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Philosophers Mafia II Dp3

Noumena
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2/27/2013 10:04:06 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Living players-

LK
Ifly
Sarcastic
Royal
Bossy
TUF

Dead players-

FT(2)/Danielle- You are Friedrich Nietzsche. While you were an important modern philosopher, you took special interest in the Ancient Greeks, scorning most of modern philosophy. Therefore you are the miller. If you are investigated, you will show up as guilty. You win with the town.

Budda- You are Marquis de Sade. While modern, you were not a philosopher in the traditional sense. In fact, many see your work as thinly veiled justification and description of sadism. Therefore you are the serial killer. Every night you may choose one person to kill. Note that you do not have to use this action every night. Also, since you are a modern philosopher you show up innocent upon investigation. However, in the event that you use your ability, there will be a 20% chance of an investigative role being directed to you. You win if you are alive at the end of the game.

Bull- You are Thomas Hobbes. Justification of the State (and more specifically monarchy) found its philosophical justification in your work. And while you also had other interests, your religious views became increasingly complicated as your years went by. Many accused you of atheism and hence you had to conceal your true beliefs on the matter. You are the fake claimer. You may not under any circumstances reveal either your character or your role. Doing so will result in mod-killing. You win with the town.

Blackvoid- You are Baruch Spinoza. You introduced an invigorating turn on the rationalist movement in epistemology but your religious views brought you into conflict with many of your time. You are the hated townie. It takes one less vote to lynch you during the day. You win with the town.

Daytona- Plato- GF
MiG- Democritus- Role cop
Drafter- Bertrand Russel- JOAT(1x doc, cop, vig)
FT(1)- Immanuel Kant- Cop

With six players alive it takes 4 votes to lynch.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
Noumena
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2/27/2013 12:43:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Le bump.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
IFLYHIGH
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2/27/2013 1:52:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 1:01:28 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
It's IFLY/Lk, me thinks. PoE..

Dude. There is a SK and I'm the only claimed protective role. I'm obvious town. Anyways, I've been thinking about the number of killing roles in this game. There is four killing roles in this game that is capable of killing. PGO, JOAT(who had a killing ability), SK, and Vig. Add the mafia NK in, and that is possibly five deaths in one night. I don't, but that seems to give the game a huge swing factor. Especially a game with only fourteen players. I don't know, but I'm thinking maybe FT was right about Royal. Or maybe it's Sarcastic, even though that seems more unlikely. Or maybe there's two SK's. I'll try to post more analysis later.
IFLYHIGH
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2/27/2013 1:53:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 1:52:32 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 2/27/2013 1:01:28 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
It's IFLY/Lk, me thinks. PoE..

Dude. There is a SK and I'm the only claimed protective role. I'm obvious town. Anyways, I've been thinking about the number of killing roles in this game. There is four killing roles in this game that is capable of killing. PGO, JOAT(who had a killing ability), SK, and Vig. Add the mafia NK in, and that is possibly five deaths in one night. I don't, but that seems to give the game a huge swing factor. Especially a game with only fourteen players. I don't know, but I'm thinking maybe FT was right about Royal. Or maybe it's Sarcastic, even though that seems more unlikely. Or maybe there's two SK's. I'll try to post more analysis later.

I wasn't clear. I think it's possible Royal lied about being PGO. I'm trying to make sense of this whole situation since I have a town read on just about everybody.
SarcasticIndeed
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2/27/2013 2:02:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 1:52:32 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 2/27/2013 1:01:28 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
It's IFLY/Lk, me thinks. PoE..

Dude. There is a SK and I'm the only claimed protective role. I'm obvious town. Anyways, I've been thinking about the number of killing roles in this game. There is four killing roles in this game that is capable of killing. PGO, JOAT(who had a killing ability), SK, and Vig. Add the mafia NK in, and that is possibly five deaths in one night. I don't, but that seems to give the game a huge swing factor. Especially a game with only fourteen players. I don't know, but I'm thinking maybe FT was right about Royal. Or maybe it's Sarcastic, even though that seems more unlikely. Or maybe there's two SK's. I'll try to post more analysis later.
Then the only one I can suspect is LK. VTL LK
<SIGNATURE CENSORED> nac
IFLYHIGH
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2/27/2013 2:22:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 2:02:59 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
Then the only one I can suspect is LK. VTL LK


No need to rush the DP by voting somebody already. I'm actually thinking that it's Royal. The only other option is if LK is fvcking awesome at being mafia or if TUF or you have fooled us into "confirming you". That is most certainly a possibility.

We need to do some things before deciding who to lynch

-Bossy needs to out his results

-TUF needs to out his results

-Royal needs to character claim and paraphrase her role PM.

I'm going to back through the DP's and try to see if anything stands out to me.
SarcasticIndeed
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2/27/2013 2:47:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 2:22:23 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 2/27/2013 2:02:59 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
Then the only one I can suspect is LK. VTL LK


No need to rush the DP by voting somebody already. I'm actually thinking that it's Royal. The only other option is if LK is fvcking awesome at being mafia or if TUF or you have fooled us into "confirming you". That is most certainly a possibility.

We need to do some things before deciding who to lynch

-Bossy needs to out his results

-TUF needs to out his results

-Royal needs to character claim and paraphrase her role PM.

I'm going to back through the DP's and try to see if anything stands out to me.

Not rushing. The vote won't lynch anyone for now. I'll try to look over the DPs.
<SIGNATURE CENSORED> nac
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 5:50:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 2:02:59 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
At 2/27/2013 1:52:32 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 2/27/2013 1:01:28 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
It's IFLY/Lk, me thinks. PoE..

Dude. There is a SK and I'm the only claimed protective role. I'm obvious town. Anyways, I've been thinking about the number of killing roles in this game. There is four killing roles in this game that is capable of killing. PGO, JOAT(who had a killing ability), SK, and Vig. Add the mafia NK in, and that is possibly five deaths in one night. I don't, but that seems to give the game a huge swing factor. Especially a game with only fourteen players. I don't know, but I'm thinking maybe FT was right about Royal. Or maybe it's Sarcastic, even though that seems more unlikely. Or maybe there's two SK's. I'll try to post more analysis later.
Then the only one I can suspect is LK. VTL LK


Great reasoning brah.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 5:52:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Sarcastic, who did you shoot NP1?

@Social: Do TP actions go ahead of town and mafia's actions?
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 5:53:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This is exactly what I told you retards. If we leave an SK alive throughout the night, we have no guarantee that he actually won't shoot.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Buddamoose
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2/27/2013 5:59:33 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 5:53:13 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
This is exactly what I told you retards. If we leave an SK alive throughout the night, we have no guarantee that he actually won't shoot.

Bull was the next rational choice to be mafia, so dont act like you wouldnt be pushing his lynch today if i didnt shoot him, Douche
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

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TUF
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2/27/2013 6:00:44 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 5:52:11 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Sarcastic, who did you shoot NP1?

He forfeited I think.

@Social: Do TP actions go ahead of town and mafia's actions?
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 6:00:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'm skeptical of Bossy's claim. We already have two town individuals with investigate powers (FT and Drafter) compared to the mafia's one individual with investigative powers (Mig). Although it's unlikely that the mafia would have two investigative powers, I'm seriously starting to doubt there being three town investigative powers.

Furthermore, Bossy claimed at a time when almost everybody's role nature was known, thus making his role unfalsifiable. The only person who hadn't claimed was IFLYHIGH, but it was a pretty simple deduction that he was likely a protective role.

VTL Bossy
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 6:03:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:00:44 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 5:52:11 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Sarcastic, who did you shoot NP1?

He forfeited I think.

If he did, then this effectively confirms Royal as PGO.

@Social: Do TP actions go ahead of town and mafia's actions?
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
TUF
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2/27/2013 6:09:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
IFLY, and sarcastic are definitely confirmed, if sarcastic wasn't roleblocked or tampered with in anyway, I think there is a fairly good indication that he really is the doc (not that I ever really doubted he was).

That leaves royal, bossy, and LK.

I think I understand that given the way this game is set up, that there very well could be a PGO. Royal hasn't been very active so it's been hard to establish a behavioral read on her given the circumstances.

I seemed to believe LK's claim last DP (and yes, this was BEFORE He had agreed with me on the budda situation; which worked out anyway thanks to sarcastic), but I am not so sure about him. I have a hard time saying he is mafia, because of how quick he was to dis-credit BD's claim, in accordance to how his was different. It may have been some damn good WIFOM on his part, but I don't know. LK really does seem to have town behavior. His role is a common fake claimable role, though, and doesn't really help the town much.

Bossy's role could be helpful in verifying other people's roles, and I seemed to believe him last DP, but I want to hear who he targetted. Hopefully not IFLY, as the point of that was to prove his role, but now that's already wasted anyway, thanks to FT last DP.

We definitely need to hear Bossy's results before we go anywhere.

Scum is somewhere in bossy, LK, and royal.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 6:14:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:09:55 PM, TUF wrote:
IFLY, and sarcastic are definitely confirmed, if sarcastic wasn't roleblocked or tampered with in anyway, I think there is a fairly good indication that he really is the doc (not that I ever really doubted he was).

That leaves royal, bossy, and LK.

I think I understand that given the way this game is set up, that there very well could be a PGO. Royal hasn't been very active so it's been hard to establish a behavioral read on her given the circumstances.

I seemed to believe LK's claim last DP (and yes, this was BEFORE He had agreed with me on the budda situation; which worked out anyway thanks to sarcastic), but I am not so sure about him. I have a hard time saying he is mafia, because of how quick he was to dis-credit BD's claim, in accordance to how his was different. It may have been some damn good WIFOM on his part, but I don't know. LK really does seem to have town behavior. His role is a common fake claimable role, though, and doesn't really help the town much.

Bossy's role could be helpful in verifying other people's roles, and I seemed to believe him last DP, but I want to hear who he targetted. Hopefully not IFLY, as the point of that was to prove his role, but now that's already wasted anyway, thanks to FT last DP.

We definitely need to hear Bossy's results before we go anywhere.

Scum is somewhere in bossy, LK, and royal.

See my analysis regarding Bossy's role claim being unconfirmable and unlikely.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
TUF
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2/27/2013 6:22:34 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:00:58 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
I'm skeptical of Bossy's claim. We already have two town individuals with investigate powers (FT and Drafter) compared to the mafia's one individual with investigative powers (Mig). Although it's unlikely that the mafia would have two investigative powers, I'm seriously starting to doubt there being three town investigative powers.

Drafter was a one shot. And Bossy's role is quite a bit smaller in power compared to a standard role, but it helps in verifying whether people lied or not about their role. I believe that his role could be in this game, because of the way his role was worded, seemed to have socials same style, and the role seemed to fit with the multiple killing roles in this game.

Furthermore, Bossy claimed at a time when almost everybody's role nature was known, thus making his role unfalsifiable. The only person who hadn't claimed was IFLYHIGH, but it was a pretty simple deduction that he was likely a protective role.

This is true, but it's not really normal for every single claim to be out by DP2 like that. Bossy kind of got put into a situation where his claim would seem scummy either way. And he hasn't really been super active. But I agree, given the circumstances, his role doesn't help us much. Even if he caught someone with a diffrent type of role than they said they had, I doubt anyone would know how to trust the results.

VTL Bossy

I want to hear what his results are first, see whether he tried to follow the plan on IFLY, or do his own thing. He definitely is on the list of potential scum though, but there's not more on him, than there is on you or royal for example. In fact, there really isn't a whole lot on any of you, so I am going to have to go and do some behavioral reading.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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2/27/2013 6:24:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 1:53:54 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 2/27/2013 1:52:32 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 2/27/2013 1:01:28 PM, SarcasticIndeed wrote:
It's IFLY/Lk, me thinks. PoE..

Dude. There is a SK and I'm the only claimed protective role. I'm obvious town. Anyways, I've been thinking about the number of killing roles in this game. There is four killing roles in this game that is capable of killing. PGO, JOAT(who had a killing ability), SK, and Vig. Add the mafia NK in, and that is possibly five deaths in one night. I don't, but that seems to give the game a huge swing factor. Especially a game with only fourteen players. I don't know, but I'm thinking maybe FT was right about Royal. Or maybe it's Sarcastic, even though that seems more unlikely. Or maybe there's two SK's. I'll try to post more analysis later.

I wasn't clear. I think it's possible Royal lied about being PGO. I'm trying to make sense of this whole situation since I have a town read on just about everybody.

The only way that could be possible, is if sarcastic killed FT1. And if he did that, why wouldn't he have told us?
I think Royal really is pgo, but whether she is town or not is another story.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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2/27/2013 6:25:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:03:08 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:00:44 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 5:52:11 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Sarcastic, who did you shoot NP1?

He forfeited I think.

If he did, then this effectively confirms Royal as PGO.

Agreed. Mafia PGO, or town PGO though??

@Social: Do TP actions go ahead of town and mafia's actions?
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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2/27/2013 6:36:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:22:34 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:00:58 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
I'm skeptical of Bossy's claim. We already have two town individuals with investigate powers (FT and Drafter) compared to the mafia's one individual with investigative powers (Mig). Although it's unlikely that the mafia would have two investigative powers, I'm seriously starting to doubt there being three town investigative powers.

Drafter was a one shot. And Bossy's role is quite a bit smaller in power compared to a standard role, but it helps in verifying whether people lied or not about their role. I believe that his role could be in this game, because of the way his role was worded, seemed to have socials same style, and the role seemed to fit with the multiple killing roles in this game.

God dammit this is so annoying. The large amount of cops could easily balance out with the fact that town has essentially four vanilla roles.

Furthermore, Bossy claimed at a time when almost everybody's role nature was known, thus making his role unfalsifiable. The only person who hadn't claimed was IFLYHIGH, but it was a pretty simple deduction that he was likely a protective role.

This is true, but it's not really normal for every single claim to be out by DP2 like that. Bossy kind of got put into a situation where his claim would seem scummy either way. And he hasn't really been super active. But I agree, given the circumstances, his role doesn't help us much. Even if he caught someone with a diffrent type of role than they said they had, I doubt anyone would know how to trust the results.

If something comes up as a possible inconsistency or scummy behaviour, it doesn't do good to immediately dismiss it as a coincidence. We can't confirm his role, but we can confirm that the circumstances under which he claimed his role were scummy.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
TUF
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2/27/2013 6:42:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:36:55 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:22:34 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:00:58 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
I'm skeptical of Bossy's claim. We already have two town individuals with investigate powers (FT and Drafter) compared to the mafia's one individual with investigative powers (Mig). Although it's unlikely that the mafia would have two investigative powers, I'm seriously starting to doubt there being three town investigative powers.

Drafter was a one shot. And Bossy's role is quite a bit smaller in power compared to a standard role, but it helps in verifying whether people lied or not about their role. I believe that his role could be in this game, because of the way his role was worded, seemed to have socials same style, and the role seemed to fit with the multiple killing roles in this game.

God dammit this is so annoying. The large amount of cops could easily balance out with the fact that town has essentially four vanilla roles.

There's always the possibility that you aren't a vanilla. Just saying lol.

Furthermore, Bossy claimed at a time when almost everybody's role nature was known, thus making his role unfalsifiable. The only person who hadn't claimed was IFLYHIGH, but it was a pretty simple deduction that he was likely a protective role.

This is true, but it's not really normal for every single claim to be out by DP2 like that. Bossy kind of got put into a situation where his claim would seem scummy either way. And he hasn't really been super active. But I agree, given the circumstances, his role doesn't help us much. Even if he caught someone with a diffrent type of role than they said they had, I doubt anyone would know how to trust the results.

If something comes up as a possible inconsistency or scummy behaviour, it doesn't do good to immediately dismiss it as a coincidence. We can't confirm his role, but we can confirm that the circumstances under which he claimed his role were scummy.

Agreed. I am not going to lynch him because of the circumstances he was put in though. I need to do some behavioral analysis.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
Noumena
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2/27/2013 6:44:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 5:52:11 PM, Lordknukle wrote:

@Social: Do TP actions go ahead of town and mafia's actions?

Mafia are weighted first, then TP, then town. This is only in case of conflicts where, say, mafia try to NK the vig who's taking out the mafia performing the kill. In that situation, the mafia kill would go through and then he would die from the vig.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 6:50:33 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:42:16 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:36:55 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:22:34 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:00:58 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
I'm skeptical of Bossy's claim. We already have two town individuals with investigate powers (FT and Drafter) compared to the mafia's one individual with investigative powers (Mig). Although it's unlikely that the mafia would have two investigative powers, I'm seriously starting to doubt there being three town investigative powers.

Drafter was a one shot. And Bossy's role is quite a bit smaller in power compared to a standard role, but it helps in verifying whether people lied or not about their role. I believe that his role could be in this game, because of the way his role was worded, seemed to have socials same style, and the role seemed to fit with the multiple killing roles in this game.

God dammit this is so annoying. The large amount of cops could easily balance out with the fact that town has essentially four vanilla roles.

There's always the possibility that you aren't a vanilla. Just saying lol.

There's always the possibility that you aren't watcher. See how easy that was? :)

Furthermore, Bossy claimed at a time when almost everybody's role nature was known, thus making his role unfalsifiable. The only person who hadn't claimed was IFLYHIGH, but it was a pretty simple deduction that he was likely a protective role.

This is true, but it's not really normal for every single claim to be out by DP2 like that. Bossy kind of got put into a situation where his claim would seem scummy either way. And he hasn't really been super active. But I agree, given the circumstances, his role doesn't help us much. Even if he caught someone with a diffrent type of role than they said they had, I doubt anyone would know how to trust the results.

If something comes up as a possible inconsistency or scummy behaviour, it doesn't do good to immediately dismiss it as a coincidence. We can't confirm his role, but we can confirm that the circumstances under which he claimed his role were scummy.

Agreed. I am not going to lynch him because of the circumstances he was put in though. I need to do some behavioral analysis.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
TUF
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2/27/2013 6:59:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:50:33 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:42:16 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:36:55 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:22:34 PM, TUF wrote:
At 2/27/2013 6:00:58 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
I'm skeptical of Bossy's claim. We already have two town individuals with investigate powers (FT and Drafter) compared to the mafia's one individual with investigative powers (Mig). Although it's unlikely that the mafia would have two investigative powers, I'm seriously starting to doubt there being three town investigative powers.

Drafter was a one shot. And Bossy's role is quite a bit smaller in power compared to a standard role, but it helps in verifying whether people lied or not about their role. I believe that his role could be in this game, because of the way his role was worded, seemed to have socials same style, and the role seemed to fit with the multiple killing roles in this game.

God dammit this is so annoying. The large amount of cops could easily balance out with the fact that town has essentially four vanilla roles.

There's always the possibility that you aren't a vanilla. Just saying lol.

There's always the possibility that you aren't watcher. See how easy that was? :)

I am not implicating that you aren't the vanilla, I am just saying, that the balance out thing, may be wrong. There is a lot to consider. I kind of want to see where IFLY stands on all of this, and here bossy's result before doing anything this DP.

This DP is the make or break one for us. We have to lynch scum today, or we could be at LYLO tomorrow. For all I know, we are at lylo now.

Do you think this game has 4 mafia, or 5?
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 7:43:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/27/2013 6:59:36 PM, TUF wrote:
Do you think this game has 4 mafia, or 5?

Actually, with 14 players, I was thinking that it would be either three or four.

If it was five, we would have already lost.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Lordknukle
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2/27/2013 7:45:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
In the American Politics game modded by Pinko, there were 14 players and three mafia.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."