Total Posts:13|Showing Posts:1-13
Jump to topic:

Sources shouldn't count against limit

roguetech
Posts: 15
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.
Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 3:13:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

Or we could allow debaters to provide sources in comments ;)
The thing is, I hate relativism. I hate relativism more than I hate everything else, excepting, maybe, fibreglass powerboats... What it overlooks, to put it briefly and crudely, is the fixed structure of human nature. - Jerry Fodor

Don't be a stat cynic:
http://www.debate.org...

Response to conservative views on deforestation:
http://www.debate.org...

Topics I'd like to debate (not debating ATM): http://tinyurl.com...
Jonbonbon
Posts: 2,760
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 3:19:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

Well, if you have a 10,000 character debate, most people find it somewhat difficult to fill up that space with arguments. If you do fill up that space, more than likely you can condense it by more than enough characters.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

Unless something changed while I was gone, Juggle doesn't make updates or changes to this site anymore. This site is probably just going to remain as-is for the rest of eternity.
The Troll Queen.

I'm also the Troll Goddess of Reason. Sacrifices are appreciated but not necessary.

"I'm a vivacious sex fiend," SolonKR.

Go vote on one of my debates. I'm not that smart, so it'll probably be an easy decision.

Fite me m9

http://www.debate.org...
roguetech
Posts: 15
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 3:20:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 3:13:02 PM, Diqiucun_Cunmin wrote:
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech
I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources.

Or we could allow debaters to provide sources in comments ;)

There's a couple of problems with that. First, it makes it more difficult on both the debaters and spectators to find and read them, especially if there are active commenters. Second, it raises the issue of timeliness. How long after posting an argument does it become misconduct? Will voters notice a delay? In a quick debate, someone could respond before sources are ever posted, especially if there's no mention of them.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 3:20:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

I agree. As to the ad hock'usecomments' it messes with the reader. It would be really cool if a 'debate ref' at the end of the debate' with simple linking via [1] could be used.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 3:25:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
It's funny, but there is a ton if html available in debates. I did a couple with superscript refs, div layouts etc. Problem with that is HTML counts too, so a superscript 1 takes like 30 chars
LordHelm
Posts: 15
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 6:02:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

I wrote a rule in my debate where all sources could be external. My sources take up a total of, at most, 20 characters because of it.
Emilrose
Posts: 2,479
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 6:04:57 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Or you can easily use pasting websites like this for your sources: http://pasted.co...

That way you can use how many you like without really impacting character limit.
Commentator on a picture with David Cameron and a Cat: 'Amazing what you can achieve with photoshop these days. I'm sure that used to be a pig.'

Commentator on Hillary Clinton: 'If Clinton is now what passes for progressive, maybe this country deserves Trump.'

Commentator on British parliament: 'All that talent in one place, where is Ebola when you need it?'

John Kerry on words: 'These aren't just words, folks.'
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,315
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 7:31:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

Tinyurl is a perfect option, as it allows users to have the same length of each source. This also ensures that one can actually abide by the character limit. By posting sources elsewhere, it disadvantages the opponent by the ability to use more character space. If you make a rule in your specific debate, that's fine.

Anothe problem is the voter. Having to access another site to get the sources is frankly a waste of time, and could potentially discourage voters.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

That would be very nice. :P But as it stands, what I stated above should remain.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 8:00:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

I don't how to use tiny url sites. Anyway no. Sources should absolutely count against your character limit, and if you're using much more than 10, you're probably not explaining your points thoroughly enough.
roguetech
Posts: 15
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 8:03:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 8:00:13 PM, Wylted wrote:

I don't how to use tiny url sites. Anyway no. Sources should absolutely count against your character limit, and if you're using much more than 10, you're probably not explaining your points thoroughly enough.

I vote for Pro due to Con not rebutting the original points and simply making an argument from assertion.
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,315
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/8/2015 8:04:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/8/2015 8:00:13 PM, Wylted wrote:
At 9/8/2015 2:43:37 PM, roguetech wrote:
Since debaters cannot control the length of links, and sources are not (or at least, should not) be part of the debate itself, it is unfair to those who provide more sources. In addition, it discourages providing multiple sources per fact, as well as sourcing every fact. Furthermore, it provides a disadvantage to those who may not know to use tinyurl sites.

I suggest a separate section to the debate form be provided for sources. Only links with markup, would be permitted in this box. Markup format could be provided (I suggest [#] or {#}) where the site could automatically insert the link into the debate text for readers.

I don't how to use tiny url sites.

You can learn. ;)

Anyway no. Sources should absolutely count against your character limit, and if you're using much more than 10, you're probably not explaining your points thoroughly enough.

I agree. They should count against it, because you're utilizing what *they* say as your own, so it should absolutely be considered part of your argument, in both content and size.

But I'd have to disagree about using more than 10 sources. It's quite easy, in a 10,000 character debate, to explain your points thoroughly as well as the sources you choose to use. Or, you can stat spam like 16k and JMK on open border. :P
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW