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Insignifica
Posts: 285
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10/21/2015 8:30:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Why are so many of the debates in the challenge period just lists of topics?

Maybe it's just me, but that seems more like something which users should be putting on their own profiles.

It would get awfully crowded if every single member had a list like that in the challenge period.
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 8:34:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:30:22 PM, Insignifica wrote:
Why are so many of the debates in the challenge period just lists of topics?

I don't know, it's quite frustrating.

Maybe it's just me, but that seems more like something which users should be putting on their own profiles.

I agree. Forums are also the place to do this, as well as signatures.

It would get awfully crowded if every single member had a list like that in the challenge period.

Indeed it would
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
famousdebater
Posts: 3,940
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10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:30:22 PM, Insignifica wrote:
Why are so many of the debates in the challenge period just lists of topics?

Maybe it's just me, but that seems more like something which users should be putting on their own profiles.

It would get awfully crowded if every single member had a list like that in the challenge period.

They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.
"Life calls the tune, we dance."
John Galsworthy
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 8:38:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM, famousdebater wrote:
They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.

Creating a forum thread would be just as effective and less annoying. The challenge period debate section is for OPEN debate challenges, not for advertising your potential topics.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
famousdebater
Posts: 3,940
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10/21/2015 8:43:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:38:24 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM, famousdebater wrote:
They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.

Creating a forum thread would be just as effective and less annoying. The challenge period debate section is for OPEN debate challenges, not for advertising your potential topics.

I'm not against the usage of forum threads to advertise potential debate ideas. In fact I support this. What I meant by this argument was that it isn't a major problem at the moment and it personally doesn't bother me.
"Life calls the tune, we dance."
John Galsworthy
Jonbonbon
Posts: 2,759
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10/21/2015 8:47:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:38:24 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM, famousdebater wrote:
They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.

Creating a forum thread would be just as effective and less annoying. The challenge period debate section is for OPEN debate challenges, not for advertising your potential topics.

Well it's not so much an advertisement as it is a list of open debates on that debate. Most members do those topics because they're willing to debate anyone on those topics, and anyone can choose whichever one they want to debate on. Then the list of topics becomes a debate on one of those topics.

I think they're less effective than intended because most people look for controversy in the debates section not an extremely open intellectual challenge. So those topics get overlooked due to the lack of emotion associated with the challenge.

However, as far as I've seen, it would be incorrect to label them as "advertisements."
The Troll Queen.

I'm also the Troll Goddess of Reason. Sacrifices are appreciated but not necessary.

"I'm a vivacious sex fiend," SolonKR.

Go vote on one of my debates. I'm not that smart, so it'll probably be an easy decision.

Fite me m9
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 8:49:16 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:43:59 PM, famousdebater wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:38:24 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM, famousdebater wrote:
They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.

Creating a forum thread would be just as effective and less annoying. The challenge period debate section is for OPEN debate challenges, not for advertising your potential topics.

I'm not against the usage of forum threads to advertise potential debate ideas. In fact I support this. What I meant by this argument was that it isn't a major problem at the moment and it personally doesn't bother me.

Fair enough. :)
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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10/21/2015 8:49:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I agree. People should stop cluttering the challenge section with them.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

Follow the DDOlympics
: http://www.debate.org...

Open Debate Topics Project: http://www.debate.org...
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 8:51:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:47:34 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:
Well it's not so much an advertisement as it is a list of open debates on that debate.

Howso? They put those debates up to attract attention and attempt to get people to debate those topics. That fulfills the necessary quota to being an advertisement. Advertisement may have the connotation of tangibility, but theoretically, it's the same thing.

Most members do those topics because they're willing to debate anyone on those topics, and anyone can choose whichever one they want to debate on. Then the list of topics becomes a debate on one of those topics.

Yeah, but a forum would be more effective and result in less clutter.

I think they're less effective than intended because most people look for controversy in the debates section not an extremely open intellectual challenge. So those topics get overlooked due to the lack of emotion associated with the challenge.

Agreed.

However, as far as I've seen, it would be incorrect to label them as "advertisements."

Eh.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Insignifica
Posts: 285
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10/21/2015 8:54:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:49:45 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I agree. People should stop cluttering the challenge section with them.

How bad would it have to get for you to take presidential action?
Jonbonbon
Posts: 2,759
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10/21/2015 8:59:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:51:51 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:47:34 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:
Well it's not so much an advertisement as it is a list of open debates on that debate.

Howso? They put those debates up to attract attention and attempt to get people to debate those topics. That fulfills the necessary quota to being an advertisement. Advertisement may have the connotation of tangibility, but theoretically, it's the same thing.

I see it just as a debate challenge involving a selection of different debates. Like instead of spamming the debates section with all of those debates, you just make one topic overall and debate them one at a time.

Most members do those topics because they're willing to debate anyone on those topics, and anyone can choose whichever one they want to debate on. Then the list of topics becomes a debate on one of those topics.

Yeah, but a forum would be more effective and result in less clutter.

I do agree with that. I've seen these forum topics have a lot of successes in starting debates. Much more than the debate topics. I'm mainly just trying to calm down the fire in here, cuz it seemed like flames were about to start.

I don't think these debates are necessarily bad or that people shouldn't do them. I just don't think they're as effective as their creators intended.
The Troll Queen.

I'm also the Troll Goddess of Reason. Sacrifices are appreciated but not necessary.

"I'm a vivacious sex fiend," SolonKR.

Go vote on one of my debates. I'm not that smart, so it'll probably be an easy decision.

Fite me m9
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 9:02:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:59:37 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:
Yeah, but a forum would be more effective and result in less clutter.

I do agree with that. I've seen these forum topics have a lot of successes in starting debates. Much more than the debate topics. I'm mainly just trying to calm down the fire in here, cuz it seemed like flames were about to start.

I agree. Lol, I wasn't upset... I hope famousdebater wasn't either.. I was just expressing my opinion.

I don't think these debates are necessarily bad or that people shouldn't do them. I just don't think they're as effective as their creators intended.

Agreed, except I do find them particularly annoying when they are SO many.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 9:02:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:49:45 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I agree. People should stop cluttering the challenge section with them.

+1
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Jonbonbon
Posts: 2,759
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10/21/2015 9:05:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 9:02:09 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:59:37 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:
Yeah, but a forum would be more effective and result in less clutter.

I do agree with that. I've seen these forum topics have a lot of successes in starting debates. Much more than the debate topics. I'm mainly just trying to calm down the fire in here, cuz it seemed like flames were about to start.

I agree. Lol, I wasn't upset... I hope famousdebater wasn't either.. I was just expressing my opinion.

I don't think these debates are necessarily bad or that people shouldn't do them. I just don't think they're as effective as their creators intended.

Agreed, except I do find them particularly annoying when they are SO many in number.

Fix'd
The Troll Queen.

I'm also the Troll Goddess of Reason. Sacrifices are appreciated but not necessary.

"I'm a vivacious sex fiend," SolonKR.

Go vote on one of my debates. I'm not that smart, so it'll probably be an easy decision.

Fite me m9
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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10/21/2015 9:06:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:54:03 PM, Insignifica wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:49:45 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I agree. People should stop cluttering the challenge section with them.

How bad would it have to get for you to take presidential action?

As President, I am not a moderator. I cannot remove those debates, but I could take steps to try to discourage people from doing it. I may do this if it continues to happen, but my hope is that it's just a fad.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

Follow the DDOlympics
: http://www.debate.org...

Open Debate Topics Project: http://www.debate.org...
famousdebater
Posts: 3,940
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10/21/2015 9:15:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 9:02:09 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:59:37 PM, Jonbonbon wrote:
Yeah, but a forum would be more effective and result in less clutter.

I do agree with that. I've seen these forum topics have a lot of successes in starting debates. Much more than the debate topics. I'm mainly just trying to calm down the fire in here, cuz it seemed like flames were about to start.

I agree. Lol, I wasn't upset... I hope famousdebater wasn't either.. I was just expressing my opinion.

No, I wasn't upset and I doubt that it would have resulted in an argument.

I don't think these debates are necessarily bad or that people shouldn't do them. I just don't think they're as effective as their creators intended.

Agreed, except I do find them particularly annoying when they are SO many.
"Life calls the tune, we dance."
John Galsworthy
EndarkenedRationalist
Posts: 14,201
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10/21/2015 9:48:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 8:38:24 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM, famousdebater wrote:
They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.

Creating a forum thread would be just as effective and less annoying. The challenge period debate section is for OPEN debate challenges, not for advertising your potential topics.

... Don't YOU have one of those?
Insignifica
Posts: 285
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10/21/2015 9:50:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 9:06:50 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:54:03 PM, Insignifica wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:49:45 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I agree. People should stop cluttering the challenge section with them.

How bad would it have to get for you to take presidential action?

As President, I am not a moderator. I cannot remove those debates, but I could take steps to try to discourage people from doing it. I may do this if it continues to happen, but my hope is that it's just a fad.

Yes that's what I meant. Like privately message the instigators and request them to use their profiles or forum signatures. I know I would probably listen if the president of the site personally contacted me like that.
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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10/21/2015 9:52:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 9:50:31 PM, Insignifica wrote:
At 10/21/2015 9:06:50 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:54:03 PM, Insignifica wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:49:45 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I agree. People should stop cluttering the challenge section with them.

How bad would it have to get for you to take presidential action?

As President, I am not a moderator. I cannot remove those debates, but I could take steps to try to discourage people from doing it. I may do this if it continues to happen, but my hope is that it's just a fad.

Yes that's what I meant. Like privately message the instigators and request them to use their profiles or forum signatures. I know I would probably listen if the president of the site personally contacted me like that.

I might do that eventually. My hope is that they'll clear out in a few days, but if that doesn't change, we'll see.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

Follow the DDOlympics
: http://www.debate.org...

Open Debate Topics Project: http://www.debate.org...
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,292
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10/21/2015 10:06:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/21/2015 9:48:15 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:38:24 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 10/21/2015 8:37:02 PM, famousdebater wrote:
They expire after a while and don't stay there forever. At the moment it's stable but if it got out of hand the mods would deal with it. The problem with just posting them on your profile is mainly a problem that beginners face. Since beginners aren't recognized as much as the more popuar members, people don't check out their profiles as much. That is why you see new members doing this more than the well known members on the site.

Creating a forum thread would be just as effective and less annoying. The challenge period debate section is for OPEN debate challenges, not for advertising your potential topics.

... Don't YOU have one of those?

A forum? Yes. An OPEN debate challenge? No. I have both a forum and a debate, but the debate is cancelled and doesn't appear on the "open challenges" feed.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Zaradi
Posts: 14,125
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10/22/2015 6:44:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Okay people, how to ACTUALLY make a debate with your list of proposed topics without cluttering the challenge section.

Step 1: Create the debate
Step 2: Put your list of topics in the opening round
Step 3: Put the debate in the challenge section.
Step 4: IMMEDIATELY cancel the debate. This doesn't delete the debate, rather just closes it from challengers accepting and takes it off of the challenge list. This gives you a page that people can go to find your debates that you're interested in doing, while also giving you the option to edit the list later on without creating new forum threads.
Step 5: Put link on your profile, signature, etc.. Wherever you want to, really.
Step 6: Enjoy

You're welcome.
Want to debate? Pick a topic and hit me up! - http://www.debate.org...
logical-master123
Posts: 288
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10/22/2015 6:52:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/22/2015 6:44:51 AM, Zaradi wrote:
Okay people, how to ACTUALLY make a debate with your list of proposed topics without cluttering the challenge section.

Step 1: Create the debate
Step 2: Put your list of topics in the opening round
Step 3: Put the debate in the challenge section.
Step 4: IMMEDIATELY cancel the debate. This doesn't delete the debate, rather just closes it from challengers accepting and takes it off of the challenge list. This gives you a page that people can go to find your debates that you're interested in doing, while also giving you the option to edit the list later on without creating new forum threads.
Step 5: Put link on your profile, signature, etc.. Wherever you want to, really.
Step 6: Enjoy

You're welcome.

I cancelled the debate. Can I see it or others?
Came back to the site :)
Zaradi
Posts: 14,125
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10/22/2015 6:54:45 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/22/2015 6:52:06 AM, logical-master123 wrote:
At 10/22/2015 6:44:51 AM, Zaradi wrote:
Okay people, how to ACTUALLY make a debate with your list of proposed topics without cluttering the challenge section.

Step 1: Create the debate
Step 2: Put your list of topics in the opening round
Step 3: Put the debate in the challenge section.
Step 4: IMMEDIATELY cancel the debate. This doesn't delete the debate, rather just closes it from challengers accepting and takes it off of the challenge list. This gives you a page that people can go to find your debates that you're interested in doing, while also giving you the option to edit the list later on without creating new forum threads.
Step 5: Put link on your profile, signature, etc.. Wherever you want to, really.
Step 6: Enjoy

You're welcome.

I cancelled the debate. Can I see it or others?

Everyone can see it. An example is the link in my sig.
Want to debate? Pick a topic and hit me up! - http://www.debate.org...
Stefanwaal
Posts: 54
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10/22/2015 11:51:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
It seems like multiple people believe that those "Topics I would debate" debates clutter the challenges list. In fact, I believe they make the list NEATER.

The argument goes like this:
The goal of the "Challenges period" is to bring three things together: person A, person B and a topic. Currently somebody comes up with a topic and makes a debate about this. But since most people can handle multiple debates at the same time, people make multiple debates. Furthermore, not all debates get accepted, so people maybe want to make a few more. So one person might start three debates while that person could also make one "Topics I would debate" debate.

There are three alternatives presented in this forum thread, but I suspect they are both less effective than the "Topics I would debate" option.

The first one is making a forum thread. This has two problems. First of all, this will only move the problem from the "Challenge section" to the "Debate.org" forum. I'm willing to predict that once four people post their topics they want to debate on the forum a new forum post gets made called "Topics I would debate forum threads are annoying". The second problem is that when I look for debate challenges I look in the "Challenge section". Not the forum.

The second suggestion of making a debate, canceling it and putting the link in your signature is also ineffective. After all, mainly new members create those "Topics I would debate" debates. Those people have few forum posts, so their signatures are rarely spotted.

The third about making a list on your profile has the same flaw as posting it in your signature.

But since people still want a neat list in the challenge section here's my proposal:
We will allow "Topics I want to debate" debates. However, at the top you need to write something like: "I only want to accept 2 debates. After accepting those debates, this debate gets canceled."
This gets implemented by posting a comment in all the "Topics I want to debate" debates which mentions that people consider the threads annoying, so the maker should cancel it once it's no longer needed.