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Refusing to recognize imabench

F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 2:36:29 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
Here's a proposal for everyone who is interested in retaining the presidency and wants the status quo to continue as is: simply refuse to recognize imabench or any form of abolition. The logic is pretty simple:

As long as solid segment of the site wants the presidency, all we need to do is hold elections every six months and elect a president. The president has no impact on the lives or user experience of anyone that's not interested in it. "Drama" is not an excuse because if it's truly the desire of the abolitionists to minimize drama, they would simply not participate in it. Instead they created the biggest drama the site has ever seen by dividing the members into pro-presidency and anti-presidency camps. imabench is selling the Kool-Aid and an astonishing number of people are actually buying the line that he, master troll of DDO is on a righteous crusade to end drama once and for all. I suppose he also promised some cheese from the moon and a tour of the galaxy to go along with it.

If you want the presidency to remain, simply hold elections every six months, elect a president, and continue as before. Neither imabench nor the abolitionists have any leverage to diminish your own experience on the site. Ignore the "abolitionist" movement. If they don't want the presidency, they can refuse to participate in presidency-related matters. My guess is they'll probably come around. For the ones that don't, no big deal.
YYW
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6/22/2016 2:37:29 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 2:36:29 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Here's a proposal for everyone who is interested in retaining the presidency and wants the status quo to continue as is: simply refuse to recognize imabench or any form of abolition. The logic is pretty simple:

As long as solid segment of the site wants the presidency, all we need to do is hold elections every six months and elect a president. The president has no impact on the lives or user experience of anyone that's not interested in it. "Drama" is not an excuse because if it's truly the desire of the abolitionists to minimize drama, they would simply not participate in it. Instead they created the biggest drama the site has ever seen by dividing the members into pro-presidency and anti-presidency camps. imabench is selling the Kool-Aid and an astonishing number of people are actually buying the line that he, master troll of DDO is on a righteous crusade to end drama once and for all. I suppose he also promised some cheese from the moon and a tour of the galaxy to go along with it.

If you want the presidency to remain, simply hold elections every six months, elect a president, and continue as before. Neither imabench nor the abolitionists have any leverage to diminish your own experience on the site. Ignore the "abolitionist" movement. If they don't want the presidency, they can refuse to participate in presidency-related matters. My guess is they'll probably come around. For the ones that don't, no big deal.

Yes I pretty much said the same thing about two months ago.
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1harderthanyouthink
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6/22/2016 2:48:17 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
I will honor abolition for as long as it is implemented, but I think we should still have votes every 6 months if abolition wins on whether to continue with abolition or to reinstate the Presidency.

I mean, democracy is kind of a good thing.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

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F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 3:04:26 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 2:48:17 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
I will honor abolition for as long as it is implemented, but I think we should still have votes every 6 months if abolition wins on whether to continue with abolition or to reinstate the Presidency.

I mean, democracy is kind of a good thing.

If you want abolition, that's your perogative. I'm saying you don't have to recognize it if you don't want to.

Democracy is choosing the president. If a segment of vocal people on the site don't want to vote, that's their choice and is not binding on you. They don't have any legitimate claim to prevent you to electing a president just as you electing a president every six months doesn't affect their lives.
PetersSmith
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6/22/2016 3:16:50 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 2:36:29 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Here's a proposal for everyone who is interested in retaining the presidency and wants the status quo to continue as is: simply refuse to recognize imabench or any form of abolition. The logic is pretty simple:

As long as solid segment of the site wants the presidency, all we need to do is hold elections every six months and elect a president. The president has no impact on the lives or user experience of anyone that's not interested in it. "Drama" is not an excuse because if it's truly the desire of the abolitionists to minimize drama, they would simply not participate in it. Instead they created the biggest drama the site has ever seen by dividing the members into pro-presidency and anti-presidency camps. imabench is selling the Kool-Aid and an astonishing number of people are actually buying the line that he, master troll of DDO is on a righteous crusade to end drama once and for all. I suppose he also promised some cheese from the moon and a tour of the galaxy to go along with it.

If you want the presidency to remain, simply hold elections every six months, elect a president, and continue as before. Neither imabench nor the abolitionists have any leverage to diminish your own experience on the site. Ignore the "abolitionist" movement. If they don't want the presidency, they can refuse to participate in presidency-related matters. My guess is they'll probably come around. For the ones that don't, no big deal.

It's not very nice to just refuse to acknowledge someone :(
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1harderthanyouthink
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6/22/2016 3:18:54 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:04:26 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 6/22/2016 2:48:17 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
I will honor abolition for as long as it is implemented, but I think we should still have votes every 6 months if abolition wins on whether to continue with abolition or to reinstate the Presidency.

I mean, democracy is kind of a good thing.

If you want abolition, that's your perogative.

It's not my first choice.

I'm saying you don't have to recognize it if you don't want to.

Democracy is choosing the president. If a segment of vocal people on the site don't want to vote, that's their choice and is not binding on you. They don't have any legitimate claim to prevent you to electing a president just as you electing a president every six months doesn't affect their lives.

And if people want no President, they shall get no President. It does effect them - pretending their thoughts don't exist don't make them go away.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

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imabench
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6/22/2016 3:24:44 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
You know the pro-presidency group is getting really desperate when they flat out refuse to even recognize the existence of the other side..... It only shows how they want to live in their own little world rather than the reality we currently occupy ;D
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

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F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 3:25:27 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:18:54 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
And if people want no President, they shall get no President. It does effect them - pretending their thoughts don't exist don't make them go away.

The logical fallacy here is equating having a president with having no president. They don't get to control and prevent others from having elections and electing presidents.

They can't choose for others to "have no president." That's not up to them. What is up to them is to not take part in any presidency related matters.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 3:28:15 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:24:44 AM, imabench wrote:
You know the pro-presidency group is getting really desperate when they flat out refuse to even recognize the existence of the other side..... It only shows how they want to live in their own little world rather than the reality we currently occupy ;D

If the other side doesn't want a president, then they can excuse themselves of all presidency-related matters. Your entire campaign is sisyphean endeavor that won't affect anything in the long run.
imabench
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6/22/2016 3:36:37 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:28:15 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:24:44 AM, imabench wrote:
You know the pro-presidency group is getting really desperate when they flat out refuse to even recognize the existence of the other side..... It only shows how they want to live in their own little world rather than the reality we currently occupy ;D

If the other side doesn't want a president, then they can excuse themselves of all presidency-related matters.

We can, but we wont, because now I have provided a means for actually getting rid of the presidency which no other abolitionist candidate or abolition supporter has done before. You dont get to keep the presidency just by ignoring those who see it for its pointlessness. We're here. Some of us are queer. Get used to it.

Your entire campaign is sisyphean endeavor that won't affect anything in the long run.

Actually my campaign has already changed everything. The lines are definitively drawn between abolitionists and pro-presidency voters now. Future abolitionist candidates have a platform they can run on to abolish the presidency should I come up just short in this election. Abolitionism is now a legitimate cause, and people are flocking to it. I have already affected elections in the long run, you just deny it because pro-presidency supporters have a tendency to deny the reality of the situation
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 3:40:22 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:36:37 AM, imabench wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:28:15 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:24:44 AM, imabench wrote:
You know the pro-presidency group is getting really desperate when they flat out refuse to even recognize the existence of the other side..... It only shows how they want to live in their own little world rather than the reality we currently occupy ;D

If the other side doesn't want a president, then they can excuse themselves of all presidency-related matters.

We can, but we wont, because now I have provided a means for actually getting rid of the presidency which no other abolitionist candidate or abolition supporter has done before. You dont get to keep the presidency just by ignoring those who see it for its pointlessness. We're here. Some of us are queer. Get used to it.

Your entire campaign is sisyphean endeavor that won't affect anything in the long run.

Actually my campaign has already changed everything. The lines are definitively drawn between abolitionists and pro-presidency voters now. Future abolitionist candidates have a platform they can run on to abolish the presidency should I come up just short in this election. Abolitionism is now a legitimate cause, and people are flocking to it. I have already affected elections in the long run, you just deny it because pro-presidency supporters have a tendency to deny the reality of the situation

The difference is that pro-presidency members holding their own elections every six months doesn't infringe on your experience. We're not telling you to be or do anything. You and your supporters can continue chugging along as usual and pretend that the presidency doesn't exist.

On the other hand, there will be a president doing great things for the site that the pro-presidency members look to as a site leader. People who are anti-presidency can still join in and contribute to social programs. Or they can choose not to. That's their choice.

You don't get to impose your choices on anyone else.
imabench
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6/22/2016 3:47:28 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:40:22 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:

The difference is that pro-presidency members holding their own elections every six months doesn't infringe on your experience.

False opinion.... People have always been tired of seeing a flurry of presidency threads in the main forum dating back to the days of jimtimmy, long before abolitionism was even born.

We're not telling you to be or do anything.

Youre literally telling people to simply 'ignore' the very thing they want to abolish....

You and your supporters can continue chugging along as usual and pretend that the presidency doesn't exist.

Or, we can get rid of the presidency, replace it with a new system, and see how it works.

On the other hand, there will be a president doing great things for the site

The president can barely do anything for the site, let alone 'great' things.

People who are anti-presidency can still join in and contribute to social programs. Or they can choose not to. That's their choice.

Until they believe that those programs are useless. then they should shut up and go crawl back in a hole like you order them to.

You don't get to impose your choices on anyone else.

Says the guy who literally is trying to impose the presidency onto others by telling them to ignore it if it bothers them.......... I cant tell if youre really cant see your own hypocrisy here, or youre just that devoted to being a sheep for DK or 1harder.
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
thett3
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6/22/2016 3:49:52 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:24:44 AM, imabench wrote:
You know the pro-presidency group is getting really desperate when they flat out refuse to even recognize the existence of the other side..... It only shows how they want to live in their own little world rather than the reality we currently occupy ;D

Absolutely crushing response, sir!
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 3:52:17 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
1. You can't control what other people post. What a member posts is their own choice and if the members on this site want to post flurries of threads about the presidency, tough luck.

2. I'm not telling you to do anything. I'm addressing the pro-presidency members and telling them that if they really do want the presidency to remain, to simply hold elections and continue as before. Nothing that you or your supporters do should infringe on their right to do as they please.

3. I don't want to impose the presidency on you. You and your supporters can pretend that it doesn't exist if you desire. The ones that do want the presidency are the ones that'll make use of it. Live and let live.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.
Skepsikyma
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6/22/2016 3:58:14 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.

I'm founding group Q: we will vote for Supreme Vice-President Thett, and recognize him and only him as the leader of our site regardless of the election outcomes, because we choose not to recognize any president as the position has henceforth been abolished during Thett's interim government.

I don't know why anyone hasn't thought of this before. We can have twenty 'presidents' which all refuse to recognize one another's authority or right to exist. Everyone is happy, and the sanctity of the office if preserved for posterity!
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
ShabShoral
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6/22/2016 3:59:18 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:58:14 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.

I'm founding group Q: we will vote for Supreme Vice-President Thett, and recognize him and only him as the leader of our site regardless of the election outcomes, because we choose not to recognize any president as the position has henceforth been abolished during Thett's interim government.

I don't know why anyone hasn't thought of this before. We can have twenty 'presidents' which all refuse to recognize one another's authority or right to exist. Everyone is happy, and the sanctity of the office if preserved for posterity!

B A S E D
A
S
E
D
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ShabShoral
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6/22/2016 4:00:54 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
A recent variant of anarchistic theory, which is befuddling some of the younger advocates of freedom, is a weird absurdity called "competing governments." Accepting the basic premise of the modern statists"who see no difference between the functions of government and the functions of industry, between force and production, and who advocate government ownership of business"the proponents of "competing governments" take the other side of the same coin and declare that since competition is so beneficial to business, it should also be applied to government. Instead of a single, monopolistic government, they declare, there should be a number of different governments in the same geographical area, competing for the allegiance of individual citizens, with every citizen free to "shop" and to patronize whatever government he chooses.

Remember that forcible restraint of men is the only service a government has to offer. Ask yourself what a competition in forcible restraint would have to mean.

One cannot call this theory a contradiction in terms, since it is obviously devoid of any understanding of the terms "competition" and "government." Nor can one call it a floating abstraction, since it is devoid of any contact with or reference to reality and cannot be concretized at all, not even roughly or approximately. One illustration will be sufficient: suppose Mr. Smith, a customer of Government A, suspects that his next-door neighbor, Mr. Jones, a customer of Government B, has robbed him; a squad of Police A proceeds to Mr. Jones" house and is met at the door by a squad of Police B, who declare that they do not accept the validity of Mr. Smith"s complaint and do not recognize the authority of Government A. What happens then? You take it from there.
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imabench
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6/22/2016 4:01:59 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:52:17 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:

1. You can't control what other people post.

The crazy things is that we can in this scenario.... If we replace the Presidency with Conventions, than all the presidency and campaign posts go away, and are instead replaced with actual proposals to better the site.....

if the members on this site want to post flurries of threads about the presidency, tough luck.

By all means keep doing it, it only pushes people further to my side and hurting your own cause ;)

2. I'm not telling you to do anything.

Not me specifically no, but your telling other people to do things based on YOUR own opinions rather than their own opinions, which goes entirely against the idea that youre somehow not telling anyone to do anything.....

I'm addressing the pro-presidency members and telling them that if they really do want the presidency to remain, to simply hold elections and continue as before.

And that would have worked in the past when abolition candidates were a joke, but now that Ive legitimized the movement, that might not be the best strategy for pro-presidency supporters to pursue. Abolitionist voters almost hijacked the presidency last time by getting Wylted elected over Bsh, you really think that leaving them on their own will make them go away now that Ive legitimized their effort to abolish the presidency? Guess again.

Nothing that you or your supporters do should infringe on their right to do as they please.

We're getting rid of the presidency, not freedom of speech..... You act as if abolitionism is somehow tyrannical by nature, which only further paints the picture that pro-presidency voters are irrationally attached to the presidency

3. I don't want to impose the presidency on you. You and your supporters can pretend that it doesn't exist if you desire. The ones that do want the presidency are the ones that'll make use of it. Live and let live.

No. Not anymore. Our time has come and we will no longer simply leave the presidency to those who want it. If you want to cling to the past, then vote to cling to the past. The presidency is done, Conventions are the future. Pick a side.
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
thett3
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6/22/2016 4:01:59 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.

Competing jurisdictions.

This is a website, not a Rothbardian wet dream.
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#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 4:03:19 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 3:58:14 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.

I'm founding group Q: we will vote for Supreme Vice-President Thett, and recognize him and only him as the leader of our site regardless of the election outcomes, because we choose not to recognize any president as the position has henceforth been abolished during Thett's interim government.

I don't know why anyone hasn't thought of this before. We can have twenty 'presidents' which all refuse to recognize one another's authority or right to exist. Everyone is happy, and the sanctity of the office if preserved for posterity!

That's not the way it works. The presidency is going to be there. If you don't like it, pretend it doesn't exist.
imabench
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6/22/2016 4:05:39 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:03:19 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:58:14 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.

I'm founding group Q: we will vote for Supreme Vice-President Thett, and recognize him and only him as the leader of our site regardless of the election outcomes, because we choose not to recognize any president as the position has henceforth been abolished during Thett's interim government.

I don't know why anyone hasn't thought of this before. We can have twenty 'presidents' which all refuse to recognize one another's authority or right to exist. Everyone is happy, and the sanctity of the office if preserved for posterity!

That's not the way it works. The presidency is going to be there.

Not if I win ;)
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
ShabShoral
Posts: 3,236
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6/22/2016 4:08:01 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:03:19 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:58:14 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 6/22/2016 3:54:45 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Think of the pro and anti presidency groups as two separate groups: P and A.

P will elect a president every six months.

A will not elect a president and will hold "conventions" or whatever they choose amongst themselves.

I'm founding group Q: we will vote for Supreme Vice-President Thett, and recognize him and only him as the leader of our site regardless of the election outcomes, because we choose not to recognize any president as the position has henceforth been abolished during Thett's interim government.

I don't know why anyone hasn't thought of this before. We can have twenty 'presidents' which all refuse to recognize one another's authority or right to exist. Everyone is happy, and the sanctity of the office if preserved for posterity!

That's not the way it works.

SEVEN POINTS TO PRO
"This site is trash as a debate site. It's club penguin for dysfunctional adults."

~ Skepsikyma <3

"Your idea of good writing is like Spinoza mixed with Heidegger."

~ Dylly Dylly Cat Cat

"You seem to aspire to be a cross between a Jewish hipster, an old school WASP aristocrat, and a political iconoclast"

~ Thett the Mighty

"fvck omg ur face"

~ Liz
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 4:10:40 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
If pro-presidency people like 1harder and ShabShoral want to "recognize" abolition on the basis of a logical fallacy, that's their perogative. You are the ones losing out by not doing what you want because you are unable to identify why imabench's campaign is fallacious. That's something I've explained to you. Take it how you will. If you want to impose artificial restrictions on yourself and not do something you want to do, then all I'm going to do is *shrug.*
Skepsikyma
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6/22/2016 4:11:09 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:00:54 AM, ShabShoral wrote:
A recent variant of anarchistic theory, which is befuddling some of the younger advocates of freedom, is a weird absurdity called "competing governments." Accepting the basic premise of the modern statists"who see no difference between the functions of government and the functions of industry, between force and production, and who advocate government ownership of business"the proponents of "competing governments" take the other side of the same coin and declare that since competition is so beneficial to business, it should also be applied to government. Instead of a single, monopolistic government, they declare, there should be a number of different governments in the same geographical area, competing for the allegiance of individual citizens, with every citizen free to "shop" and to patronize whatever government he chooses.

Remember that forcible restraint of men is the only service a government has to offer. Ask yourself what a competition in forcible restraint would have to mean.

One cannot call this theory a contradiction in terms, since it is obviously devoid of any understanding of the terms "competition" and "government." Nor can one call it a floating abstraction, since it is devoid of any contact with or reference to reality and cannot be concretized at all, not even roughly or approximately. One illustration will be sufficient: suppose Mr. Smith, a customer of Government A, suspects that his next-door neighbor, Mr. Jones, a customer of Government B, has robbed him; a squad of Police A proceeds to Mr. Jones" house and is met at the door by a squad of Police B, who declare that they do not accept the validity of Mr. Smith"s complaint and do not recognize the authority of Government A. What happens then? You take it from there.

https://themindlessphilosopher.files.wordpress.com...
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
ShabShoral
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6/22/2016 4:11:25 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:10:40 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
If pro-presidency people like 1harder and ShabShoral want to "recognize" abolition on the basis of a logical fallacy, that's their perogative. You are the ones losing out by not doing what you want because you are unable to identify why imabench's campaign is fallacious. That's something I've explained to you. Take it how you will. If you want to impose artificial restrictions on yourself and not do something you want to do, then all I'm going to do is *shrug.*

lmao since when am I "pro presidency"
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ShabShoral
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6/22/2016 4:12:10 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:11:09 AM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 6/22/2016 4:00:54 AM, ShabShoral wrote:
A recent variant of anarchistic theory, which is befuddling some of the younger advocates of freedom, is a weird absurdity called "competing governments." Accepting the basic premise of the modern statists"who see no difference between the functions of government and the functions of industry, between force and production, and who advocate government ownership of business"the proponents of "competing governments" take the other side of the same coin and declare that since competition is so beneficial to business, it should also be applied to government. Instead of a single, monopolistic government, they declare, there should be a number of different governments in the same geographical area, competing for the allegiance of individual citizens, with every citizen free to "shop" and to patronize whatever government he chooses.

Remember that forcible restraint of men is the only service a government has to offer. Ask yourself what a competition in forcible restraint would have to mean.

One cannot call this theory a contradiction in terms, since it is obviously devoid of any understanding of the terms "competition" and "government." Nor can one call it a floating abstraction, since it is devoid of any contact with or reference to reality and cannot be concretized at all, not even roughly or approximately. One illustration will be sufficient: suppose Mr. Smith, a customer of Government A, suspects that his next-door neighbor, Mr. Jones, a customer of Government B, has robbed him; a squad of Police A proceeds to Mr. Jones" house and is met at the door by a squad of Police B, who declare that they do not accept the validity of Mr. Smith"s complaint and do not recognize the authority of Government A. What happens then? You take it from there.

https://themindlessphilosopher.files.wordpress.com...

Well done, Comrade :)
"This site is trash as a debate site. It's club penguin for dysfunctional adults."

~ Skepsikyma <3

"Your idea of good writing is like Spinoza mixed with Heidegger."

~ Dylly Dylly Cat Cat

"You seem to aspire to be a cross between a Jewish hipster, an old school WASP aristocrat, and a political iconoclast"

~ Thett the Mighty

"fvck omg ur face"

~ Liz
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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6/22/2016 4:12:24 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:11:25 AM, ShabShoral wrote:
At 6/22/2016 4:10:40 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
If pro-presidency people like 1harder and ShabShoral want to "recognize" abolition on the basis of a logical fallacy, that's their perogative. You are the ones losing out by not doing what you want because you are unable to identify why imabench's campaign is fallacious. That's something I've explained to you. Take it how you will. If you want to impose artificial restrictions on yourself and not do something you want to do, then all I'm going to do is *shrug.*

lmao since when am I "pro presidency"

Must have mistaken you for someone else then. What I said still applies to harder and anyone with the same opinion as him.
imabench
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6/22/2016 4:14:26 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:10:40 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
If pro-presidency people like 1harder and ShabShoral

Does F-16 actually think that Shab Shoral is pro-presidency?..... lol XD

want to "recognize" abolition on the basis of a logical fallacy, that's their perogative. You are the ones losing out by not doing what you want because you are unable to identify why imabench's campaign is fallacious.

The thing is though that its not fallacious.... If it were, you would be busy pointing out why its fallacious rather than simply telling people to ignore it ;)
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ShabShoral
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6/22/2016 4:22:53 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/22/2016 4:14:26 AM, imabench wrote:
At 6/22/2016 4:10:40 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
If pro-presidency people like 1harder and ShabShoral

Does F-16 actually think that Shab Shoral is pro-presidency?..... lol XD
Seriously... I think I was an abolitionist before Max's last term!
want to "recognize" abolition on the basis of a logical fallacy, that's their perogative. You are the ones losing out by not doing what you want because you are unable to identify why imabench's campaign is fallacious.

The thing is though that its not fallacious.... If it were, you would be busy pointing out why its fallacious rather than simply telling people to ignore it ;)

F-16 is employing the venerable debating style of the ostrich.
"This site is trash as a debate site. It's club penguin for dysfunctional adults."

~ Skepsikyma <3

"Your idea of good writing is like Spinoza mixed with Heidegger."

~ Dylly Dylly Cat Cat

"You seem to aspire to be a cross between a Jewish hipster, an old school WASP aristocrat, and a political iconoclast"

~ Thett the Mighty

"fvck omg ur face"

~ Liz