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Skyrim Mafia Endgame

ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 1:43:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Imperials and Town joint win!

Town:

Bossy as Colette Marence (Doctor): You are an instructor at the College of Winterhold. Your expertise in the Restoration school of magic means you are Skyrim's doctor. Each night you may target a player. That player will be protected from any lethal actions. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Rev as Vex (Hider). You are a talented infiltrator for the Thieves Guild. Because of your penchant for stealth and remaining undetected, you are the Hider. Each night you must target another player and hide behind them. If they survive the night, you survive the night. IIf they die in the night, you also die. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Airmax as Aela the Huntress (Tracker): You are a member of the Companions. Your woodland knowledge and experience hunting down the Silver Hand has given you excellent tracking skills. Therefore, each night you may visit another player. You will learn who that player visited. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Mikal as Astrid (Miller): You are the leader of the last remaining Dark Brotherhood sanctuary. You are in charge of a shadowy criminal organization, and you are willing to betray and kill members of your own family. Clearly you are not to be trusted. Therefore you appear guilty to any investigative roles. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Geographia as Jarl Balgruuf (Recruit). You are the Jarl of Whiterun, an important province for the strategic interests of both Imperials and Stormcloaks. The first time you are targeted for death by the Imperials or by the Stormcloaks, you survive and join the side that attacked you. If neither side targets you for death, you win with the people of Skyrim.

Endark as Jarl Idgrod Ravencrone (Medium). You are the Jarl of Hjaalmarch, a province of Skyrim. Everyone knows you receive visions granted by the Divines. This makes you the Medium. Each night you will receive some information about the game. You win with the people of Skyrim.
Results Endark was scheduled to receive:
NP1: The people of Skyrim can joint win with the Imperials or the Stormcloaks, but not both.
NP2: The people of Skyrim can joint win with Delphine.
NP3: The people of Skyrim cannot joint win with Alduin.
NP4: Alduin recovers his strength by devouring the souls of the fallen. He is bulletproof on nights following a lynch and lynchproof on days following a successful night kill.
NP5: It is possible for Delphine to solo win.


AlwaysRight as Sinding (Random Day Vigilante). You are Sinding, a laborer who is secretly a werewolf. Cursed by the Daedric lord of the hunt Hircine, you are unable to control your violent transformations. If you isolate yourself from society, you are harmless. But if you come near others, you become dangerous. Every time you place a vote, you may be forced to randomly day-vig one player. If this kill occurs, it will be revealed in the DP and it will be stated that Sinding is responsible. The DP will not end. You win with the people of Skyrim.
Hidden Mod note: The chance of randomly day-vigging was 25% each time Sinding placed a vote.

Khaos as Nepos the Nose (PGO). You are a devoted servant of Madanach, the King in Rags, leader of the Forsworn rebellion. While he is locked up in Cidhna Mine, you carry out his orders, which often include assassinations. Needless to say, this has earned you many enemies. You stay in your house at all times under a heavy security detail, killing any who enter and confront you with proof of your crimes. Therefore, you are the Paranoid Gun Owner. You kill anyone who visits you at night. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Ore_Ele as Paarthurnax (Ascetic). You were Alduin's old lieutenant. However, you have long since grown disillusioned with his leadership and you now oppose his plan to destroy the world. You live in seclusion on top of the Throat of the World. Therefore you are immune to all non-lethal actions. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Bull_Diesel as Odahviing (Searcher). You are one of Alduin's subjects. However, you have recently grown disillusioned with his leadership and you now oppose his plan to destroy the world. You are attempting to stop Alduin by taking the Dragonborn to Skuldafn, the only place where Alduin can be found and defeated. Each night, you may target another player in your search of Skuldafn. If you successfully target Alduin, he loses his invulnerability for that NP and the following DP. You win with the people of Skyrim.

Imperials:

SeventhProfessor as General Tullius (Even-night Roleblocker). You are the leader of the Imperial Legion in Skyrim. Your troops have the ability to capture and detain anyone who is suspected of being a Stormcloak sympathizer. Therefore, each even night you may Roleblock another player. You win with the Imperials.

Medic/Yama2 as Legate Rikke (Odd-night Bodyguard, 1x Bulletproof). You are General Tullius' chief lieutenant. You would lay down your life in service of him and the Empire. Therefore, you have a Bodyguard ability. Each odd night you may target another player. Any lethal actions targeted at that player are redirected to you. Additionally, since you are a skilled warrior, you are 1x Bulletproof. The first time a night action would kill you, you survive. You win with the Imperials.

TN05 as Hadvar (1x Character Cop). You are an Imperial captain. Your scouts are keeping close tabs on the Stormcloak rebellion. Therefore, you have a 1x Character Cop ability. You may target one player. You learn that player's character. You win with the Imperials.

Stormcloaks:

Shadowguynick as Ulfric Stormcloak (Odd night Roleblocker). You are the Jarl of Windhelm and leader of the rebellion. Your Stormcloaks have the ability to capture and detain anyone who is suspected of collaborating with the Imperials. Therefore, each odd night you may roleblock another player. You win with the Stormcloaks.

2001bhu as Galmar Stone-Fist (Even night Bodyguard, 1x Bulletproof). You are Ulfric Stormcloak's right hand man. You would lay down your life in service of him and his cause. Therefore, you have a Bodyguard ability. Each even night you may target another player. Any lethal actions targeted at that player are redirected to you. Additionally, since you are a fearsome warrior, you are 1x Bulletproof. The first time a night action would kill you, you survive. You win with the Stormcloaks.

ButterCatX as Ralof (1x Character Cop). You are a Stormcloak officer. Your scouts are keeping close tabs on the Imperial Legion. Therefore, you have a 1x Character Cop ability. You may target one player. You learn that player's character. You win with the Stormcloaks.

Third Parties:

Yama1 as Delphine (Dragon Hunter TP). You are a sworn member of the Blades. You have dedicated your life to pursuing your order's old enemies, the dragons. Each night you may target another player. If that player is a dragon, you learn their identity and attempt to kill them. If you kill all the dragons in the game, whether by lynching them by day or by killing them at night, you solo win. If you outlive all dragons in the game but are not directly responsible for all their deaths, you joint win. If you die while any dragons survive, you lose.

1harder as Alduin the World-Eater (TP). You are the harbinger of the end times. You intend to bring about the end of the world by swallowing it whole. Skyrim's civil war strengthens you, since you gain strength by feasting on the souls of the dead from both sides. Therefore you are Bulletproof following days where anybody was lynched, and you are Lynchproof following nights where anybody died. You also have a 1x janitor kill. You win when you are one of the last 2 surviving players.
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 1:44:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Flavor Quotes:

General Tullius: "The Legion's always been here. Without us to keep order, the provinces would fall into barbarism and lawlessness. Especially Skyrim. Take for example, Ulfric Stormcloak and his little rebellion. But rest assured, his days are numbered."

Legate Rikke: "I am a loyal citizen of the Empire. My parents were Legionnaires, and I've followed in their footsteps. But more importantly, I am a daughter of Skyrim and wish to see her made whole again."

Hadvar: "Ever wonder if we should call a truce with the Stormcloaks, join forces for just a little while, and take care of some of these dragons?"

Ulfric Stormcloak: "I fight for my people impoverished to pay the debts of an Empire too weak to rule them, yet brands them criminals for wanting to rule themselves! I fight so that all the fighting I've already done hasn't been for nothing. I fight... because I must."

Galmar Stone-fist: "I oppose tyranny. I oppose those who tell me how to live, what to think, and what to believe. I'm a man. Skyrim is man's homeland. That's a fact. A fact I'm proud of. There's no shame in that. Read your history."

Ralof: "Ever wonder if maybe we should call a truce with the Imperials, join forces for a while, and take care of some dragons?

Colette Marence: "It's not just healing cuts and bruises, you know. The undead are a very real, very dangerous threat and Restoration magics can keep them at bay. Not to mention the benefit of wards! How can they continually overlook wards!"

Vex: "Before we begin, I want to make two things perfectly clear. One, I'm the best infiltrator this rathole of a Guild's got, so if you think you're here to replace me, you're dead wrong. And two, you follow my lead and do exactly as I say... no questions, no excuses."

Aela the Huntress: "I stayed with my father in the woods until I was old enough for my Trial. We hunted everything there was to hunt. Good training."

Astrid: "I'm sorry. So very sorry. The Penitus Oculatus... Maro... He said that by giving you to them, he would leave the Dark Brotherhood alone. Forever. By Sithis, I was such a fool. All of this... it's all my fault."

Jarl Balgruuf: "No doubt General Tullius and his friends in the Empire will tell you that I owe them my loyalty, and perhaps I do. Ulfric Stormcloak would say that I owe my allegiance to the Nord people as they fight for Skyrim's independence. Perhaps this is also true. The day might come when I am forced to draw my sword for one side or the other. But that day has not come yet."

Jarl Idgrod Ravencrone: "The Divines reveal things to me at times, yes. I do not hide this. It is a gift. Anyone who believes otherwise does not and cannot understand it."

Sinding: "I held in my rage as long as I could. But it boiled inside of me. She looked so fragile. Helpless prey. And then... I feel terrible about what happened. About what I did."

Nepos the Nose: "My dear boy, what makes you think you're getting out of here alive? You were seen coming in. The girl at the door is a Forsworn agent masquerading as a maid. You aren't the first one to have gotten this far. You won't be the last."

Paarthurnax: "What is better"to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort?"

Odahviing: "Many of us have begun to question Alduin's lordship, whether his Thu'um was truly the strongest."

Delphine: "Dragons aren't just coming back, they're coming back to life. They weren't gone somewhere for all these years. They were dead, killed off centuries ago by my predecessors. Now something's happening to bring them back to life."

Alduin: "I am Alduin, Firstborn of Akatosh! I cannot be slain here, by you or anyone else! You cannot prevail against me, I will outlast you... mortal!"
SeventhProfessor
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4/4/2015 1:58:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
If anyone's curious about the Endark kill, it was because at that point, the last Stormcloak had to have been from the following group:

Shadow
Endark
Ore
bull
(not bossy because we roleblocked him one night where Ulfric wouldn't have had an action and he mentioned being roleblocked in the DP, not Mikal because we had character copped him)

We figured Ore was the least likely of the four to be Stormcloak through behavioral analysis, and Endark would be the most difficult to lead a lynch on.
#UnbanTheMadman

#StandWithBossy

#BetOnThett

"bossy r u like 85 years old and have lost ur mind"
~mysteriouscrystals

"I've honestly never seen seventh post anything that wasn't completely idiotic in a trying-to-be-funny way."
~F-16

https://docs.google.com...
YamaVonKarma
Posts: 7,570
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4/4/2015 2:09:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Thank you for allowing me back in and I feel sorry for the Stromclokes.
People who I've called as mafia DP1:
TUF, and YYW
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,143
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4/4/2015 2:10:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Rule Clarifications

Stormcloaks had an odd night kill, Imperials had an even night kill. The win conditions for Stormcloaks and Imperials were essentially to outlive each other, as well as Alduin. Town had to destroy Alduin and either the Stormcloaks or the Imperials. Delphine could solo win if she personally killed all 3 dragons (Odahviing, Paarthurnax, and Alduin) or joint win if she merely outlived all of them. Alduin had the toughest wincon of all, as he had to survive to the last two players in order to win, but he would have gained an even or odd night kill if he was still alive at the time that one of the two warring factions was destroyed.

Town/TP MVP: Ore_Ele
Really struggled with this one and considered not even giving one out. Town was really confused all game long, and never really understood the setup of the game. Part of that was due to the complex nature of the warring factions, but part of that was due to many townies lying. Examples: Khaos lying about being miller and then dreamer, Mikal lying about the nonexistent sword, Bull_Diesel fake claiming, AlwaysRight lying about his role... So understandably there was quite a bit of confusion. Khaos' gambit did ultimately succeed in taking out scum, but had the Stormcloaks not been a complete noob team, it's unlikely anyone would have fallen for it. So the half-hearted town MVP goes to Ore for being one of the few townies to survive to the endgame, despite having a weak/scummy role, and for not having confused the town as much as some other players. Congrats, I guess?

Stormcloak MVP: Shadowguynick
He was the only member of his team to not fall under immediate suspicion. He also survived the longest, only to suddenly go completely inactive. If he had played on, he was still outnumbered 3 to 1, but he may have eventually managed to take out one Imperial with him. Maybe.

Imperial and Overall MVP: Seventh
Seventh turned in the best performance in this game, successfully staying under the radar and diverting lynches to people who weren't on his team. He was not widely scum read until the Imperial victory was basically guaranteed, and by then the town's best move was to joint win. He also did a decent job of coordinating the Imperial night actions in the PM, though he never quite managed to kill a Stormcloak directly.

Best Night Action: Bull_Diesel Searching Harder on NP4. Because Endark died just before receiving the crucial result that would have told town why harder was lynchproof and bulletproof, if Bull_Diesel hadn't targeted harder that night and removed his invulnerability, the game could have dragged on for several more DPs. Town and Imperials would probably have gotten increasingly frustrated at their inability to kill harder. The entire town would probably have died before harder.

WTF moment of the game: Too many to choose from. Take your pick between Khaos accidentally CCing the miller, Mikal claiming he had a sword to day-vig Endark (and everyone completely falling for it), AlwaysRight fake-claiming twice for no apparent reason, harder using the fake claim he got from janitoring Rev but totally botching his supposed night actions, and literally everything bhu and butter did. I'm sure there were more, too.
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 2:22:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Night Actions

N1:
Shadow RB Rev
Bhu kills yama (Why???)
Medic BG Seventh
Yama Hunts Mikal
ButterCat Character Cops Bossy (great choice, but they somehow didn't realize he was doc)
Harder janitors Rev
Rev hides behind Shadow (lol the irony)
Airmax tracks Mikal
Bossy docs bossy (this would become a theme)
Bull_Diesel Searches Airmax

N2:
TN05 attempts to kill Harder, fails
Bhu BG ButterCat
Bossy doc bossy
Seventh RB bossy
Bull_Diesel Searches Seventh
Airmax modkilled :(

N3:
TN05 Character cops Mikal (people were really not buying his miller claim)
Shadowguy RB bossy (one of the few good Stormcloak moves all game long)
Medic BG Seventh
Butter kills Khaos (noob team fell for the gambit here)
Bossy docs bossy (fails again)
Bull_Diesel Searches Mikal (nobody trusts Mikal)

N4:
TN05 kills Endark (just before he could spill the beans on Alduin)
bossy docs bossy
Seventh RB harder
Bull_Diesel searches harder
EndarkenedRationalist
Posts: 14,201
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4/4/2015 2:24:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 1:58:48 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
If anyone's curious about the Endark kill, it was because at that point, the last Stormcloak had to have been from the following group:

Shadow
Endark
Ore
bull
(not bossy because we roleblocked him one night where Ulfric wouldn't have had an action and he mentioned being roleblocked in the DP, not Mikal because we had character copped him)

We figured Ore was the least likely of the four to be Stormcloak through behavioral analysis, and Endark would be the most difficult to lead a lynch on.

Lol, really? Half the players were on my wagon all DP. I was the most viable mislynch target. But whatever, I still win.
SeventhProfessor
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4/4/2015 2:26:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:24:58 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 4/4/2015 1:58:48 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
If anyone's curious about the Endark kill, it was because at that point, the last Stormcloak had to have been from the following group:

Shadow
Endark
Ore
bull
(not bossy because we roleblocked him one night where Ulfric wouldn't have had an action and he mentioned being roleblocked in the DP, not Mikal because we had character copped him)

We figured Ore was the least likely of the four to be Stormcloak through behavioral analysis, and Endark would be the most difficult to lead a lynch on.

Lol, really? Half the players were on my wagon all DP. I was the most viable mislynch target. But whatever, I still win.

Yeah, but half of those players had either changed their mind by the end or were Imperials, lol
#UnbanTheMadman

#StandWithBossy

#BetOnThett

"bossy r u like 85 years old and have lost ur mind"
~mysteriouscrystals

"I've honestly never seen seventh post anything that wasn't completely idiotic in a trying-to-be-funny way."
~F-16

https://docs.google.com...
EndarkenedRationalist
Posts: 14,201
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4/4/2015 2:29:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:26:30 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:24:58 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 4/4/2015 1:58:48 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
If anyone's curious about the Endark kill, it was because at that point, the last Stormcloak had to have been from the following group:

Shadow
Endark
Ore
bull
(not bossy because we roleblocked him one night where Ulfric wouldn't have had an action and he mentioned being roleblocked in the DP, not Mikal because we had character copped him)

We figured Ore was the least likely of the four to be Stormcloak through behavioral analysis, and Endark would be the most difficult to lead a lynch on.

Lol, really? Half the players were on my wagon all DP. I was the most viable mislynch target. But whatever, I still win.

Yeah, but half of those players had either changed their mind by the end or were Imperials, lol

It's alright. I forgive you.
So...did anyone tell the truth about their role all game? Besides me?
SeventhProfessor
Posts: 5,094
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4/4/2015 2:31:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:29:46 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:26:30 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:24:58 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 4/4/2015 1:58:48 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
If anyone's curious about the Endark kill, it was because at that point, the last Stormcloak had to have been from the following group:

Shadow
Endark
Ore
bull
(not bossy because we roleblocked him one night where Ulfric wouldn't have had an action and he mentioned being roleblocked in the DP, not Mikal because we had character copped him)

We figured Ore was the least likely of the four to be Stormcloak through behavioral analysis, and Endark would be the most difficult to lead a lynch on.

Lol, really? Half the players were on my wagon all DP. I was the most viable mislynch target. But whatever, I still win.

Yeah, but half of those players had either changed their mind by the end or were Imperials, lol

It's alright. I forgive you.
So...did anyone tell the truth about their role all game? Besides me?

Almost. If we had lasted another DP, TN was gonna tell the truth about his role, what we had discovered, and lead the lynch on Shadow.
#UnbanTheMadman

#StandWithBossy

#BetOnThett

"bossy r u like 85 years old and have lost ur mind"
~mysteriouscrystals

"I've honestly never seen seventh post anything that wasn't completely idiotic in a trying-to-be-funny way."
~F-16

https://docs.google.com...
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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4/4/2015 2:32:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Everything I said in-game was true.
I did not see Mikal's post, otherwise, I would have not claimed miller, since that 100% screwed up the reason for claiming it.

Claiming PGO is anti-town, as, like bomb, it makes me a vanilla, but possibly worse, given any redirection, so that is why I lied. I claimed the best role I could think of to avoid being visited by pro-town roles (cop, doc, watcher, as they should never target a miller, IMO).

I am aware that I am a scummy player, so I had to do something to avoid being copped in the game. I suppose I could have claimed dreamer, but I did not want to out the real one and/or have a cop soft CC me.

I am also well aware my play by the end of DP3 was very obvious, but at that point, I wasn't trying to draw the NK, I was trying to draw any mafia visiting role, like roleblocker or framer.

Also, I am down for lynching DP1 any negative utility roles, like PGO or miller, which is why I claimed miller, to add confidence they are town. However, I realized had mafia been given fake claims, then I could have been CC'd as miller, and town cred would be given to scum (which is why I thought bossy and Mikal were scum for some time).
My work here is, finally, done.
ford_prefect
Posts: 4,143
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4/4/2015 2:36:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
My thoughts on the game

First, thank you to those of you who played and gave it your best effort. I have to say that overall, this game did not go the way I had hoped it would. Against my better judgement, I allowed players who were not experienced into the game, and it didn't work out. My apologies to everyone for this mistake. In the future, I will be more selective about who can join.

Perhaps compounding the effects of this mistake, I am committed to total randomness when modding games. Therefore, when the random number generator gave me a very inexperienced team, I resisted the urge to reroll and I just used it. I don't think that's a mistake, since I do believe in full randomization. However, it did mean that the game I had envisioned, with a heated battle between Stormcloaks and Imperials, with town just trying to stay alive, didn't play out that way.

Balancing: Because of all the irregular mistakes, it's hard for me to comment on the balance of this game. I didn't see anything to make me think any faction had the odds tremendously stacked against it. Obviously the Imperials wiped the floor with the Stormcloaks and didn't lose a single member, but that's clearly due to the player skill differential, since they had the exact same roles.

The TPs also didn't work out the way I had intended. I set up a sort of rock paper scissors where Delphine wanted to kill all dragons, including Odahviing, but Alduin would be difficult to kill without either Odahviing visiting him or the medium living to DP5. Thus, if Delphine had early success and found Odahviing, she'd have a tougher time killing Alduin eventually. Or conversely, if Alduin used his 1x kill on either one, he'd be vulnerable to the other one until he gained his factional kill. However, this idea was pretty much destroyed when Yama was killed on NP1, leaving Odahviing all the time in the game to find Alduin.

Harder also lurked a lot more than I thought was necessary. If he had been more active, and avoided that dumb slip, he could have had a great chance at winning the game after the last stormcloak went down.

So what are your thoughts? I hope people enjoyed this game, at least as much at it was possible. I'd appreciate feedback on mechanics/roles you liked or didn't like, and why. Again, thanks for playing and I hope to learn from this experience and keep improving as a mod.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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4/4/2015 2:37:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
BTW, this game sucked regardless.
Town could joint win, which no one knew, but it was 10 townies vs. 8 scum, of which one town was mislynch bait (miller with no cop) and one was a traitor.

There was no way for town to know they had a chance, and no reason for town to play when, with eight players left, there are five scum.

Had the warring factions actually killed each other, the game would have been interesting, but why would they, when they could just kill townies and leave mislynch bait (from their POV) on the table.
Ironically, my mistakenly CC'ing miller and FOS'ing bossy may well have been the only thing that saved town.
My work here is, finally, done.
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 2:40:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:24:21 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
Bossy, you fail as a doctor. This is why objectivists should never go to medical school.

I thought it was really funny that he got RBd twice in a row while protecting himself, yet didn't die
SeventhProfessor
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4/4/2015 2:42:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:36:13 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
My thoughts on the game

First, thank you to those of you who played and gave it your best effort. I have to say that overall, this game did not go the way I had hoped it would. Against my better judgement, I allowed players who were not experienced into the game, and it didn't work out. My apologies to everyone for this mistake. In the future, I will be more selective about who can join.

Perhaps compounding the effects of this mistake, I am committed to total randomness when modding games. Therefore, when the random number generator gave me a very inexperienced team, I resisted the urge to reroll and I just used it. I don't think that's a mistake, since I do believe in full randomization. However, it did mean that the game I had envisioned, with a heated battle between Stormcloaks and Imperials, with town just trying to stay alive, didn't play out that way.

Balancing: Because of all the irregular mistakes, it's hard for me to comment on the balance of this game. I didn't see anything to make me think any faction had the odds tremendously stacked against it. Obviously the Imperials wiped the floor with the Stormcloaks and didn't lose a single member, but that's clearly due to the player skill differential, since they had the exact same roles.

The TPs also didn't work out the way I had intended. I set up a sort of rock paper scissors where Delphine wanted to kill all dragons, including Odahviing, but Alduin would be difficult to kill without either Odahviing visiting him or the medium living to DP5. Thus, if Delphine had early success and found Odahviing, she'd have a tougher time killing Alduin eventually. Or conversely, if Alduin used his 1x kill on either one, he'd be vulnerable to the other one until he gained his factional kill. However, this idea was pretty much destroyed when Yama was killed on NP1, leaving Odahviing all the time in the game to find Alduin.

Harder also lurked a lot more than I thought was necessary. If he had been more active, and avoided that dumb slip, he could have had a great chance at winning the game after the last stormcloak went down.

So what are your thoughts? I hope people enjoyed this game, at least as much at it was possible. I'd appreciate feedback on mechanics/roles you liked or didn't like, and why. Again, thanks for playing and I hope to learn from this experience and keep improving as a mod.

I really liked the idea of two factions fighting each other, yet both trying to win with the town. But, I think it would have been better if we had a two player anti-town team as opposed to one anti-town TP. While the Delphine vs. Dragons thing was a cool idea, it was kind of unfair to both Delphine and Alduin.
#UnbanTheMadman

#StandWithBossy

#BetOnThett

"bossy r u like 85 years old and have lost ur mind"
~mysteriouscrystals

"I've honestly never seen seventh post anything that wasn't completely idiotic in a trying-to-be-funny way."
~F-16

https://docs.google.com...
RevNge
Posts: 13,835
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4/4/2015 2:43:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:22:42 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
Night Actions

N1:
Shadow RB Rev
Bhu kills yama (Why???)
Medic BG Seventh
Yama Hunts Mikal
ButterCat Character Cops Bossy (great choice, but they somehow didn't realize he was doc)
Harder janitors Rev
Rev hides behind Shadow (lol the irony)

roflmao
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 2:45:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:37:22 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
BTW, this game sucked regardless.
Town could joint win, which no one knew, but it was 10 townies vs. 8 scum, of which one town was mislynch bait (miller with no cop) and one was a traitor.

There was no way for town to know they had a chance, and no reason for town to play when, with eight players left, there are five scum.

I disagree. Medium was told town could joint win, and on top of that there was good evidence to suggest that the 5 scum left were on 3 separate factions. So town knew they had a chance

Had the warring factions actually killed each other, the game would have been interesting, but why would they, when they could just kill townies and leave mislynch bait (from their POV) on the table.

Because if only one team does that while the other team successfully kills them off, then the first team loses. It was clearly in the warring factions' best interest to kill each other off. They just failed spectacularly at it.

Ironically, my mistakenly CC'ing miller and FOS'ing bossy may well have been the only thing that saved town.

How so? Bossy didn't successfully protect anyone all game long. Your gambit did lead to one Stormcloak death, but the Imperials already knew Butter was Stormcloak, and they'd have been able to lynch him in the morning anyway.
RevNge
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4/4/2015 2:45:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Oh, and damn you, Harder, for killing/janitoring me. I am one of the worst players in DDO Mafia and was almost entirely sure that I wouldn't get N1'ed even if I genuinely tried to play, but you proved me wrong m8. T_T
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 2:47:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:42:49 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:36:13 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
My thoughts on the game

First, thank you to those of you who played and gave it your best effort. I have to say that overall, this game did not go the way I had hoped it would. Against my better judgement, I allowed players who were not experienced into the game, and it didn't work out. My apologies to everyone for this mistake. In the future, I will be more selective about who can join.

Perhaps compounding the effects of this mistake, I am committed to total randomness when modding games. Therefore, when the random number generator gave me a very inexperienced team, I resisted the urge to reroll and I just used it. I don't think that's a mistake, since I do believe in full randomization. However, it did mean that the game I had envisioned, with a heated battle between Stormcloaks and Imperials, with town just trying to stay alive, didn't play out that way.

Balancing: Because of all the irregular mistakes, it's hard for me to comment on the balance of this game. I didn't see anything to make me think any faction had the odds tremendously stacked against it. Obviously the Imperials wiped the floor with the Stormcloaks and didn't lose a single member, but that's clearly due to the player skill differential, since they had the exact same roles.

The TPs also didn't work out the way I had intended. I set up a sort of rock paper scissors where Delphine wanted to kill all dragons, including Odahviing, but Alduin would be difficult to kill without either Odahviing visiting him or the medium living to DP5. Thus, if Delphine had early success and found Odahviing, she'd have a tougher time killing Alduin eventually. Or conversely, if Alduin used his 1x kill on either one, he'd be vulnerable to the other one until he gained his factional kill. However, this idea was pretty much destroyed when Yama was killed on NP1, leaving Odahviing all the time in the game to find Alduin.

Harder also lurked a lot more than I thought was necessary. If he had been more active, and avoided that dumb slip, he could have had a great chance at winning the game after the last stormcloak went down.

So what are your thoughts? I hope people enjoyed this game, at least as much at it was possible. I'd appreciate feedback on mechanics/roles you liked or didn't like, and why. Again, thanks for playing and I hope to learn from this experience and keep improving as a mod.

I really liked the idea of two factions fighting each other, yet both trying to win with the town. But, I think it would have been better if we had a two player anti-town team as opposed to one anti-town TP. While the Delphine vs. Dragons thing was a cool idea, it was kind of unfair to both Delphine and Alduin.

I agree that Delphine and Alduin had the hardest wincons out of everyone. I wish I could see what would have happened if Yama hadn't been killed N1 for no good reason, though
RevNge
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4/4/2015 2:47:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:36:13 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
My thoughts on the game

First, thank you to those of you who played and gave it your best effort. I have to say that overall, this game did not go the way I had hoped it would. Against my better judgement, I allowed players who were not experienced into the game, and it didn't work out. My apologies to everyone for this mistake. In the future, I will be more selective about who can join.

Perhaps compounding the effects of this mistake, I am committed to total randomness when modding games. Therefore, when the random number generator gave me a very inexperienced team, I resisted the urge to reroll and I just used it. I don't think that's a mistake, since I do believe in full randomization. However, it did mean that the game I had envisioned, with a heated battle between Stormcloaks and Imperials, with town just trying to stay alive, didn't play out that way.

I think that the method Skeps uses to select players in his game is the most effective, since it generally attracts a decent player pool, and no significant differences in skill between the factions are evident even with full randomization.
SeventhProfessor
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4/4/2015 2:48:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:45:02 PM, ford_prefect wrote:

but yeah, what was up with having a miller and no cop?
#UnbanTheMadman

#StandWithBossy

#BetOnThett

"bossy r u like 85 years old and have lost ur mind"
~mysteriouscrystals

"I've honestly never seen seventh post anything that wasn't completely idiotic in a trying-to-be-funny way."
~F-16

https://docs.google.com...
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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4/4/2015 2:55:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:45:02 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:37:22 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
BTW, this game sucked regardless.
Town could joint win, which no one knew, but it was 10 townies vs. 8 scum, of which one town was mislynch bait (miller with no cop) and one was a traitor.

There was no way for town to know they had a chance, and no reason for town to play when, with eight players left, there are five scum.

I disagree. Medium was told town could joint win, and on top of that there was good evidence to suggest that the 5 scum left were on 3 separate factions. So town knew they had a chance
Medium had to out their role in order to disclose this information, and had nearly a 25% chance of death before learning it.

Had the warring factions actually killed each other, the game would have been interesting, but why would they, when they could just kill townies and leave mislynch bait (from their POV) on the table.

Because if only one team does that while the other team successfully kills them off, then the first team loses. It was clearly in the warring factions' best interest to kill each other off. They just failed spectacularly at it.
Did they?
Town knew of Butter and Bhu's slips, so why would the other faction bother killing them? When a team is losing, they can just play spoiler. Part of the reason cult games suck.

Ironically, my mistakenly CC'ing miller and FOS'ing bossy may well have been the only thing that saved town.

How so? Bossy didn't successfully protect anyone all game long. Your gambit did lead to one Stormcloak death, but the Imperials already knew Butter was Stormcloak, and they'd have been able to lynch him in the morning anyway.

I think people left me, Mikal, and bossy alone, so they killed others. This kept nearly half the town alive.

For balance, town needed roles that could actually help them. A real vig would have been nice. As it was, town had to lynch the traitor, and it was already a losing game. Town was forced to play a game where we did not know our goal was to side with one group, nor did we have any way to know which side would win.
Further, a TP that basically wins by playing? That's ridiculous. There was no reason not to lynch scum, since there were so many, and town had only one role that could prevent deaths, while there are four scum factions that can kill.

Town did not know we were not a traditional town until the last DP.
My work here is, finally, done.
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 2:59:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:48:13 PM, SeventhProfessor wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:45:02 PM, ford_prefect wrote:

but yeah, what was up with having a miller and no cop?

If miller is claimed immediately, as it usually is, it is not as likely to be mislynched. I wanted to introduce more doubt by not having a cop. To counterbalance this, as the game went on, it was supposed to become more obvious that Astrid was not a scum character. The role's intended effect was basically obliterated by khaos' accidental CC, though.
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 3:09:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 2:55:52 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:45:02 PM, ford_prefect wrote:
At 4/4/2015 2:37:22 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
BTW, this game sucked regardless.
Town could joint win, which no one knew, but it was 10 townies vs. 8 scum, of which one town was mislynch bait (miller with no cop) and one was a traitor.

There was no way for town to know they had a chance, and no reason for town to play when, with eight players left, there are five scum.

I disagree. Medium was told town could joint win, and on top of that there was good evidence to suggest that the 5 scum left were on 3 separate factions. So town knew they had a chance
Medium had to out their role in order to disclose this information, and had nearly a 25% chance of death before learning it.

Had the warring factions actually killed each other, the game would have been interesting, but why would they, when they could just kill townies and leave mislynch bait (from their POV) on the table.

Because if only one team does that while the other team successfully kills them off, then the first team loses. It was clearly in the warring factions' best interest to kill each other off. They just failed spectacularly at it.
Did they?
Town knew of Butter and Bhu's slips, so why would the other faction bother killing them? When a team is losing, they can just play spoiler. Part of the reason cult games suck.
Again, the imperials knew they joint won with town. So they were leaving bhu and butter alive to be lynched, yes, but they were searching for nick all game long. They were trying to kill Stormcloaks, not town.
Ironically, my mistakenly CC'ing miller and FOS'ing bossy may well have been the only thing that saved town.

How so? Bossy didn't successfully protect anyone all game long. Your gambit did lead to one Stormcloak death, but the Imperials already knew Butter was Stormcloak, and they'd have been able to lynch him in the morning anyway.

I think people left me, Mikal, and bossy alone, so they killed others. This kept nearly half the town alive.
Mikal was not left alone at all. Look at the night actions, lol. Nor was bossy for that matter, he got RBd twice. I don't think your CC helped town all that much. Maybe different people would have been NKd? But mostly town died in the night anyway.
For balance, town needed roles that could actually help them. A real vig would have been nice. As it was, town had to lynch the traitor, and it was already a losing game. Town was forced to play a game where we did not know our goal was to side with one group, nor did we have any way to know which side would win.
Ok, this is a valid criticism. I don't necessarily agree that's a bad thing, because to me part of a good mafia game is uncertainty about who you can win with. But I see how it could be frustrating if you were expecting a traditional set up.
Further, a TP that basically wins by playing? That's ridiculous. There was no reason not to lynch scum, since there were so many, and town had only one role that could prevent deaths, while there are four scum factions that can kill.
Which TP wins by playing? You realize neither TP won, right? Also, yes four factions could kill, but only 1 kill a night, maybe 2 if Delphine gets lucky and hits a dragon. Alduin only had a 1x and the warring factions had even/odd, which is equal to a traditional mafia.
Town did not know we were not a traditional town until the last DP.

Ok? I still don't see how that meant there was no sense in playing. If the game is still going on, you still have a chance to win.
Ore_Ele
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4/4/2015 3:12:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
lol, town MYP for being ignorant of my character that it was a dragon. Okay, I'll take it.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Mikal
Posts: 11,271
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4/4/2015 3:19:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
This was a fun game, not the best but fun. There are quite a few things I locked myself into it once I said

I noted the sword thing as a reaction test for endark. I would expect him to rage if he were town, which is partially why I scum read him so much.

I finally got off my scum read right before the last night. When he was at L-1 and still would no claim imperial, I started to town read him a little. I also was forced to say he was not a dragon because of the fake sword claim which did quite a bit as well

Right at the end I switched from him to tn05 due to his reaction at L-1. I would have expected him to claim as imperial because there would have been no reason not too. Then by POE tn05 was my next bet.

Nick being inactive plauged us
7th lurked
bull lurked

Entire game was hard to read due to inactivity , lurking, and a lot of other features that went into it.

Game was broke when harder claimed. Any balance that it has was gone at that point.

Fun game though
Mikal
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4/4/2015 3:20:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/4/2015 3:12:03 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
lol, town MYP for being ignorant of my character that it was a dragon. Okay, I'll take it.

I think thats why I town read you so hard though
ford_prefect
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4/4/2015 3:23:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I think it was really funny that half of the scum hunting that happened was focused on "the dragon" faction, even though it didn't exist. I thought Yama flipping as TP would show that the dragons were not all in the same faction, but I think only khaos pointed that out. Everyone else seemed to continue thinking "the dragons" were on a team, lol
Mikal
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4/4/2015 3:30:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
After going over this there is quite a bit I regret

Correct Reads

Town Reads

Ore ( 100 percent town due to ignorance of claim)
Endark ( at the very end , after L1. Until this way off thanks to butter being a dipshit)
Khaos

TP Faction

Tno5 (By Poe)
2nd Yama (His change in play)
Shadow (Poe)

Dragon

Harder ( for obvious reasons)

My lynch pile at the end of the last DP was

tn05
bossy
Seventh
and possibly shadow depending on replacement

Wrong Reads

Yama 1
Bossy

Bad Plays

Sword Reaction Test

This was an all around bad idea. I expected endark to rage at me upon a vig which did not happen and made me scum read him as an imperial up to he got at l1, and it also locked in my logic as town because if I said he was a dragon after I vigged him with that claim, I would get lynched. I could not back off of it and say it was a test or I would get lynched

He reacted entirely different than I expected him too.