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Beginners' Mafia 37.3 DP2

1harderthanyouthink
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5/7/2015 5:20:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Died in the night

Wylted - You are the PUMA. You are known for being extraordinarily protective of your cubs, to the point where you've fought off grizzlies to save them. Thus, you are the DOCTOR. Each night you may select a player and protect them from death. You win with the town.

VOT - You are the BOBCAT. There isn't much special about you--you are a pretty generic predator of fairly generic size (even your name sounds bland), so you are VANILLA. You have no role. You win with the town.

Graveyard

Wylted - town
VOT - town

Living players

XLAV (Yassine)
Val
Molon
Vaar
Saph
Skep
BLAH
Wylted
FT

With 8 players alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.
The DP ends at 5:20 DDO time, on 5/9/15.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

DDO Risk King
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
There's either a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 5:24:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM, Valkrin wrote:
There's a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.

Fix'd
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 5:48:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM, Valkrin wrote:
There's either a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.

VTL Valkrin

You've been scum with me twice. You know that I NK strong players and drive to lynch weak players. VoT was a weak player who played very scummily, so you know that this is a completely invalid reason to lynch me.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 5:51:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
In a game which I played as scum with Valk, and I explained that we were deviating from my normal SOP when it comes to lynching as scum.

http://www.debate.org...
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 6:01:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 5:48:17 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM, Valkrin wrote:
There's either a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.

VTL Valkrin

You've been scum with me twice. You know that I NK strong players and drive to lynch weak players. VoT was a weak player who played very scummily, so you know that this is a completely invalid reason to lynch me.

This is just WIFOM.
There were two deaths. You were pushing for the Voice lynch DP1 and he *just* so happened to die. As well, Wylted soft claimed Doctor.

If you were scum, you could've killed Wylted. You could've also been pushing for a mislynch on VoT, and if you were unsatisfied, you may have decided to kill him. Then again, this implies a vig killed Wylted, which I highly doubt unless they were dumb as a rock. You even explain how you're willing to deviate from normal SOP. Why should I trust your "meta" here?
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Vaarka
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5/7/2015 6:11:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
My guess is that scum killed Voice. As for Wylted being doctor, there's probably some other means of death. My best guess is we have a PGO this game and Wylted tried to protect him last night,
You're probably thinking right now "haha I'm a genius". Well you're not -Valkrin

inferno: "I don't know, are you attracted to women?"
ButterCatX: "No, Vaarka is mine!"

All hail scum Vaarka, wielder of the bastard sword, smiter of nations, destroyer of spiders -VOT

"Vaarka, I've been thinking about this for a long time now," (pulls out small box made of macaroni) "W-will you be my noodle buddy?" -Kirigaya
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 6:14:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:11:17 PM, Vaarka wrote:
My guess is that scum killed Voice. As for Wylted being doctor, there's probably some other means of death. My best guess is we have a PGO this game and Wylted tried to protect him last night,

I didn't think of that possibility, but in that case, the PGO didn't SOP claim and cost us our doctor. Whoever they are, they should've claimed, fair and simple.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Vaarka
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5/7/2015 6:16:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:14:33 PM, Valkrin wrote:
At 5/7/2015 6:11:17 PM, Vaarka wrote:
My guess is that scum killed Voice. As for Wylted being doctor, there's probably some other means of death. My best guess is we have a PGO this game and Wylted tried to protect him last night,

I didn't think of that possibility, but in that case, the PGO didn't SOP claim and cost us our doctor. Whoever they are, they should've claimed, fair and simple.

It's entirely possible. We had several people not claim a role. Someone may have been staying quiet in hopes that mafia might target them. There's also Yass, who wasn't replaced until DP1 ended.
You're probably thinking right now "haha I'm a genius". Well you're not -Valkrin

inferno: "I don't know, are you attracted to women?"
ButterCatX: "No, Vaarka is mine!"

All hail scum Vaarka, wielder of the bastard sword, smiter of nations, destroyer of spiders -VOT

"Vaarka, I've been thinking about this for a long time now," (pulls out small box made of macaroni) "W-will you be my noodle buddy?" -Kirigaya
Sapphique
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5/7/2015 6:18:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:11:17 PM, Vaarka wrote:
My guess is that scum killed Voice. As for Wylted being doctor, there's probably some other means of death. My best guess is we have a PGO this game and Wylted tried to protect him last night,

Why would scum have killed voice? He literally went and claimed vanilla. I'm not seeing how it would benefit them.
DDO Beginners' Mafia Moderator -- PM me if you'd like to learn how to play mafia!

"We wondered what happiness would look like if we could give it a physical form...the shape of happiness might resemble glass...even though you don't usually notice it, it's still definitely there. You merely have to change your point of view slightly, and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light. I doubt that anything else could argue its own existence more eloquently." ~Lelouch
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 6:18:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:16:55 PM, Vaarka wrote:

That wouldn't be in favor of them. The odds are in the favor that they will hit a town more likely than a scum.

Speaking of Yas, I want XLAV's thoughts on the game so far.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Vaarka
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5/7/2015 6:19:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:18:14 PM, Sapphique wrote:
At 5/7/2015 6:11:17 PM, Vaarka wrote:
My guess is that scum killed Voice. As for Wylted being doctor, there's probably some other means of death. My best guess is we have a PGO this game and Wylted tried to protect him last night,

Why would scum have killed voice? He literally went and claimed vanilla. I'm not seeing how it would benefit them.

You never know Saph. I was targeted even after claiming PGO during 37.1
You're probably thinking right now "haha I'm a genius". Well you're not -Valkrin

inferno: "I don't know, are you attracted to women?"
ButterCatX: "No, Vaarka is mine!"

All hail scum Vaarka, wielder of the bastard sword, smiter of nations, destroyer of spiders -VOT

"Vaarka, I've been thinking about this for a long time now," (pulls out small box made of macaroni) "W-will you be my noodle buddy?" -Kirigaya
Sapphique
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5/7/2015 6:22:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 5:48:17 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM, Valkrin wrote:
There's either a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.

VTL Valkrin

You've been scum with me twice. You know that I NK strong players and drive to lynch weak players. VoT was a weak player who played very scummily, so you know that this is a completely invalid reason to lynch me.

I haven't been scum with you. I read the post you referenced...are you saying you wouldn't have killed voice since you'd use the NK on very good players?
DDO Beginners' Mafia Moderator -- PM me if you'd like to learn how to play mafia!

"We wondered what happiness would look like if we could give it a physical form...the shape of happiness might resemble glass...even though you don't usually notice it, it's still definitely there. You merely have to change your point of view slightly, and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light. I doubt that anything else could argue its own existence more eloquently." ~Lelouch
Sapphique
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5/7/2015 6:26:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
@skep, I know you said it would be uncharacteristic of you to have killed voice, but can you explain why you scum read him last DP?
DDO Beginners' Mafia Moderator -- PM me if you'd like to learn how to play mafia!

"We wondered what happiness would look like if we could give it a physical form...the shape of happiness might resemble glass...even though you don't usually notice it, it's still definitely there. You merely have to change your point of view slightly, and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light. I doubt that anything else could argue its own existence more eloquently." ~Lelouch
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 6:28:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:26:21 PM, Sapphique wrote:
@skep, I know you said it would be uncharacteristic of you to have killed voice, but can you explain why you scum read him last DP?

He scum read him due to his character claim. Allow me to quote:

At 5/4/2015 10:58:47 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
A Bobcat is not a large, generic predator. They live in my area, and they're a little bigger than a Maine Coon.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 6:32:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Though, in Skep's defense, VoT added the "large".
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 6:39:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:01:23 PM, Valkrin wrote:
At 5/7/2015 5:48:17 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM, Valkrin wrote:
There's either a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.

VTL Valkrin

You've been scum with me twice. You know that I NK strong players and drive to lynch weak players. VoT was a weak player who played very scummily, so you know that this is a completely invalid reason to lynch me.

This is just WIFOM.
There were two deaths. You were pushing for the Voice lynch DP1 and he *just* so happened to die. As well, Wylted soft claimed Doctor.

If you were scum, you could've killed Wylted. You could've also been pushing for a mislynch on VoT, and if you were unsatisfied, you may have decided to kill him. Then again, this implies a vig killed Wylted, which I highly doubt unless they were dumb as a rock. You even explain how you're willing to deviate from normal SOP. Why should I trust your "meta" here?

This isn't meta to clear myself, it's to indict you. Killing VoT as scum would be utterly stupid because he is an easy mislynch target due to his erratic behavior last DP, which I scum read him for (the claim was a small part of my case). His push for claims DP1, his OMGUS on me, these were all scummy.

I don't expect self-meta to make me appear town, I expect it to make sense when analyzing your motives.

If you were town, you would remember my policy and ask yourself 'what motivation would he have to kill VoT?'. There is none. Knowing my thoughts on general lynch practices, you would know that this would an exception which I would have to justify. Where is the justification? Why one earth would I want VoT dead so badly that I would NK him? If I were scum, I would kill Saph, FT, Wytled, or XLAV once he replaced. Killing VoT is just dumb from a scum perspective, which makes me think that it was a vig kill.

As scum, you might try and pull off a mislynch of me based on his flip. If so, this was a misstep, as the motivation behind it is completely transparent.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 6:40:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:22:15 PM, Sapphique wrote:
At 5/7/2015 5:48:17 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 5/7/2015 5:23:48 PM, Valkrin wrote:
There's either a vig here.
VTL Skep, due to pushing for Voice's death, and the next day, bam, he's dead.

Vig. Whoever you are, out yourself.

VTL Valkrin

You've been scum with me twice. You know that I NK strong players and drive to lynch weak players. VoT was a weak player who played very scummily, so you know that this is a completely invalid reason to lynch me.

I haven't been scum with you. I read the post you referenced...are you saying you wouldn't have killed voice since you'd use the NK on very good players?

Yes, unless there were extenuating circumstances, which don't usually arise NP1, and certainly weren't in play here.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 6:41:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:26:21 PM, Sapphique wrote:
@skep, I know you said it would be uncharacteristic of you to have killed voice, but can you explain why you scum read him last DP?

Fishing for claims, OMGUSing me, awkward play, focusing on theme, and a scummy claim which he for some reason lied about, as his real flip says nothing about 'large'.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 6:51:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:39:18 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:

This isn't meta to clear myself, it's to indict you. Killing VoT as scum would be utterly stupid because he is an easy mislynch target due to his erratic behavior last DP, which I scum read him for (the claim was a small part of my case). His push for claims DP1, his OMGUS on me, these were all scummy.

I don't expect self-meta to make me appear town, I expect it to make sense when analyzing your motives.

If you were town, you would remember my policy and ask yourself 'what motivation would he have to kill VoT?'. There is none. Knowing my thoughts on general lynch practices, you would know that this would an exception which I would have to justify. Where is the justification? Why one earth would I want VoT dead so badly that I would NK him? If I were scum, I would kill Saph, FT, Wytled, or XLAV once he replaced. Killing VoT is just dumb from a scum perspective, which makes me think that it was a vig kill.

As scum, you might try and pull off a mislynch of me based on his flip. If so, this was a misstep, as the motivation behind it is completely transparent.

No it isn't.

This entire post is, again, WIFOM.
The fact is we have TWO DEATHS. VoT and Wylted. It's entirely possible you wanted to NK VoT b/c of disrupting town. However, you were comfortable to admitting you wanted to kill Wylted if you were scum. If a vig claims and says they killed VoT, you are under suspicion. If they vigged Wylted, I would seriously question them and lay off you.

As well, worth noting that Blah claimed vanilla in 37.1 before being CC'd by Saph, and then Blah proceeded to out his real role. With Yas inactive, it's plausible that VoT *could've* claimed Vanilla to mask his real role, and scum wouldn't have known and decided to kill him. Only we know this wasn't the case.

You aren't out of the question but you're my primary suspect as of now. I want the vig, or whoever caused Wylted/VoT's death to out themselves. Now.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 6:59:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:51:56 PM, Valkrin wrote:
At 5/7/2015 6:39:18 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:

This isn't meta to clear myself, it's to indict you. Killing VoT as scum would be utterly stupid because he is an easy mislynch target due to his erratic behavior last DP, which I scum read him for (the claim was a small part of my case). His push for claims DP1, his OMGUS on me, these were all scummy.

I don't expect self-meta to make me appear town, I expect it to make sense when analyzing your motives.

If you were town, you would remember my policy and ask yourself 'what motivation would he have to kill VoT?'. There is none. Knowing my thoughts on general lynch practices, you would know that this would an exception which I would have to justify. Where is the justification? Why one earth would I want VoT dead so badly that I would NK him? If I were scum, I would kill Saph, FT, Wytled, or XLAV once he replaced. Killing VoT is just dumb from a scum perspective, which makes me think that it was a vig kill.

As scum, you might try and pull off a mislynch of me based on his flip. If so, this was a misstep, as the motivation behind it is completely transparent.

No it isn't.

This entire post is, again, WIFOM.
The fact is we have TWO DEATHS. VoT and Wylted. It's entirely possible you wanted to NK VoT b/c of disrupting town. However, you were comfortable to admitting you wanted to kill Wylted if you were scum. If a vig claims and says they killed VoT, you are under suspicion. If they vigged Wylted, I would seriously question them and lay off you.

As well, worth noting that Blah claimed vanilla in 37.1 before being CC'd by Saph, and then Blah proceeded to out his real role. With Yas inactive, it's plausible that VoT *could've* claimed Vanilla to mask his real role, and scum wouldn't have known and decided to kill him. Only we know this wasn't the case.

You aren't out of the question but you're my primary suspect as of now. I want the vig, or whoever caused Wylted/VoT's death to out themselves. Now.

This entire conversation is WIFOMGUS, and it was started by you, when you scum read me based on the WIFOMy argument that I killed VoT, which makes no sense when you look at motivation. Honestly.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
1harderthanyouthink
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5/7/2015 7:04:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Vote count:

Skep - (1/5) - Valkrin
Valkrin - (1/5) - Skep
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

DDO Risk King
Sapphique
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5/7/2015 7:04:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
@skep, I'd like a soft claim from you, just in case. I'll hard claim myself after you, which I think will clear up some of this confusion.
DDO Beginners' Mafia Moderator -- PM me if you'd like to learn how to play mafia!

"We wondered what happiness would look like if we could give it a physical form...the shape of happiness might resemble glass...even though you don't usually notice it, it's still definitely there. You merely have to change your point of view slightly, and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light. I doubt that anything else could argue its own existence more eloquently." ~Lelouch
Sapphique
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5/7/2015 7:05:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
@everyone, what do you all make of the exchange between val and skep? Do you think one of them is scum?
DDO Beginners' Mafia Moderator -- PM me if you'd like to learn how to play mafia!

"We wondered what happiness would look like if we could give it a physical form...the shape of happiness might resemble glass...even though you don't usually notice it, it's still definitely there. You merely have to change your point of view slightly, and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light. I doubt that anything else could argue its own existence more eloquently." ~Lelouch
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 7:08:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 6:59:34 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:

This entire conversation is WIFOMGUS, and it was started by you, when you scum read me based on the WIFOMy argument that I killed VoT, which makes no sense when you look at motivation. Honestly.

Well, I'm not saying you're confirmed scum, because you aren't. I'm saying you're the biggest target right now.
Reasons VoT could've died by your hand:
1. Confusing town with WIFOM.
2. VoT scum-read you, the only one to, in fact.
3. It's possible VoT could have been hiding his role and you didn't want another potential unknown.

Let's assume that, for now, you are town. At the very least, is your role confirmable?
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 7:12:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 7:05:22 PM, Sapphique wrote:
@everyone, what do you all make of the exchange between val and skep? Do you think one of them is scum?

Don't ask everyone. Speak for yourself.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Valkrin
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5/7/2015 7:13:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Don't get me wrong, they should answer, but I'm tired of people waiting for others' opinions. Those who witness it should have a mind of their own and not easily get swayed, or just wait for others to contribute.
"So, to start off, I've never committed suicide." - Vaarka
Skepsikyma
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5/7/2015 7:18:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 7:04:17 PM, Sapphique wrote:
@skep, I'd like a soft claim from you, just in case. I'll hard claim myself after you, which I think will clear up some of this confusion.

TTBB - ITFOTN - WIHOE - CFTFS
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Sapphique
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5/7/2015 7:27:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/7/2015 7:18:35 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 5/7/2015 7:04:17 PM, Sapphique wrote:
@skep, I'd like a soft claim from you, just in case. I'll hard claim myself after you, which I think will clear up some of this confusion.

TTBB - ITFOTN - WIHOE - CFTFS

...Okay...lemme try deciphering this first. I think it'll take a while.
DDO Beginners' Mafia Moderator -- PM me if you'd like to learn how to play mafia!

"We wondered what happiness would look like if we could give it a physical form...the shape of happiness might resemble glass...even though you don't usually notice it, it's still definitely there. You merely have to change your point of view slightly, and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light. I doubt that anything else could argue its own existence more eloquently." ~Lelouch
Vaarka
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5/7/2015 7:50:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I'm getting off for the night. Have fun figuring that out Saph...
You're probably thinking right now "haha I'm a genius". Well you're not -Valkrin

inferno: "I don't know, are you attracted to women?"
ButterCatX: "No, Vaarka is mine!"

All hail scum Vaarka, wielder of the bastard sword, smiter of nations, destroyer of spiders -VOT

"Vaarka, I've been thinking about this for a long time now," (pulls out small box made of macaroni) "W-will you be my noodle buddy?" -Kirigaya