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Mafia Setups

ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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6/30/2015 5:08:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I've been reading over some setups here and on mafiascum, as well as reviewing the very well-written guide F-16 put together, and it's really changed my approach to modding. I'm guilty of throwing in a bunch of power roles and assuming that, insofar as I beef up the town, I also need to beef up the mafia. I think a lot of people would agree that the tools at the disposal of the two factions were roughly equal in power, though I never took the time to calculate mislynches or the number of mistakes the town could make, or to make a conscious effort to include more vanillas. I've seen the value in that recently, and the setups I create hereinafter - including when my forum game starts, which will probably be a few months from now - will reflect that. In a 9-person game, I view the ultimate measure of the value of my setup as how protracted or close the game is. My last two games made it to three-person lylo: I consider that a success, but want to be sure that I can properly diversify my setups going forward, without reverting to my past bad habits.

To that end, I've created a few setups that, in my view, are balanced. I haven't had a chance to trial run them yet in live games, but I'd really appreciate if someone else could review them before I do. Any takers? (And, obviously I wouldn't post them publicly, lest they be easily accessible to regulars).
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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6/30/2015 5:35:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I guess I can add a bit more to this post - just a few conclusions I've come to over time. Feel free, of course, to add to this list or tell me if I'm full of sh1t.

(1) Doctors should not be allowed to self-protect unless there's a Mafia Strongman. A self-protecting Doctor is essentially a bulletproof, and it obviates the need to toe a line behaviorally speaking so as to not appear overly towny, and thus provoke the night kill. That sounds a tad counterintuitive, but I think Max said it well: because he, Bluesteel, Zaradi and a few others who regularly play live are considered "pro's," they're prime NP1 targets. Thus, it may be beneficial to them, for the purpose of staying alive, to step back and withhold the more hardcore scum-hunting until later in the game.

(2) JOAT's are ridiculous. I understand the utility of a JOAT, but in town-form, I have a hard time conceiving of a JOAT that wouldn't completely throw off the power of the game. Using the rule of thumb that about 2/3 of townies ought to be vanilla - which, in a 9-person game, leaves about three power roles - there's a trade-off between putting all your eggs (e.g., power roles) in one basket, lest he or she be killed, and possibly overpowering the town. I'm inclined, therefore, not to use JOAT's.

(3) Guns/day vigs.... I don't need to really say more. They're sort of my trademark and they're a lot of fun, but they completely mess with the rule that the number of available mislynches ought to equal the number of scum. I'm inclined, therefore, to toss these outs.

(4) TP's... I'm just not going there. The game are way too small to accommodate a TP, though maybe one would be appropriate in a larger forum game. I'd probably prefer an SK to a Survivor.

I may add to this list. Any thoughts thus far?
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah
RevNge
Posts: 13,835
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6/30/2015 5:55:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/30/2015 5:35:06 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
I guess I can add a bit more to this post - just a few conclusions I've come to over time. Feel free, of course, to add to this list or tell me if I'm full of sh1t.

(1) Doctors should not be allowed to self-protect unless there's a Mafia Strongman. A self-protecting Doctor is essentially a bulletproof, and it obviates the need to toe a line behaviorally speaking so as to not appear overly towny, and thus provoke the night kill. That sounds a tad counterintuitive, but I think Max said it well: because he, Bluesteel, Zaradi and a few others who regularly play live are considered "pro's," they're prime NP1 targets. Thus, it may be beneficial to them, for the purpose of staying alive, to step back and withhold the more hardcore scum-hunting until later in the game.

(2) JOAT's are ridiculous. I understand the utility of a JOAT, but in town-form, I have a hard time conceiving of a JOAT that wouldn't completely throw off the power of the game. Using the rule of thumb that about 2/3 of townies ought to be vanilla - which, in a 9-person game, leaves about three power roles - there's a trade-off between putting all your eggs (e.g., power roles) in one basket, lest he or she be killed, and possibly overpowering the town. I'm inclined, therefore, not to use JOAT's.

(3) Guns/day vigs.... I don't need to really say more. They're sort of my trademark and they're a lot of fun, but they completely mess with the rule that the number of available mislynches ought to equal the number of scum. I'm inclined, therefore, to toss these outs.

(4) TP's... I'm just not going there. The game are way too small to accommodate a TP, though maybe one would be appropriate in a larger forum game. I'd probably prefer an SK to a Survivor.


I may add to this list. Any thoughts thus far?

O___________O

Does that mean Joey games are no longer bastard now (rather the opposite, boring)?
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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6/30/2015 5:57:57 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/30/2015 5:55:53 PM, RevNge wrote:
At 6/30/2015 5:35:06 PM, ResponsiblyIrresponsible wrote:
I guess I can add a bit more to this post - just a few conclusions I've come to over time. Feel free, of course, to add to this list or tell me if I'm full of sh1t.

(1) Doctors should not be allowed to self-protect unless there's a Mafia Strongman. A self-protecting Doctor is essentially a bulletproof, and it obviates the need to toe a line behaviorally speaking so as to not appear overly towny, and thus provoke the night kill. That sounds a tad counterintuitive, but I think Max said it well: because he, Bluesteel, Zaradi and a few others who regularly play live are considered "pro's," they're prime NP1 targets. Thus, it may be beneficial to them, for the purpose of staying alive, to step back and withhold the more hardcore scum-hunting until later in the game.

(2) JOAT's are ridiculous. I understand the utility of a JOAT, but in town-form, I have a hard time conceiving of a JOAT that wouldn't completely throw off the power of the game. Using the rule of thumb that about 2/3 of townies ought to be vanilla - which, in a 9-person game, leaves about three power roles - there's a trade-off between putting all your eggs (e.g., power roles) in one basket, lest he or she be killed, and possibly overpowering the town. I'm inclined, therefore, not to use JOAT's.

(3) Guns/day vigs.... I don't need to really say more. They're sort of my trademark and they're a lot of fun, but they completely mess with the rule that the number of available mislynches ought to equal the number of scum. I'm inclined, therefore, to toss these outs.

(4) TP's... I'm just not going there. The game are way too small to accommodate a TP, though maybe one would be appropriate in a larger forum game. I'd probably prefer an SK to a Survivor.


I may add to this list. Any thoughts thus far?

O___________O

Does that mean Joey games are no longer bastard now (rather the opposite, boring)?

Lol.

I may pull out a... "bastard" setup at some point in the future, but it will be heavily curtailed to at the very least allow town two mislynches. I think those setups are really fun to use, but obviously that's from my perspective as the mod (though night phases, I will admit, aren't so fun). But a slightly watered-down setup need not be boring.
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah
ResponsiblyIrresponsible
Posts: 12,398
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6/30/2015 11:52:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/30/2015 10:22:23 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
Why did you leave?

I'm still here.
~ResponsiblyIrresponsible

DDO's Economics Messiah