Total Posts:13|Showing Posts:1-13
Jump to topic:

Ottoman Empire: Better if it still Existed?

1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/25/2013 4:13:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I debated this a while back, but my opponent was xxx200 so it's obvious ow it went. Do you think the Ottoman Empire should still exist or not?

At what borders?
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/25/2013 4:35:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
If Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo were autonomous provinces within an Ottoman rule, it would benefit them. I am against any similar annexation of Bosnia though. I doubt any Middle Eastern country would go forward with a whole union, unless the plan was to create the Caliphate state.

I read some of your debate, and you're right about the unique religious freedom that existed at the time. Nearly 3 years ago I was in a museum in Bosnia, and a note from one of the rulers who came a few centuries ago explained the importance of religious freedom, even protection of churches by the Muslims.

A problem today is ethnic conflicts between people, and larger lands are not the solution.
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/25/2013 9:06:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/25/2013 4:35:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
If Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo were autonomous provinces within an Ottoman rule, it would benefit them. I am against any similar annexation of Bosnia though. I doubt any Middle Eastern country would go forward with a whole union, unless the plan was to create the Caliphate state.

I read some of your debate, and you're right about the unique religious freedom that existed at the time. Nearly 3 years ago I was in a museum in Bosnia, and a note from one of the rulers who came a few centuries ago explained the importance of religious freedom, even protection of churches by the Muslims.

A problem today is ethnic conflicts between people, and larger lands are not the solution.

Joining World War 1 was the biggest mistake the Ottoman Empire made.
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
Subutai
Posts: 3,187
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/25/2013 10:56:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/25/2013 9:06:04 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 1/25/2013 4:35:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
If Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo were autonomous provinces within an Ottoman rule, it would benefit them. I am against any similar annexation of Bosnia though. I doubt any Middle Eastern country would go forward with a whole union, unless the plan was to create the Caliphate state.

I read some of your debate, and you're right about the unique religious freedom that existed at the time. Nearly 3 years ago I was in a museum in Bosnia, and a note from one of the rulers who came a few centuries ago explained the importance of religious freedom, even protection of churches by the Muslims.

A problem today is ethnic conflicts between people, and larger lands are not the solution.

Joining World War 1 was the biggest mistake the Ottoman Empire made.

On the losing side though. Still, they were the "sick man of Europe", war or not. It's highly doubtful they would still exist today.
I'm becoming less defined as days go by, fading away, and well you might say, I'm losing focus, kinda drifting into the abstract in terms of how I see myself.
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/26/2013 6:49:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Oh, it will rise again.

Here's a nice video, btw:
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
falconduler
Posts: 228
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/2/2013 3:37:45 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/25/2013 9:06:04 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 1/25/2013 4:35:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
If Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo were autonomous provinces within an Ottoman rule, it would benefit them. I am against any similar annexation of Bosnia though. I doubt any Middle Eastern country would go forward with a whole union, unless the plan was to create the Caliphate state.

I read some of your debate, and you're right about the unique religious freedom that existed at the time. Nearly 3 years ago I was in a museum in Bosnia, and a note from one of the rulers who came a few centuries ago explained the importance of religious freedom, even protection of churches by the Muslims.

A problem today is ethnic conflicts between people, and larger lands are not the solution.

Joining World War 1 was the biggest mistake the Ottoman Empire made.

Providing women and slaves to a sick and depraved government is your idea of something good to do, well ,you maybe just as sick and depraved as the ottomons were.,
suttichart.denpruektham
Posts: 1,115
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/8/2013 4:48:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/25/2013 4:13:17 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I debated this a while back, but my opponent was xxx200 so it's obvious ow it went. Do you think the Ottoman Empire should still exist or not?

At what borders?

Can you show me the debate you made. I am interested.
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/23/2013 1:05:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think that the 'natural state' of the middle east, when you look at the history of the area, is a caliphate state. The region is characterized by such drastic and intricate demographical crazing that, unless it is unified by some overarching principle, it tends to descend into bitter political, sectarian, and ethnic warfare. A lot of it's current problems can be traced to the imperialistic activity, especially in the Levant, of the West during the Ottoman Empire's decomposition. The schisms formed during that period were reinforced during the cold war, exacerbated by the foundation and support of Israel by the West, and then exploited for geopolitical and economic gains. The bitter division engenders religious radicalism and feeds grand vendettas against both whatever nation/people/sect victimizes another and whichever Western power supports them. All in all, I'm not surprised that they hate us.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/24/2013 2:08:29 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/2/2013 3:37:45 PM, falconduler wrote:
At 1/25/2013 9:06:04 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 1/25/2013 4:35:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
If Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo were autonomous provinces within an Ottoman rule, it would benefit them. I am against any similar annexation of Bosnia though. I doubt any Middle Eastern country would go forward with a whole union, unless the plan was to create the Caliphate state.

I read some of your debate, and you're right about the unique religious freedom that existed at the time. Nearly 3 years ago I was in a museum in Bosnia, and a note from one of the rulers who came a few centuries ago explained the importance of religious freedom, even protection of churches by the Muslims.

A problem today is ethnic conflicts between people, and larger lands are not the solution.

Joining World War 1 was the biggest mistake the Ottoman Empire made.

Providing women and slaves to a sick and depraved government is your idea of something good to do, well ,you maybe just as sick and depraved as the ottomons were.,

Yes it is, because of its foreign policy. We don't need anymore furniture.
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
TheRantingKoala
Posts: 1
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/4/2014 2:40:09 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 1/25/2013 9:06:04 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 1/25/2013 4:35:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
If Albania, Macedonia, and Kosovo were autonomous provinces within an Ottoman rule, it would benefit them. I am against any similar annexation of Bosnia though. I doubt any Middle Eastern country would go forward with a whole union, unless the plan was to create the Caliphate state.

I read some of your debate, and you're right about the unique religious freedom that existed at the time. Nearly 3 years ago I was in a museum in Bosnia, and a note from one of the rulers who came a few centuries ago explained the importance of religious freedom, even protection of churches by the Muslims.

A problem today is ethnic conflicts between people, and larger lands are not the solution.

Joining World War 1 was the biggest mistake the Ottoman Empire made.

That is very true because all that was left of the empire is Turkey! XD
Claw2k11
Posts: 1
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/31/2014 12:03:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/25/2013 4:13:17 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I debated this a while back, but my opponent was xxx200 so it's obvious ow it went. Do you think the Ottoman Empire should still exist or not?

At what borders?

If the Ottoman Empire were still to exist, for let's say at it peak untill today(though that's highly unlikely beacuse revolutions would have sprung up all over even if the Polish would have failed to turn the war over on their side with the Siege of Vienna.). They would be one of the biggest powers of the WWI and WWII, if they had aided the Germans in WWI, not even America or Russia might have had a chance to stop them. And in WWII, while I doubt they would have supported Hitler, IF they had supported them, then the war would have taken much longer to end and it would have probably meant the end for some countries such as Soviet Russia(or at least it would have been weakened to a point where there would have been another Revolution or something thanks to the poverty).
They would have changed history in one way or another, but I'm sure that many people from the Balkan region are glad that what happened, really happened. For if they existed today at the borders they had at their peak(again I highly doubt that), they would probably be a major world player(and probably have a Permanent Seat in UN Security Council instead of a weakened(and probably divided)Russia.), there would be no war on terrorism as it controlled a lot of the territories that the Taliban, Al-Qaeda and ISIS are spread through.
And there wouldn't be most of the countries that exist today, Greece, Bosnia, Croatia, Montenegro, Syria, Iraq, arguably Romania, Slovakia, heck even Hungary would have had a chance of not existing if the Ottoman Empire maintained itself at it's peak.
There are probably hundreds more ways a still preserved Ottoman Empire could have changed the modern world, but I can't name them all here(mostly due to my laziness :p).
So while history would be a little more interesting if the Ottoman Empire would have still existed today, a lot of people would say no to your question.