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Atheists questions to thiests.

GodSands
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6/26/2009 4:19:18 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
All atheists, give us your most challenging questions, not liky biky questions, I mean ones that will made us think alittle.

Where to begin, go for it.
Rezzealaux
Posts: 2,251
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6/26/2009 4:21:48 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
lolwut?
: If you weren't new here, you'd know not to feed me such attention. This is like an orgasm in my brain right now. *hehe, my name is in a title, hehe* (http://www.debate.org...)

Just in case I get into some BS with FREEDO again about how he's NOT a narcissist.

"The law is there to destroy evil under the constitutional government."
So... what's there to destroy evil inside of and above the constitutional government?
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/26/2009 4:22:08 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:19:18 PM, GodSands wrote:
All atheists, give us your most challenging questions, not liky biky questions, I mean ones that will made us think alittle.

Where to begin, go for it.

GodSands, what is your response to the omnipotence contradiction ("Paradox of the Stone")?

If the Doctrine of The Virgin Mary was not instated by the Church until the 1800s, why should we believe it?
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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6/26/2009 4:22:13 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
Why post a thread asking atheists to ask intelligent questions to theists/you, when you cannot yourself answer any questions on other threads/debates/messages intelligently?
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/26/2009 4:23:04 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:21:48 PM, Rezzealaux wrote:
lolwut?

This is the fun section where we can question GodSands. Most anything is fair game. However, I do plan to answer some questions.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/26/2009 4:24:00 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:22:13 PM, Volkov wrote:
Why post a thread asking atheists to ask intelligent questions to theists/you, when you cannot yourself answer any questions on other threads/debates/messages intelligently?

Because it makes things more specific. Besides, it gives us a chance to try to re-organize the discussion.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Volkov
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6/26/2009 4:25:21 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:24:00 PM, wjmelements wrote:
Because it makes things more specific. Besides, it gives us a chance to try to re-organize the discussion.

You can't reorganize a discussion when one of the people discussing refuses to be organized.
wjmelements
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6/26/2009 4:28:47 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:25:21 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:24:00 PM, wjmelements wrote:
Because it makes things more specific. Besides, it gives us a chance to try to re-organize the discussion.

You can't reorganize a discussion when one of the people discussing refuses to be organized.

Then we'll do our best to keep it organized despite the fact.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Rezzealaux
Posts: 2,251
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6/26/2009 7:28:49 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 6:18:34 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 6/26/2009 4:21:48 PM, Rezzealaux wrote:
lolwut?

Hey you read my signsture?

I apologize, my apostate heathen mind does not know what a signsture is.
: If you weren't new here, you'd know not to feed me such attention. This is like an orgasm in my brain right now. *hehe, my name is in a title, hehe* (http://www.debate.org...)

Just in case I get into some BS with FREEDO again about how he's NOT a narcissist.

"The law is there to destroy evil under the constitutional government."
So... what's there to destroy evil inside of and above the constitutional government?
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
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6/26/2009 7:32:24 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
: At 6/26/2009 7:28:49 PM, Rezzealaux wrote:
At 6/26/2009 6:18:34 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 6/26/2009 4:21:48 PM, Rezzealaux wrote:
lolwut?

Hey you read my signsture?

I apologize, my apostate heathen mind does not know what a signsture is.


Haha, you are clever, and smart. Don't say such things. It is where you quoted the Bible from the book of Judges, 1:19. Read mine.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/26/2009 7:45:24 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:22:08 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:19:18 PM, GodSands wrote:
All atheists, give us your most challenging questions, not liky biky questions, I mean ones that will made us think alittle.

Where to begin, go for it.

GodSands, what is your response to the omnipotence contradiction ("Paradox of the Stone")?

If the Doctrine of The Virgin Mary was not instated by the Church until the 1800s, why should we believe it?

You still haven't answered my questions....
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
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6/26/2009 8:04:42 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
: At 6/26/2009 7:45:24 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:22:08 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:19:18 PM, GodSands wrote:
All atheists, give us your most challenging questions, not liky biky questions, I mean ones that will made us think alittle.

Where to begin, go for it.

GodSands, what is your response to the omnipotence contradiction ("Paradox of the Stone")?

If the Doctrine of The Virgin Mary was not instated by the Church until the 1800s, why should we believe it?

You still haven't answered my questions....


Well I am not expert on how the church came about, besides I am not a Catholic. However that isn't the point. The only evidence for the existence of Jesus is his cloth what he was rapped up in, showing his facial features and the outer line of his body. And ofcourse Jesus is evident to people who have experience him in Spirit. Evermore you did not stae your question you posed it to my, by beginning the sentance with the word 'If' and therefore, I can believe that it was not instated into the church in the 1800's, however I may have been.

Jesus talks to hypocrites in the church in Mathew 23:23-28. The Church has maeesed up, 40 books were taken out of the Bible because it did not suit the churches thinking. I has not respect for the church, but Jesus alone.
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/26/2009 8:10:33 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:04:42 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 6/26/2009 7:45:24 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:22:08 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:19:18 PM, GodSands wrote:
All atheists, give us your most challenging questions, not liky biky questions, I mean ones that will made us think alittle.

Where to begin, go for it.

GodSands, what is your response to the omnipotence contradiction ("Paradox of the Stone")?

If the Doctrine of The Virgin Mary was not instated by the Church until the 1800s, why should we believe it?

You still haven't answered my questions....


Jesus talks to hypocrites in the church in Mathew 23:23-28. The Church has maeesed up, 40 books were taken out of the Bible because it did not suit the churches thinking. I has not respect for the church, but Jesus alone.

Agree. And those that corrupted the Word are said to recieve some terrible punishment (though I forgot what it was exactly.

But what of the Paradox of the Stone?
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
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6/26/2009 8:13:31 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
: At 6/26/2009 8:10:33 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 8:04:42 PM, GodSands wrote:
: At 6/26/2009 7:45:24 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:22:08 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:19:18 PM, GodSands wrote:
All atheists, give us your most challenging questions, not liky biky questions, I mean ones that will made us think alittle.

Where to begin, go for it.

GodSands, what is your response to the omnipotence contradiction ("Paradox of the Stone")?

If the Doctrine of The Virgin Mary was not instated by the Church until the 1800s, why should we believe it?

You still haven't answered my questions....


Jesus talks to hypocrites in the church in Mathew 23:23-28. The Church has maeesed up, 40 books were taken out of the Bible because it did not suit the churches thinking. I has not respect for the church, but Jesus alone.

Agree. And those that corrupted the Word are said to recieve some terrible punishment (though I forgot what it was exactly.

But what of the Paradox of the Stone?


Remind me? I do not know what that is.
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
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6/26/2009 8:18:21 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
"omnipotence contradiction" Oh right, about an all powerful God? You are debating against that right now, how can you say God is not all powerful.

Anyway God is personal to a single person, and then you can dicuss God to others and God with you about others. Give me an example of this contradiction.
amcclinton
Posts: 15
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6/26/2009 8:35:55 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:18:21 PM, GodSands wrote:
"omnipotence contradiction" Oh right, about an all powerful God? You are debating against that right now, how can you say God is not all powerful.

Anyway God is personal to a single person, and then you can dicuss God to others and God with you about others. Give me an example of this contradiction.

Is "God is personal to a single person" the answer to the omnipotence contradiction?
JBlake
Posts: 4,634
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6/26/2009 8:41:50 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:04:42 PM, GodSands wrote:
The only evidence for the existence of Jesus is his cloth what he was rapped up in, showing his facial features and the outer line of his body.

Then what would you say about the fact that this cloth (the Shroud of Turin) has been dated by three separate sources simultaneously in 1988, all of which dated the shroud to the twelfth century?
Kleptin
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6/26/2009 8:44:30 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 4:24:00 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:22:13 PM, Volkov wrote:
Why post a thread asking atheists to ask intelligent questions to theists/you, when you cannot yourself answer any questions on other threads/debates/messages intelligently?

Because it makes things more specific. Besides, it gives us a chance to try to re-organize the discussion.

If you were the host of this topic, I would participate. However, I am dealing with GodSands, so I shall not.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
burningpuppies101
Posts: 1,268
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6/26/2009 8:59:59 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
I actually think this thread is a good idea, if misplaced a bit.

Question to GodSands:

Why should we believe in a God that we cannot experience without first believing we can experience Him. Why should we believe in a God that we cannot prove exists.

What empirical evidence can you point to that says we should believe in an omnipotent being who does everything that is said to have been done by Him in the Bible, or any other religious text?
Omnes te moriturum amant 

http://www.debate.org...
wjmelements
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6/27/2009 7:30:23 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:59:59 PM, burningpuppies101 wrote:
I actually think this thread is a good idea, if misplaced a bit.

Question to GodSands:

Why should we believe in a God that we cannot experience without first believing we can experience Him. Why should we believe in a God that we cannot prove exists.

Locke believed that God was the thing that we are most certain exists of all the things we cannot percieve. An explanation of Lockean empiricism http://evans-experientialism.freewebspace.com...

What empirical evidence can you point to that says we should believe in an omnipotent being who does everything that is said to have been done by Him in the Bible, or any other religious text?

Quite a burden. I'm not a fan of the Ontalogical argument, but I will refer you to the First Cause argument. I think it is best worded here: http://www.existence-of-god.com...
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/27/2009 7:32:32 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:18:21 PM, GodSands wrote:
"omnipotence contradiction" Oh right, about an all powerful God? You are debating against that right now, how can you say God is not all powerful.

Anyway God is personal to a single person, and then you can dicuss God to others and God with you about others. Give me an example of this contradiction.

It is called the Paradox of the Stone, and it has many variations. http://www.existence-of-god.com...
Ragnar's favorite variation is the one that an all-powerful God would be able to create something with more powers than it, which is impossible.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/27/2009 7:34:34 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:44:30 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:24:00 PM, wjmelements wrote:
At 6/26/2009 4:22:13 PM, Volkov wrote:
Why post a thread asking atheists to ask intelligent questions to theists/you, when you cannot yourself answer any questions on other threads/debates/messages intelligently?

Because it makes things more specific. Besides, it gives us a chance to try to re-organize the discussion.

If you were the host of this topic, I would participate. However, I am dealing with GodSands, so I shall not.

I didn't plan to start an "ask elements" thread or a few more months.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
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6/27/2009 7:35:51 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 8:39:53 PM, amcclinton wrote:
Is the Resurrection a contradiction to science - specifically irreversibility (http://en.wikipedia.org...)?

In the terms of an omnipotent God, no. The creator's powers would not be limited to his own rules of science.
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
GodSands
Posts: 2,843
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6/27/2009 8:14:04 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
: At 6/26/2009 8:39:53 PM, amcclinton wrote:
Is the Resurrection a contradiction to science - specifically irreversibility (http://en.wikipedia.org...)?

If you think about Jesus' resurrection, it can either be two things. The most wicked and horrific prank/hoax played upon millions and millions of believers. That or either the resurrection was the most brillant, underestimated, rejected fact there is in history.

Well it would seem so, Jesus clearly died on the cross. He died of shock when the nails were nailed between his index finger and this thumb. And when this cirtain place is penitraded, it is a very painful pain which caused Jesus to die of shock. So Jesus obivously died. He then was checked to be dead by there being a spear stabes through his gut, which would have killed him in any case.

3 days laster some woman observed that Jesus' body was gone, no longer in the tomb the rock was removed. Through out the 40 days that Jesus remained on earth, many people (500) claimed to have seen him at one time. Just like today, people could have either denied it was Jesus or they could have accepted it was Jesus. I do not see why people would lie in that account, almost everyone rejected Jesus as a blasphema and it would be relatively illogical for them to suddendly lie or use this as a opportunity for the worlds largest and cruelest pranks every thought up in history.

Like in any case eye witnesses are the most important tool and crucial part to solve any mystery. Eye witnesses do not lie when they not know the meaning behind something, they would just tell it at face value, as it happened.

For the disciples to take Jesus' body would contradict their faith in Jesus. They did know Jesus would rise from the dead 3 days after his burial. (Matthew 27:62) And you can link this back to Matthew 8:23 where Jesus got into a boat with his followers, later Jesus fell asleep and a storm arose. So Jesus' followers panicked and woke Jesus up. If Jesus' disciples did take his body, that would be like his followers throwing Jesus over boared so that he would wake up. Crual and horrific. However Jesus woke up and calmed the storm, I think then his discples earn their lesson. In trusting and respecting Jesus.

I couldn't see that as the explaination of the resurrection of Jesus. How then can you explain the encounter that Marry Madeline had with Jesus, when she was weeping that he was gone. (Matthew 28) The tomb was also guarded closely till the third day. Even though the Pharisees called Jesus a liar they still made guard of the tomb. And it even claims that the body would be stolen if the tomb was not guarded in Matthew 27: 64. Why would then, Matthew the author write a lie and then be burned to death for his beliefs that Jesus did rise from the dead? This also goes for Paul who was crucified up side down, after fleeing from the scene where Jesus was being arrested. And the other discples, Mark, Luke John all died of either being killed publicly as Mark was bured in Alexandria, and then was bured again in the earilest parts of the church.

The important thing here is that all the discples but Judus died defending Jesus' as the true Messiah.

Since then there has been many other cases of people rising from the dead.
There are cases where people awake in moauges days after they are comfired dead. If you look hard on Youtube you can find some people who have risen from the dead in recent times.
wjmelements
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6/27/2009 8:29:04 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
RE: RESURRECTION

The three alternatives to the resurrection being true are:
-That he didn't die in the first place
-That those who "witnessed" him had merely hallucinated
-Those that had "witnessed" him had lied about seeing him

The argument against the first is that people didn't survive crucifiction, and that there was no way that the Romans would fail to kill Jesus.

The argument against the second proposition is that the proposed hallucinations were too similar, and that group hallucinations did not happen.

The argument agains the third propostion is that disciples did not even claim to have lied when it would have saved their lives. Their committment was too significant to have been falsified.

For more information: http://www.existence-of-god.com...
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
Rezzealaux
Posts: 2,251
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6/27/2009 10:57:12 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 6/26/2009 7:34:18 PM, GodSands wrote:
I will allow you to figure out why they had hearts of iron and not gold or even siliver. It's to do with heat.

I'm not sure what you're saying. The line talks about a physical battle with chariots.
: If you weren't new here, you'd know not to feed me such attention. This is like an orgasm in my brain right now. *hehe, my name is in a title, hehe* (http://www.debate.org...)

Just in case I get into some BS with FREEDO again about how he's NOT a narcissist.

"The law is there to destroy evil under the constitutional government."
So... what's there to destroy evil inside of and above the constitutional government?