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Jester...

BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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2/3/2012 2:31:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
So when I was in the beginner games, there was always talk of jesters. If someone was acting stupidly, we'd just be like "he's probably jester". And I see people talking about it in newer beginner too. But this is all before we realize that Jester is like, never used. I have never seen a game with a jester in it. Probably for good reason though. I agree that its super easy to get yourself lynched. But I dont see why we can't add some modifiers to the role to make it more difficult to win. Jester seems like a really fun role to have in the game, so as long as its balanced then there should be no problem. So I've compiled a short list of ways to make Jester balanced and was looking for other opinions.

1. Jester awareness

Simple. The mod tells everyone that a Jester is in the game on DP1. This means you can't just act stupid and fake random investigations on people to get you lynched. People will suspect you for it.

2. Odd/Even Jester

This could possibly be coupled with the previous option. Have ahester that can only win if lynched on odd or even DP's. Alternately, make them have to be lynched on a specific DP.

3. Double Jester

This might be the best idea yet. Simply make the Jester have to be lynched TWICE. When the first lynch on them fails, town might be reluctant to lynch them again for fear of another no lynch and a wasted DP.

4. Martry/Jester

Make the jester have to be both lynched and night killed. This would add a whole new level of strategy for the role, because they have to act suspicious enough to be lynched, but not so suspicious that mafia will keep them alive in the hopes of getting a mislynch later.

5. Forced claim Jester

Give the Jester a strong character claim (not main character, but still a strong one) and force them to have to claim that character under pressure. Also, you could give them a role and force them to claim that too. This would make town reluctant to lynch them even if they act foolishly and get townies lynched. The only problem here is that most strong character claims might not have Jester-like roles.

6. Bussed Jester

On NP1, have the strongest investigator be redirected onto the Jester, who they will find innocent. This will semi-confirm the Jester as town making it difficult for them to get lynched. But if they strategize correctly, they can still win.

I really would like to see Jesters used every now and then. These are just a few possible ways to prevent it from being broken. If anyone else has other ideas, feel free to post.
blackhawk1331
Posts: 4,932
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2/3/2012 2:36:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I was jester in the knowledge game. I decided to help town, though, so when a mafia claimed cop and said they got an inno on me, I roleclaimed and tried to get two mafia killed. The town actually lynched me and I won.
Because you said it was a waste, numb nuts. - Drafter

So fvck you. :) - TV

Use prima facie correctly or not at all. - Noumena
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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2/3/2012 2:48:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I've actually seen most of those flavors lol.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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2/3/2012 2:49:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I wanna be jester sometime tho, lol.

New solution: give it to a n00b lol.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
blackhawk1331
Posts: 4,932
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2/3/2012 3:21:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/3/2012 2:49:06 PM, lovelife wrote:
I wanna be jester sometime tho, lol.

New solution: give it to a n00b lol.

That's brilliant. No one would ever know.
Because you said it was a waste, numb nuts. - Drafter

So fvck you. :) - TV

Use prima facie correctly or not at all. - Noumena
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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2/3/2012 3:29:00 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I guess the only problem with the awareness thing is that mafia can just fake a shitton of investigations on people, and get off scotch free because people will say they're just jester.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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2/3/2012 3:34:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/3/2012 3:29:00 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
I guess the only problem with the awareness thing is that mafia can just fake a shitton of investigations on people, and get off scotch free because people will say they're just jester.

Lol, this is true. I think what works best is requiring the jester to stay alive until a certain DP (maybe DP5) and only get lynched on that DP.
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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2/3/2012 3:36:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/3/2012 3:34:14 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 2/3/2012 3:29:00 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
I guess the only problem with the awareness thing is that mafia can just fake a shitton of investigations on people, and get off scotch free because people will say they're just jester.

Lol, this is true. I think what works best is requiring the jester to stay alive until a certain DP (maybe DP5) and only get lynched on that DP.

I don't know. A lot of games end before DP5 ever comes around. And staying alive that long is pretty tough too (as I'm sure you know due to recent games).
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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2/3/2012 3:38:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/3/2012 3:36:55 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
At 2/3/2012 3:34:14 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 2/3/2012 3:29:00 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
I guess the only problem with the awareness thing is that mafia can just fake a shitton of investigations on people, and get off scotch free because people will say they're just jester.

Lol, this is true. I think what works best is requiring the jester to stay alive until a certain DP (maybe DP5) and only get lynched on that DP.

I don't know. A lot of games end before DP5 ever comes around. And staying alive that long is pretty tough too (as I'm sure you know due to recent games).

The jester could be made bulletproof.
Logic_on_rails
Posts: 2,445
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2/4/2012 11:52:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The best jester variant I've ever seen was from Chrys' Harry Potter game. From http://www.debate.org...

"Nonentity: Jester: Third Party
You are the Golden Snitch. You are an annoying golden orb that tends to hold up Quidditch games. Unlike normal Jesters, your goal is to hold off getting lynched for a little while. Get within two votes of being lynched on two separate DP's, and you win, even if you are subsequently lynched. You are third party, of course, and will come up guilty upon investigation."

Getting within 2 votes of being lynched on 2 separate days is much more challenging.
"Tis not in mortals to command success
But we"ll do more, Sempronius, we"ll deserve it
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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2/4/2012 11:57:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/4/2012 11:52:26 PM, Logic_on_rails wrote:
The best jester variant I've ever seen was from Chrys' Harry Potter game. From http://www.debate.org...

"Nonentity: Jester: Third Party
You are the Golden Snitch. You are an annoying golden orb that tends to hold up Quidditch games. Unlike normal Jesters, your goal is to hold off getting lynched for a little while. Get within two votes of being lynched on two separate DP's, and you win, even if you are subsequently lynched. You are third party, of course, and will come up guilty upon investigation."

Getting within 2 votes of being lynched on 2 separate days is much more challenging.

Really? It seems pretty easy.

DP1: Pressure someone like TV or Medic, who will almost assuredly pressure you to claim once they do. Then log off for a while while the pressure votes stockpile. Then come back on when you're 2 votes away from death, claim and move on.

DP2: Fake claim doctor. When you're CC'd, they lynch you and you win.
royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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2/5/2012 12:03:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I think that roles that require one to get killed are too easy to play. Martyr seems a bit more fair than Jester, but I would rather not have either.