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Do you think abortion is murder?

yeahyeah21
Posts: 7
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12/16/2009 6:05:55 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
According to ONE dictionary, it is.

Abortion = fatally premature expulsion (one out of several of the definitions)

Fatal = causing or capable of causing death

Murder = to kill, to cause death

If abortion is to fatal, fatal is to murder, does that not mean abortion = murder?

It's just a theory. There are flaws with this argument though because the dictionary I used could change the definition slightly and I looked at a couple other dictionaries and they did not include the word "fatal" within the description of abortion, so I don't know. What do you guys think?
Harlan
Posts: 1,880
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12/16/2009 6:08:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It's fatal to the fetus, yes. Were you unaware that Fetuses (feti, as cool people say) do not survive abortion?
LB628
Posts: 176
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12/16/2009 8:27:05 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The definition of murder provided assumes that the thing being killed is classified as a person.

Murder is a very specific legal term "unlawful premeditated killing of a human being by a human being".

http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu...
alto2osu
Posts: 277
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12/17/2009 11:06:01 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Your conception of "murder" is totally off. The use of term "murder" requires that certain circumstances be in place prior to the proper usage of the term. Intent isn't taken into account at all. Did I "murder" the chicken fetus I consumed this morning?
Puck
Posts: 6,457
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12/17/2009 2:05:29 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/16/2009 6:05:55 PM, yeahyeah21 wrote:

Fatal = causing or capable of causing death

Murder = to kill, to cause death

By that set of definitions scratching yourself and killing a skin microbe that's feeding is murder and when someone drives a car, a mass murderer.
wonderwoman
Posts: 744
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12/18/2009 6:37:38 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
murder is defined as the unlawful act of taking a life

as soon as abortion is illegal than it will be murder but as of right now it can't possibly
johngriswald
Posts: 1,294
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12/18/2009 6:40:38 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It's all about whether you define the fetus to be human.

This relies solely upon your definition of humanity.
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I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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12/19/2009 2:33:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a baby.

Fetus. There is a difference.

A good definition for murder does not have the word "unlawful" in it.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
mongeese
Posts: 5,387
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12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/19/2009 2:36:49 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

Well if you go through the process of birth it's effectively consenting you will care for it. Otherwise, see: Orphanage
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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12/19/2009 2:37:22 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

As are children and people with mental and physical disorders.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Vi_Veri
Posts: 4,487
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12/19/2009 2:40:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:37:22 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

As are children and people with mental and physical disorders.

Steven Hawking?
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
Alex
Posts: 2,058
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12/19/2009 2:45:59 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It seems pretty simple. Once a human has been conceived it should not be the choice of another human to decide whether or not it gets to live, no matter what stage it or you is in. Ending somebodies life, or stopping it's short developing process in which it will "become a human" as if it wasn't already, is the same. Again, the life of one should not be left up to the decision of another.
Why kill people who kill people to show that killing people is wrong?
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/19/2009 2:47:03 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:45:59 PM, alex_hanson911 wrote:
It seems pretty simple. Once a human has been conceived it should not be the choice of another human to decide whether or not it gets to live, no matter what stage it or you is in. Ending somebodies life, or stopping it's short developing process in which it will "become a human" as if it wasn't already, is the same. Again, the life of one should not be left up to the decision of another.

So you agree on anarchism?
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Reasoning
Posts: 4,456
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12/19/2009 2:47:52 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:36:49 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

Well if you go through the process of birth it's effectively consenting you will care for it. Otherwise, see: Orphanage

What contract did the parent sign with the child?
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
Alex
Posts: 2,058
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12/19/2009 2:48:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:47:03 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:45:59 PM, alex_hanson911 wrote:
It seems pretty simple. Once a human has been conceived it should not be the choice of another human to decide whether or not it gets to live, no matter what stage it or you is in. Ending somebodies life, or stopping it's short developing process in which it will "become a human" as if it wasn't already, is the same. Again, the life of one should not be left up to the decision of another.

So you agree on anarchism?

I guess in this particular case. I don't really know what anarchism entails.
Why kill people who kill people to show that killing people is wrong?
mongeese
Posts: 5,387
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12/19/2009 2:49:10 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:47:52 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:36:49 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

Well if you go through the process of birth it's effectively consenting you will care for it. Otherwise, see: Orphanage

What contract did the parent sign with the child?

Well, the parent consented to its possible existence already, so...
Alex
Posts: 2,058
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12/19/2009 2:50:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:47:52 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:36:49 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

Well if you go through the process of birth it's effectively consenting you will care for it. Otherwise, see: Orphanage

What contract did the parent sign with the child?

The human being that THE PARENTS decided to make, now needs a contract in order for it to live?
Why kill people who kill people to show that killing people is wrong?
Reasoning
Posts: 4,456
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12/19/2009 2:50:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:49:10 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:47:52 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:36:49 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

Well if you go through the process of birth it's effectively consenting you will care for it. Otherwise, see: Orphanage

What contract did the parent sign with the child?

Well, the parent consented to its possible existence already, so...

I consent to your possible existence. Does this make me responsible for you and obligated to provide for you?
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
Alex
Posts: 2,058
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12/19/2009 2:51:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Sigh..This whole time i thought that was WJMelements, change your avatar PLEASE?
Why kill people who kill people to show that killing people is wrong?
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/19/2009 2:54:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:50:19 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:49:10 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:47:52 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:36:49 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:35:49 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

Babies are parasitic as well, just not to the same degree.

Well if you go through the process of birth it's effectively consenting you will care for it. Otherwise, see: Orphanage

What contract did the parent sign with the child?

Well, the parent consented to its possible existence already, so...

I consent to your possible existence. Does this make me responsible for you and obligated to provide for you?

You have a grand total of 9 months to bail out. If you don't, you should be liable to care for it until it turns 16 or chooses otherwise.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/19/2009 2:54:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:48:56 PM, alex_hanson911 wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:47:03 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:45:59 PM, alex_hanson911 wrote:
It seems pretty simple. Once a human has been conceived it should not be the choice of another human to decide whether or not it gets to live, no matter what stage it or you is in. Ending somebodies life, or stopping it's short developing process in which it will "become a human" as if it wasn't already, is the same. Again, the life of one should not be left up to the decision of another.

So you agree on anarchism?

I guess in this particular case. I don't really know what anarchism entails.

Replacement of state with corporations. Silly really.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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12/19/2009 4:27:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

At what point does a fetus become a baby?
kfc
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/19/2009 4:28:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 4:27:28 PM, Koopin wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:31:19 PM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 12/19/2009 2:20:06 PM, Koopin wrote:
It is killing a parasitical foetus.

Fix'd

At what point does a fetus become a baby?

Point it leaves the womb, Scientifically speaking.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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12/19/2009 4:32:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Let me ask you a question.
Does you getting out of your bed, then going to your car make you a different person?

A short trip out of the mother es not change the baby into a baby.
It is already a baby.
kfc
desiflavour
Posts: 6
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12/20/2009 10:48:58 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
"It's all about whether you define the fetus to be human.
This relies solely upon your definition of humanity."

How you define 'life' rather is the central issue. Not humanity. Some people assert that up to a certain point its all right to abort (justifying that it hasn't begun "living" yet) while others obviously don't think the same way. After all, biologically speaking, even a single cell has life!
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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12/20/2009 12:04:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 12/19/2009 4:32:07 PM, Koopin wrote:
Let me ask you a question.
Does you getting out of your bed, then going to your car make you a different person?

A short trip out of the mother es not change the baby into a baby.
It is already a baby.

In the womb, a foetus is 100% reliant on the mother for life. The second it is out of the womb, it is no longer dependent.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
comoncents
Posts: 5,647
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12/20/2009 12:33:41 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It seems like this question is becoming more of an opinion that an understood.

So, to me, it is murder.
The baby has a heart beat, and someone should stick up for that baby.
People ask me, "When does that baby have rights"

I believe he has a general right to live when he is conceived.
The parents knows the consequences of sex. Pragers is a byproduct of it.

Just like a person that murders knows that jail is a likely consequence.

I am not religious, by any means, but i feel strong on the side of anti-abortion.