your total existence is moot. Especially if you believe in god and spell a word wrong.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 10:44:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:22:17 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

I'm sorry but you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy", just because someone is committing a fallacy fallacy, doesn't mean all their points are moot.

Sorry you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy fallacy"
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2015 11:20:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 10:22:35 PM, daytonanerd wrote:
The name of this sounds good. The fallacy police. I may put it in DDO HoC.

Maybe then Senpai will notice me.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 11:07:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

Hey, that's actually a great idea now, Mr. Penguin! DDO should have an actual Fallacy Police!

I'll go right ahead and write you up the first ticket for The Fallacy Fallacy Fallacy.

Please enclose this in a sealed envelope with postage and send it to the Grand Poobah Imperial Bureaucracy Headquarters of DDO with an enclosed photo ID of your left buttcheeck and a written statement identifying your favorite ice cream flavor. We will get back to you with a gift basket.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 11:36:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 11:07:24 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

Hey, that's actually a great idea now, Mr. Penguin! DDO should have an actual Fallacy Police!

I'll go right ahead and write you up the first ticket for The Fallacy Fallacy Fallacy.

Please enclose this in a sealed envelope with postage and send it to the Grand Poobah Imperial Bureaucracy Headquarters of DDO with an enclosed photo ID of your left buttcheeck and a written statement identifying your favorite ice cream flavor. We will get back to you with a gift basket.

Should I make a recruitment thread to those that want to join the fallacy police?
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 12:08:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 11:36:58 AM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Should I make a recruitment thread to those that want to join the fallacy police?

Yes. I hereby grant you the official powers to carry out this duty! You are now Uther, Penguin in Chief of The Fallacy Police. And you may deputize anyone you please.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 12:18:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 12:08:23 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/1/2015 11:36:58 AM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Should I make a recruitment thread to those that want to join the fallacy police?

Yes. I hereby grant you the official powers to carry out this duty! You are now Uther, Penguin in Chief of The Fallacy Police. And you may deputize anyone you please.
I am creating a recruitment thread now, would you want to be my deputy.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
thett3
Posts: 14,334
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 12:35:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
On DDO, about 90% of the time I've seen someone point out a fallacy they were really just strawmanning their opponents argument
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
bluesteel
Posts: 12,301
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 12:39:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 12:35:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
On DDO, about 90% of the time I've seen someone point out a fallacy they were really just strawmanning their opponents argument

Ad hom
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into - Jonathan Swift (paraphrase)
thett3
Posts: 14,334
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 12:43:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 12:39:15 PM, bluesteel wrote:
At 3/1/2015 12:35:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
On DDO, about 90% of the time I've seen someone point out a fallacy they were really just strawmanning their opponents argument

Ad hom

your mom
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
bluesteel
Posts: 12,301
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 1:08:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 12:43:58 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 3/1/2015 12:39:15 PM, bluesteel wrote:
At 3/1/2015 12:35:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
On DDO, about 90% of the time I've seen someone point out a fallacy they were really just strawmanning their opponents argument

Ad hom

your mom

Red herring
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into - Jonathan Swift (paraphrase)
Benshapiro
Posts: 3,942
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 2:02:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

Stop yelling at me!!!! *cries*

(Women fallacy)
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 3:36:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

Is this thread not just an attack on those people rather than their arguments? Or are you presenting some kind of argument here?
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,679
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 3:37:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 3:36:22 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

Is this thread not just an attack on those people rather than their arguments? Or are you presenting some kind of argument here?

I'm not intending to make an argument just commenting on the irony of the Fallacy Police.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 3:38:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 6:08:58 PM, Ragnar wrote:
If you are legitimately making Ad Hominem attacks instead of an argument, I see no issue with them dismissing it as such. While it can cross the line into a fallacy itself, it's often a space efferent way to refute a line of reasoning.

Part of the issue is when people make an argument, but include personal insults in it. Something like, "wow, are you really this stupid? can't you see [beginning of an actual argument]..."

That has a personal attack in it, but the argument cannot be dismissed because of the personal attack.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 3:39:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/1/2015 1:08:46 PM, bluesteel wrote:
At 3/1/2015 12:43:58 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 3/1/2015 12:39:15 PM, bluesteel wrote:
At 3/1/2015 12:35:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
On DDO, about 90% of the time I've seen someone point out a fallacy they were really just strawmanning their opponents argument

Ad hom

your mom

Red herring

Your mom is a fish?
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
WillYouMarryMe
Posts: 247
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/1/2015 4:44:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/28/2015 10:20:24 PM, sadolite wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:22:17 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 2/28/2015 6:05:45 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Have you ever argued with someone who consistently accused you of making a fallacy at every given opportunity? They don't even have to make an argument aganist your point they just yell out "ad hominien" or "tu quoque".

Its kind of ironic that these type of people are committing a fallacy themselves the "fallacy fallacy"

I'm sorry but you are committing a "fallacy fallacy fallacy", just because someone is committing a fallacy fallacy, doesn't mean all their points are moot.

On DDO if you even spell a word wrong all of your points and arguments are all moot until the end of time. You are no longer even considered human. You are some kind of pre evolution primate. Your total existence is moot. Especially if you believe in god and spell a word wrong.

primates arent pre-evolution