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What happened with this election

Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
This election wasn't a referendum on Bsh personally for the vast majority of people involved. I don't even think it was about the presidency in general. It was about two conflicting worldviews: the 'let's be nice, organize things, and build friendships, and be polite' group and the more 'toughen up buttercup, I can dish it out and take it, let's just wing it and see what happens' types. The groundswell uprising happened because the first group is so completely and utterly dominant in the DDO landscape, and because the second group is entirely necessary to its intellectual vitality.

The first group gained power, I believe, a little under two years ago, when the 'personal insults' part of the TOS was first enforced with more stringency, and cultural hallmarks of the site like the weekly stupid collapsed. As often happens, the more abstract value which these self-policing institutions, and the general atmosphere of boisterous camaraderie, contributed to the site was drastically, drastically underestimated. And the benefit of becoming more civil, more respectful, and more organized were overestimated: conflicts which would once erupt sporadically in flame wars and then petered out didn't go away, they just festered, with passive-aggression being the only acceptable outlet for interpersonal conflict or just plain dislike. Cliques formed, and I've seen some of the nastiness that goes on behind the veil: a flame war is very much preferable, because both outrage and sympathy are forthcoming and, most importantly, because it is cathartic as opposed to repressive.

This election was a schism, a violent rejection of an order which, while it may look pretty at first sight, coddles and weakens those with potential and serves to enable passive aggression. Bsh1 didn't create this 'kinder, gentler world 'order, but he was treated as a symbol of it because he does embody so many of its characteristics. And of course those characteristics are not inherently bad; it is the suffocating preponderance of this worldview, and not the worldview itself, which incites such violent rebellion. This election was tied because the more anarchic elements of DDO are still strong; they just want a chance to reestablish themselves. And the tragedy for those on the other side is that their standard toolbox for addressing problems is completely impotent to address this one: no policy, committee, or conference will help a group which feels smothered by rules and regulations. An arsonist has no use for a hammer, nails, and planks.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
ShabShoral
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12/14/2015 3:40:20 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
"An arsonist has no use for a hammer, nails, and planks."

This is the most poetic summation of the election I've seen.
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thett3
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12/14/2015 3:41:23 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
This. Skep, you're much more articulate than I but you always manage to explain exactly what's going on in my head
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
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12/14/2015 3:41:55 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
Jesus fck, Skep is the one of the most articulate fckers I've ever met.

Like, really, we should just lynch him out of envy.


VTL Skep
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ResponsiblyIrresponsible
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12/14/2015 3:43:07 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:42:44 AM, Romanii wrote:
Spot on.

Put your vote on Skep right now, or you're next.
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ESocialBookworm
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12/14/2015 3:45:28 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:

I want to hear you speak.
Solonkr~
I don't care about whether an ideology is "necessary" or not,
I care about how to solve problems,
which is what everyone else should also care about.

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Me~
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MY SHIP SAILEY MUST SAIL"

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P.S. Shipped Sailey before it was cannon bitches.
1harderthanyouthink
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12/14/2015 3:47:28 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
I think that the number of people that voted Wylted for the reasons you stated are very much a minority of those voters.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

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Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 3:49:22 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:40:56 AM, TheGreatAndPowerful wrote:
Wylted

The dream lives.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 3:50:31 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:47:28 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
I think that the number of people that voted Wylted for the reasons you stated are very much a minority of those voters.

Why? You have the most important contributors to his campaign in this thread right now, agreeing with this assessment of their views.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 3:51:06 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:41:23 AM, thett3 wrote:
This. Skep, you're much more articulate than I but you always manage to explain exactly what's going on in my head

Aw shucks *blushes*
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
PetersSmith
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12/14/2015 3:51:22 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
This election wasn't a referendum on Bsh personally for the vast majority of people involved. I don't even think it was about the presidency in general. It was about two conflicting worldviews: the 'let's be nice, organize things, and build friendships, and be polite' group and the more 'toughen up buttercup, I can dish it out and take it, let's just wing it and see what happens' types. The groundswell uprising happened because the first group is so completely and utterly dominant in the DDO landscape, and because the second group is entirely necessary to its intellectual vitality.

The first group gained power, I believe, a little under two years ago, when the 'personal insults' part of the TOS was first enforced with more stringency, and cultural hallmarks of the site like the weekly stupid collapsed. As often happens, the more abstract value which these self-policing institutions, and the general atmosphere of boisterous camaraderie, contributed to the site was drastically, drastically underestimated. And the benefit of becoming more civil, more respectful, and more organized were overestimated: conflicts which would once erupt sporadically in flame wars and then petered out didn't go away, they just festered, with passive-aggression being the only acceptable outlet for interpersonal conflict or just plain dislike. Cliques formed, and I've seen some of the nastiness that goes on behind the veil: a flame war is very much preferable, because both outrage and sympathy are forthcoming and, most importantly, because it is cathartic as opposed to repressive.

This election was a schism, a violent rejection of an order which, while it may look pretty at first sight, coddles and weakens those with potential and serves to enable passive aggression. Bsh1 didn't create this 'kinder, gentler world 'order, but he was treated as a symbol of it because he does embody so many of its characteristics. And of course those characteristics are not inherently bad; it is the suffocating preponderance of this worldview, and not the worldview itself, which incites such violent rebellion. This election was tied because the more anarchic elements of DDO are still strong; they just want a chance to reestablish themselves. And the tragedy for those on the other side is that their standard toolbox for addressing problems is completely impotent to address this one: no policy, committee, or conference will help a group which feels smothered by rules and regulations. An arsonist has no use for a hammer, nails, and planks.

No one but me voted for airmax. That's what happened.
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thett3
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12/14/2015 3:51:57 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:51:06 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:41:23 AM, thett3 wrote:
This. Skep, you're much more articulate than I but you always manage to explain exactly what's going on in my head

Aw shucks *blushes*

Except your godless heathen religious views. You'd make a great Christian apologist, but instead you'd rather burn
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
daytonanerd
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12/14/2015 3:55:29 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
This election wasn't a referendum on Bsh personally for the vast majority of people involved. I don't even think it was about the presidency in general. It was about two conflicting worldviews: the 'let's be nice, organize things, and build friendships, and be polite' group and the more 'toughen up buttercup, I can dish it out and take it, let's just wing it and see what happens' types. The groundswell uprising happened because the first group is so completely and utterly dominant in the DDO landscape, and because the second group is entirely necessary to its intellectual vitality.

The first group gained power, I believe, a little under two years ago, when the 'personal insults' part of the TOS was first enforced with more stringency, and cultural hallmarks of the site like the weekly stupid collapsed. As often happens, the more abstract value which these self-policing institutions, and the general atmosphere of boisterous camaraderie, contributed to the site was drastically, drastically underestimated. And the benefit of becoming more civil, more respectful, and more organized were overestimated: conflicts which would once erupt sporadically in flame wars and then petered out didn't go away, they just festered, with passive-aggression being the only acceptable outlet for interpersonal conflict or just plain dislike. Cliques formed, and I've seen some of the nastiness that goes on behind the veil: a flame war is very much preferable, because both outrage and sympathy are forthcoming and, most importantly, because it is cathartic as opposed to repressive.

This election was a schism, a violent rejection of an order which, while it may look pretty at first sight, coddles and weakens those with potential and serves to enable passive aggression. Bsh1 didn't create this 'kinder, gentler world 'order, but he was treated as a symbol of it because he does embody so many of its characteristics. And of course those characteristics are not inherently bad; it is the suffocating preponderance of this worldview, and not the worldview itself, which incites such violent rebellion. This election was tied because the more anarchic elements of DDO are still strong; they just want a chance to reestablish themselves. And the tragedy for those on the other side is that their standard toolbox for addressing problems is completely impotent to address this one: no policy, committee, or conference will help a group which feels smothered by rules and regulations. An arsonist has no use for a hammer, nails, and planks.

So what you're saying was that I was right 2 years ago back when Max enforced the personal insults thing and I, along with Bench, got megapissed?
#FeeltheFreezerBern
1harderthanyouthink
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12/14/2015 3:55:43 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:50:31 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:47:28 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
I think that the number of people that voted Wylted for the reasons you stated are very much a minority of those voters.

Why? You have the most important contributors to his campaign in this thread right now, agreeing with this assessment of their views.

You aren't his most important contributors. You're his smartest supporters, I think - and you're also the only ones who, while you started with trolling a bit, actually had an underlying reason. I can't say that the people that just wanted to be the ones to "make it interesting" in the last hour had a legitimate reason - nor do I think the majority of the people Wylted asked to vote for him who ended up doing so thought it out as you have.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

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thett3
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12/14/2015 4:03:42 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
I legitimately think that a step in the right direction is to let Imabench do the weekly stupid again
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#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
dylancatlow
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12/14/2015 4:06:37 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
An arsonist has no use for a hammer, nails, and planks.

You should write a book called "Analogies with Skepsikyma"
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 4:08:04 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:55:29 AM, daytonanerd wrote:

So what you're saying was that I was right 2 years ago back when Max enforced the personal insults thing and I, along with Bench, got megapissed?

Um, yeah. I was megapissed as well, remember? I mellowed out about it since then, but I was firmly anti when it went through.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
EndarkenedRationalist
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12/14/2015 4:08:17 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:03:42 AM, thett3 wrote:
I legitimately think that a step in the right direction is to let Imabench do the weekly stupid again

+1
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 4:09:11 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:03:42 AM, thett3 wrote:
I legitimately think that a step in the right direction is to let Imabench do the weekly stupid again

Actually, I do to. Also, make the 'misc' forum exempt from the no insults rule. Just have an 'enter at your own risk' subforum. Then he could post it there.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 4:09:29 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
*too
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
ShabShoral
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12/14/2015 4:10:15 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:06:37 AM, dylancatlow wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
An arsonist has no use for a hammer, nails, and planks.

You should write a book called "Analogies with Skepsikyma"

Seconded.
"This site is trash as a debate site. It's club penguin for dysfunctional adults."

~ Skepsikyma <3

"Your idea of good writing is like Spinoza mixed with Heidegger."

~ Dylly Dylly Cat Cat

"You seem to aspire to be a cross between a Jewish hipster, an old school WASP aristocrat, and a political iconoclast"

~ Thett the Mighty
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 4:11:19 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:51:57 AM, thett3 wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:51:06 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:41:23 AM, thett3 wrote:
This. Skep, you're much more articulate than I but you always manage to explain exactly what's going on in my head

Aw shucks *blushes*

Except your godless heathen religious views. You'd make a great Christian apologist, but instead you'd rather burn

Haha, I actually end up being a Christian apologist sometimes, because I get sick of dumb atheist arguments. So I end up playing devil's advocate (well, I guess a more proper term in this case is 'Jesus's advocate').
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
thett3
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12/14/2015 4:13:43 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:11:19 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:51:57 AM, thett3 wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:51:06 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:41:23 AM, thett3 wrote:
This. Skep, you're much more articulate than I but you always manage to explain exactly what's going on in my head

Aw shucks *blushes*

Except your godless heathen religious views. You'd make a great Christian apologist, but instead you'd rather burn

Haha, I actually end up being a Christian apologist sometimes, because I get sick of dumb atheist arguments. So I end up playing devil's advocate (well, I guess a more proper term in this case is 'Jesus's advocate').

Fight the power http://img.ifcdn.com...
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
lamerde
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12/14/2015 4:21:32 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
passive-aggression

I feel like taking credit for the popularity of this word today.
Why I ignore YYW:
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http://www.debate.org...
Calling someone a bitch multiple times while claiming you're taking the high road is an art form, I suppose: http://www.debate.org...
bsh1
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12/14/2015 4:22:16 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:21:32 AM, lamerde wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:36:05 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
passive-aggression

I feel like taking credit for the popularity of this word today.

Lol.
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daytonanerd
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12/14/2015 4:24:15 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:08:04 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:55:29 AM, daytonanerd wrote:

So what you're saying was that I was right 2 years ago back when Max enforced the personal insults thing and I, along with Bench, got megapissed?

Um, yeah. I was megapissed as well, remember? I mellowed out about it since then, but I was firmly anti when it went through.

Oh yeah, that's right, you too were on my side, buddy. Jeez, the memories sort of get shaken up after a while. I'm still kind of pissed about it.
#FeeltheFreezerBern
Skepsikyma
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12/14/2015 4:25:27 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 3:55:43 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:50:31 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 12/14/2015 3:47:28 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
I think that the number of people that voted Wylted for the reasons you stated are very much a minority of those voters.

Why? You have the most important contributors to his campaign in this thread right now, agreeing with this assessment of their views.

You aren't his most important contributors. You're his smartest supporters, I think - and you're also the only ones who, while you started with trolling a bit, actually had an underlying reason. I can't say that the people that just wanted to be the ones to "make it interesting" in the last hour had a legitimate reason - nor do I think the majority of the people Wylted asked to vote for him who ended up doing so thought it out as you have.

So why do you think that other people voted for Wylted? Because Bsh1 is just SUCH an abrasive @sshole? /sarcasm

I honestly don't know what you think the agenda of the opposition was if it wasn't this.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -