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We need to be nicer to new people

Loserboi
Posts: 1,232
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9/13/2010 4:44:24 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
We need to be nicer to new people or else they will all just keep leaving... Like we gotta stop saying their argument is stupid in the comments or like destroying their first debates with semantics.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 4:45:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:44:24 PM, Loserboi wrote:
We need to be nicer to new people or else they will all just keep leaving... Like we gotta stop saying their argument is stupid in the comments or like destroying their first debates with semantics.

This site is all about perseverance. My first post was absolutely atrocious and I was RIPPED APART. But if you really want to debate, you should stick around and learn from others.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/13/2010 4:51:24 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

All the time. Usually in a debate, though.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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9/13/2010 4:53:46 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

No, being personally insulted doesn't help people learn. It just makes them feel down about themselves. At least it does with me, but then again I have no self-esteem. Why learn when you feel like you're a dumba$s?
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/13/2010 4:54:31 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:53:46 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

No, being personally insulted doesn't help people learn. It just makes them feel down about themselves. At least it does with me, but then again I have no self-esteem. Why learn when you feel like you're a dumba$s?

So you don't feel like a dumb@ss anymore.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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9/13/2010 4:56:23 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:54:31 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:46 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

No, being personally insulted doesn't help people learn. It just makes them feel down about themselves. At least it does with me, but then again I have no self-esteem. Why learn when you feel like you're a dumba$s?

So you don't feel like a dumb@ss anymore.

Well some people lose motivation by being personally insulted.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 4:57:15 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:53:46 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

No, being personally insulted doesn't help people learn. It just makes them feel down about themselves. At least it does with me, but then again I have no self-esteem. Why learn when you feel like you're a dumba$s?

Ok, insults are not needed; obviously. I was more focusing on the "semantics" part. Dismantling someone's argument with semantics is annoying, but on this site inevitable. I mean, even the old members get nagged about semantics. Ya have to keep arguing! And really, if they're just being d!cks and insulting the debate (or you), ignore them.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/13/2010 4:57:30 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:56:23 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Well some people lose motivation by being personally insulted.

We're opposites then, I'm most motivated to correct my actions after someone berates me for them.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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9/13/2010 4:58:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:44:24 PM, Loserboi wrote:
We need to be nicer to new people or else they will all just keep leaving... Like we gotta stop saying their argument is stupid in the comments or like destroying their first debates with semantics.

This site needs to be nicer to all people. I'm not saying "all hold hands and act like friends" but at least have some respect towards other members.

This is a debate site not a personal attack site, if you wanna talk trash go to twitter or something. Same if you expect everyone to just agree and get along.

Its for debating, not just destroying new people and easy targets. If you want more smart people the best way is to help them become smart. Not just insult them.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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9/13/2010 5:00:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:57:30 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:56:23 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Well some people lose motivation by being personally insulted.

We're opposites then, I'm most motivated to correct my actions after someone berates me for them.

I guess I'm middle ground. I'm more motivated with positive critisism. I feel no motivation, only anger by personal insults.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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9/13/2010 5:04:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:57:30 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:56:23 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Well some people lose motivation by being personally insulted.

We're opposites then, I'm most motivated to correct my actions after someone berates me for them.

Yea. Negative criticism just makes me lose motivation. I kinda get a "why try if nobody appreciates my efforts?" type attitude after receiving such criticism.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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9/13/2010 5:04:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

Not dumb down I'd say. More like don't write an essay of semantics for a responce.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 5:04:58 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

He's not asking us to be stupid. He's asking for special consideration for n00bs. And even though I don't agree with special consideration for n00bs, I don't believe his intention were, "Hey! Ya'll are too smart. Could you be a little more stupid so people will join the site?"
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/13/2010 5:05:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

I took his statement to mean: "Don't be a semantic using douchebag and use constructive criticism instead of destructive criticism."
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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9/13/2010 5:05:34 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:04:02 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

Not dumb down I'd say. More like don't write an essay of semantics for a responce.

If the person on the receiving end has any intellectual worth whatsoever, he or she (as the case may be) would do well to disregard it and plow forward. This site's members shouldn't have to stop for every person who becomes frustrated or gets their feelings hurt.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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9/13/2010 5:06:50 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:04:58 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

He's not asking us to be stupid. He's asking for special consideration for n00bs.

And that's precisely why I call it intellectual welfare.

And even though I don't agree with special consideration for n00bs, I don't believe his intention were, "Hey! Ya'll are too smart. Could you be a little more stupid so people will join the site?"

He's asking us to hold back certain varieties of argumentation so that certain people won't become frustrated.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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9/13/2010 5:09:50 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:05:34 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:04:02 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

Not dumb down I'd say. More like don't write an essay of semantics for a responce.

If the person on the receiving end has any intellectual worth whatsoever, he or she (as the case may be) would do well to disregard it and plow forward. This site's members shouldn't have to stop for every person who becomes frustrated or gets their feelings hurt.

For new members the format and just working it might be frustrating. Then take in that people write huge responces that aren't really saying much at all, and you have people getting frustrated and thiking they are just that dumb. I feel that way sometimes, but I know how this site works. If we could keep the new members long enough, I'm sure they would get better.

Basically I propose that vets and good debaters not take on the obvious n00b.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
J.Kenyon
Posts: 4,194
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9/13/2010 5:12:44 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

Heh...

http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org... (this guy was a real SOB, he made like 4 accounts to votebomb me. He did it to theLwerd, too. Still lost though :P)
http://www.debate.org...
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 5:13:38 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:06:50 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:04:58 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

He's not asking us to be stupid. He's asking for special consideration for n00bs.

And that's precisely why I call it intellectual welfare.

Hmm... Yeah, in a way. But we don't have to dumb ourselves down... Well, I don't believe we should. That would be asinine.

And even though I don't agree with special consideration for n00bs, I don't believe his intention were, "Hey! Ya'll are too smart. Could you be a little more stupid so people will join the site?"

He's asking us to hold back certain varieties of argumentation so that certain people won't become frustrated.

Which I disagree with. But by holding back varieties of argumentation, we are not becoming "dumb". We're simply becoming more... open to stupidity, I guess.

Regardless of his intentions, I think it's a bad idea and more destructive than constructive.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 5:14:51 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:12:44 PM, J.Kenyon wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:49:30 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:47:39 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I certainly agree with the OP. We have a select few members who tend to chase new members away if they don't meet their standards. These elitist attitudes need to stop.

I think you learn the best from being trashed personally... I haven't really seen anyone get demolished and then leave on this site... Has that really happened? o.O

Heh...

http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org... (this guy was a real SOB, he made like 4 accounts to votebomb me. He did it to theLwerd, too. Still lost though :P)
http://www.debate.org...

LOL Ya get an ego boost from crushing n00bs?
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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9/13/2010 5:16:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:09:50 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:05:34 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:04:02 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

Not dumb down I'd say. More like don't write an essay of semantics for a responce.

If the person on the receiving end has any intellectual worth whatsoever, he or she (as the case may be) would do well to disregard it and plow forward. This site's members shouldn't have to stop for every person who becomes frustrated or gets their feelings hurt.

For new members the format and just working it might be frustrating. Then take in that people write huge responces that aren't really saying much at all, and you have people getting frustrated and thiking they are just that dumb. I feel that way sometimes, but I know how this site works. If we could keep the new members long enough, I'm sure they would get better.

Basically I propose that vets and good debaters not take on the obvious n00b.

First of all, not everyone makes a good debater - especially people that get confused that easily by a lengthy response.

Second of all, the "format" is really only tricky for the first day or two. If you leave because you aren't an expert from the beginning, you probably shouldn't be here.

Third of all, saying that good debaters should "have mercy" on the bad ones doesn't help anything. In fact, that seems counterproductive. An intelligent person tends to learn more from those who have more skill and/or experience.
J.Kenyon
Posts: 4,194
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9/13/2010 5:16:06 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:14:51 PM, annhasle wrote:

LOL Ya get an ego boost from crushing n00bs?

Hey! I do legitimate debates, too. Besides, our all time n00b-chaser-offer is still probably theLwerd.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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9/13/2010 5:18:59 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:16:06 PM, J.Kenyon wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:14:51 PM, annhasle wrote:

LOL Ya get an ego boost from crushing n00bs?

Hey! I do legitimate debates, too.

Sure....Lol

Besides, our all time n00b-chaser-offer is still probably theLwerd.

Yeah, probably. They have no idea what they get themselves into... I feel bad for them. Well, unless they're one of those cocky n00bs who think they're going to win no matter what. That's when I laugh....
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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9/13/2010 5:20:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:13:38 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:06:50 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:04:58 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:02:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:53:23 PM, Korashk wrote:
At 9/13/2010 4:52:16 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Loserboi, your BIG issues say that you're against welfare. How can you criticize its material form when you clearly support its intellectual variant?

You can't take my intelligence and give it to someone else.

He's asking us to dumb ourselves down so that new members don't get scared and leave. Rather than pulling someone else up (as in the material form), we're being asked to take ourselves down. Different forms, different means.

He's not asking us to be stupid. He's asking for special consideration for n00bs.

And that's precisely why I call it intellectual welfare.

Hmm... Yeah, in a way. But we don't have to dumb ourselves down... Well, I don't believe we should. That would be asinine.

I don't believe we should, either. But that's essentially what it boils down to. By asking you not to argue a certain way--to stick to "conventional" ways of debating--one is asking you to take yourself down to the level of someone who is incapable of dealing with that style of argument. It's one of those "ugly truths" which people try to claim is untrue by virtue of it going unacknowledged.

And even though I don't agree with special consideration for n00bs, I don't believe his intention were, "Hey! Ya'll are too smart. Could you be a little more stupid so people will join the site?"

He's asking us to hold back certain varieties of argumentation so that certain people won't become frustrated.

Which I disagree with. But by holding back varieties of argumentation, we are not becoming "dumb". We're simply becoming more... open to stupidity, I guess.

The only way to open yourself to something is to level with it.

Regardless of his intentions, I think it's a bad idea and more destructive than constructive.

I agree. Quite destructive.
J.Kenyon
Posts: 4,194
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9/13/2010 5:24:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/13/2010 5:18:59 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:16:06 PM, J.Kenyon wrote:
At 9/13/2010 5:14:51 PM, annhasle wrote:

LOL Ya get an ego boost from crushing n00bs?

Hey! I do legitimate debates, too.

Sure....Lol

http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...