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Minimum Wage to $15 per Hour

ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
lannan13
Posts: 23,034
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9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.
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If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
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ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 1:27:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?

Well, I was hoping to get feedback and have people try to show that it should be raised or that it not. For some reason, few people ever respond to my forums lol
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Varrack
Posts: 2,410
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9/30/2015 1:35:07 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:27:20 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?

Well, I was hoping to get feedback and have people try to show that it should be raised or that it not. For some reason, few people ever respond to my forums lol

Make some bad arguments in favor of it and I guarantee you'll get a lot more interest :)
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 1:40:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:35:07 AM, Varrack wrote:
At 9/30/2015 1:27:20 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?

Well, I was hoping to get feedback and have people try to show that it should be raised or that it not. For some reason, few people ever respond to my forums lol

Make some bad arguments in favor of it and I guarantee you'll get a lot more interest :)

Lol. Sounds good. You could also give your input... ;) I'd be interested to hear your stance.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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9/30/2015 1:46:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:27:20 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?

Well, I was hoping to get feedback and have people try to show that it should be raised or that it not. For some reason, few people ever respond to my forums lol

Do what Varrack said, he is wise
Varrack
Posts: 2,410
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9/30/2015 1:50:32 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:40:39 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/30/2015 1:35:07 AM, Varrack wrote:
At 9/30/2015 1:27:20 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?

Well, I was hoping to get feedback and have people try to show that it should be raised or that it not. For some reason, few people ever respond to my forums lol

Make some bad arguments in favor of it and I guarantee you'll get a lot more interest :)

Lol. Sounds good. You could also give your input... ;) I'd be interested to hear your stance.

Lol, well, I'm too lazy to make any arguments here. But I did make a short case in Round 1 here: http://www.debate.org... after that Pro said some absurd things about a $15 MW actually being good so I saw it my duty to put him in his place :)

I could make a stronger case for sure, but I thought my opponent was a noob at first so I didn't put in too much effort.
1harderthanyouthink
Posts: 13,102
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9/30/2015 1:51:47 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
$15 is not agreeable, in my opinion.

The Fair Labor Standards Act were enacted to ensure wages met "the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and general well-being."

$15 is far more than that.

A "living wage", as relating to the Fair Labor Standards Act would be about $10-11. The greatest value the minimum wage had was in the 1960s, when the minimum wage peaked at about $10.50 in 1968 in current value. Wages have eroded in the lower classes since then.

In certain cities, however, living wages may be higher. For example, it may be reasonable that cities like Los Angeles and New York City - since people do need to provide for their families - that a minimum wage be higher than $10-11 due to the higher expenses that come with living in a city.

On a nationwide scale, $15 is not reasonable.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

DDO Risk King
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 2:00:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:50:32 AM, Varrack wrote:
Lol, well, I'm too lazy to make any arguments here. But I did make a short case in Round 1 here: http://www.debate.org... after that Pro said some absurd things about a $15 MW actually being good so I saw it my duty to put him in his place :)

Indeed. It is small, but I see potential. :)

I could make a stronger case for sure, but I thought my opponent was a noob at first so I didn't put in too much effort.

Yep. :)
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 2:17:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:51:47 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
$15 is not agreeable, in my opinion.

I agree so far.. :)

The Fair Labor Standards Act were enacted to ensure wages met "the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and general well-being."
$15 is far more than that.

Quite true.

A "living wage", as relating to the Fair Labor Standards Act would be about $10-11. The greatest value the minimum wage had was in the 1960s, when the minimum wage peaked at about $10.50 in 1968 in current value. Wages have eroded in the lower classes since then.

There is a few fundamental flaws here... First of all, a living wage couldn't be determined on a federal level. The cost of living and absorption abilities would differ from more rural areas to larger cities. You mention this later, but it doesn't agree with smaller towns, whose businesses can't absorb such an increase.

In certain cities, however, living wages may be higher. For example, it may be reasonable that cities like Los Angeles and New York City - since people do need to provide for their families - that a minimum wage be higher than $10-11 due to the higher expenses that come with living in a city.

This is true, but it's also true that these increases cause unemployment and other issues.

On a nationwide scale, $15 is not reasonable.

True, but it's not reasonable on a local level, either.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
1harderthanyouthink
Posts: 13,102
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9/30/2015 2:20:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 2:17:11 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/30/2015 1:51:47 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
$15 is not agreeable, in my opinion.

I agree so far.. :)

The Fair Labor Standards Act were enacted to ensure wages met "the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and general well-being."
$15 is far more than that.

Quite true.

A "living wage", as relating to the Fair Labor Standards Act would be about $10-11. The greatest value the minimum wage had was in the 1960s, when the minimum wage peaked at about $10.50 in 1968 in current value. Wages have eroded in the lower classes since then.

There is a few fundamental flaws here... First of all, a living wage couldn't be determined on a federal level. The cost of living and absorption abilities would differ from more rural areas to larger cities. You mention this later, but it doesn't agree with smaller towns, whose businesses can't absorb such an increase.

That's why I say later that it shouldn't be $15 nationwide. But businesses should be able to pay $10, at the very least. If they can't - like really *can't* - then the federal government should pay the difference.

In certain cities, however, living wages may be higher. For example, it may be reasonable that cities like Los Angeles and New York City - since people do need to provide for their families - that a minimum wage be higher than $10-11 due to the higher expenses that come with living in a city.

This is true, but it's also true that these increases cause unemployment and other issues.

That's a contentious issue, and one you'd be hard-pressed to find a consensus on.

On a nationwide scale, $15 is not reasonable.

True, but it's not reasonable on a local level, either.

How so?
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

DDO Risk King
Romanii
Posts: 4,851
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9/30/2015 2:28:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

I don't think starting a forum topic on a policy proposal like this is going to accomplish anything... debates are far more conducive to this sort of discussion.
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 2:52:03 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 2:28:33 AM, Romanii wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

I don't think starting a forum topic on a policy proposal like this is going to accomplish anything... debates are far more conducive to this sort of discussion.

I know, I just like open discussion as well. I'm not necessarily trying to resolve the issue, just encourage discussion. :)
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Romanii
Posts: 4,851
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9/30/2015 2:56:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 2:52:03 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/30/2015 2:28:33 AM, Romanii wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

I don't think starting a forum topic on a policy proposal like this is going to accomplish anything... debates are far more conducive to this sort of discussion.

I know, I just like open discussion as well. I'm not necessarily trying to resolve the issue, just encourage discussion. :)

Alright well what do you think of the corporate tax argument I ran in my debate with LordHelm?
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 2:59:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 2:20:51 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
At 9/30/2015 2:17:11 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/30/2015 1:51:47 AM, 1harderthanyouthink wrote:
$15 is not agreeable, in my opinion.

I agree so far.. :)

The Fair Labor Standards Act were enacted to ensure wages met "the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and general well-being."
$15 is far more than that.

Quite true.

A "living wage", as relating to the Fair Labor Standards Act would be about $10-11. The greatest value the minimum wage had was in the 1960s, when the minimum wage peaked at about $10.50 in 1968 in current value. Wages have eroded in the lower classes since then.

There is a few fundamental flaws here... First of all, a living wage couldn't be determined on a federal level. The cost of living and absorption abilities would differ from more rural areas to larger cities. You mention this later, but it doesn't agree with smaller towns, whose businesses can't absorb such an increase.

That's why I say later that it shouldn't be $15 nationwide. But businesses should be able to pay $10, at the very least. If they can't - like really *can't* - then the federal government should pay the difference.

Fair enough. Though wouldn't government intervention offset any monetary gain?

In certain cities, however, living wages may be higher. For example, it may be reasonable that cities like Los Angeles and New York City - since people do need to provide for their families - that a minimum wage be higher than $10-11 due to the higher expenses that come with living in a city.

This is true, but it's also true that these increases cause unemployment and other issues.

That's a contentious issue, and one you'd be hard-pressed to find a consensus on.

An analysis of evidence overwhelmingly supports the notion that, if increased to a significant degree (which $15 is, it's double the current), cause unemployment. [http://tinyurl.com...] This is not simply based on studies, but also economic theory. To absorb the costs, employers will either a) cut jobs, b) raise prices, or c) reduce hours. There's no escaping.

Obviously, a small-scale increase wouldn't have much negative impact (if any), because companies still in business have *enough* profit to absorb the costs.

The review is from the Fraser Institute, based in Canada.

On a nationwide scale, $15 is not reasonable.

True, but it's not reasonable on a local level, either.

How so?

As we both suggested, rural economies can't sustain a $15 minimum.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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9/30/2015 3:00:04 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 2:56:51 AM, Romanii wrote:
At 9/30/2015 2:52:03 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/30/2015 2:28:33 AM, Romanii wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

I don't think starting a forum topic on a policy proposal like this is going to accomplish anything... debates are far more conducive to this sort of discussion.

I know, I just like open discussion as well. I'm not necessarily trying to resolve the issue, just encourage discussion. :)

Alright well what do you think of the corporate tax argument I ran in my debate with LordHelm?

Let me look over it again.. I'll get back with you tomorrow, can't tonight. :/ Sorry!
Will do it, though. :)
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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10/15/2015 9:29:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I wish this thread hadn't died. :(
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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10/17/2015 5:59:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Disagree on a moral level.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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10/17/2015 6:00:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/30/2015 1:35:07 AM, Varrack wrote:
At 9/30/2015 1:27:20 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 10:13:52 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:43:58 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 9/29/2015 9:40:24 PM, lannan13 wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Horrible idea.

Indeed. :)

lol what was the purpose of this?

Well, I was hoping to get feedback and have people try to show that it should be raised or that it not. For some reason, few people ever respond to my forums lol

Make some bad arguments in favor of it and I guarantee you'll get a lot more interest :)

Lol, post some bad arguments to lure people in, then hit them with your real arguments.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,293
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10/19/2015 1:51:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/17/2015 5:59:12 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/29/2015 7:46:00 PM, ColeTrain wrote:
What do you think?

#FeelTheBern

Disagree on a moral level.

Agreed, but also on an economic level.
"The right to 360 noscope noobs shall not be infringed!!!" -- tajshar2k
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." -- Vaarka
"I eat glue." -- brontoraptor
"I mean, at this rate, I'd argue for a ham sandwich presidency." -- ResponsiblyIrresponsible
"Overthrow Assad, heil jihad." -- 16kadams when trolling in hangout
"Hillary Clinton is not my favorite person ... and her campaign is as inspiring as a bowl of cottage cheese." -- YYW