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Beginners' Mafia 26.1: ENDGAME

bsh1
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6/13/2014 9:43:00 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Mafia wins!!!

MAFIA

KC - You are the HUNTER. Upon being lynched, you may select another player to die with you. You win with the mafia.

[Originally: Role Stealer]

Number - You are the SCOUT. Each night you may select a player. You will learn who that player visits.

Bossy - You are the LOOKOUT. Each night you may select a player. You will learn who visited that player.

TOWN

Esocial - You are VANILLA. You have no role. You win with the town.

[Originally: Hunter]

SJ - You are the DREAMER. Each night, you will receive a dream containing the names of three players. At least one of these players will be mafia. You win with the town.

Angel - You are the SUPER SAINT. If lynched, you kill whoever hammers you. You win with the town.

Blade - You are BULLETPROOF. You cannot be NK'd. You win with the town.

Raymond - You are the PRIEST. You learns the roles of your nighttime visitors, but NOT which player is what role. You win with the town.

Wylted - You are the PRIEST. You learns the roles of your nighttime visitors, but NOT which player is what role. You win with the town.

[Originally: MIMIC]

Chosen - You are the ROLE COP. Each night you may select a player. You will learn their role but not their affiliation. You win with the town.

NIGHT ACTIONS

NP1

SJ - Drm. Raymond, Bossy, Blade
Wylted - Mimic Raymond
Bossy - Lkt. Blade
Number - Sct. Angel
KC - Rlst. Esocial
KC - NK Blade

NP2

Bossy - Lkt. Blade
Number - Sct. Angel
Number - Nk Angel

NP3

Number - NK Angel

MOD COMMENTS

Really, town didn't do badly. Mafia was just superb. Excellent game to spectate. Advisor are free to comment and weigh-in on the game without restriction.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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bsh1
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6/13/2014 9:43:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
CORRECTION

NP3

Number - NK Esocial
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 9:50:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I can't believe you guy's didn't see the Bossy/Wang push that took place mutually every day phase. Lets be cautious about that next season.

Town knows what its up against now, and we know people's play style.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
bsh1
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6/13/2014 9:52:05 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 9:45:35 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
I suspected Bossy and Numberwange

*snorts outrageously with laughter*
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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Raymond_Reddington
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6/13/2014 9:53:42 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 9:50:33 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
I can't believe you guy's didn't see the Bossy/Wang push that took place mutually every day phase. Lets be cautious about that next season.

Town knows what its up against now, and we know people's play style.

The town got split into a huge rivalry unknowingly. Unfortunately this meant we basically gave number a pass. I don't think anyone ever suspected him.
ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 9:56:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 9:53:42 PM, Raymond_Reddington wrote:
At 6/13/2014 9:50:33 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
I can't believe you guy's didn't see the Bossy/Wang push that took place mutually every day phase. Lets be cautious about that next season.

Town knows what its up against now, and we know people's play style.

The town got split into a huge rivalry unknowingly. Unfortunately this meant we basically gave number a pass. I don't think anyone ever suspected him.

I did. I called him and bossy out R1 and wanted to R2. I thought that at least two of the Esocial, Bossy, and Wang triumvirate would of been guilty.

Hardly matters now. We know that Wang is a very good player, and I vote we trust him a lot less in a leading role. He is the most dangerous player for Mafia and Town.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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6/13/2014 9:58:25 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Not sure what happened, but it should have been assumed that Blade and AOD? (whose role was stolen?), that narrows the scum down to 2 of four players.

Nice try.
You shouldn't have been so hasty, though.
Did you analyze the cop's death? Not sure if that would have helped.
My work here is, finally, done.
bsh1
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6/13/2014 10:00:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
ATTENTION

I'll try to have the next game up in the next 90 minutes...no promises though. I strongly suggest you use this thread--even after game 2 begins--to deconstruct last game and drawn lesson therefrom.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:01:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 9:58:25 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
Not sure what happened, but it should have been assumed that Blade and AOD? (whose role was stolen?), that narrows the scum down to 2 of four players.

Nice try.
You shouldn't have been so hasty, though.
Did you analyze the cop's death? Not sure if that would have helped.

I think that was a major error on towns part. I noticed in R2 Wang and Bossy tried to divert from your advice on my death. They band wagoned on Kc as he was the most viable death for mafia, and a good scape goat.

The VTL for Raymond was incredibly misguided.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I think we know who to trust and not to trust next phase. Here's my thoughts on all the players performance.

Esocial - Played honestly, but like me, she slipped a lot on her decisions. She shouldn't be blamed to much for slipping.

Kc - I think I saw Kc play before. He posts a lot when he's town. Take from that what you will. He was very inactive this game.

Wylted - His play strategy tends to come in the form of taking supporting roles. As town, he's usually very cautious in VTl'ing people. Take note of any attempts at him leading a vote. It might mean he's mafia.

AOD- She's inactive. Replace her.

Spencer Royage - She can be easily manipulated by either side, If we have to possible scum, I recommend she be the most likely candidate for a VTl. Her dream appeared to be honest.

Raymond- I don't know what to think with him. I'll take my usual caution.

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Wang - Most dangerous player IMO. A powerful tool for either side. I strongly advise we confirm him as soon as NP1 begins.

Any thoughts?
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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6/13/2014 10:11:36 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Oh, yeah, KC's lynch was manufactured.
Mafia wanted KC to die.
Bossy's results were very convenient.

Analyze lynches.
Analyze behaviors.
Analyze everything.
My work here is, finally, done.
Wylted
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6/13/2014 10:13:58 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
I think we know who to trust and not to trust next phase. Here's my thoughts on all the players performance.

Esocial - Played honestly, but like me, she slipped a lot on her decisions. She shouldn't be blamed to much for slipping.

Kc - I think I saw Kc play before. He posts a lot when he's town. Take from that what you will. He was very inactive this game.

Wylted - His play strategy tends to come in the form of taking supporting roles. As town, he's usually very cautious in VTl'ing people. Take note of any attempts at him leading a vote. It might mean he's mafia.

Not true, refer to last beginner game.

AOD- She's inactive. Replace her.

Spencer Royage - She can be easily manipulated by either side, If we have to possible scum, I recommend she be the most likely candidate for a VTl. Her dream appeared to be honest.

Raymond- I don't know what to think with him. I'll take my usual caution.

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Wang - Most dangerous player IMO. A powerful tool for either side. I strongly advise we confirm him as soon as NP1 begins.

Any thoughts?
ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:14:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:12:20 PM, Wylted wrote:
What was blade thinking, not VTLing Bossy?

I want to know how they convinced 4 people to vote for Raymond. Who voted for him?
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:15:49 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:13:58 PM, Wylted wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
I think we know who to trust and not to trust next phase. Here's my thoughts on all the players performance.

Esocial - Played honestly, but like me, she slipped a lot on her decisions. She shouldn't be blamed to much for slipping.

Kc - I think I saw Kc play before. He posts a lot when he's town. Take from that what you will. He was very inactive this game.

Wylted - His play strategy tends to come in the form of taking supporting roles. As town, he's usually very cautious in VTl'ing people. Take note of any attempts at him leading a vote. It might mean he's mafia.

Not true, refer to last beginner game.

I referred to the current one. I can't imagine a sudden shift in play style. I trust you as a town member more than others. If I think your scummy, I do plan on supporting my reasoning with this though.

AOD- She's inactive. Replace her.

Spencer Royage - She can be easily manipulated by either side, If we have to possible scum, I recommend she be the most likely candidate for a VTl. Her dream appeared to be honest.

Raymond- I don't know what to think with him. I'll take my usual caution.

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Wang - Most dangerous player IMO. A powerful tool for either side. I strongly advise we confirm him as soon as NP1 begins.

Any thoughts?
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
bsh1
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6/13/2014 10:18:12 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Bossy led in the mafia PM. He was their senior statesman, and brought forward planning to the team. He was by no means anyone's "first mate."
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:19:25 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:18:12 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Bossy led in the mafia PM. He was their senior statesman, and brought forward planning to the team. He was by no means anyone's "first mate."

No, I was talking about how he let Wang make all the claims in the forum. There is no way to analyze what he does in the Mafia PM.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
bsh1
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6/13/2014 10:22:34 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:19:25 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:18:12 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Bossy led in the mafia PM. He was their senior statesman, and brought forward planning to the team. He was by no means anyone's "first mate."

No, I was talking about how he let Wang make all the claims in the forum. There is no way to analyze what he does in the Mafia PM.

From your perspective, not from mine or there's. Just be careful analyzing mafia based only on what you can see; most of the important stuff goes on behind scenes.

Number and Bossy made a very good team, and Number really--and with deftness--got a ton of towncred he never really earned. That's skill. Bossy helped ensure a measured overarching strategy and kept things levelheaded. Number did have a stroke of brilliance in getting KC to rlst. Esocial. They are a team to be feared, certainly.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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Raymond_Reddington
Posts: 525
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6/13/2014 10:23:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:14:23 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:12:20 PM, Wylted wrote:
What was blade thinking, not VTLing Bossy?

I want to know how they convinced 4 people to vote for Raymond. Who voted for him?

Blade and Number orchestrated it and Bossy and (possibly?) Esocial jumped on the bandwagon. Mafia orchestrated it so that everyone was under the impression either I or blade had to be town. Wylted ended up getting linked to me and Bossy to blade. Even with little evidence everyone felt that they had to lynch someone from one side so people picked the one who appeared most guilty. In the future we should be slower to pit 2 sides against each other and claim one side has to be mafia.
ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:24:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:22:34 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:19:25 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:18:12 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Bossy led in the mafia PM. He was their senior statesman, and brought forward planning to the team. He was by no means anyone's "first mate."

No, I was talking about how he let Wang make all the claims in the forum. There is no way to analyze what he does in the Mafia PM.

From your perspective, not from mine or there's. Just be careful analyzing mafia based only on what you can see; most of the important stuff goes on behind scenes.

Number and Bossy made a very good team, and Number really--and with deftness--got a ton of towncred he never really earned. That's skill. Bossy helped ensure a measured overarching strategy and kept things levelheaded. Number did have a stroke of brilliance in getting KC to rlst. Esocial. They are a team to be feared, certainly.

I do agree. Unlike most of my team mates, I didn't buy all of Wang's theories. He was assertive, which made people look to him for leadership.

That's a lesson within itself.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
bossyburrito
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6/13/2014 10:25:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:18:12 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:10:12 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:

Bossy - Supported as a first mate kinda scenario with Wang. I suspect he'll likely lead support any claims by Mafia, if he ends up being such. As town, I imagine he'll play like Wylted did.

Bossy led in the mafia PM. He was their senior statesman, and brought forward planning to the team. He was by no means anyone's "first mate."

Haha, I think that Number did a lot more for the mafia than I did... I certainly wouldn't say that I led. He's a great player, for being so new.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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6/13/2014 10:25:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I considered a number-bossy team or a blade-bossy team. It's obvious which scenario I favored, but number did a good job. If I had given number any credit for being smart I would have favored a number-bossy team over a blade-bossy team.
Raymond_Reddington
Posts: 525
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6/13/2014 10:27:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:25:02 PM, Wylted wrote:
I considered a number-bossy team or a blade-bossy team. It's obvious which scenario I favored, but number did a good job. If I had given number any credit for being smart I would have favored a number-bossy team over a blade-bossy team.

It's creepy when someone (number) can sound honest just by reading their words. Number definitely always struck me as honest, at least until the end of DP3.
ChosenWolff
Posts: 3,361
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6/13/2014 10:27:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:23:18 PM, Raymond_Reddington wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:14:23 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:12:20 PM, Wylted wrote:
What was blade thinking, not VTLing Bossy?

I want to know how they convinced 4 people to vote for Raymond. Who voted for him?

Blade and Number orchestrated it and Bossy and (possibly?) Esocial jumped on the bandwagon. Mafia orchestrated it so that everyone was under the impression either I or blade had to be town. Wylted ended up getting linked to me and Bossy to blade. Even with little evidence everyone felt that they had to lynch someone from one side so people picked the one who appeared most guilty. In the future we should be slower to pit 2 sides against each other and claim one side has to be mafia.

I didn't agree with them. Wylted by far used the most reason this game. He was protective over all the town members, even in DP1. Which makes sense, because he's a priest.

I think we should make him our leadership role next game, with the usual caution. I wouldn't trust Wang as a town leader in the slightest, although Bsh1 might already realize this. I have a cringe in me that makes me think Wang will be made town.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
ChosenWolff
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6/13/2014 10:30:03 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:27:29 PM, Raymond_Reddington wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:25:02 PM, Wylted wrote:
I considered a number-bossy team or a blade-bossy team. It's obvious which scenario I favored, but number did a good job. If I had given number any credit for being smart I would have favored a number-bossy team over a blade-bossy team.

It's creepy when someone (number) can sound honest just by reading their words. Number definitely always struck me as honest, at least until the end of DP3.

That's where we screwed up. I was very clear that he was making a lot of assertions. Mafia has to strategies. They can make lots of assertions until one sticks, or they can let town divide itself, and VTl the mistrustful townie.
How about NO elections?

#onlyonedeb8
bsh1
Posts: 27,504
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6/13/2014 10:30:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/13/2014 10:27:47 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:23:18 PM, Raymond_Reddington wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:14:23 PM, ChosenWolff wrote:
At 6/13/2014 10:12:20 PM, Wylted wrote:
What was blade thinking, not VTLing Bossy?

I want to know how they convinced 4 people to vote for Raymond. Who voted for him?

Blade and Number orchestrated it and Bossy and (possibly?) Esocial jumped on the bandwagon. Mafia orchestrated it so that everyone was under the impression either I or blade had to be town. Wylted ended up getting linked to me and Bossy to blade. Even with little evidence everyone felt that they had to lynch someone from one side so people picked the one who appeared most guilty. In the future we should be slower to pit 2 sides against each other and claim one side has to be mafia.

I didn't agree with them. Wylted by far used the most reason this game. He was protective over all the town members, even in DP1. Which makes sense, because he's a priest.

I think we should make him our leadership role next game, with the usual caution. I wouldn't trust Wang as a town leader in the slightest, although Bsh1 might already realize this. I have a cringe in me that makes me think Wang will be made town.

Affiliation is randomly determined.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

Follow the DDOlympics
: http://www.debate.org...

Open Debate Topics Project: http://www.debate.org...