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Is it possible t return to the gold standard?

harrytruman
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5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.

{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...
harrytruman
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5/10/2016 6:54:06 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
As well as exchanging their gold for US dollars would fetch them a higher price for their gold and silver than otherwise.
ColeTrain
Posts: 4,291
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5/17/2016 4:32:06 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:

Even if it were possible, I don't think it's feasible to overhaul the system this late in the game.
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Chang29
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5/17/2016 6:19:36 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
Since a couple executive orders took America off the gold standard, then a couple more could bring it back.

A better solution is to remove government from currency.
A free market anti-capitalist

If it can be de-centralized, it will be de-centralized.
harrytruman
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5/17/2016 9:35:24 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/17/2016 4:32:06 AM, ColeTrain wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:

Even if it were possible, I don't think it's feasible to overhaul the system this late in the game.

We could do it, but you would have to be very care full in how you do it as to not cause a depression.
harrytruman
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5/17/2016 9:37:56 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/17/2016 6:19:36 AM, Chang29 wrote:
Since a couple executive orders took America off the gold standard, then a couple more could bring it back.

A better solution is to remove government from currency.

Well if we made gold and silver our official currency, the government would only be there to certify that coins and bars have a certain purity and weight of gold or silver as to prevent fraud, it wouldn't really have any power over the economy, the free market would, the government would only be there to ensure honest practice.
Rukado
Posts: 527
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5/18/2016 6:55:47 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/17/2016 9:37:56 PM, harrytruman wrote:

Well if we made gold and silver our official currency, the government would only be there to certify that coins and bars have a certain purity and weight of gold or silver as to prevent fraud, it wouldn't really have any power over the economy, the free market would, the government would only be there to ensure honest practice.

Something like gold-backed digital currency could transform society, like bitcoins on steroids. There's no need to have the government certify the gold, as private organizations could do that. The government would just come in to punish fraud, after the fact.
ken1122
Posts: 460
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5/28/2016 7:42:22 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

http://www.usstuckonstupid.com...
Seems to me going back to the gold standard would cause drastic deflation. As you can see from the link above, the US GNP has grown over 500% in the last 30 years. If the worth of the GNP is constantly going up, but the amount of Gold we have remains the same, seems that would cause prices and wages to fall. So a product worth $1 in 1980 would probably cost twenty cents now, and only a few pennies 30 years from now; and the same would go for the wages.

Ken
ViceRegent
Posts: 604
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6/5/2016 2:28:12 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

The post misstates the issue. Congress would set the value of an ounce of gold at $20.00. It is products that would adjust.
SkyLeach
Posts: 206
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6/7/2016 10:56:53 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
wait...
you've only accounted for physical dollars in circulation, not the hundreds of trillions of dollars in accounts.

You've also failed to address future and recurring values, ownership of resources, political restrictions on resources, regional monopolies and political shenanigans with currency exchange.

So basically you aren't offering any solution at all. You're offering a change which would present new problems and challenges but change nothing at all.
Math is just another language, however one without analogy.

- http://arxiv.org...
Mister_K
Posts: 4
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7/22/2016 8:41:38 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
I remember reading something about the US government having problems with people wanting to trade out all of their paper currency for gold around the time of the Great Depression and even before this time period. Apparently banks didn't have enough on hand and were forced to closed instead of pay out. Would this be an issue again if the system was to be revived? Did the revised Gold Standard used later in US history even allow this?
slo1
Posts: 4,308
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8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.
slo1
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8/14/2016 2:23:15 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

M2 is almost 13 trillion.
harrytruman
Posts: 812
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8/14/2016 7:09:09 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

No, just overvalue gold.
slo1
Posts: 4,308
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8/15/2016 12:18:59 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/14/2016 7:09:09 PM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

No, just overvalue gold.

That is what increasing the value of the dollar means. It would be priced closer to 20,000 per oz versus your 2k estimate. Seeing how the US would be the only country on the standard , it there would still be a secondary market for gold at the global price. It would cause weird and whacky unintended consequences such as those that happened on the gold standard and resulted in laws such as making it illegal to use gold in international trade, making it illegal for individuals to own gold, or even suspendingnthe gold standard to deal with extreme deficit spending during critical times such as world wars.
harrytruman
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8/15/2016 4:19:13 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/15/2016 12:18:59 AM, slo1 wrote:
At 8/14/2016 7:09:09 PM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

No, just overvalue gold.

That is what increasing the value of the dollar means. It would be priced closer to 20,000 per oz versus your 2k estimate. Seeing how the US would be the only country on the standard , it there would still be a secondary market for gold at the global price. It would cause weird and whacky unintended consequences such as those that happened on the gold standard and resulted in laws such as making it illegal to use gold in international trade, making it illegal for individuals to own gold, or even suspendingnthe gold standard to deal with extreme deficit spending during critical times such as world wars.

It's simple, don't deficit spend.
slo1
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8/15/2016 2:27:06 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/15/2016 4:19:13 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 12:18:59 AM, slo1 wrote:
At 8/14/2016 7:09:09 PM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

No, just overvalue gold.

That is what increasing the value of the dollar means. It would be priced closer to 20,000 per oz versus your 2k estimate. Seeing how the US would be the only country on the standard , it there would still be a secondary market for gold at the global price. It would cause weird and whacky unintended consequences such as those that happened on the gold standard and resulted in laws such as making it illegal to use gold in international trade, making it illegal for individuals to own gold, or even suspendingnthe gold standard to deal with extreme deficit spending during critical times such as world wars.

It's simple, don't deficit spend.

That would threaten national security during times of war and other extra ordinary times. Becoming a pacifist nation is not an option especially if directly attacked on a large scale.
harrytruman
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8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because thi will solve the trade deficit.
harrytruman
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8/20/2016 3:26:53 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/14/2016 2:23:15 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

M2 is almost 13 trillion.

who cares? We only have to back the base currency.
bballcrook21
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8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because thi will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.
If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand. - Friedman

Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. -Friedman

Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program. - Friedman

Society will never be free until the last Democrat is strangled with the entrails of the last Communist.
harrytruman
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8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.
bballcrook21
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8/20/2016 3:45:27 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.

No, you really don't, and making such false statements brings shame to anyone who supports the gold standard. You cannot arbitrarily overvalue gold. To believe such is to have an absolute disregard for market forces as well as the stock market in general, and to also lack any basic knowledge of finance.
If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand. - Friedman

Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. -Friedman

Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program. - Friedman

Society will never be free until the last Democrat is strangled with the entrails of the last Communist.
harrytruman
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8/20/2016 3:49:24 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 3:45:27 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.

No, you really don't, and making such false statements brings shame to anyone who supports the gold standard. You cannot arbitrarily overvalue gold. To believe such is to have an absolute disregard for market forces as well as the stock market in general, and to also lack any basic knowledge of finance.

The dollars stay the same though, we would merely be tying them to gold. This would create immediate fluctuations in the stock market but would quickly settle down and become more stable than before.
bballcrook21
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8/20/2016 4:00:41 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 3:49:24 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:45:27 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.

No, you really don't, and making such false statements brings shame to anyone who supports the gold standard. You cannot arbitrarily overvalue gold. To believe such is to have an absolute disregard for market forces as well as the stock market in general, and to also lack any basic knowledge of finance.

The dollars stay the same though, we would merely be tying them to gold. This would create immediate fluctuations in the stock market but would quickly settle down and become more stable than before.

Tying the dollar to the gold will contract the economy and have a major financial catastrophe. The issue is that not only are you changing the value of currency already in circulation, but you are also deflating the value of money in bank accounts, which are not necessarily printed money.
If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand. - Friedman

Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. -Friedman

Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program. - Friedman

Society will never be free until the last Democrat is strangled with the entrails of the last Communist.
harrytruman
Posts: 812
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8/20/2016 4:35:52 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 4:00:41 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:49:24 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:45:27 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.

No, you really don't, and making such false statements brings shame to anyone who supports the gold standard. You cannot arbitrarily overvalue gold. To believe such is to have an absolute disregard for market forces as well as the stock market in general, and to also lack any basic knowledge of finance.

The dollars stay the same though, we would merely be tying them to gold. This would create immediate fluctuations in the stock market but would quickly settle down and become more stable than before.

Tying the dollar to the gold will contract the economy and have a major financial catastrophe. The issue is that not only are you changing the value of currency already in circulation, but you are also deflating the value of money in bank accounts, which are not necessarily printed money.

How is this contracting the money supply though? the amount of dollars remains the same, in fact they will increase. The money in accounts is measured in dollars correct? Therefor the nominal sum of dollars remains, increases actually due to people spending gold and silver at these new rates. This, however, will be accounted for with banks holding more base gold and silver on reserve due to replacing the Fractional Reserve system with a fractional reserve grading system, which will put a big "F" on the front windows of most banks.
bballcrook21
Posts: 4,468
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8/20/2016 4:58:56 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 4:35:52 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 4:00:41 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:49:24 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:45:27 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.

No, you really don't, and making such false statements brings shame to anyone who supports the gold standard. You cannot arbitrarily overvalue gold. To believe such is to have an absolute disregard for market forces as well as the stock market in general, and to also lack any basic knowledge of finance.

The dollars stay the same though, we would merely be tying them to gold. This would create immediate fluctuations in the stock market but would quickly settle down and become more stable than before.

Tying the dollar to the gold will contract the economy and have a major financial catastrophe. The issue is that not only are you changing the value of currency already in circulation, but you are also deflating the value of money in bank accounts, which are not necessarily printed money.

How is this contracting the money supply though? the amount of dollars remains the same, in fact they will increase. The money in accounts is measured in dollars correct? Therefor the nominal sum of dollars remains, increases actually due to people spending gold and silver at these new rates. This, however, will be accounted for with banks holding more base gold and silver on reserve due to replacing the Fractional Reserve system with a fractional reserve grading system, which will put a big "F" on the front windows of most banks.

The amount of dollars in circulation has to be reduced drastically, otherwise the value of the dollar will drop. The point of a gold standard is that it not only sets the value of the dollar to gold, but it also stops the mass printing of more currency to put into circulation.
If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand. - Friedman

Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. -Friedman

Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program. - Friedman

Society will never be free until the last Democrat is strangled with the entrails of the last Communist.
slo1
Posts: 4,308
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8/20/2016 7:06:59 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 3:26:53 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/14/2016 2:23:15 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

M2 is almost 13 trillion.

who cares? We only have to back the base currency.

No, you need to back all deposits because they are redeemable in currency.
harrytruman
Posts: 812
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8/20/2016 2:48:32 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 7:06:59 AM, slo1 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:26:53 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/14/2016 2:23:15 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 8/14/2016 1:59:28 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 5/10/2016 6:51:49 AM, harrytruman wrote:
Currently, the US Treasury has 261,498,926 troy ounces in gold, whereas mints have 248,046,115 ounces in gold, Federal reserve banks have a total of 13,452,810 ounces of gold, adding up to ~512 million ounces of gold {1}. Currently, there are 1.4 trillion dollars in paper money in circulation, {2} this means that enable to back all of our paper money, an ounce of gold would have to be priced at 2,735$ a ounce, which may be drasttically overvalued, but it is within reason.

The US has 25 thousand Metric Tons of Silver {3}, or 804 million ounces, if gold is priced at 50 times an ounce of silver, then we can say that the US Goveronment has the equivelent of 26 billion 404 million ounces of silver, to back all US dollars, silver would have to be priced at 53$ an ounce and gold at 2,650$ an ounce.

Both bimetalism and monometalism require us to overvalue gold and silver drastically, but if gold and silver were overvalued, other nations as well as people from other nations would see an oppurtunity by trading in their gold and silver to the US Treasury in exchange for US dollars because it would be easier to achieve US Dollars, normally harder to get as iut is the worlds reserve currency, thus exchange cost a heafty fine, but tbacking the US Dollar by gold will increase this, increasing the demand for dollars, thus causing people to exchange gold and silver for US dollars.


{1}. https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov...
{2}. https://www.federalreserve.gov...
{3}. http://www.statista.com...

You need to calculate on money supply not dollars in circulation to price gold. The US would have to purchase more gold or greatly increase value of dollar.

M2 is almost 13 trillion.

who cares? We only have to back the base currency.

No, you need to back all deposits because they are redeemable in currency.

The banks can take care of that! We back the currency, and banks provide the currency.
harrytruman
Posts: 812
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8/20/2016 2:50:35 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/20/2016 4:58:56 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 4:35:52 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 4:00:41 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:49:24 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:45:27 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:43:03 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:40:12 AM, bballcrook21 wrote:
At 8/20/2016 3:25:50 AM, harrytruman wrote:
At 8/15/2016 6:44:09 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
It is neither possible nor desirable

It is both, just overvalue gold, that way it is possible, it will also be desirable because this will solve the trade deficit.

You can't just overvalue gold. I don't think you understand how this works.

I think I do, make gold legal tender for 3,750$ and silver for 70$, problem solved.

No, you really don't, and making such false statements brings shame to anyone who supports the gold standard. You cannot arbitrarily overvalue gold. To believe such is to have an absolute disregard for market forces as well as the stock market in general, and to also lack any basic knowledge of finance.

The dollars stay the same though, we would merely be tying them to gold. This would create immediate fluctuations in the stock market but would quickly settle down and become more stable than before.

Tying the dollar to the gold will contract the economy and have a major financial catastrophe. The issue is that not only are you changing the value of currency already in circulation, but you are also deflating the value of money in bank accounts, which are not necessarily printed money.

How is this contracting the money supply though? the amount of dollars remains the same, in fact they will increase. The money in accounts is measured in dollars correct? Therefor the nominal sum of dollars remains, increases actually due to people spending gold and silver at these new rates. This, however, will be accounted for with banks holding more base gold and silver on reserve due to replacing the Fractional Reserve system with a fractional reserve grading system, which will put a big "F" on the front windows of most banks.

The amount of dollars in circulation has to be reduced drastically, otherwise the value of the dollar will drop. The point of a gold standard is that it not only sets the value of the dollar to gold, but it also stops the mass printing of more currency to put into circulation.

The dollar won't drop in value because now it is redeemable for 1/3750 ounces of gold, whereas before, how much gold was it redeemable for? 0 ounces? By this logic the value of the dollar should go up.