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Old Games = Best Games

ConservativePolitico
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5/29/2012 9:55:57 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
So I picked up Planescape: Torment and Arcanum (Magicka Obscura or whatever), both are from around 2000 and the games are simply amazing.

The story, dialogue, gameplay, everything is just top notch. They don't make games like they used to.

Now, the focus is so much on the graphics that everything else falls by the wayside.
AlwaysMoreThanYou
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5/29/2012 9:59:00 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 9:55:57 AM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
So I picked up Planescape: Torment and Arcanum (Magicka Obscura or whatever), both are from around 2000 and the games are simply amazing.

The story, dialogue, gameplay, everything is just top notch. They don't make games like they used to.

Now, the focus is so much on the graphics that everything else falls by the wayside.

I hate to say it, but I agree. It's kind of like what someone said about Star Wars; the originals were much better because lack of visual effects forced good acting and plot.

I still play 2000-ish games. The graphics look like the devil himself invaded my monitor, but the games are still fun as hell.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13
bossyburrito
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5/29/2012 10:10:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 9:55:57 AM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
So I picked up Planescape: Torment and Arcanum (Magicka Obscura or whatever), both are from around 2000 and the games are simply amazing.

The story, dialogue, gameplay, everything is just top notch. They don't make games like they used to.

Now, the focus is so much on the graphics that everything else falls by the wayside.

There were a lot of crappy games in that era, but a lot of good ones. Games like Starsiege: Tribes, Kotor, Operation:Desert Storm, Jedi Knight, Halo, and Deus Ex come to mind.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
Oryus
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5/29/2012 12:25:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Pharoah!!
: : :Tulle: The fool, I purposely don't engage with you because you don't have proper command of the English language.
: :
: : The Fool: It's my English writing. Either way It's okay have a larger vocabulary then you, and a better grasp of language, and you're a woman.
:
: I'm just going to leave this precious struggle nugget right here.
Agent_Orange
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5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.
#BlackLivesMatter
Rusty
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5/29/2012 1:07:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.
Agent_Orange
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5/29/2012 1:11:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 1:07:22 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.

Not sure what point you're trying to make here.
#BlackLivesMatter
Rusty
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5/29/2012 1:20:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 1:11:59 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
At 5/29/2012 1:07:22 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.

Not sure what point you're trying to make here.

Oh, was the first bolded part about the crap new games?
Agent_Orange
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5/29/2012 1:32:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 1:20:19 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 5/29/2012 1:11:59 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
At 5/29/2012 1:07:22 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.

Not sure what point you're trying to make here.

Oh, was the first bolded part about the crap new games?

Yeah. What I'm saying is, you've got crap new games and crap old ones. He's too focused on the crap new ones that come out.
#BlackLivesMatter
Rusty
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5/29/2012 1:35:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 1:32:29 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
At 5/29/2012 1:20:19 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 5/29/2012 1:11:59 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
At 5/29/2012 1:07:22 PM, Rusty wrote:
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.

Not sure what point you're trying to make here.

Oh, was the first bolded part about the crap new games?

Yeah. What I'm saying is, you've got crap new games and crap old ones. He's too focused on the crap new ones that come out.

Oh okay, I see. My bad.
ConservativePolitico
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5/29/2012 1:48:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.

It's not nostalgia because I've never played these games until now. The game play mechanics are just better. None of the games today pose a challenge to me, none. Frankly, they bore me.
airmax1227
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5/29/2012 2:33:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 1:48:13 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
At 5/29/2012 12:53:17 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
I disagree. The best games are the ones coming out now. You're just focused on the crap ones.

For instance, while I loved the first 2, Max Payne 3 might be the best game I've ever played in terms of story telling and dialogue.

None of the old games come close to any modern R* project. Bully was great. But what compares to Red Dead Redemption? What old games comes close to the Mass Effect series? The God of War series?

I love the old games but I hate when people are blinded by nostalgia.

It's not nostalgia because I've never played these games until now. The game play mechanics are just better. None of the games today pose a challenge to me, none. Frankly, they bore me.

The challenging aspects of most modern games has been replaced with accessibility for mass appeal. There are some tough modern games out there, (Dark Souls comes to mind) but for the most part, most games released these days lack the challenge of games released in the 80's and early 90's.

Today, it's usually just a matter of putting in the 40 hours into a triple-A title, which usually will assure basic completion of it. I don't think there is anything inherently bad with this development though, and if you want to be challenged, you just have to specifically seek out those games. Keep in mind they generally wont be those that have mass market appeal.
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bossyburrito
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5/29/2012 2:48:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 2:41:19 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Megaman, dude. Contra. Battletoads.

Frogger. Quix.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
airmax1227
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5/29/2012 2:49:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 2:41:19 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Megaman, dude. Contra. Battletoads.

Contra was great, especially in Co-op (only way I could beat it), and Battletoads just seemed unfair, no company could get away with that kind of difficult spike these days.
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OberHerr
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5/29/2012 2:52:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I like games that are hard, but not stupidly so.

Like, when you die, it seems fair, not just "walk around a corner, die for no reason."
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Maikuru
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5/29/2012 3:30:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
After reading this thread, I sat down and made a list of my ten favorite games. Only one - Star Wars: KOTOR - was made this decade. That doesn't mean newer games aren't worth playing and don't have superior graphics and bells & whistles (Pokemon: Black/White are obviously more advanced than Pokemon: Red/Blue). It means that older games offer originality and novelty that become less and less common as game developers focus more on sequels and mass appeal.
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OberHerr
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5/29/2012 3:45:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:30:33 PM, Maikuru wrote:
After reading this thread, I sat down and made a list of my ten favorite games. Only one - Star Wars: KOTOR - was made this decade. That doesn't mean newer games aren't worth playing and don't have superior graphics and bells & whistles (Pokemon: Black/White are obviously more advanced than Pokemon: Red/Blue). It means that older games offer originality and novelty that become less and less common as game developers focus more on sequels and mass appeal.

You left out Battlefront!?!?!

*shuns*
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Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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Maikuru
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5/29/2012 3:56:52 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:45:30 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:30:33 PM, Maikuru wrote:
After reading this thread, I sat down and made a list of my ten favorite games. Only one - Star Wars: KOTOR - was made this decade. That doesn't mean newer games aren't worth playing and don't have superior graphics and bells & whistles (Pokemon: Black/White are obviously more advanced than Pokemon: Red/Blue). It means that older games offer originality and novelty that become less and less common as game developers focus more on sequels and mass appeal.

You left out Battlefront!?!?!

*shuns*

and Halo. Yeah, I said it.
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
- lamerde

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Agent_Orange
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5/29/2012 3:58:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Holy crap. Am I the only gamer here?

I will take your old games vs. new ones and I can show you modern games are just better.

Again this is not a shot at older games, but seriously you people have no idea what you are talking about.

Show me ONE old game half as original as Portal 1 & 2.

Show me a an old game with a full universe filled with a robust back story as the Mass Effect series. Also one where your actions in the first game impact events in the third game. Nothing comes close. I loss sleep trying to decide whether or not to cure the genophage

Show me a game from the last decade that lets you be as free as you are in Skyrim. Where you can truly become the character you want to be.

Show me a game with not one single word of dialogue but tells one of the most haunting tales I've ever seen. Oh you don't know one? Go play Limbo.

You talk about "bells and whistles" but the difficulty you people are praising is nothing but a marketing ploy. What's a good way to keep people playing? Make it difficult. Some people won't give up till they beat it, and once they do, they challenge their friends. So they also go buy the game. It's a very cheap tactic designed to hide a lack of originality, or bigger problems like bugs within the game.
#BlackLivesMatter
OberHerr
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5/29/2012 3:58:46 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:56:52 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:45:30 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:30:33 PM, Maikuru wrote:
After reading this thread, I sat down and made a list of my ten favorite games. Only one - Star Wars: KOTOR - was made this decade. That doesn't mean newer games aren't worth playing and don't have superior graphics and bells & whistles (Pokemon: Black/White are obviously more advanced than Pokemon: Red/Blue). It means that older games offer originality and novelty that become less and less common as game developers focus more on sequels and mass appeal.

You left out Battlefront!?!?!

*shuns*

and Halo. Yeah, I said it.

I could understand Halo not for everyone, and you strike me as a RPG, RTS, ect. kind of guy.

But BF, and BF 2......
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-OBERHERR'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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bossyburrito
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5/29/2012 4:06:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:45:30 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:30:33 PM, Maikuru wrote:
After reading this thread, I sat down and made a list of my ten favorite games. Only one - Star Wars: KOTOR - was made this decade. That doesn't mean newer games aren't worth playing and don't have superior graphics and bells & whistles (Pokemon: Black/White are obviously more advanced than Pokemon: Red/Blue). It means that older games offer originality and novelty that become less and less common as game developers focus more on sequels and mass appeal.

You left out Battlefront!?!?!

*shuns*

I want to play BF now so badly.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
Maikuru
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5/29/2012 4:10:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:58:46 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:56:52 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:45:30 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:30:33 PM, Maikuru wrote:
After reading this thread, I sat down and made a list of my ten favorite games. Only one - Star Wars: KOTOR - was made this decade. That doesn't mean newer games aren't worth playing and don't have superior graphics and bells & whistles (Pokemon: Black/White are obviously more advanced than Pokemon: Red/Blue). It means that older games offer originality and novelty that become less and less common as game developers focus more on sequels and mass appeal.

You left out Battlefront!?!?!

*shuns*

and Halo. Yeah, I said it.

I could understand Halo not for everyone, and you strike me as a RPG, RTS, ect. kind of guy.

But BF, and BF 2......

Damn, I read that as Battlefield. The Battlefront series absolutely makes the list.

I apologize to both of you and anyone else I may have offended by that omission.
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
- lamerde

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airmax1227
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5/29/2012 4:10:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:58:11 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
Holy crap. Am I the only gamer here?

I will take your old games vs. new ones and I can show you modern games are just better.

Again this is not a shot at older games, but seriously you people have no idea what you are talking about.

Show me ONE old game half as original as Portal 1 & 2.


Portal 2 is a sequel so it's not very original. As for Portal 1, while I like the game very much, the answer to your question is easy. Pong, Tetris and Pac Man are even more than half as original, because they represent crucial titles in video game history, with conventions and concepts generally unused before (Portal does too to some extent, but it uses many already established game conventions, like platforming and puzzle solving, but puts it all together to make it greater than the sum of its parts).

Also "better" is subjective. I still love tons of old games and play them all the time. But I also like new games and play them even more. I like seeing what new ideas will be developed and how the technology will keep advancing.

There certainly is a differences between games from each generation as common conventions evolve, or simply become obsolete. Whether that makes them better or not, depends on the individual.
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Agent_Orange
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5/29/2012 4:24:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 4:10:48 PM, airmax1227 wrote:
At 5/29/2012 3:58:11 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
Holy crap. Am I the only gamer here?

I will take your old games vs. new ones and I can show you modern games are just better.

Again this is not a shot at older games, but seriously you people have no idea what you are talking about.

Show me ONE old game half as original as Portal 1 & 2.


Portal 2 is a sequel so it's not very original. As for Portal 1, while I like the game very much, the answer to your question is easy. Pong, Tetris and Pac Man are even more than half as original, because they represent crucial titles in video game history, with conventions and concepts generally unused before (Portal does too to some extent, but it uses many already established game conventions, like platforming and puzzle solving, but puts it all together to make it greater than the sum of its parts).
Portal 2 is very different from portal 1. And sure those games were groundbreaking but lets be honest. Pong fvcking sucks. I'm sick of people worshipping stuff because it's old. Yeah it paved the way for modern games but leave it in the past where it belongs.

Also "better" is subjective. I still love tons of old games and play them all the time. But I also like new games and play them even more. I like seeing what new ideas will be developed and how the technology will keep advancing.
That's my point. ConservativePolitico was dismissing all modern games. I won't stand for that.

There certainly is a differences between games from each generation as common conventions evolve, or simply become obsolete. Whether that makes them better or not, depends on the individual.

Well said.

Can you argue any of my other points? Like the one about Limbo?
#BlackLivesMatter
bossyburrito
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5/29/2012 4:39:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:58:11 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
Holy crap. Am I the only gamer here?

I will take your old games vs. new ones and I can show you modern games are just better.

Again this is not a shot at older games, but seriously you people have no idea what you are talking about.

Show me ONE old game half as original as Portal 1 & 2.
LSD, Lemmings, Myst, and many more.
Show me a an old game with a full universe filled with a robust back story as the Mass Effect series.
Star wars games.
Also one where your actions in the first game impact events in the third game. Nothing comes close. I loss sleep trying to decide whether or not to cure the genophage
The tech wasn't there, but overall, old games were better.

Show me a game from the last decade that lets you be as free as you are in Skyrim. Where you can truly become the character you want to be.
Deus Ex.
Show me a game with not one single word of dialogue but tells one of the most haunting tales I've ever seen. Oh you don't know one? Go play Limbo.
Just because it can tell a story without dialogue doesn't automatically mean its better.
You talk about "bells and whistles" but the difficulty you people are praising is nothing but a marketing ploy. What's a good way to keep people playing? Make it difficult. Some people won't give up till they beat it, and once they do, they challenge their friends. So they also go buy the game. It's a very cheap tactic designed to hide a lack of originality, or bigger problems like bugs within the game.

Yeah, while i can beat a Cod game without firing.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
OberHerr
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5/29/2012 4:44:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 4:39:11 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
Yeah, while i can beat a Cod game without firing.

To be fair though, it is the first level, and it's not necessarily easy to pull that off. You can't do that on Vetern either.
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Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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bossyburrito
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5/29/2012 4:45:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 4:44:02 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/29/2012 4:39:11 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
Yeah, while i can beat a Cod game without firing.

To be fair though, it is the first level, and it's not necessarily easy to pull that off. You can't do that on Vetern either.

It also shows how scripted the game is. The game force feeds a movie to you.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
Rusty
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5/29/2012 4:53:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/29/2012 3:58:11 PM, Agent_Orange wrote:
You talk about "bells and whistles" but the difficulty you people are praising is nothing but a marketing ploy. What's a good way to keep people playing? Make it difficult. Some people won't give up till they beat it, and once they do, they challenge their friends. So they also go buy the game. It's a very cheap tactic designed to hide a lack of originality, or bigger problems like bugs within the game.

I see you mentioned Skyrim at one point. You don't think the free-roam nature of certain games can be a marketing ploy at times? Have you ever played Just Cause 2?