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The Eternal Nightmare Mafia Eclipse Phase 1.5

Lucky_Luciano
Posts: 4,350
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8/5/2013 4:11:02 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
The last thread got too damn long. On a side note: This is the most active game I've ever modded, and during a time when inactivity is supposed to be high. Props to you guys.

About to Fade Away

Beginner - 2/7
TUF - 1/7
Drafter - 1/7
Maikuru - 1/7
Flip - 1/7
IFLY - 1/7
Budda - 1/7
"Age is not important" - Airmax 2014
"Australia... is that a place?" - Airmax 2014
Yraelz
Posts: 4,056
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8/5/2013 4:15:36 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:10:55 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:05:48 AM, Yraelz wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:01:28 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
Why should I have?
Why should I assume my assumption is correct?

That's not much of an assumption. Your PM apparently mentions the night in a mafia game? What else could it mean?

It could also mean the "night" phase, perhaps it will be called something else, too. Like Nightmare phase, or twilight.

Why don't you answer my more important question of: why should I out my intel?
If someone, like Beginner, is saying there in no night phase because it is EP, why can't I correct him with general knowledge?

It's not a question of why can't you correct him with general knowledge. What I'm interested in is our play style from game to game. As town you are a player who likes to examine the set-up and postulate theories about it.

To me it looks like you legitimately didn't know if a NP existed. However, if you started this game with a role PM that said, "blah blah blah night blah blah blah", then I can't see this being a question in your mind. For instance, check out IFLYs response.

I'm going to think about this a bit more.
Buddamoose
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8/5/2013 4:16:38 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 3:58:22 AM, FrackJack wrote:
At 8/5/2013 3:55:15 AM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 8/5/2013 3:50:19 AM, FrackJack wrote:

The "No" was directed to the "Dust"

First off, I wanted to know more. I actually nulled readed him, thus the unvote. Be back for the quotes.

So his character is null to you?

Yes. Let me hunt the quotes.

"IFLY is a roleblocker right? Well first off, I FOS Beginner because of his character not his role. Note the use of the word 'could'. I refuse to let a idiot like beginner to live."

Post #435

Buddamoose:Now you are saying Beginner has commited a lot of scum-tells, yet, haven't actually listed anything that is a scum tell, or at least haven't been able to explain why it is a scum-tell coherently.

FrackjackI have.

"Scummy role"

(etc.)

I didn't even change my reasons.

Post #462
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
Yraelz
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8/5/2013 4:18:51 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:13:43 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
Were you not implying that there were no NPs? If not, what is the point of your post? We have to do something so we get DPs back...Yeah labels!!!

No. I was implying that we could change EPs back into DPs possibly. That has no bearing on NPs.

If turning the EP to DP has some real significance, why wouldn't you have explained what happened in that game? Tsk Tsk for withholding information.

Because the OP indicates this is true. The OP says that we can't see votes because the sun is eclipsed, thus EP. This is a mafia sided mechanic. The balance mechanism is probably to convert it back into DPs...
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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8/5/2013 4:23:48 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Kind of like how I thought beginner might be a ship?
Or how I thought it was humans vs. aliens vs. humans?
I am still postulating things, so that's not different.

Look at the context, man.
I was questioning why Beginner's role offered protection in the day. Ask him why he was confused by the new term.
With you, I inferred you saying there was no NP. If that was wrong, so be it. My correcting you was not contadictory, since I stated the same claim... there is no mention of there being no NPs.

Let me put it this way:
Beginner said there was no NP because it was replaced by EP. I said we don't know that, since it isn't stated.
You said (or I inferred) that there is no NP because we must do something to eliminate the EP. I said there is no mention there is no NP.

Context...
My work here is, finally, done.
Khaos_Mage
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8/5/2013 4:24:46 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:20:26 AM, Yraelz wrote:
Bed time Khaos, I'll think about you more in the morning.

No, you will think of me tonight...in bed.
My work here is, finally, done.
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,448
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8/5/2013 4:26:02 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:24:46 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:20:26 AM, Yraelz wrote:
Bed time Khaos, I'll think about you more in the morning.

No, you will think of me tonight...in bed.

oooooh kinkyyy, you saucy brute you ;)

lol
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
Lucky_Luciano
Posts: 4,350
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8/5/2013 4:26:38 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:24:46 AM, Tulle wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:20:26 AM, Yraelz wrote:
Bed time Khaos, I'll think about you more in the morning.

No, you will think of me tonight...in bed.
"Age is not important" - Airmax 2014
"Australia... is that a place?" - Airmax 2014
FrackJack
Posts: 1,392
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8/5/2013 4:29:10 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:26:38 AM, Lucky_Luciano wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:24:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:20:26 AM, Yraelz wrote:
Bed time Khaos, I'll think about you more in the morning.

No, you will think of me tonight...in bed.

How did you mix this up?
: At 8/8/2013 6:15:09 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
: The idiots are rebelling.

http://i.imgur.com...
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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8/5/2013 4:29:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:18:51 AM, Yraelz wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:13:43 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
Were you not implying that there were no NPs? If not, what is the point of your post? We have to do something so we get DPs back...Yeah labels!!!

No. I was implying that we could change EPs back into DPs possibly. That has no bearing on NPs.

If turning the EP to DP has some real significance, why wouldn't you have explained what happened in that game? Tsk Tsk for withholding information.

Because the OP indicates this is true. The OP says that we can't see votes because the sun is eclipsed, thus EP. This is a mafia sided mechanic. The balance mechanism is probably to convert it back into DPs...

1. We can't see votes because everyone is paranoid because of the eclipse, not simply because the sun is eclipsed. Semantic, but true.
2. The balance mechanic, I would assume, is to beat the mafia, thus winning the game, and restoring balance to the sun. But, whatever.

The fact that I am "funny" to you because I inferred something from your statement is pathetic. Even more so because if my inference was correct, there is nothing scummy in my response.

It is almost like you are tying to find a reason to attack me.
Now, ask beginner your questions. And then answer your own damn questions yourself.
My work here is, finally, done.
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,448
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8/5/2013 4:30:16 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:29:10 AM, FrackJack wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:26:38 AM, Lucky_Luciano wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:24:46 AM, Fourtrouble wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:20:26 AM, Yraelz wrote:
Bed time Khaos, I'll think about you more in the morning.

No, you will think of me tonight...in bed.

How did you mix this up?

whatttt, you both have it wrong
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
FrackJack
Posts: 1,392
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8/5/2013 4:31:45 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:30:16 AM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:29:10 AM, FrackJack wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:26:38 AM, Lucky_Luciano wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:24:46 AM, Izbo14 wrote:
At 8/5/2013 4:20:26 AM, Yraelz wrote:
Bed time Khaos, I'll think about you more in the morning.

No, you will think of me tonight...in bed.

How did you mix this up?

whatttt, you both have it wrong

kfc
: At 8/8/2013 6:15:09 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
: The idiots are rebelling.

http://i.imgur.com...
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,448
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8/5/2013 4:35:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Just had to sig it XD
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
Beginner
Posts: 4,292
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8/5/2013 4:39:47 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
It's sooo late. FrackJack, you're just being stupidly biased against me and digging yourself deeper into your grave. It's relatively hard for me not to imagine a lynch on you this EP. If you are town, you've been a pretty bad town.
TO BED! XD
Senpai has noticed you.
Beginner
Posts: 4,292
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8/5/2013 4:40:39 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:35:54 AM, Buddamoose wrote:
Just had to sig it XD

Guess I wasn't the only one..
Senpai has noticed you.
FrackJack
Posts: 1,392
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8/5/2013 4:48:33 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 4:39:47 AM, Beginner wrote:
It's sooo late. FrackJack, you're just being stupidly biased against me and digging yourself deeper into your grave. It's relatively hard for me not to imagine a lynch on you this EP. If you are town, you've been a pretty bad town.
TO BED! XD

kfc.
: At 8/8/2013 6:15:09 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
: The idiots are rebelling.

http://i.imgur.com...
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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8/5/2013 7:19:49 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/4/2013 8:58:23 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/4/2013 8:38:37 PM, drafterman wrote:
Who's voting Flip?

probably his self because a vote went away from beginner

He said he was going to vote me, and there is a vote on me.

At 8/4/2013 9:11:02 PM, IFLYHIGH wrote:
At 8/4/2013 8:57:29 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/4/2013 7:41:19 PM, drafterman wrote:
IFLY - On the fence. What if he makes a scum player permanently unlynchable?

Holy crap, this flew completely over my head. can he do this? Wouldnt that make it impossible for town to win?

I can make a person unlynchable/immune to night kills as long as I am alive.

If you made a mafioso unlynchable, they would never kill you. So how are you to die?

At 8/4/2013 10:05:10 PM, FrackJack wrote:

Why the fvck don't you get about beginner? I found him scummy. That is enough. Do you have Down's syndrome?

It isn't enough. I don't know *why* you find him scummy.

At 8/4/2013 10:35:53 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
Drafter- Why is it that you null-read IFLY on the basis that he could potentially make a scum-player unlynchable? It seems to me that even if he could, that doesn't factor into what his affiliation could be.

Yes. Hence the null read. He could go either way.

At 8/5/2013 12:02:18 AM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 8/5/2013 12:00:08 AM, mattrodstrom wrote:
At 8/4/2013 2:35:12 PM, TUF wrote:
I think Alpha might be a third party role..

I was kind of thinking he was town given that he was mentioned in the story as trying to save someone..

However, given my pm, a TP serial killer could definitely be a possibility I suppose.
That said, if that's so I guess I've kinda put a bit of a target on my back dp1 :(

if there is a watcher, or a doctor, maybe consider targeting me Huh? :o)

Uh... why? Because you theorized the possibility of SK?

At 8/5/2013 12:11:54 AM, Beginner wrote:
I'm a form of double voter that grants a person immunity to EP actions (lynching not included)
^Anyone care to reveal the ramifications?

If you posses a Mafioso at MYLO/LYLO that could end the game.
TUF
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8/5/2013 7:56:48 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
So far, I see this the game slightly failing due to player error, and over-eagerness. I think people are focusing far too much on the surface. In order to win this game, we will need to break down on player behaviors.

I say "behaviors" loosely, however, as certain players can tend to have "bad behavior" and often times will be town. In order to win this game, we need to analyze each individual players behavior in accordance to their play style. For example: Many people think that khaos is scummy in almost every game he plays in, based on his conclusions, and weird (to them) actions. I dis-agree that khaos is objectively wrong, or scummy, but I think that he is on a different level of thinking than most people. He is mis-understood, and some of his logic seems to contradict that of other players. Naturally this doesn"t really win him much favor with the town, and usually presents an easy mis-lynch for mafia members.

But we have to stop lynching people based on these principles alone, because it often times results in mis-lynches. And ultimately there isn"t an objective way to play the game. SOP"s, and policies, based on the status qou is harmful.

So rather than leading lynches off of players having "weird reasoning" let"s ask questions that might lead us to believe this reasoning is "weird" specifically to that player"s play as town/mafia.

On the other side of this, posting like town, doesn"t always mean someone is town. A clever mafia could very easily dis-guise themselves as townie through multiple methods; so for certain players we might have to delve a little deeper into than others.

I"ll jump into some current reads, though keep in mind I am not entirely caught up.

Right now, if I were to lead a lynch on someone it would be IFLY.

IFLY-

I think I have played enough games with him, to be able to generally tell when he is town. I have been wrong about him multiple times in past games, to the point where I think his town behavior is telling.

IFLY for the most part has been pretty in-active this dayphase. I won"t hold this specifically against him because I know he has spurts of activity, and inactivity. But focusing on the content and quality alone in his posts, they don"t seem very to match his town play. None of IFLY"s posts seem to really be inquisitive about many functions of the game. Even when he is in-active as town, it"s generally pretty easy to tell that IFLY is at least trying to figure out scum. In this game, he has been a lot more stand-offish and reserved.

What first turned my nose towards IFLY was that I was looking for players specifically that match his description up until now.

Here"s my theory (and I accept that it may be wrong).

Scum will interact with each other in 2 different ways in a game.

1. Casually regard each other, maybe ask a question once towards each other, but ultimately there will be little to no interaction early game that really suggests a link to each other. Despite how many people think buddying is a scum tell, it has developed to such a point that this play has switched. Normally "buddying" is a town tell in my eyes, as mafia don"t want to link themselves together like this. So you will see scum regard each other with a lack of interest, or not too much emotion towards each other.

2. The second is usually when the mafia wants to try and create deception and manipulation from the start, and two of them will try to separate each other through mock "fighting". This is a fairly common technique that is dropped every once and a while, and can sometimes work pretty well. The thing to remember about this technique, is that usually this is only between 2 mafia. The mafia don"t want to bring to much attention to themselves, and this bus technique is generally really risky to begin with.

Number one is the most common way, because it is a pretty safe way to play without putting a team at too much risk. Even if number two is happening, the remaining mafia will be falling into the first category.

The difference in town behavior is that town is a little more sporadic and confused. They won"t have this same calm reserve. Noticing players falling into category one isn"t always as easy as I make it sound however, because yes, townies will act in ways similar to this as well. So again, we have to make this game player specific.

I am feeling IFLY falls specifically into this category, BECAUSE this is not his normal town genre. IFLY"s casual, calm, reserved play, doesn"t fall into his normal speculative play style (IE before IFLY was changed to mafia in drafters game, he was extremely skeptical, and objective).

IFLY"s interactions with players, quite frankly doesn"t fit his town play. At the beginning of this game, he makes plenty of his casual posts, and even tries to participate in the "tridra" joke. His posts don"t tie him down to anyone, and put him off as a separate entity; the image the mafia are trying to pull off.

This behavior is what initially led me to believe that IFLY was scum.

The next part of his behavior that leads me to be suspicious of IFLY is his role claim, and the way he claimed it.

There was already a wagon building on Beginner (for what I believe to be mostly made up of quite silly reasons). I don"t think it was IFLY"s real intention to get beginner lynched with his "CC". He hadn"t already stated a significant amount of FOS to suggest that he was wanting to lynch him from his claim, nor did he do so much as cast his vote on Beginner after he claimed his role. I don"t think he actually expected beginner to get lynched form his CC, (though if he did, I am sure it would have been an added benefit). It looks more like he was trying to get a decently confirmable early claim out, to make him look townish. The CC attempt is a pretty good cover up excuse for him to be allowed to claim as well. But if he really IS the Seraph knight, was sense did it make to "CC" beginner? At the point in which he CC"ed, beginner had already announced that immunity of lynches was just theory, and that he was waiting on answers from the mod. Did IFLY just not read? And if he didn"t, it still wouldn"t make sense for him from a town perspective not to press him for more details first before claiming the way he did. Also if IFLY really is the Seraph knight, he is possibly the strongest townie role in the game. Claiming the way he did was extremely anti-town and makes almost 0 sense given the situation. Another minor note, is how specific he was in his claiming. There was no hesitation in confidence in his Seraph knight claim. While I don"t know if all roles were given names or not, I seem to assume they didn"t based on maikrus question to me (wouldn"t have been relevant, if it wasn"t something true about his own role PM). IFLY describes the Seraph knight, and pretty straight forward. I have a hard time believing his paraphrasal was actually paraphrased, given it"s flow, and continuity perfection as well. I am generally pretty keen on catching these types of things. I know he claimed one of the main characters in the OP; TBH, I am not too worried about this. I am more interested in focusing on behavior, than WIFOM"ing about whether mafia were given fake claims, and trying to deduce the affiliations of characters mentioned in the OP based on a vague and open to interpret OP. We don"t know what plot twists are in store, nor does the story line seem to have suggested any type of villain so far.

Anyways, IFLY seems pretty scummy to me right now, almost more than anyone else. I am not completely confident in his lynching just yet, however.

Yraelz (flippant)-

Despite my multiple posts that suggest I think he is scummy, I actually have been mentally been crossing him off the scum list. It"s hard to judge Hyrda"s because both players in the hydra may have very different styles. So far I think FT has demonstrated the biggest side of their pro-town efforts. But I will admit
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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8/5/2013 7:57:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
and behavior I have severely over-estimated his skill level (no offense). I think Yraelz is a good player, in that he is active, and based on BTSOTST, can be manipulative. But his analysis in this game isn"t very behavioral driven, and has coincided with a lot of the others players more shallow styles. I think Yraelz is a fair step above a lot of them, but I wouldn"t say that his approach towards this game has been very great. Even if he is mafia, It doesn"t make a lot of sense for him to respond the way he has, and to have pushed certain players the way he has. But Yraelz has been playing quite a bit more seriously in this game, as opposed to his more light and careless approach that you see him employ as mafia quite often. His responses to my interrogation earlier were also pretty good indicators that Yraelz is tow if BTSOTST is any reference at all. He is a lot less passionate or worried about my pressure. As a townie, he automatically has the right to be less defensive against my attacks, if he actually is innocent. He answered my questions with ease, and confidence. I don"t think he was really worried that I was on to him, because he doesn"t have anything to hide. On an emotional base, his genuine forgetfulness/lack of caring towards romance of the three kingdoms seems pretty legit.

On FT"s part, his commitment towards helping the town would be a little bit more unusual as mafia. His idea with self voting would be detrimental to the mafia also. This seems like smart townie creativity to me. Mafia inherently wouldn"t have much of a reason to think about these, even if they were trying to throw off the town. I will ultimately take a stand on him after I have reviewed more material though, as I could be completely wrong about this. Yraelz"s analysis in this game hasn"t been too helpful or pro-town, nor his continuing lack of trying to pursue legitimate behavior, but I am still leaning town more than scum on him.

I am developing other reads right now, however as it stands:

I am feeling a slight rising scum on budda.

Maikuru: Town, keeping in mind he has a townish style even as mafia.

Frack- Doctor is a pretty big claim. I feel that his role adds just a little bit overbalance to the town. The possibility of stopping the mafia night kill with a seraph knight, and a doctor makes it a little unfair to the mafia. If one of them is lying, I would assume it would be IFLY. Frack meets the description behavior wise, that I described on khaos earlier. But it is kind of hard to read frack sometimes, because his behavioral isn"t really tactic based, which makes things a little annoying. Ultimately I have a slight town on him though.

Beginner- Definite town.

Khaos- Null

Matt, and bull diesel really need to post, or get replaced.

Dealing with inactives is one of the most controversial things, but if they need an incentive to start posting, I am sure I can convince town to give them one. Were not about to let potential lazy scum skate through as town tears each other apart.

Drafter- Null
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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8/5/2013 7:58:45 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Before I commit to my other reads I need to analyze behaviors a bit more. I have mainly been delving my attention into two or three people.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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8/5/2013 8:02:02 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
updating my signature. Still need to catch up in the last thread to see if I missed something.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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8/5/2013 8:11:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
So what do you guys think about a seraph knight, AND a doctor on the town side?
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
Lucky_Luciano
Posts: 4,350
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8/5/2013 8:12:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Your google drive docs are not on public access. I want to monitor them.
"Age is not important" - Airmax 2014
"Australia... is that a place?" - Airmax 2014
Noctan
Posts: 420
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8/5/2013 8:14:47 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Why does everything happen when I'm asleep?
I can manage my anger if people can manage their stupidity.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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8/5/2013 8:20:14 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 8:11:54 AM, TUF wrote:
So what do you guys think about a seraph knight, AND a doctor on the town side?

Ignoring the lynch immunity for the moment, a Seraph Knight basically is a doctor, albeit one that chooses the same target each night. Since the Seraph Knight can't change targets, it is slightly less powerful than a Doctor, since A) he could always end up protecting a Mafioso, negating his utility; and B) once his target is known, the Mafio can work around it.

For the moment, let's consider it as like two doctors. Overpowered? Well, how should we know? We don't know all the roles in the game. Given Lucky's proclivity for killing roles, I don't consider this outside the realm of possibility.

I think the more important factor is the lynch immunity. I can see it as a balance to the hidden votes, since that increases the liklihood of mislynches but, again, what if he ends up protecting Mafia? Town will basically have to waste a lynch on IFLY just to get to the last Mafioso, something we night not be able to afford by the time we realize IFLY's target is mafia.
Noctan
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8/5/2013 8:28:46 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 8:20:14 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 8/5/2013 8:11:54 AM, TUF wrote:
So what do you guys think about a seraph knight, AND a doctor on the town side?

Ignoring the lynch immunity for the moment, a Seraph Knight basically is a doctor, albeit one that chooses the same target each night. Since the Seraph Knight can't change targets, it is slightly less powerful than a Doctor, since A) he could always end up protecting a Mafioso, negating his utility; and B) once his target is known, the Mafio can work around it.

For the moment, let's consider it as like two doctors. Overpowered? Well, how should we know? We don't know all the roles in the game. Given Lucky's proclivity for killing roles, I don't consider this outside the realm of possibility.

I think the more important factor is the lynch immunity. I can see it as a balance to the hidden votes, since that increases the liklihood of mislynches but, again, what if he ends up protecting Mafia? Town will basically have to waste a lynch on IFLY just to get to the last Mafioso, something we night not be able to afford by the time we realize IFLY's target is mafia.

True, but a mafia can't really be protected.

Oh wait, third parties.
I can manage my anger if people can manage their stupidity.
TUF
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8/5/2013 8:29:34 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 8:12:55 AM, Lucky_Luciano wrote:
Your google drive docs are not on public access. I want to monitor them.

Fixed em.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
TUF
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8/5/2013 8:32:57 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/5/2013 8:20:14 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 8/5/2013 8:11:54 AM, TUF wrote:
So what do you guys think about a seraph knight, AND a doctor on the town side?

Ignoring the lynch immunity for the moment, a Seraph Knight basically is a doctor, albeit one that chooses the same target each night. Since the Seraph Knight can't change targets, it is slightly less powerful than a Doctor, since A) he could always end up protecting a Mafioso, negating his utility; and B) once his target is known, the Mafio can work around it.

For the moment, let's consider it as like two doctors. Overpowered? Well, how should we know? We don't know all the roles in the game. Given Lucky's proclivity for killing roles, I don't consider this outside the realm of possibility.

I think the more important factor is the lynch immunity. I can see it as a balance to the hidden votes, since that increases the liklihood of mislynches but, again, what if he ends up protecting Mafia? Town will basically have to waste a lynch on IFLY just to get to the last Mafioso, something we night not be able to afford by the time we realize IFLY's target is mafia.

I think even if there was 3 every night kills, multiple protective roles would be unfair to a the mafia, as the chance of their successful kill is hindered.

Anyways, behaviorally what do you think of IFLY?
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227