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Tax Payer owned Non Profit Shopping Centers

SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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10/8/2016 5:02:20 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
Tax Payer owned Non Profit Shopping Centers :
1. Improves Quality of life.
2. Reduces cost of living.
3. Reduces National Debt.
4. Boosts Manufacturing.
5. Creates jobs.
6. Eliminates Poverty.
7. Pays for itself !
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SilverBullet
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10/9/2016 2:40:40 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
Look at this :

Example 1. Minimum wage $10
The manufacturer produces a product which costs $10 for labor, plus $10 for materials, plus the manufacture adds $10 for profit.
Than the product is sold to the supplier for a total of $30."
The supplier doubles the price and sells it to retailer for $60.
The retailer doubles the price and sells it to consumer for $120.

Example 2. Minimum wage is raised to $15

Same as above,"
The manufacturer produces a product but this time the cost of labor is $15 plus $10 for materials, plus the manufacture adds $10 for profit.
Than the product is sold to the supplier for a total of now $35."
The supplier doubles the price and now sells it to retailer for $70.
The retailer doubles the price and now sells it to consumer for $140.

please study the two above examples.
You will see a gain of five dollars for labor required to produce an item resulted in a $20 increase in the final consumer price.
This is why the gap is widening in the distribution of wealth."
The solution is to establish a tax payer owned non profit shopping system."
This will eliminate the unnecessary buy and sell capitalist profits that returns nothing to the consumer. It's a small adjustment with a huge impact on society and it's economy !

Please contribute your support.
Have a nice day !
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SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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10/10/2016 4:24:53 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
The 2015 USA budget was 3.6 Trillion dollars.
If 2% of the national budget were set aside to establish a tax payer owned non profit shopping distribution system, that would come to approx. 1.4 Billions dollars revenue per state to begin construction. This means each state could build 5- 200million dollar football stadium sized shopping centers, plus a 400 million dollar distribution hub. This would be an excellent start. A family of sixty thousand dollar annual household income would contribute approx. 60,000 / 2 * 2% = $600.
A six hundred dollar tax payer investment could establish the beginnings of a tax payer owned non profit shopping center, and once established the system will pay for itself, and the tax payer / consumer will enjoy profit free shopping !
In the first year alone how much will the consumer save?
How many jobs will this create?
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Peepette
Posts: 1,237
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10/10/2016 5:16:26 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/10/2016 4:24:53 PM, SilverBullet wrote:
The 2015 USA budget was 3.6 Trillion dollars.
If 2% of the national budget were set aside to establish a tax payer owned non profit shopping distribution system, that would come to approx. 1.4 Billions dollars revenue per state to begin construction. This means each state could build 5- 200million dollar football stadium sized shopping centers, plus a 400 million dollar distribution hub. This would be an excellent start. A family of sixty thousand dollar annual household income would contribute approx. 60,000 / 2 * 2% = $600.
A six hundred dollar tax payer investment could establish the beginnings of a tax payer owned non profit shopping center, and once established the system will pay for itself, and the tax payer / consumer will enjoy profit free shopping !
In the first year alone how much will the consumer save?
How many jobs will this create?

Essentially tax payer owned business = government owned/run business. Sounds like socialism
SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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10/12/2016 10:21:38 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
The definition of Socialism tends to point towards Social ownership and Democratic control over the means of production and price control.
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system does not own the means of production, neither does this system control the final market price.
A tax payer non profit shopping system is a product handling system owned by the tax payer.
This system would handle product from the Capitalist manufacturer to the private consumer.
The product handling fee would be added to whatever the manufacturer sets his product value at.
The product handling fee would be a calculated cost without additional profit.
This calculated handling cost would be passed on to the consumer in addition to the set manufacturers price."
The Capitalist manufacturer has total control over what product he produces, and what his final price will be."
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system simply provides the consumer with the option of purchasing products without the additional burden of paying high inflated buy and sell profits as we currently have today in our private buy and sell market system.
Keep in mind, the business of buy and sell is completely different from the manufacturing business.
(IMHO, one is worthy of respect while the other is not.)

"As stated earlier an initial 2% tax payer investment in a system which will pay for itself, will also lead to huge consumer and economic benefits.
With a tax payer owned non profit shopping system, consumers will save millions upon billions of dollars !
..the economic benefits will be staggering!
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SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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10/13/2016 4:53:17 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
The intent of Socialism was to solve the problem/ concern in the inequality of wealth distribution."
The goal was to provide an equal sustainable standard of living for all people's."
Unfortunately, as we seen with the Russian Communist style of Socialism, it was a failure."
A couple of possibilities for its failure was the lack of individual success."
It seems, as in a Capitalist society, when there is a promise of individual success this creates an incentive to "try harder!""
A 2nd possibility for its failure, could have been the communist style of ruler ship."
Communism is not equivalent to the western style of Democratic rule."
For one, the Communist manifesto states you are not permitted to speak against the party! " "
This alone clearly sets western democracy apart from Russian Communism.
But that being said, Socialism did have an honorable intent.
Capitalism seems to have provided the missing element to achieve the need of incentive, but Capitalism fails to provide an equal distribution of wealth."
So , the intent of Socialism takes a back seat once again.
The tax payer owned non profit shopping system leaves the Capitalist incentive in the manufacturing sector, plus reaches towards the goal of Socialism which was to even out the wealth and standard of living!
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SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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10/15/2016 3:48:31 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/13/2016 7:39:48 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
Why stop at shopping centers? Why don't we just implement communism?

Well technically ..we are not planning to stop at shopping centers, but rather it is where we plan to start !
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SilverBullet
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10/15/2016 4:17:27 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/13/2016 7:40:38 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
(I'm being sarcastic by the way)

"Today it's Shopping Centers, tomorrow it's gonna be, THE WORLD."
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SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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10/20/2016 3:52:15 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
Sorry about the interruption..
Now, where were we?"
Ah yes, a tax payer owned non profit shopping system !
This is an economical miracle !
This will improve the lives of all people's !
Unfettered profits in the private buy and sell industry has created a terrible strain on the economy and community."
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system will remove this strain.

Try to look at private buy and sell profits as weeds in the garden; we water them, feed them, supply them with plenty of sunshine.."

Paying the additional buy and sell profits on top of the actual costs does the consumer no gain, no service, and only drives the economy, the community and it's citizens into deep hardship."

It is time to stop nurturing the weeds!"

It is time we provide our citizens with an alternate shopping option. An option where unnecessary buy and sell profits are no longer a burden placed on the backs of consumers.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system will remove the burden of unnecessary buy and sell profits from the backs of consumers..
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Javier-Riefkohl
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10/20/2016 4:42:01 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
This is actually a great idea! If there is a way to legitimize this and make it as a proposal it definitely has my vote.
JavierRiefkohl
SilverBullet
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10/21/2016 6:59:00 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 4:42:01 PM, Javier-Riefkohl wrote:
This is actually a great idea! If there is a way to legitimize this and make it as a proposal it definitely has my vote.

Javier,
Your words are very encouraging !
And, that is a great question!
If there is any way to make a proposal out of this, please let me know.
As this would definitely have my vote too.
Thank you !
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SilverBullet
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10/24/2016 2:27:24 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
Often I hear about how great Capitalism is.
So I would like to challenge Capitalism.
If Capitalism is so great, they should have no objection to a little competition?
Competition in the form of a tax payer owned non profit shopping system."
Let the consumers decide which is the better system?
Privately owned , or community owned.
So what do you say all you die hard Capitalists,"
will you accept this challenge?"
Will you agree to the civil construction of a tax payer owned non profit shopping system, built next to your unfettered, make the highest profits possible, regardless of the cost to the community it's people, and it's economy , Capitalist monopoly "system ..?
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SilverBullet
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10/30/2016 11:28:24 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
If I had a choice..
I would prefer taxes over profits.
With taxes, I know exactly how much I am paying , and that every penny of it will be returned to the community within the current fiscal year!
With profits, the whole buy and sell business is so shady, that I never know how much profits I pay , and I know none of it ever comes back to the community.
I like the transparency of government compared to the secretiveness of buy and sell capitalism."
I would prefer to do my business with government over private capitalism.
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BillSPrestonEsq
Posts: 131
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11/4/2016 1:05:47 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 10/24/2016 2:27:24 PM, SilverBullet wrote:
Often I hear about how great Capitalism is.
So I would like to challenge Capitalism.
If Capitalism is so great, they should have no objection to a little competition?
Competition in the form of a tax payer owned non profit shopping system."
Let the consumers decide which is the better system?
Privately owned , or community owned.
So what do you say all you die hard Capitalists,"
will you accept this challenge?"
Will you agree to the civil construction of a tax payer owned non profit shopping system, built next to your unfettered, make the highest profits possible, regardless of the cost to the community it's people, and it's economy , Capitalist monopoly "system ..?

How can the free market compete with thieves? That is, if you take the money by force through taxation you can undercut any business, and then just raise taxes. What would stop a government from doing just that? What is going to stop them from currently doing similar things?
We have 'government retirement" in the form of SS, which is bankrupt, just to name one. I'm not even going to list all the services the government has taken over by force and then driven into the ground. Have you seen the debt? Not just the US but governments around the world?
If the government was made of angels and not men, you would have something, but it's not. For a minute just imagine that the government is a corporation. Now it fails at everything, it lies to you and regularly makes empty promises, and to top it all off it takes your money by threat of jail time. Also the only corporation with guns, bombs, missiles, ships, jets, etc.
Profit is incentive. Remove profit, remove incentive. Remove incentive and you have inaction. I do not support exploitative profits, and no free market can have them for long. Again no free market. The reason being, excess profits are a sign to the market (aka people) that business X can be undercut.
SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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11/11/2016 7:39:46 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
In a tax payer capitalist society, tax payers have been subsidizing capitalism.
Capitalism does not supply the economy with enough jobs.
The tax payer system has to continually run a deficit in order to maintain enough possible jobs for the community.
The profits made by capitalists are not being recirculated back into the economy fast enough to create enough jobs.
Capitalist profits trickle back into the economy very slowly, and only where it is deemed more profits can be made.
The tax payer system has to make up for the slow recirculation of capitalist profits by borrowing from future tax dollars. This has created an unbelievably high national debt where ever there is a capitalist system."
Basically capitalist profits are fueled at the expense of the tax payer( and consumer).
The capitalist has no obligation to create jobs for the community and thus sits on his profits until an investment opportunity arises.
The government, on the other hand, has an obligation to the well being of its people and thus creates as many jobs as possible under the pressure of tax debt."
A tax payer non profit shopping system will prevent money collected by buy and sell capitalist profits from being taken out of the economic system. This will ensure a healthier circulation of monetary funds within the system. Keep in mind the current profits taken out of the system through the extraction of buy and sell for profit transactions really supplies the economy with no benefit what so ever. A practice that is blatantly anti- productive."
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SilverBullet
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11/18/2016 5:05:28 PM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system :

" One small step for man, one giant leap for mankind! "

At this stage of the game nothing else will benefit the people more,
as we move forward with the human experiment and development of civilization.
This is a highly advanced and complicated topic; with all due respect to myself, to fellow viewers and contributors, and to this website, please refrain from making uneducated remarks and or non productive comments or suggestions.
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BillSPrestonEsq
Posts: 131
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11/20/2016 2:12:33 PM
Posted: 1 week ago
"With taxes, I know exactly how much I am paying , and that every penny of it will be returned to the community within the current fiscal year!"

Absolutely not

"With profits, the whole buy and sell business is so shady, that I never know how much profits I pay , and I know none of it ever comes back to the community"

No

What about the bailouts? Just looking at the recent 'Wall Street' or auto industry bailouts, that was hundreds of billions. Same goes for the Iraq war, hundreds of billions of tax dollars went to Halliburton and other government contractors.
This whole plan of yours ignores reality and replaces it with one where government is the hand of god. Hate to burst your bubble, the government is slowly crushing 'it's people' as governments have always done since the beginning of civilization.
SilverBullet
Posts: 17
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11/26/2016 9:40:12 PM
Posted: 1 week ago
BillPreston-
You lack the intelligence to contribute to this discussion.
Now, be quiet and pay attention!

The 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of Capitalism."
And another example of where public "tax payers had to bail out private capitalism.
Had there been a tax payer owned non profit shopping system in place back in 2008, there would have been no need for the bailouts. In fact the recession would have never occurred.
Capitalism is a failed experiment that will eventually lead to the demise of the western world. And/Or perhaps the entire global economy. Unless we begin now to implement a tax payer owned non profit shopping system, and allow the consumer savings to trickle back into paying off consumer debt and the recovery of our national debt while making a gentle transition removing away from the effect of private buy and sell for profit system; which has bled the economy to its knees."
Recovery is possible.
"We can turn this downward economic tide, this perpetual downward slide into debt, with "a very small adjustment to our current system. An adjustment that would bring on a replenishment to the economy , civilization, and it's people.
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system will turn the economic tide.
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system will stop the capitalist buy and sell for private profit - bleeding of the economies "life blood."

Are you listening Mr Preston?!

The trillions of dollars spent by the tax payer dollar to recover the economy is about to come to an end. Trump is intending to adjust regulations and taxes to entice the wealthy capitalist to return some of their profits back to the economy. You see, even Trump knows where all the tax money has gone."
Going further into tax payer debt is no longer an option. We have to stop the capitalist buy and sell profits from bleeding the economy, and a tax payer owned non profit shopping system will do just that; It's the "Silver Bullet " in this drowning in debt economy.
"A tax payer owned non profit shopping system will turn the economic tide towards economic recovery. And to get this started all we need is a two percent initial tax payer investment!
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David_Debates
Posts: 244
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11/27/2016 11:17:44 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 10/8/2016 5:02:20 AM, SilverBullet wrote:
Tax Payer owned Non Profit Shopping Centers :
1. Improves Quality of life.

Not exactly. For the people who's jobs are harmed by an non-profit store, the quality of life will go down, as they will be without a job.

2. Reduces cost of living.

Incorrect. As it is basically stealing from tax payers and handing it back out, it will simply be something that must raise taxes.
More Gov't "buisnesses" = More money necessary to run the Gov't.
More money nessesary to run the Gov't = Must raise taxes OR Go into more debt.
This really is that simple.

3. Reduces National Debt.

Incorrect yet again. This creates more need for taxes. See above.

4. Boosts Manufacturing.

I'd say that because regular companies cannot compete with stealing, these businesses will eventually go under, thus making less demand for the manufacturing.

5. Creates jobs.

But it eliminates other jobs, because other for-profit businesses that aren't the Gov't (an entity that you must legally pay taxes to) cannot compete with a non-profit company that you are legally obligated to support with your taxes. Have you heard of the broken window fallacy?

6. Eliminates Poverty.

By doing what? How does this eliminate poverty? It doesn't make anyone richer, only poorer.

7. Pays for itself !

By taxing people.
The reason why it pays for itself is because it forces us taxpayers to support it with our financial backing.
And if we don't?
We'll be thrown in jail for tax evasion.
Sounds like communism to me.

This is a bad, bad idea.
BillSPrestonEsq
Posts: 131
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11/27/2016 11:18:49 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/26/2016 9:40:12 PM, SilverBullet wrote:
BillPreston-
You lack the intelligence to contribute to this discussion.
Now, be quiet and pay attention!

The 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of Capitalism."
And another example of where public "tax payers had to bail out private capitalism.
Had there been a tax payer owned non profit shopping system in place back in 2008, there would have been no need for the bailouts. In fact the recession would have never occurred.

Ha ha, sure thing.. The word 'capitalism' is defined as "private ownership of production". So to say that "the 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of Capitalism." Is to say "the 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of the private ownership of production". The recession was actually caused by many things, none of them have anything to do "production". Mainly it was caused by a contraction of credit, and the money supply ( or rather a halt in growth) which burst the housing bubble that the whole country was hugely invested in. It was mainly caused by the heavily government regulated banking system. The same one that was rewarded with billions and billions of taxpayer dollars. THE GOVERNMENT was entirely responsible for that happening. The VERY SAME government you want to manage how we get everything else we need through some 'non profit' government run shopping centers. It is ridiculously na"ve and stupid. Move to North Korea instead.. One day hopefully you will look at your post and realize that you had absolutely no clue what the hell you're talking about. I am an idiot for even responding to any of this.
David_Debates
Posts: 244
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11/27/2016 11:27:14 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/27/2016 11:18:49 PM, BillSPrestonEsq wrote:
At 11/26/2016 9:40:12 PM, SilverBullet wrote:
BillPreston-
You lack the intelligence to contribute to this discussion.
Now, be quiet and pay attention!

The 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of Capitalism."
And another example of where public "tax payers had to bail out private capitalism.
Had there been a tax payer owned non profit shopping system in place back in 2008, there would have been no need for the bailouts. In fact the recession would have never occurred.

Ha ha, sure thing.. The word 'capitalism' is defined as "private ownership of production". So to say that "the 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of Capitalism." Is to say "the 2008 recession was a clear example of the failure of the private ownership of production". The recession was actually caused by many things, none of them have anything to do "production". Mainly it was caused by a contraction of credit, and the money supply ( or rather a halt in growth) which burst the housing bubble that the whole country was hugely invested in. It was mainly caused by the heavily government regulated banking system. The same one that was rewarded with billions and billions of taxpayer dollars. THE GOVERNMENT was entirely responsible for that happening. The VERY SAME government you want to manage how we get everything else we need through some 'non profit' government run shopping centers. It is ridiculously na"ve and stupid. Move to North Korea instead.. One day hopefully you will look at your post and realize that you had absolutely no clue what the hell you're talking about. I am an idiot for even responding to any of this.

Well said.
SilverBullet
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11/29/2016 9:53:23 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
A simple walk through :

Once a tax payer owned non profit shopping system gets the go ahead, certain steps will follow -
1. A national government department will need to be appointed over see this project.
2. Decisions will need to be made as to where proper locations can begin construction. I would recommend a large clear area where a brand new facility can be built with proper traffic access. A huge decision.
3. the initial budget , which will be a tax payer investment and the tax payer, community, and consumers will reap the benefit of this non profit publicly owned system, ..the initial budget will be responsible for taking this project from concept to grand opening, which afterwards this system will support it self and no longer be a tax payer investment, but rather a tax payer return!
4. Plenty of jobs will be required in all handling aspects of merchandise.
5. The final cost of all merchandise will be substantially lower than the current capitalist shopping for profit centers. This lower cost will improve the consumers standard of living, and increase sales. The increase in sales will benefit the manufacturing job sector.
6. The cost of handling the product will be determined by product dimensions, and special handling requirements. It will not be calculated by a percentage of the manufacturing actual price as do current capitalist markets calculate their prices."
7. Product dimension handling costs , which is very similar to our current transportation industry, or even our postal system. The postal does not charge handling fees according to the value of the item being shipped.. They charge according to dimensions.
8. There will be a small percentage added to cost for growth and maintenance of system.
9. In the beginning the store locations will be limited, and the growth of locations will develop in proportion to the amount of traffic.
10. Shoppers could supply the store with their zip code / postal code, and this information will help determine where growth should pursue new locations.
11. Shoppers could also request products they would like to see on display. This will help management supply manufacturers with forecasting product demand. An online Internet ordering system could eventually be adopted."
12. Shoppers could even notify store locations with an estimated time of shopping, this will help store management to ensure enough staff is on hand to meet the needs of the community."

These are all suggestions at this point, but hopefully begin to paint a picture as how we will move forward with this.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system will eventually replace the current capitalist buy and sell for profits market system which is destroying our communities and lives. But this is not intended to interfere with the manufacturing product supply and demand needs. Manufacturing will see a boost in demand due to lower consumer pricing.

This is a win win win solution, and long long overdue"

The sooner we begin on the development of a tax payer owned non profit shopping system, the sooner our communities, economy, and lives will begin to recover and develop into a positive healthy and productive future !
This is a highly advanced and complicated topic; with all due respect to myself, to fellow viewers and contributors, and to this website, please refrain from making uneducated remarks and or non productive comments or suggestions.
And welcome to the discussion of this thread!
SilverBullet
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12/3/2016 7:13:37 PM
Posted: 5 hours ago
I really did not intend to get into the discussion about all the down faults and failures of Capitalism;"the elephant in the room!
But, we must understand the problem in order to address the solution.

Private Capitalist buy and sell for profit is the mistake in our current economic system.
It is the mistake that causes consumers to work longer hours.
It is the mistake that causes reduced manufacturing orders.
It is the mistake that causes layoff and unemployment."
It is the mistake that causes the economy to stall.
It is the mistake that causes poverty and strife.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system corrects the mistake of capitalist buy and sell for profits.
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system reduces the necessary consumer work week to a more comfortable level, allowing for consumer leisure time, activities, and education.
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system increases manufacturing sales and thus thus creates job demand and increased wages!
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system stimulates and revives the economy.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system is the solution to :
A worldwide - Capitalist buy and sell for profits - problem .
This is a highly advanced and complicated topic; with all due respect to myself, to fellow viewers and contributors, and to this website, please refrain from making uneducated remarks and or non productive comments or suggestions.
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David_Debates
Posts: 244
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12/3/2016 11:12:09 PM
Posted: 1 hour ago
At 12/3/2016 7:13:37 PM, SilverBullet wrote:
I really did not intend to get into the discussion about all the down faults and failures of Capitalism;"the elephant in the room!
But, we must understand the problem in order to address the solution.

Private Capitalist buy and sell for profit is the mistake in our current economic system.

And the solution is to make everything free, I'm assuming.

It is the mistake that causes consumers to work longer hours.

Consumers aren't forced to work longer hours. Those that do are those that produce more product, and thus can sell more product, but in a free market, no one is forced to do anything.

It is the mistake that causes reduced manufacturing orders.
It is the mistake that causes layoff and unemployment."
It is the mistake that causes the economy to stall.
It is the mistake that causes poverty and strife.

Are you aware of the hockey stick of human prosperity? That was a result of the industrial revolution, of capitalism, of free markets. The results of your taxpayer funded life were, well, just look at what happened in the USSR.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system corrects the mistake of capitalist buy and sell for profits.

It's not a mistake. It's a process that's been proven to work effectively and well.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system reduces the necessary consumer work week to a more comfortable level, allowing for consumer leisure time, activities, and education.

How so? The taxpayers are footing the bill, and thus, their taxes would increase. I'm assuming that these products would still have a sales tax, right?

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system increases manufacturing sales and thus thus creates job demand and increased wages!
A tax payer owned non profit shopping system stimulates and revives the economy.

A tax payer owned non-profit shopping system desentivizes production and stalls the economy.
Charges without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

A tax payer owned non profit shopping system is the solution to :
A worldwide - Capitalist buy and sell for profits - problem .

A tax-driven shopping system is a problem, not a solution.

You have provided no evidence whatsoever for any of your claims. You assert without evidence. Not only that, but you haven't even replied to my original post, you've avoided it. Please respond.