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Anti-Noob-Sniping Idea

bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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5/4/2015 8:30:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I proposed a system whereby anyone with 3,500+ ELO could not accept a debate instigated by a member with a month or less of membership. It originally met with opposition, so I scrapped it, but now some people have seemed to voice a desire for something similar.

What are your thoughts?
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FourTrouble
Posts: 12,757
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5/4/2015 8:33:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I support the overall proposal. I think a month might be too long, since some members prove themselves easily within two weeks, and I'd want to be able to debate those members if they have interesting topics.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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5/4/2015 8:39:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:33:48 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
I support the overall proposal. I think a month might be too long, since some members prove themselves easily within two weeks, and I'd want to be able to debate those members if they have interesting topics.

True, but doesn't this system allow the noob to accept a debate you instigate?
Just tell them you will debate them, and challenge them.
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FourTrouble
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5/4/2015 8:40:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:39:34 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 5/4/2015 8:33:48 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
I support the overall proposal. I think a month might be too long, since some members prove themselves easily within two weeks, and I'd want to be able to debate those members if they have interesting topics.

True, but doesn't this system allow the noob to accept a debate you instigate?
Just tell them you will debate them, and challenge them.

That's true. Good point.
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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5/4/2015 8:56:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
If anything make them Non ELO debates, but new people should definitely get the opportunity to debate experienced opponents.
Maikuru
Posts: 9,112
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5/4/2015 9:17:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:56:46 PM, Wylted wrote:
If anything make them Non ELO debates, but new people should definitely get the opportunity to debate experienced opponents.

I definitely like the idea of non-ELO debates.
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Death23
Posts: 781
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5/4/2015 9:30:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:30:55 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I proposed a system whereby anyone with 3,500+ ELO could not accept a debate instigated by a member with a month or less of membership. It originally met with opposition, so I scrapped it, but now some people have seemed to voice a desire for something similar.

What are your thoughts?

I would support this if all of the prior ELO gains from noob-sniping were retroactively reversed. It wouldn't be fair to have the prior ELO gains from noob-sniping permanently grandfathered in.
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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5/4/2015 9:31:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 9:30:28 PM, Death23 wrote:
At 5/4/2015 8:30:55 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I proposed a system whereby anyone with 3,500+ ELO could not accept a debate instigated by a member with a month or less of membership. It originally met with opposition, so I scrapped it, but now some people have seemed to voice a desire for something similar.

What are your thoughts?

I would support this if all of the prior ELO gains from noob-sniping were retroactively reversed. It wouldn't be fair to have the prior ELO gains from noob-sniping permanently grandfathered in.

I would like that too.
Live Long and Prosper

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"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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5/4/2015 9:32:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:56:46 PM, Wylted wrote:
If anything make them Non ELO debates, but new people should definitely get the opportunity to debate experienced opponents.

Noobs and experienced members could still debate, but only if the experienced member instigated. That way the noob wasn't "sniped."
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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: http://www.debate.org...

Open Debate Topics Project: http://www.debate.org...
Maikuru
Posts: 9,112
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5/4/2015 9:36:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The idea is a good one, though the more I think about it, the more unnecessary it seems. If a new member is thoughtful, they will look into other debates before making their own. They could also accept pending debates against seemingly equally-skilled debaters before instigating. If they don't want to take these steps, then they obviously open themselves up to facing skilled opponents.
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tejretics
Posts: 6,089
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5/4/2015 9:44:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:30:55 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I proposed a system whereby anyone with 3,500+ ELO could not accept a debate instigated by a member with a month or less of membership. It originally met with opposition, so I scrapped it, but now some people have seemed to voice a desire for something similar.

What are your thoughts?

Not a MONTH or less, because, for example, when I was a month old on DDO, I wanted higher-Elo members to be better at debating. Maybe 2 weeks.
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ShabShoral
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5/4/2015 10:12:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
There's no reason to stop noobs from doing whatever they choose. They can already filter their opponents so as to exclude high-Elo debaters. If they don't use this mechanism, that's on them. What's not acceptable, however, is to force them into not having good debaters accept their challenges. There's no point in that level of nanny-state micromanaging.
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RainbowDash52
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5/4/2015 10:59:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The best way to prevent noob sniping would be to have people start off with a provisional ELO for there first 5 or so debates. When a person with a provisional ELO debates someone with a non-provisional ELO, the non-provisional ELO will not be affected. This way everyone can debate whoever they want, but you can't noob snipe to boost ELO.
ShabShoral
Posts: 3,234
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5/4/2015 11:16:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 10:59:23 PM, RainbowDash52 wrote:
The best way to prevent noob sniping would be to have people start off with a provisional ELO for there first 5 or so debates. When a person with a provisional ELO debates someone with a non-provisional ELO, the non-provisional ELO will not be affected. This way everyone can debate whoever they want, but you can't noob snipe to boost ELO.

This is the right answer. Have new members start as "unranked", and, until they complete some debates, have their Elo change without changing the Elos of their opponents.
"This site is trash as a debate site. It's club penguin for dysfunctional adults."

~ Skepsikyma <3

"Your idea of good writing is like Spinoza mixed with Heidegger."

~ Dylly Dylly Cat Cat

"You seem to aspire to be a cross between a Jewish hipster, an old school WASP aristocrat, and a political iconoclast"

~ Thett the Mighty

"fvck omg ur face"

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FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,219
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5/5/2015 12:02:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Do you consider it noob sniping if the opponent FFs? I feel bad about any gains in ELO I get from accepting a debate in which I win, and the opponent FFed the majority or all of the remaining rounds. There was nothing there.
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Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
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5/5/2015 1:55:25 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/4/2015 8:30:55 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I proposed a system whereby anyone with 3,500+ ELO could not accept a debate instigated by a member with a month or less of membership. It originally met with opposition, so I scrapped it, but now some people have seemed to voice a desire for something similar.

What are your thoughts?

Can we just tell them 'you can set an upper limit on the number of debates your opponent has completed'? Then they'll get to set a reasonable limit, say, 30, which allows themselves to choose not to be noob-sniped. (I'm doing that myself, though I'm choosing opponents by asking them to apply in comments, rather than with a hard limit). If they choose to be noob-sniped, on the other hand, they can also do it.
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