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College was a waste

keepinitreal
Posts: 58
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11/12/2012 5:15:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
of time and money.
-I'm working in a career field that is completely irrelevant to my degree.
-Specifically have not applied anything I learned from college to my job or real-world.
- Amounted with student loan debt (almost paid off but it was close to 70-80k total).
- Have forgotten a lot of things I learned in college
- Basically a Piece of paper or check off the block that an individual needs to meet a requirement to get a particular job or go to grad school

Maybe it is a good investment because I am working in a job that requires a bachelors degree and making decent salary But really learned more from the experience and hands on than from what I learned in a lecture hall.

Not saying an individual should not go to college but just pointing out that to some individuals, the cons outweigh the pros.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.
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EvanK
Posts: 599
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11/12/2012 6:14:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM, FREEDO wrote:
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.

This.
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quarterexchange
Posts: 1,549
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11/12/2012 9:54:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM, FREEDO wrote:
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.

Bingo.

Too many people think that so long as you go to college, you're set for that "dream career".

This was true 20-30 years ago but now since an extraordinary amount of people are given the opportunity courtesy of the government, the value of almost all degrees is in the decline.
I don't discriminate....I hate everybody.
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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11/12/2012 10:09:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 9:54:37 PM, quarterexchange wrote:
At 11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM, FREEDO wrote:
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.

Bingo.

Too many people think that so long as you go to college, you're set for that "dream career".

This was true 20-30 years ago but now since an extraordinary amount of people are given the opportunity courtesy of the government, the value of almost all degrees is in the decline.

I don't think so. Instead, more careers require a college degree. Long gone are the days where most jobs require you to work in manufacturing. Now its all about the service and research industries.
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Ron-Paul
Posts: 2,557
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11/12/2012 10:16:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
In the right fields, a college degree is required, or at least highly advised.

It depends on what you are majoring in.
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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11/12/2012 10:23:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
So you have a job that requires a bachelor's degree and you're making a decent salary.

Yup, sounds like a complete waste to me.
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quarterexchange
Posts: 1,549
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11/12/2012 10:59:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 10:09:08 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/12/2012 9:54:37 PM, quarterexchange wrote:
At 11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM, FREEDO wrote:
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.

Bingo.

Too many people think that so long as you go to college, you're set for that "dream career".

This was true 20-30 years ago but now since an extraordinary amount of people are given the opportunity courtesy of the government, the value of almost all degrees is in the decline.

I don't think so. Instead, more careers require a college degree. Long gone are the days where most jobs require you to work in manufacturing. Now its all about the service and research industries.

Well yes, since it's become the new HS diploma. It's essentially setting the bar higher to get the same job that people fresh out of high school and vocational school were doing a couple of decades ago.

It nowhere near qualifies the degree holder with the salary that college graduates were getting 30 years ago.

But I will agree that there certainly are degrees worth investing in, such as engineering, chemistry, medicine, mathematics, etc. But the majority of college graduates don't go into those fields.
I don't discriminate....I hate everybody.
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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11/12/2012 11:50:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 10:59:38 PM, quarterexchange wrote:
At 11/12/2012 10:09:08 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/12/2012 9:54:37 PM, quarterexchange wrote:
At 11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM, FREEDO wrote:
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.

Bingo.

Too many people think that so long as you go to college, you're set for that "dream career".

This was true 20-30 years ago but now since an extraordinary amount of people are given the opportunity courtesy of the government, the value of almost all degrees is in the decline.

I don't think so. Instead, more careers require a college degree. Long gone are the days where most jobs require you to work in manufacturing. Now its all about the service and research industries.

Well yes, since it's become the new HS diploma. It's essentially setting the bar higher to get the same job that people fresh out of high school and vocational school were doing a couple of decades ago.

It nowhere near qualifies the degree holder with the salary that college graduates were getting 30 years ago.

But I will agree that there certainly are degrees worth investing in, such as engineering, chemistry, medicine, mathematics, etc. But the majority of college graduates don't go into those fields.

No, I think most degrees are pretty useful. Only a few of them are completely useless. Some are better then others, but most have some degree of usefulness.

HS teaches you some stuff that can qualify you for an entry level position for some jobs, but the trend is still towards more high-skill work.
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bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
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11/13/2012 12:10:57 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 11:50:37 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/12/2012 10:59:38 PM, quarterexchange wrote:
At 11/12/2012 10:09:08 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/12/2012 9:54:37 PM, quarterexchange wrote:
At 11/12/2012 5:22:47 PM, FREEDO wrote:
It depends on what you major in.

And if you go all the way through, it's just plain cool to have Dr. before your name.

Bingo.

Too many people think that so long as you go to college, you're set for that "dream career".

This was true 20-30 years ago but now since an extraordinary amount of people are given the opportunity courtesy of the government, the value of almost all degrees is in the decline.

I don't think so. Instead, more careers require a college degree. Long gone are the days where most jobs require you to work in manufacturing. Now its all about the service and research industries.

Well yes, since it's become the new HS diploma. It's essentially setting the bar higher to get the same job that people fresh out of high school and vocational school were doing a couple of decades ago.

It nowhere near qualifies the degree holder with the salary that college graduates were getting 30 years ago.

But I will agree that there certainly are degrees worth investing in, such as engineering, chemistry, medicine, mathematics, etc. But the majority of college graduates don't go into those fields.

No, I think most degrees are pretty useful. Only a few of them are completely useless. Some are better then others, but most have some degree of usefulness.

HS teaches you some stuff that can qualify you for an entry level position for some jobs, but the trend is still towards more high-skill work.

This.

If you go to college just because of high-paying jobs in that area, you are a complete imbecile.
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TheRainKing
Posts: 12
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11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.
"And like the seasons you are also, and though in your winter you deny your spring: yet spring, reposing within you, smiles in her drowsiness and is not offended." - Khalil Gibran
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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11/13/2012 2:40:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

source? Somehow I don't think Latin and Greek grammar are really that important in the real world. Our education is more focused on science then languages.
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TheRainKing
Posts: 12
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11/13/2012 2:45:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 2:40:41 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

source? Somehow I don't think Latin and Greek grammar are really that important in the real world. Our education is more focused on science then languages.

If you mean a source on the entrance exam, here you go.

http://lmgtfy.com...
"And like the seasons you are also, and though in your winter you deny your spring: yet spring, reposing within you, smiles in her drowsiness and is not offended." - Khalil Gibran
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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11/13/2012 3:00:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 2:40:41 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

source? Somehow I don't think Latin and Greek grammar are really that important in the real world. Our education is more focused on science then languages.

Here's the non-douche-bag source >> http://graphics8.nytimes.com...
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darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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11/13/2012 3:19:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 3:00:32 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 11/13/2012 2:40:41 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

source? Somehow I don't think Latin and Greek grammar are really that important in the real world. Our education is more focused on science then languages.

Here's the non-douche-bag source >> http://graphics8.nytimes.com...

that's pretty cool. Although to be fair I'll point a few things out:
1) We stress different things nowadays which is different from the exam as said previously.
2) This is a Harvard exam, which would be harder then most other college entry level exams. Now, we have a universal system (SAT and ACT), however in order to get into Harvard you have to get a near perfect score on the SAT. So while the exam might be easier, you probably have to do better to get in.
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royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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11/13/2012 8:22:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

Oh, give me a break. That probably is only difficult if you have not learned it. Greek and Latin are functionally useless in the modern United States, so it is not taught in school. It was popular in that era because the curriculum was focused on theology and Classics.

The math problems really were not that complex. All of that is basic high school math that you should have completed by sophomore or junior year. Many students now complete at least a semester of calculus, and I know a few (including me) who finished Calculus III before they entered college.
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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11/13/2012 8:23:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The history/geography section was just memorization. That used to be emphasized in 1800.

The standards have changed because what is taught in high school has changed, and I prefer critical thinking and understanding material to rote memorization of geography facts.
TheRainKing
Posts: 12
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11/13/2012 10:29:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 8:22:21 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

Oh, give me a break. That probably is only difficult if you have not learned it. Greek and Latin are functionally useless in the modern United States, so it is not taught in school. It was popular in that era because the curriculum was focused on theology and Classics.

The math problems really were not that complex. All of that is basic high school math that you should have completed by sophomore or junior year. Many students now complete at least a semester of calculus, and I know a few (including me) who finished Calculus III before they entered college.

Do you really think that the Harvard application in question was just as easy as modern day college applications?
"And like the seasons you are also, and though in your winter you deny your spring: yet spring, reposing within you, smiles in her drowsiness and is not offended." - Khalil Gibran
ax123man
Posts: 317
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11/14/2012 9:38:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The cost of a degree has four components: one, what you learned. Two, the proof you can learn and do work. Three, the social and other soft aspects. Four, the degree itself.

Two and four get you a job. One, not so much (depends on the degree).

Regarding four, it doesn't have to be this way. Why not decouple accreditation from learning? If a teen teaches himself to be a computer wiz in his/her free time during high school, what's the point of college?
keepinitreal
Posts: 58
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11/15/2012 8:54:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I majored in Economics and I am currently working in a logistics career field.

You should get a higher education because you strive for knowledge and have the desire to learn. Unfortunately a lot of people get higher education for the wrong reasons
Lordknukle
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11/17/2012 10:29:28 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/15/2012 8:54:55 PM, keepinitreal wrote:
I majored in Economics and I am currently working in a logistics career field.

You should get a higher education because you strive for knowledge and have the desire to learn. Unfortunately a lot of people get higher education for the wrong reasons

An economics degree is suitable for the self-masturbatory egocentric philosophy degree types. If you wanted something useful, you should have gotten a finance degree.
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royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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11/17/2012 10:30:26 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/13/2012 10:29:25 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
At 11/13/2012 8:22:21 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 11/13/2012 2:31:09 PM, TheRainKing wrote:
In a desperate attempt to collect as much Federal student loan money as possible, most colleges have dumbed down their curriculum as to funnel in as many students as they can. This is true even of prestigious colleges. Have you ever seen the Harvard entry exam from the late 1800s/early 1900s? You had to translate English to Latin, answer questions about Greek grammar, describe arcane historical events, and do complex math with nothing but a pencil and paper. Needless to say, it's suffered a bit of backslide.

Oh, give me a break. That probably is only difficult if you have not learned it. Greek and Latin are functionally useless in the modern United States, so it is not taught in school. It was popular in that era because the curriculum was focused on theology and Classics.

The math problems really were not that complex. All of that is basic high school math that you should have completed by sophomore or junior year. Many students now complete at least a semester of calculus, and I know a few (including me) who finished Calculus III before they entered college.

Do you really think that the Harvard application in question was just as easy as modern day college applications?

Yes. They took a standardized test that was similar to the ones we take in terms of math content, and the rest was just memorization.
keepinitreal
Posts: 58
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11/17/2012 7:29:10 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
An individual should not be forced to choose a particular major for the sake of earning money. Like I said, individuals should seek higher education for their desire to further learn that particular academic subject.

If someone chooses to major in engineering because of practicality and potential to land a high earning job after obtaining the degree but s/he is not happy with that field or has no interested in it, then something is wrong with that picture. A student should seek the subject that s/he wants to further learn and has interest in that field.

I have said philosophy is one of the useless degrees but I have not said that a student should not choose that degree. If s/he has great passion for that field and wants to further seek knowledge and learn in that area of study, then by all means, go for it.

Like I mentioned earlier, quite few are seeking higher education for the wrong reasons.

to not deviate from this topic (noticed that this is a trend in this forum). To a lot of students; college can be a waste of time and money. In other words, college can be considered overrated. The purpose of college IMO is to learn and further expand your knowledge and hopefully, apply it in real life. It can be a waste of time and money to quite a lot; it is a cost (opportunity). The money and time spent on college could have been used elsewhere that would have resulted in a higher net gain to that individual.
VainApocalypse
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11/18/2012 3:36:48 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 7:29:10 PM, keepinitreal wrote:
An individual should not be forced to choose a particular major for the sake of earning money. Like I said, individuals should seek higher education for their desire to further learn that particular academic subject.

If you want to learn merely for the sake of learning, any information presented in a curriculum is accessible on the internet for a trivial fee. Hence, it makes no sense to think of college as an investment in self enrichment, as it's an astronomically inefficient means to that end. It makes more sense viewed strictly as a professional investment.
keepinitreal
Posts: 58
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11/18/2012 8:47:59 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
There are individuals who go to college and choose a degree that will lead them to greater prosperity; viewing it as a personal investing. Even if there are means to do it outside of college.

I, on the other hand, would disagree that. Again, certain people seek higher education for the wrong reasons. I personally don't view it as an investment. I personally view it as an opportunity for people to learn and gain knowledge through an institution that will further expand your knowledge and skill sets. If that's the case college would heavily leaned towards degrees that have more practically and has the reputation of landing you a career. That is not the case. Universities offers a wide range of different degrees for individuals to choose from; matching what they want and their joy or curiosity for seeking advancement in knowledge in that field of study.
comoncents
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11/18/2012 11:31:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/12/2012 5:15:02 PM, keepinitreal wrote:
of time and money.
-I'm working in a career field that is completely irrelevant to my degree.
-Specifically have not applied anything I learned from college to my job or real-world.
- Amounted with student loan debt (almost paid off but it was close to 70-80k total).
- Have forgotten a lot of things I learned in college
- Basically a Piece of paper or check off the block that an individual needs to meet a requirement to get a particular job or go to grad school

Maybe it is a good investment because I am working in a job that requires a bachelors degree and making decent salary But really learned more from the experience and hands on than from what I learned in a lecture hall.

Not saying an individual should not go to college but just pointing out that to some individuals, the cons outweigh the pros.

Huh, I don't know. College taught me how to be a better citizen, person, and father. I went for Poli Sci and Religious Studies. Everything I learned may not apply directly to my current situation, but overall, I learned a lot.