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Beginner Mafia 1.3- Mob War DP 4

medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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10/14/2011 9:02:26 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
A new day dawns in the big city, and another body is found. Henry Thomasino (Dninja), who had just been elevated to underboss for the Corleone family, didn't survive his first night. His body was found this morning in Central Park by a jogger. He had been hacked to death with meat cleavers. First Don Corleone, then the underboss. The Corleone family must be in chaos, and the new leaders need to make a big comeback, or the city will soon be lost.

Active Players

2. F-16 Falcon
5. Quarterexchange
7. Mestari
8. Man-is-good
9. Marcuscato
11. Blackhawk1331
13. Randolph7
14. Innomen

Sleeping With the Fishes:

Nerdykiller- Carlo Gervasi- Vinci family
Curious18- Joe Barbaro- Corleone family
Logic_on_rails- Vicenzo Mancini- Corleone family
Andromeda_Z- Paulie "Walnuts" Gaultieri- Corleone family
Lickdafoot- Don Vito Corleone- Corleone family
Greyparrot- Luca Brasi- Vinci family
Detectableninja- Henry Thomasino- Corleone family
marcuscato
Posts: 738
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10/14/2011 9:18:12 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
All right, im going to try clear some of the air.

I am frank five angels pentangeli. <<That is my character claim.I claimed last dp but people seem to have missed it.
I have also provided proof of me being town.
http://www.debate.org...
Medic made a post regarding game events in which he clearly stated that frank five angels pentangeli( is innocent. Clearly i am a 100% townie. Lickdafoot (for reasons unknown to me) also felt that i was town.She agreed with me and vtl 'ed mestari.

Role claim: I am the watcher.
I followed QE last night. He visited dninja.Dninja died. QE is mafia. Unfortunately, i seem to have wasted my power because QE gave himself away.
VTL Quarterexchange
(if it makes you(QE) feel any better i realised you were mafia last dp.)
.....Contd
marcuscato
Posts: 738
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10/14/2011 9:21:35 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 9:08:37 AM, medic0506 wrote:
Bonus: What are the two most critical rules that MUST be followed by mafia players??

1.No discussion of game outside official places(game thread and mafia pm or townie pm)
2.No copy pasting of PM
randolph7
Posts: 307
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10/14/2011 9:24:33 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
I have class today I may be on later tonite.
"ahh but i have indeed found the burdon of truth the, muffs have found it. oh mothy dear dear mothy"
marcuscato
Posts: 738
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10/14/2011 9:45:52 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
KILL MESTARI:

1. He had an extra power on NP2(he said so himself).
I was shot during DP2. I was not allowed to use my power on NP2.
There was a similar event last game(when i was a mafia), I was given a choice, then on the basis of that choice i somebody and if it succeeded then that person would get a penalty and i would get a bonus.
This is exactly what seems to have happened. Mestari gained one use of my power.

2. Last dp, his conduct was extremely suspicious. He kept trying to extract information. At one point lickdafoot even said"dont answer that" regarding a question which mestari was asking.
If mestari was a townie he should have taken a hint. Instead he went after andro and found out that she was a jailer.
This made me suspicious and I wanted to lynch him. Lickdafoot agreed and VTL'ed mestari. Andromeda also said that mestari was suspicious.

Mestari has been acting really scummy and I am convinced that he is a mafia.
There were 2 people(not included in a list prepared by blackhawk of possible) whose allegiance was expected to be revealed but was not, 1. greyparrot 2.mestari
Blackhawk is the best person to give an explanation of this.
Miscellaneous:
DP1 i was watching LOR: i found that he visited f16 and innomen
Dp2 i was not allowed to use my power.
Dp3 i was watching QE( i realised he was mafia when he immediately jumped on innomens Vote to lynch Andro. Its a typical mafia move. If F16 remembers, last game the motion to lynch him was started by a townie(greyparrot i think) and all the mafia hopped on it really fast).

For mafia beginners : Explanation of watcher(my power):
I can choose to watch some person. I find out the people visited by that person and the people who visited that person.
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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10/14/2011 10:18:54 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 9:21:35 AM, marcuscato wrote:
At 10/14/2011 9:08:37 AM, medic0506 wrote:
Bonus: What are the two most critical rules that MUST be followed by mafia players??

1.No discussion of game outside official places(game thread and mafia pm or townie pm)
2.No copy pasting of PM

Excellent!!

When I went through askbob's beginner games he stressed these rules, and I think that's a good idea. Everyone should know these rules by now, if not, you do now. These are the cardinal sins of mafia. Learn them, and live by them. Any deviation from these two rules makes you a cheater, and if you have to cheat to win, you didn't really win anything. Copy/pasting will always be caught by the mod, but if someone contacts you and wants to talk about the game you should tell the person to keep the game in the game thread, and if they persist, notify the mod.

One other rule should be mentioned. Mafia is just a game and it is based on deception, mistrust, and paranoia. Some players have to lie, and be deceitful and coniving, in order to compete. It's part of the game. We want you to play hard, and be passionate and competitive, but don't take it personally, and don't make it personal against others. That takes the fun out of the game. When you get mad and take things personally, it makes you do stupid things, like cheat. That just ruins the game for everyone. If that's the kind of personality you have, then maybe mafia isn't for you. Ok lecture over.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 10:50:19 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Okay, so I will take a wild guess that 1/3 is mafia, 2/3 is town. That seems quite reasonable. So we have 5 mafiosos total. 2 are dead, so 3 mafiaosos are still left. There are 8 people left, so 5 of them are town.

1. F-16 Falcon - ? - Lie Detector
2. Quarterexchange - Johnny Fontane - ?
3. Mestari - Massimo Fanucci - ?
4. Man-is-good - Vito Spatafore - ?
5. Marcuscato - Frank "Five Angels" Pentangeli - Watcher
6. Blackhawk1331 - ? - ?
7. Randolph7 - Patrizio Blundetto - ?
8. Innomen - Francesco "Frankie Potts" Potenza - ?

(A) Definite mafia
- Quarterexchange

(B) Unknown (organized by level of suspicion) - 2 people from this list are mafia and two are town. This game hinges on the two townies helping as much as possible.
- Mestari
- Innomen
- Randolph
- Marcuscato

(C) Definite town
- F_16
- Blackhawk
- Man-is-good

Mestari has a lot of explaining to do.

Marcuscato on the other hand, is more likely townie than mafia. I seriously am on the fence about Marcuscato. I'd like other people to weigh in on this. The reason is that everything he said, he could have found out from the day phases. By the way, can there be multiple watcher roles for town? Should there only be one watcher per town and one for mafia?

Also, did I miss anyone's character or role that you already claimed? Don't was to accuse someone of being mafia when they have already claimed but I didn't notice it like what happened with marcuscato last DP.
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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10/14/2011 11:05:43 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 10:50:19 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Okay, so I will take a wild guess that 1/3 is mafia, 2/3 is town. That seems quite reasonable. So we have 5 mafiosos total. 2 are dead, so 3 mafiaosos are still left. There are 8 people left, so 5 of them are town.

1. F-16 Falcon - ? - Lie Detector
2. Quarterexchange - Johnny Fontane - ?
3. Mestari - Massimo Fanucci - ?
4. Man-is-good - Vito Spatafore - ?
5. Marcuscato - Frank "Five Angels" Pentangeli - Watcher
6. Blackhawk1331 - ? - ?
7. Randolph7 - Patrizio Blundetto - ?
8. Innomen - Francesco "Frankie Potts" Potenza - ?

(A) Definite mafia
- Quarterexchange

(B) Unknown (organized by level of suspicion) - 2 people from this list are mafia and two are town. This game hinges on the two townies helping as much as possible.
- Mestari
- Innomen
- Randolph
- Marcuscato

(C) Definite town
- F_16
- Blackhawk
- Man-is-good

Mestari has a lot of explaining to do.

Marcuscato on the other hand, is more likely townie than mafia. I seriously am on the fence about Marcuscato. I'd like other people to weigh in on this. The reason is that everything he said, he could have found out from the day phases. By the way, can there be multiple watcher roles for town? Should there only be one watcher per town and one for mafia?

Also, did I miss anyone's character or role that you already claimed? Don't was to accuse someone of being mafia when they have already claimed but I didn't notice it like what happened with marcuscato last DP.

There are no hard rules for any roles. It's dependant on how the mod tries to balance the game. There could be more than one of anything.
marcuscato
Posts: 738
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10/14/2011 11:59:25 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
I am 100% townie:
1.I am mod certified townie
This is indisputable proof.
2.Proof of watcher
On DP2 I came out and said Logic on rails was most likely townie. I was the only person to vouch for him(and that probably led to his lynch anyway)
http://www.debate.org...

More proof: QE tried to put the suspicion on me toward the end of last phase. You can see that he called me a john doe and tried to put the suspicion on me.
We KNOW the QE is guilty, QE was trying to get me night killed by the vig.

I think you are suspecting me because i put the suspicion on you Dp1. Think about it, you are the LD therefore you did not claim you win with the town. Not saying you win with the town automatically put the suspicion on you.
You should not be so quick to put the suspicion on Innomen. He could have been jailed if the mafia had a jailer type role or a role stealer type role(which they had last mafia game)
I correctly guessed that innomen was townie, we know for sure that logic came up with a not guilty on innomen(atleast initially).
If you think he has converted, lynch him last(give him time, if necessary LD him).
Lastly, its not avoidance. I live in India, its a different timezone(10:24pm right now).I am online at times different from you, thats why i do not have a lot of posts.
even lickdafoot did not think i was mafia..
You are suspecting innomen because he put the first vote on andro, but QE put the second and the votes piled on pretty quick(it was over in less than 24 hrs). Its a typical mafia move to pile the votes when townie suspects townie. 2 birds with 1 stone.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 12:06:15 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Okay, here are my suspicions.

You are committing a logical fallacy: Appeal to Lickdafoot

No offense to Lickdafoot if and when she reads this post but she was town. She has no idea who is mafia and who is town. An appeal to Lickdafoot is like what we call an "appeal to authority" fallacy in debate.

Also Marcuscato, I was reading DP 2 right now before you posted. It seems Medic confirmed your character BEFORE you actually claimed. You simply saw Medic's post and claimed that character. "Mod certified"? You certified yourself! Now I am highly suspicious of you. You constantly say you are "mod-certified" when you claimed AFTER the mod "certified" the character. I don't think you expected me to go through DP2 and read it line by line.
Lickdafoot
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10/14/2011 2:00:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 12:06:15 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Okay, here are my suspicions.

You are committing a logical fallacy: Appeal to Lickdafoot

No offense to Lickdafoot if and when she reads this post but she was town. She has no idea who is mafia and who is town. An appeal to Lickdafoot is like what we call an "appeal to authority" fallacy in debate.


but f-16, i was the main enchilada for a good reason- i see all. my third eye showed me. Its your own fault if you don't listen to me!

Jk. don't let that sway your own opinions.
WAKE UP AND READ THIS: http://www.debate.org...
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 2:21:00 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 2:00:32 PM, Lickdafoot wrote:
At 10/14/2011 12:06:15 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Okay, here are my suspicions.

You are committing a logical fallacy: Appeal to Lickdafoot

No offense to Lickdafoot if and when she reads this post but she was town. She has no idea who is mafia and who is town. An appeal to Lickdafoot is like what we call an "appeal to authority" fallacy in debate.


but f-16, i was the main enchilada for a good reason- i see all. my third eye showed me. Its your own fault if you don't listen to me!

Jk. don't let that sway your own opinions.

I won't. I may not believe your intuition, but I'll make sure that in the end, you end up being on the winning team. Good luck with your other games.
quarterexchange
Posts: 1,549
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10/14/2011 3:20:56 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
VTL Quarterexchange

The least I can do for you guys is speed up the process. You've all been a blast.
I don't discriminate....I hate everybody.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 3:24:13 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
All right no one else vote for quarterexchange. We want to extend this DP a little longer to get information from Marcuscato, Innomen, and possibly Randolph and Mestari as well. If we don't we will be playing in the dark.
blackhawk1331
Posts: 4,932
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10/14/2011 3:31:23 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 3:24:13 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
All right no one else vote for quarterexchange. We want to extend this DP a little longer to get information from Marcuscato, Innomen, and possibly Randolph and Mestari as well. If we don't we will be playing in the dark.

I agree. We need claims from all on the suspicious list (mestari, randolph, innomen) I am fairly certain that marcusato is innocent. Also, F-16, I think there were 4 starting mafia. Anyway, VTL MESTARI for a role claim.
Because you said it was a waste, numb nuts. - Drafter

So fvck you. :) - TV

Use prima facie correctly or not at all. - Noumena
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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10/14/2011 3:38:48 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
VTL Mestari
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 3:46:31 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I know I am probably being a little rude, but quarterexchange is totally cracking me up.
His last post on DP3:

1. Why am I suspicious to you F-16?
2. We need to vote for marcuscato to get info out of him next DP. Several people have gotten picked off now and he's still John Doe.

Then his post in the announcement thread.

I say we kill Blackhawk, that way we can say that we are on the right track because one of the people who agreed with us. Then we RB F-16.

Well quarter, does that answer your question?
blackhawk1331
Posts: 4,932
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10/14/2011 3:54:18 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 3:36:52 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
How so? Aren't 1/3 supposed to be mafia? That would make it 5 out of 15.

I agree. Let's pressure Mestari first.

I doesn't have to be.
Because you said it was a waste, numb nuts. - Drafter

So fvck you. :) - TV

Use prima facie correctly or not at all. - Noumena
blackhawk1331
Posts: 4,932
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10/14/2011 3:58:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Corleone's

Lickdafoot- Don Vito Corleone- You are The Godfather
Dninja- Vito Scaletta- Underboss
Man is good- Paulie “Walnuts“ Gualtieri- Hot-headed Hitman
Blackhawk- Fredo Corleone- The Bodyguard
MCDCBC (replaced by Blackhawk V2)- Tom Hagen- Corleone Consigliere
Curious- Hyman Roth- The Jailor. Later switched to Vinci's.
Science-nerd- Paulie Gatto- The Weak Link (similar to the traitor)
Greyparrot- Salvatore Bonpensiero- The Mentor
Falcon- Amerigo Bonasera- The Reviver.
Quarterexchange- Christopher Moltisanti(QE)- Corleone Hitman.
Nerdykiller- Vincenzo Mancini- The Protector

Vinci's

Mestari- Don Frank Vinci
Wiploc- Johnny Sacrimoni- Vinci Underboss
Marcuscato- Joe Barbaro- Roleblocker.
Randolph7 (replaced by Andromeda)- Leo Galante- Vinci Consigliere

This is the break-up from last game. 4 mafia out of 15 people.
Because you said it was a waste, numb nuts. - Drafter

So fvck you. :) - TV

Use prima facie correctly or not at all. - Noumena
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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10/14/2011 4:05:34 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I'll be posting in a few minutes. I have one in progress but it's extremely long and I want to get all of my thoughts out at once to prevent confusion. Just a heads up.
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 4:08:31 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Guys, I pieced together some info from DP2 and DP3 and it seems that Innomen is most likely town. I will say more but we have one (or maybe two) mafia amongst us. I think we should focus on the others.
Mestari
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10/14/2011 4:12:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 4:08:31 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
Guys, I pieced together some info from DP2 and DP3 and it seems that Innomen is most likely town. I will say more but we have one (or maybe two) mafia amongst us. I think we should focus on the others.

If you are going on Logic's confirmation, don't. I'll explain why when I post.
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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10/14/2011 4:17:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Since we are putting together lists:

Known Mafia
QE
Innomen

Likely Mafia
Marcuscato

Confirmed Town
F-16
Blackhawk

I Don't Have a Clear Read
Randolph
MIG

quarterexchange

QE is definitely mafia, agreed...

Innomen

I used my 1-shot watcher last night on DNinja. Innomen visited him. For refutation of marcus' claim, see marcus below.

For the LD: I know with 100% certainty that Innomen is mafia.

Furthermore, let's look back to DP 2 when logic confirmed F-16 and Innomen. He confirmed F-16 by stealing his LD power and said that Innomen was "a town for now" meaning that he investigated Innomen's claim of winning with the Corleones. He was very explicit in that Innomen's status of "currently" being a town was medic's wording, not his. Innomen claims to have been kidnapped over DP 2. Andromeda, the Corleone Kidnapper says that she did not kidnap him. Note how Andromeda was the confirmed by medic explicitly as the "Corleone Kidnapper" not "Corleone Family - Kidnapper". The word choice leads me to believe that there is a kidnapper in this game not-aligned with the Corleones, ie a Vinci Kidnapper. In which case, Innomen may have converted to the mafia. Him coming out with being kidnapped would be strategic as by being open with it, he's more believable when he states that he is a townie. Let's piece this all together now:

P1: Logic confirms that Innomen is "currently" a town during NP 1.
P2: Innomen claim to be kidnapped NP 1, DP 1, NP 2, released at the start of DP 2.
C: Logic was telling the truth (there is no reason for him to have lied as a town) and Innomen was, at the time, Corleone. Remembering that he claims medic was explicit in Innomen being a town "currently" shows that he may have been kidnapped at the time, but had yet to convert.

Logic behind my use of the 1-shot watcher power

DNinja is the vig and he has protected himself two times in a row now. The vig is more powerful as less people in the game. With QE outing himself as a mafia, I thought that DNinja was going to kill QE himself so that we wouldn't have to spend a DP to lynch him. However, this means that he would have to drop protection on himself to do so. If the mafia is smart it meant that they would, somewhat predictably, kill DNinja as to 1) take out a power role while they still can and 2) prevent QE from dying and thus force us to use a DP to lynch him.

marcuscato

Watchers do not follow people to see who they visited, watching QE would not tell him if he killed DNinja. Only a tracker can follow people.

Watcher: Select a target and see who visits him.
Tracker: Select a target and see who he visits.

Marcus claims to be the watcher yet he also claims to have tracked QE. F-16 is also right in that Marcus "confirmed himself" by claiming a confirmed character AFTER it was confirmed. If we take note from last game, not a single character whose affiliation was confirmed by medic prior to death via news alerts was actually in the game.

F-16

There are no objections to F-16 being a confirmed town that I am aware of.

Blackhawk

He was in the mason PM. Lickdafoot was town. There are no objections to blackhawk being town that have been brought to my attention.

MIG

There are no objections to MIG, but his suspicious word choice DP 1 still linger in my mind, and he hasn't exactly been confirmed. Nonetheless, I don't think he is mafia.

Randolph

He hasn't really said much all game. He kinda gets on to vote and that's it. I don't know what to say about him.

Mestari

I will proceed to defend myself in the next post I start working on.
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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10/14/2011 4:47:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The Case for my Innocence. Volume I.


Chapter 1: Pre-Game Verification

1. Statistics

We had 4 mafia with 15 players last game. I was one of them. It is likely that we started with the same numbers, as medic wanted to nerf the mafia and adding another member would do the opposite. The chances of me being mafia two games in a row are slim. 4/15 x 4/15 = 16/225 = 7.1111111%.

2. Beginner's Game

Medic wants to spread the roles around and give everyone experience. Even if we used random selection for who gets what role, it is logical that medic would switch me to town so that another player could get experience as mafia. It would be unfair for those who have never been mafia to let me be it two games in a row.

Chapter 2: Action-Based Justification

1. Information Gathering

First, note that it was my idea to end DP 1 as soon as we had enough information for every power role to make a rational decision. If I were a mafia (like last game) I would have tried to extend DP 1 in order to gain more information for a kill, such as a claim from a power role. Instead, I tried to end the DP before a power-role was outed, forcing the mafia to blind-kill.

Second, as for the accusations of forcing information out of DNinja and Andro.

DNinja: I was simply looking for a way to confirm his role. I dropped all charges when other townies claimed them to be unreasonable.

Andro: She claimed that Innomen was lying about being jailed. It was logical to assume that she was the jailor and I wanted confirmation for the LD, in case he did not want to investigate Innomen's claim. This gave no information whatsoever to the mafia as they could have just as easily arrived at the same conclusion.

2. Lynching Patterns

I VTL'd Grey early on and tried to get the town to lynch him immediately once I realized that we were all being distracted and that Andro did not claim to have jailed him either. Our delay cost us as he suicide-bombed LDF. Had the town listened to me, our mason would be very much alive right now.

I never VTL'd Andromeda. Yes, I tried to get information out of her. Yes, I was suspicious of her. No, I never tried to lynch her. In fact, I claimed that she was not a priority target. In DP 3, pg 18 I stated (this also adds to my indictment of Grey):

"Makes sense, but it also seems illogical for medic to change the role's affiliation. Regardless, you shouldn't be a priority target for the town right now. If you didn't kidnap anyone, grey isn't kidnapped. If you did kidnap Innomen, grey isn't kidnapped. Either way he's hiding. All of these random paranoia attacks are diverting attention from him. He's had days to defend himself yet he hasn't, I think it's clear that he's a mafioso trying to hide his way out of a lynch. We've all played with Grey before, we know how persuasive he is. Heck, he dares people to lynch him, but every time he's been the town. Wouldn't it make sense that the ONE game he plays conservative he may be mafia? He hasn't been acting like a jester, sticking his neck on the line for townies he brilliantly confirms, nothing beneficial to the town at all. This is a complete 180 from his standard play style. I believe that these factors all combine into a clear mafia tell."

I have not VTL'd QE yet. At this phase the town needs the most information possible about who may be mafia. Mafiosos would want the DP to win before we can draw clear conclusions about what is going on in the game.

3. No Counterclaim

I character claimed extremely early and have not been counterclaimed. I know that this isn't concrete evidence, but I wouldn't have been so open with a character claim if I was mafia. Look how resistant I was last game. I only character claimed to try and lynch Curious who was a townie.

4. Progressive Town Activity

I started the claim list to make sure that we could keep track of everything. The mafia would want the town to be as lost as possible.

5. Roleclaim

You guys seem to want a roleclaim from me. Here it is. It's a bit whacky though, so bear with me.

I started the game off as third party. My role was the Extortionist. I had no win condition. This is a role that, as far as I know, was created by medic himself. I had the ability to extort information from targets during the NP, but only those medic chose. He asked me if I wanted to extort information from LDF NP 1. As I said, I was confident that LDF was town from the very beginning, in DP 1. Since I had no win condition, I did not want to risk hurting the town as it may have hurt me later. By saying no I joined the town (it makes sense now because LDF was Don Corleone). I figure the power was only to determine my affiliation and nothing more. This is why I was also so strong about LDF being a townie AFTER she tried to lynch me. Why would refusing to extort a mafioso make me join the town? According to medic, the entire purpose of my role was to determine what team I would be on. He rigged it so that I would get this newly created role because I was running the town amok last game starting in DP 1 and he didn't feel comfortable with me starting on either team. I then became a vanilla townie, for the same reasons that he did not want me to start on either team (and because most power roles were already assigned) but because of the intuitive decisions I made as Godfather he gave me the 1-shot watcher power to be useful to the town. He was afraid of giving me more than 1 power for the same reasons previously stated (I complained... that's how I know).

It all adds up too...

My character is barely known and has almost no background information available. The only known info is that he was an extortionist. Why would medic pick a character that almost nobody would have heard of?
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
innomen
Posts: 10,052
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10/14/2011 5:05:48 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/14/2011 4:47:29 PM, Mestari wrote:
The Case for my Innocence. Volume I.


Chapter 1: Pre-Game Verification

1. Statistics

We had 4 mafia with 15 players last game. I was one of them. It is likely that we started with the same numbers, as medic wanted to nerf the mafia and adding another member would do the opposite. The chances of me being mafia two games in a row are slim. 4/15 x 4/15 = 16/225 = 7.1111111%.

2. Beginner's Game

Medic wants to spread the roles around and give everyone experience. Even if we used random selection for who gets what role, it is logical that medic would switch me to town so that another player could get experience as mafia. It would be unfair for those who have never been mafia to let me be it two games in a row.

Chapter 2: Action-Based Justification

1. Information Gathering

First, note that it was my idea to end DP 1 as soon as we had enough information for every power role to make a rational decision. If I were a mafia (like last game) I would have tried to extend DP 1 in order to gain more information for a kill, such as a claim from a power role. Instead, I tried to end the DP before a power-role was outed, forcing the mafia to blind-kill.

Second, as for the accusations of forcing information out of DNinja and Andro.

DNinja: I was simply looking for a way to confirm his role. I dropped all charges when other townies claimed them to be unreasonable.

Andro: She claimed that Innomen was lying about being jailed. It was logical to assume that she was the jailor and I wanted confirmation for the LD, in case he did not want to investigate Innomen's claim. This gave no information whatsoever to the mafia as they could have just as easily arrived at the same conclusion.

2. Lynching Patterns

I VTL'd Grey early on and tried to get the town to lynch him immediately once I realized that we were all being distracted and that Andro did not claim to have jailed him either. Our delay cost us as he suicide-bombed LDF. Had the town listened to me, our mason would be very much alive right now.

I never VTL'd Andromeda. Yes, I tried to get information out of her. Yes, I was suspicious of her. No, I never tried to lynch her. In fact, I claimed that she was not a priority target. In DP 3, pg 18 I stated (this also adds to my indictment of Grey):

"Makes sense, but it also seems illogical for medic to change the role's affiliation. Regardless, you shouldn't be a priority target for the town right now. If you didn't kidnap anyone, grey isn't kidnapped. If you did kidnap Innomen, grey isn't kidnapped. Either way he's hiding. All of these random paranoia attacks are diverting attention from him. He's had days to defend himself yet he hasn't, I think it's clear that he's a mafioso trying to hide his way out of a lynch. We've all played with Grey before, we know how persuasive he is. Heck, he dares people to lynch him, but every time he's been the town. Wouldn't it make sense that the ONE game he plays conservative he may be mafia? He hasn't been acting like a jester, sticking his neck on the line for townies he brilliantly confirms, nothing beneficial to the town at all. This is a complete 180 from his standard play style. I believe that these factors all combine into a clear mafia tell."

I have not VTL'd QE yet. At this phase the town needs the most information possible about who may be mafia. Mafiosos would want the DP to win before we can draw clear conclusions about what is going on in the game.

3. No Counterclaim

I character claimed extremely early and have not been counterclaimed. I know that this isn't concrete evidence, but I wouldn't have been so open with a character claim if I was mafia. Look how resistant I was last game. I only character claimed to try and lynch Curious who was a townie.

4. Progressive Town Activity

I started the claim list to make sure that we could keep track of everything. The mafia would want the town to be as lost as possible.

5. Roleclaim

You guys seem to want a roleclaim from me. Here it is. It's a bit whacky though, so bear with me.

I started the game off as third party. My role was the Extortionist. I had no win condition. This is a role that, as far as I know, was created by medic himself. I had the ability to extort information from targets during the NP, but only those medic chose. He asked me if I wanted to extort information from LDF NP 1. As I said, I was confident that LDF was town from the very beginning, in DP 1. Since I had no win condition, I did not want to risk hurting the town as it may have hurt me later. By saying no I joined the town (it makes sense now because LDF was Don Corleone). I figure the power was only to determine my affiliation and nothing more. This is why I was also so strong about LDF being a townie AFTER she tried to lynch me. Why would refusing to extort a mafioso make me join the town? According to medic, the entire purpose of my role was to determine what team I would be on. He rigged it so that I would get this newly created role because I was running the town amok last game starting in DP 1 and he didn't feel comfortable with me starting on either team. I then became a vanilla townie, for the same reasons that he did not want me to start on either team (and because most power roles were already assigned) but because of the intuitive decisions I made as Godfather he gave me the 1-shot watcher power to be useful to the town. He was afraid of giving me more than 1 power for the same reasons previously stated (I complained... that's how I know).

It all adds up too...

My character is barely known and has almost no background information available. The only known info is that he was an extortionist. Why would medic pick a character that almost nobody would have heard of?

The lady doth protest too much, methinks

tl;dr

charlesb of mafia.

I can't believe that we aren't doing a slam dunk with quarter after his goof. You guys are just terrible. Lynch me please.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/14/2011 5:09:44 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Okay, now I am hugely suspicious of Innomen. It has already been explained why we are not lynching quarterexchange so fast. And the fact that when Andro claimed that you were lying, quarterexchange was so quick to defend you. Now Innomen, you should go the way of the Mestari and make your own role claim.