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Education on a Freed Market

Reasoning
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3/11/2010 7:55:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The following passage makes the case that education would be provided much more efficiently on the free market. I am curious to see if anyone can spot any problem in this theory.

"Of course, education itself would be vastly improved if placed on the free market. At present, most students waste a considerable amount of each school day. This is chiefly due to two factors: first, "democratic" insistence on forcing everyone through the same educational mill regardless of ability or previous upbringing, and second, the rigidity of a socialized system which has no competition and can thus tolerate a large measure of stagnation. Free-market educational institutions in competition with each other would take quick advantage of every new advance in educational methods and materials and would undoubtedly do a far better job in a shorter time and for much less money. It is probable that this free-market application of new educational techniques would enable all but the slowest students to finish school anywhere from months to years earlier than they now do, providing a tremendous saving of the young person's time and his parents' money, as well as increasing his years of productivity (and everyone's standard of living).

A laissez-faire system of competing, free-market education would provide a tremendous variety of schools to meet the needs of people with various interests, aptitudes, beliefs, and life-styles. Devout Christians could send their children to religious schools which held prayer before every class without infringing on the right of atheists to have their children educated by the use of reason exclusively. Black Panthers could send their children to all-black schools, white segregationists to all-white schools, and integrationists of all races could patronize integrated schools (forced integration is as bad as forced segregation). There would be schools for exceptionally bright youngsters, for those with special educational problems, and for those with great aptitudes in various fields (music, mathematics, writing, etc.). These various schools would charge different amounts of tuition and operate under varying conditions and educational methods. Some would be strict, some permissive. Some might have a 12-month school year, some a 6-month year. Virtually every kind of education which consumers wanted would be offered, and selection of a school would be strictly on the basis of individual free choice. No longer would every child be forced through the same educational machine, a machine geared for the great "average" majority and, therefore, harmful to minorities of all kinds.

Although the schools in a free economy would be paid for by tuition rather than by the theft of taxation, it is not necessarily the case that parents would have to stand the entire expense of their children's education, especially in high school and college. Even today, scores of companies in search of well-trained and competent mathematicians, engineers, chemists, etc., offer generous, no-strings-attached scholarships to any talented student in hopes of luring him to work for them when he graduates. In the healthy economy of a totally free-market society, companies would be looking for even more employees (and, also, for independent sub-contractors) in an even greater variety of skilled fields. Not only would such companies put promising students through college, they might very well even pay their high school tuition. And many of them might also offer free high school curriculums to any ambitious student of average competence in return for his contractual guarantee to learn some skill useful to the company and work for them exclusively for a stated period of time.

Many firms are already manifesting a great and speedily growing interest in education, in spite of its rigidly socialized condition. They are particularly interested in research in better teaching methods, including the use of computers and other mechanical aids to improve the speed and quality of instruction. It is difficult to imagine the extent of the beneficial influence such businesses would have on the field of education if it were free of the rigor mortis of government control.

Of course, education doesn't necessarily have to take place in a classroom. One of the least expensive and most promising of educational tools is television. At present, most educational TV is undeniably poor in quality and interest level. This is largely due to lack of competition resulting from the stultifying regulations imposed by the Federal Communications Commission, which has virtual dictatorial control over who may enter the field and what kind of programs they may telecast. In a laissez-faire society, anyone who could find an unused channel could go into the business of telecasting, and he could air any type of material he wished. If his programs were offensive to his audience, he would, of course, soon go out of business for lack of viewers. Competition, as always, would impel toward excellence.

With television freed from governmental meddling, many groups would go into the business of educational TV. Educational broadcasters could offer their programs free and still make profits charging for texts and tests (a charge which would be small, with student-viewers numbering in tens of thousands). Or, texts and tests could be furnished free, with support coming from commercials, just as it now does with entertainment TV. Sponsoring companies might advertise not only for customers but for employees with the knowledge and skills taught in their TV courses. This would have the happy effect of providing both a pool of potential employees for the company and readily accessible job opportunities for the student-viewers. Also, with stiff competition for student-viewers, educational broadcasters would develop the most efficient and "fun" ways of learning possible in order to capture and hold their audiences.

In spite of lower cost, more efficient and higher quality education, the role of industry in providing scholarships, and educational TV, it is probable that some children would get very little education, and a few might go through life as illiterates. These would be children who lacked either the capacity or the desire for learning, since children who had both ability and desire would tend to attract help even if their parents did neglect them. Before calling for a government to educate these unschooled and illiterate few, however, one should consider the shockingly high rate of illiterates graduated from government high schools. Sitting in a school room for a period of years is not equivalent to receiving an education. In fact, children who are forced to sit through years of schooling which they find painfully boring are far more likely to rebel against their imprisonment and "society" in general than to develop a love of knowledge. No one can be taught unless he has a genuine desire to learn, and forcing schooling on a child against his will is hardly likely to increase this desire.

Competing educational systems would offer the consumer a free choice in his purchase of education for himself and/or his children. This would end forever squabbles over curriculum (more athletics? more academics? Black Studies programs?), student body (segregated or integrated? — shall we bus to integrate?), control of education (should it be in the hands of parents, teachers, voters, the school board, or the colleges?), and all the other insoluble questions which plague government's coercive control of education. If each consumer were free to choose among competing schools the type of education he valued most, all these problems would be solved automatically to the satisfaction of everyone. Competition in education would protect students and parents from exploitation by a coercive governmental monopoly." - The Market For Liberty

Thoughts? Criticisms?
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
FREEDO
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3/11/2010 8:15:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I support the complete destruction of the entire current educational system. That includes not only public schools but also homeschooling and other private schools. The way it's all shaped around indoctrination makes me sick. This is what you must learn and this is how you must learn it. Baw-humbug.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Cody_Franklin
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3/11/2010 8:19:32 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:15:57 PM, FREEDO wrote:
I support the complete destruction of the entire current educational system. That includes not only public schools but also homeschooling and other private schools. The way it's all shaped around indoctrination makes me sick. This is what you must learn and this is how you must learn it. Baw-humbug.

So, you don't even support private or home schooling? You're making all forms of education into indoctrination...... You're basically saying that all education is something like:

"Alright, the Pythagorean Theorem is as follows: A squared plus B squared equals worship the government."

I'm not sure how many times I've told you to stop trying to be the stereotypical "edgy, radical guy". It doesn't make you cool, nor does it make you correct. In fact, it makes you the polar opposite of boh.
FREEDO
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3/11/2010 8:27:58 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:19:32 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 3/11/2010 8:15:57 PM, FREEDO wrote:
I support the complete destruction of the entire current educational system. That includes not only public schools but also homeschooling and other private schools. The way it's all shaped around indoctrination makes me sick. This is what you must learn and this is how you must learn it. Baw-humbug.

So, you don't even support private or home schooling? You're making all forms of education into indoctrination...... You're basically saying that all education is something like:

"Alright, the Pythagorean Theorem is as follows: A squared plus B squared equals worship the government."

I'm not sure how many times I've told you to stop trying to be the stereotypical "edgy, radical guy". It doesn't make you cool, nor does it make you correct. In fact, it makes you the polar opposite of boh.

Your assumption about what I said is wrong. I propose a new educational system. One that focuses entirely on free-thought and is essentially a giant library. You can study nearly anything you want. There are teachers available if you want one. After you've studied what you want you can ask the for a test to be taken for the subjects of your choosing. After taking said test you receive a certificate showing how much you know about those fields for the primary purpose of showing it to an employer. There is no graduation time, you can come back a update your certificate with any subjects you want on it. Whether it is privately or publicly funded is of lesser importance to me.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Puck
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3/11/2010 8:33:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:27:58 PM, FREEDO wrote:
Your assumption about what I said is wrong. I propose a new educational system. One that focuses entirely on free-thought and is essentially a giant library. You can study nearly anything you want. There are teachers available if you want one. After you've studied what you want you can ask the for a test to be taken for the subjects of your choosing. After taking said test you receive a certificate showing how much you know about those fields for the primary purpose of showing it to an employer. There is no graduation time, you can come back a update your certificate with any subjects you want on it. Whether it is privately or publicly funded is of lesser importance to me.

How do children teach themselves their own language, or maths or <insert growing list>?
FREEDO
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3/11/2010 8:36:37 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:33:56 PM, Puck wrote:
At 3/11/2010 8:27:58 PM, FREEDO wrote:
Your assumption about what I said is wrong. I propose a new educational system. One that focuses entirely on free-thought and is essentially a giant library. You can study nearly anything you want. There are teachers available if you want one. After you've studied what you want you can ask the for a test to be taken for the subjects of your choosing. After taking said test you receive a certificate showing how much you know about those fields for the primary purpose of showing it to an employer. There is no graduation time, you can come back a update your certificate with any subjects you want on it. Whether it is privately or publicly funded is of lesser importance to me.

How do children teach themselves their own language, or maths or <insert growing list>?

Children are indeed a different issue. I always forget that. So, actually, not the entire system. Just for those old enough to think for themselves.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Puck
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3/11/2010 8:38:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The largest issue free market schooling faces is the validity of any form of graduation or its inference 'i am educated at X level'. Sure standardised tests exist and such testing can occur, but it's not a necessary staple under a free market system.
Puck
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3/11/2010 8:39:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:36:37 PM, FREEDO wrote:
How do children teach themselves their own language, or maths or <insert growing list>?

Children are indeed a different issue. I always forget that. So, actually, not the entire system. Just for those old enough to think for themselves.

What exactly does that constitute?
Reasoning
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3/11/2010 8:40:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:38:40 PM, Puck wrote:
The largest issue free market schooling faces is the validity of any form of graduation or its inference 'i am educated at X level'. Sure standardised tests exist and such testing can occur, but it's not a necessary staple under a free market system.

I don't see the issue.
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
Puck
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3/11/2010 8:53:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:40:47 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 3/11/2010 8:38:40 PM, Puck wrote:
The largest issue free market schooling faces is the validity of any form of graduation or its inference 'i am educated at X level'. Sure standardised tests exist and such testing can occur, but it's not a necessary staple under a free market system.

I don't see the issue.

There is a purpose for education besides 'get educated'. It allows useful analysis for employers.
Reasoning
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3/11/2010 8:54:59 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:53:56 PM, Puck wrote:
There is a purpose for education besides 'get educated'. It allows useful analysis for employers.

Sure.
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
FREEDO
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3/11/2010 11:21:01 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/11/2010 8:39:45 PM, Puck wrote:
At 3/11/2010 8:36:37 PM, FREEDO wrote:
How do children teach themselves their own language, or maths or <insert growing list>?

Children are indeed a different issue. I always forget that. So, actually, not the entire system. Just for those old enough to think for themselves.

What exactly does that constitute?

I'm not sure. What do you think? Around 10 to 13 I would say.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 7:36:26 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
I like the idea of free market schools but I would say that the govt. should provide vouchers to the poor,

and that schools which were explicitly racist should be sued/shut down,

OR at the very least not able to receive the students on government voucher.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Reasoning
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3/12/2010 11:09:36 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 7:36:26 AM, mattrodstrom wrote:
I like the idea of free market schools but I would say that the govt. should provide vouchers to the poor,

and that schools which were explicitly racist should be sued/shut down,

OR at the very least not able to receive the students on government voucher.

Though such a system would undoubtedly be superior to what is done now, it is unnecessary.

"Although the schools in a free economy would be paid for by tuition rather than by the theft of taxation, it is not necessarily the case that parents would have to stand the entire expense of their children's education, especially in high school and college. Even today, scores of companies in search of well-trained and competent mathematicians, engineers, chemists, etc., offer generous, no-strings-attached scholarships to any talented student in hopes of luring him to work for them when he graduates. In the healthy economy of a totally free-market society, companies would be looking for even more employees (and, also, for independent sub-contractors) in an even greater variety of skilled fields. Not only would such companies put promising students through college, they might very well even pay their high school tuition. And many of them might also offer free high school curriculums to any ambitious student of average competence in return for his contractual guarantee to learn some skill useful to the company and work for them exclusively for a stated period of time."
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 11:16:12 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 11:09:36 AM, Reasoning wrote:
stuff...

I read that the first time thanks.

That might happen... and that would be good.

But it certainly wouldn't happen for all, or even bankably for most, who are too poor to afford education otherwise.

Also such programs would plausibly be first to be cut if shortages in cash were to happen.

I think of basic Education as a basic need, and one that ought to be provided for if the person cannot provide it for themself.

Perhaps a Govt. ensured Loan would be more agreeable?...Though I would make the repayment contingent on their having the ability to pay it back... I wouldn't have'em thrown in jail or anything just cuz they can't pay it back.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
belle
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3/12/2010 3:03:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 7:36:26 AM, mattrodstrom wrote:
I like the idea of free market schools but I would say that the govt. should provide vouchers to the poor,

and that schools which were explicitly racist should be sued/shut down,

OR at the very least not able to receive the students on government voucher.

you have to be careful about this one. there was a lot of noise a few weeks ago because a frat at UC San Diego had a "compton cookout"

http://www.ktla.com...

personally i think its kind of funny... but ANYWAYS, a lot of newspapers and things were saying this was a sign of the disgraceful racism of the UC SYSTEM even though it was completely planned and enacted by students having nothing to do with the school except the fact that they attended it. should the UC system begin refusing admittance to racist students now to make amends for their disgracefully racist behavior? thank god, no one has suggested it as far as i know. but anyways- once you start talking about banning or punishing racism you better have a clearly defined standard of what constitutes it.
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 3:10:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 3:03:14 PM, belle wrote:

once you start talking about banning or punishing racism you better have a clearly defined standard of what constitutes it.

I was talking about Schools denying entry to students explicitly on the basis of their 'Race'.

I said such schools should either be sued, shut down,

Or at the very least, not supported with taxpayer dollars.

I also happen to think Race/religion based clubs, events, and the like ought not be supported by public funds (as I see happen every day in my Public college).
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I don't like the idea of "black history month".

I don't like the idea of "Black Unity" clubs, or whatever they call them, at my Public school.
I don't like the Muslim Club at my public school.
I don't like the Jewish club, or the christian club,
I don't like the Hispanic club...
The Vagina Monologues Club, or whatever they call it...

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

Which would of course stand for Equal rights and all and encourage membership from all ethnicities, genders, cultural backgrounds, sexual orientations and whatnot.

--And which would, above all, be against Government funding of Religious, cultural, and Race based organizations.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
popculturepooka
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3/12/2010 3:47:17 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

You act like there hasn't been a "white man's club" since America's inception. It's called the norm.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 3:55:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 3:47:17 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

You act like there hasn't been a "white man's club" since America's inception. It's called the norm.

And it shouldn't be funded by the Govt. and neither should these others...

Mine would be a parody.

Obviously it wouldn't be well received AND that's the point.

It shouldn't and neither should the others.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
belle
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3/12/2010 3:55:51 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 3:47:17 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

You act like there hasn't been a "white man's club" since America's inception. It's called the norm.

the racist actions of our ancestors are mainly irrelevant to current racist actions (except perhaps in the realm of inspiration). if he tried to actually form a "white man's club" he would be branded a racist bigot and you know it :P

and btw i agree with you matt insofar as i see no purpose for gender or race themed clubs, but people seem to really like them. race and gender never really factored into my sense of identity i guess...
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 3:58:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 3:55:51 PM, belle wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:47:17 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

You act like there hasn't been a "white man's club" since America's inception. It's called the norm.

the racist actions of our ancestors are mainly irrelevant to current racist actions (except perhaps in the realm of inspiration). if he tried to actually form a "white man's club" he would be branded a racist bigot and you know it :P

and btw i agree with you matt insofar as i see no purpose for gender or race themed clubs, but people seem to really like them. race and gender never really factored into my sense of identity i guess...

The BEST would be if the school said "No" :)

though just getting people up in arms against it would be good too :)
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
popculturepooka
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3/12/2010 4:02:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 3:55:51 PM, belle wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:47:17 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

You act like there hasn't been a "white man's club" since America's inception. It's called the norm.

the racist actions of our ancestors are mainly irrelevant to current racist actions (except perhaps in the realm of inspiration). if he tried to actually form a "white man's club" he would be branded a racist bigot and you know it :P

If he literally named it the white man's club, probably.
If he named it the Irish club, no.

Considering the fact that most of these racial/gender clubs coalesce because they are systematically marginalized I don't see how that refutes my point. There's reason why there aren't Japanese clubs in Japanese universities but there are Japanese clubs at CSU's....
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 4:10:51 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 4:02:35 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:55:51 PM, belle wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:47:17 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/12/2010 3:21:28 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

But... Given these clubs, I kind of want to form a "White Man's Club" Maybe call it a "Old Boy's Club"..

You act like there hasn't been a "white man's club" since America's inception. It's called the norm.

the racist actions of our ancestors are mainly irrelevant to current racist actions (except perhaps in the realm of inspiration). if he tried to actually form a "white man's club" he would be branded a racist bigot and you know it :P

If he literally named it the white man's club, probably.
If he named it the Irish club, no.

But what if one wants to "celebrate" (lol) all forms of "white" culture ... not that that would be the actual pupose of my club... as I said that would be

"would of course stand for Equal rights and all and encourage membership from all ethnicities, genders, cultural backgrounds, sexual orientations and whatnot.
--And which would, above all, be against Government funding of Religious, cultural, and Race based organizations.."
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
belle
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3/12/2010 4:18:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 4:02:35 PM, popculturepooka wrote:

Considering the fact that most of these racial/gender clubs coalesce because they are systematically marginalized I don't see how that refutes my point. There's reason why there aren't Japanese clubs in Japanese universities but there are Japanese clubs at CSU's....

its because they feel marginalized. whether or not they actually are is irrelevant. i'm sure there are white men out there who feel marginalized by women's suffrage and the civil rights movement...

in any case, these groups aren't about disparaging other groups they are about celebrating one's own. so whats wrong with wanting to celebrate "white" culture? the fact that its popular doesn't negate that urge. homosexuality is extremely "popular" here in SF (at least comparatively hehe) but we still have a HUGE gay parade.

why does one need to be a minority to want to celebrate some aspect of their identity?
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
popculturepooka
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3/12/2010 4:22:18 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 4:10:51 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:

If he literally named it the white man's club, probably.
If he named it the Irish club, no.

But what if one wants to "celebrate" (lol) all forms of "white" culture ... not that that would be the actual pupose of my club... as I said that would be

"would of course stand for Equal rights and all and encourage membership from all ethnicities, genders, cultural backgrounds, sexual orientations and whatnot.
--And which would, above all, be against Government funding of Religious, cultural, and Race based organizations.."

There'd be nothing wrong with that.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 4:35:26 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I'd say there's a problem with having the govt. fund Race/culture/religious "celebratory" organizations.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
popculturepooka
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3/12/2010 4:39:25 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 3/12/2010 4:18:04 PM, belle wrote:
At 3/12/2010 4:02:35 PM, popculturepooka wrote:

Considering the fact that most of these racial/gender clubs coalesce because they are systematically marginalized I don't see how that refutes my point. There's reason why there aren't Japanese clubs in Japanese universities but there are Japanese clubs at CSU's....

in any case, these groups aren't about disparaging other groups they are about celebrating one's own. so whats wrong with wanting to celebrate "white" culture? the fact that its popular doesn't negate that urge. homosexuality is extremely "popular" here in SF (at least comparatively hehe) but we still have a HUGE gay parade.

I never said there was anything wrong with that. I'm all for it if there is no disparagement involved. White people shouldn't be afraid to celebrate their culture(s).

What I am saying is it would be rather pointless to form a club that celebrates the norm.

This is similar to the good ole why can't we have a white history month (last month was black history month, of course)? Why can't we have a month celebrating men(this month is women's history month btw)? Because American history is already taught from a strongly euro-centric and male-centric point of view.

To bring another example in there's a reason why there aren't clubs that celebrate tall, beautiful, skinny women. Because that's what is the norm in mainstream culture.
Conversely, there are clubs for women who don't fit those stereotypes and I see that as a totally valid purpose for the club's existence.

why does one need to be a minority to want to celebrate some aspect of their identity?

When did I say that?
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
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mattrodstrom
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3/12/2010 4:46:53 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
There shouldn't be a white history month. There shouldn't be a "boy's club".

AND

There shouldn't be Publicly funded Race, Religious, or Cultural groups.

I, personally don't think such groups should exist at all :) (not that I'd forcibly disband them I just think they're silly and often quite ignorant)

But they definitely shouldn't be publicly funded.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

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"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
Danielle
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4/1/2010 6:45:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Out of curiosity, why did everyone flip out on the new guy when he posted something many deemed tl;dr (about Conservatives) and yet nobody was a d-ck to Reasoning for doing the same thing? A link with the same quote can be found online -- I just Googled it.

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