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Human Nature is Evil

wonderwoman
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11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
I do believe there is some good in us as the human race. But if are to look at our past I would say with the evils of slavery, abuse, war, and countless other things, we are a vile, disgusting, undeserving race. Lucky for us God sent his son to save us or we would, well to put blankly , we would be screwed over hardcore. Honestly, the evil definitely outways the good in us. For example if someone harms you on purpose, our instinct is to harm them the same way or far worse. Where as the good tells us not to but we override it because of our lust for revenge. The internet is another example. The pornographic material one can find just by typing in a website wrong, or by googling a word that was spelt wrong or even correctly. What was supposed to be used for information and communication has become a highway to hell. I fear that as a civilization and race we are evil. Our evil desires overpower our good a lot of the time. I mean honestly I can use countless and boundless examples of when I should've done something and didn't or when I shouldn't of done something but did. Our concious's work to some degree but after a while we are able to override them and make excuses to make everything evil just ok. As humans we are doomed to this evil nature because we took the apple from the snake. . Look at the evil deeds in the bible even, just pick up a newspaper, sure the media is focusing on the evil of the world but maybe that is just because the evil outweighs the good?

Obviosouly this needs to be refined but any other Ideas I could incorporate into a speech or touching up on I should do?
Kleptin
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11/2/2009 8:56:36 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
I do believe there is some good in us as the human race. But if are to look at our past I would say with the evils of slavery, abuse, war, and countless other things, we are a vile, disgusting, undeserving race.

What's so bad about slavery, abuse, and war? And by what standards are we vile, disgusting, and undeserving? What is it that we don't deserve?

Lucky for us God sent his son to save us or we would, well to put blankly , we would be screwed over hardcore.

Save us from what? How would we be screwed? According to what rules?

Honestly, the evil definitely outways the good in us. For example if someone harms you on purpose, our instinct is to harm them the same way or far worse. Where as the good tells us not to but we override it because of our lust for revenge.

Why is it good not to act in revenge? The same instincts that tell us to eat when we are hungry and drink when we are thirsty are the same instincts that tell us to attack when attacked. What makes one action right and the other action wrong?

The internet is another example. The pornographic material one can find just by typing in a website wrong, or by googling a word that was spelt wrong or even correctly. What was supposed to be used for information and communication has become a highway to hell.

Pornography is still communication. How is pornography evil? Pornography is simply pixels on the screen, just as a Playboy magazine is just ink on paper. What is it about ink and pixels that makes these things inherently evil?

I fear that as a civilization and race we are evil. Our evil desires overpower our good a lot of the time. I mean honestly I can use countless and boundless examples of when I should've done something and didn't or when I shouldn't of done something but did.

Shouldn't *HAVE*, not Shouldn't *of*. And if we are an "evil" race, why should we change our nature? Why can't we simply define "evil" as "normal" and be done with it?

Our concious's work to some degree but after a while we are able to override them and make excuses to make everything evil just ok.

*Conscience*. If our conscience tells us to do something, how do we know whether it is right or wrong? Can our conscience ever be wrong?

As humans we are doomed to this evil nature because we took the apple from the snake. . Look at the evil deeds in the bible even, just pick up a newspaper, sure the media is focusing on the evil of the world but maybe that is just because the evil outweighs the good?

And what if the evil outweighs the good? Who defines what is good and what is evil?
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
wonderwoman
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11/2/2009 9:59:16 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 8:39:02 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
If only you had heard my rant on human nature.

Im interested in hearing it and to Kleptin you bring up all excellent points but it's not helping my speech any unless I can decide the factors of what you are saying and make them concrete in detail.
wonderwoman
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11/2/2009 10:08:00 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 8:56:36 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
I do believe there is some good in us as the human race. But if are to look at our past I would say with the evils of slavery, abuse, war, and countless other things, we are a vile, disgusting, undeserving race.

What's so bad about slavery, abuse, and war? And by what standards are we vile, disgusting, and undeserving? What is it that we don't deserve?

Lucky for us God sent his son to save us or we would, well to put blankly , we would be screwed over hardcore.

Save us from what? How would we be screwed? According to what rules?

Honestly, the evil definitely outways the good in us. For example if someone harms you on purpose, our instinct is to harm them the same way or far worse. Where as the good tells us not to but we override it because of our lust for revenge.

Why is it good not to act in revenge? The same instincts that tell us to eat when we are hungry and drink when we are thirsty are the same instincts that tell us to attack when attacked. What makes one action right and the other action wrong?

The internet is another example. The pornographic material one can find just by typing in a website wrong, or by googling a word that was spelt wrong or even correctly. What was supposed to be used for information and communication has become a highway to hell.

Pornography is still communication. How is pornography evil? Pornography is simply pixels on the screen, just as a Playboy magazine is just ink on paper. What is it about ink and pixels that makes these things inherently evil?

I fear that as a civilization and race we are evil. Our evil desires overpower our good a lot of the time. I mean honestly I can use countless and boundless examples of when I should've done something and didn't or when I shouldn't of done something but did.

Shouldn't *HAVE*, not Shouldn't *of*. And if we are an "evil" race, why should we change our nature? Why can't we simply define "evil" as "normal" and be done with it?

Our concious's work to some degree but after a while we are able to override them and make excuses to make everything evil just ok.

*Conscience*. If our conscience tells us to do something, how do we know whether it is right or wrong? Can our conscience ever be wrong?

As humans we are doomed to this evil nature because we took the apple from the snake. . Look at the evil deeds in the bible even, just pick up a newspaper, sure the media is focusing on the evil of the world but maybe that is just because the evil outweighs the good?

And what if the evil outweighs the good? Who defines what is good and what is evil?

Wow, the rant about God was in there? Wow, I guess I make a bad athiest lol
leet4A1
Posts: 1,986
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11/2/2009 10:11:02 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
Wow, the rant about God was in there? Wow, I guess I make a bad athiest lol

Wait, I'm pretty sure you were a Christian not half an hour ago. Has debate.org made another conversion? :D
"Let me tell you the truth. The truth is, 'what is'. And 'what should be' is a fantasy, a terrible terrible lie that someone gave to the people long ago. The 'what should be' never did exist, but people keep trying to live up to it. There is no 'what should be,' there is only what is." - Lenny Bruce

"Satan goes to church, did you know that?" - Godsands

"And Genisis 1 does match modern science... you just have to try really hard." - GR33K FR33K5
wonderwoman
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11/2/2009 10:12:35 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 10:11:02 PM, leet4A1 wrote:
Wow, the rant about God was in there? Wow, I guess I make a bad athiest lol

Wait, I'm pretty sure you were a Christian not half an hour ago. Has debate.org made another conversion? :D

I am pretty sure, I've been atheist for quite a while.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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11/2/2009 10:22:37 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
For example if someone harms you on purpose, our instinct is to harm them the same way or far worse. Where as the good tells us not to but we override it because of our lust for revenge.

Which is exactly what Christianity teaches, an eye for an eye. Thus making Christianity evil.

.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
GeoLaureate8
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11/2/2009 10:27:03 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 10:12:35 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
Lucky for us God sent his son to save us
I've been atheist for quite a while.

I'm confused now. "A while" as in 10 minutes? lol

.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
wonderwoman
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11/2/2009 10:28:22 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 10:27:03 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 11/2/2009 10:12:35 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
Lucky for us God sent his son to save us
I've been atheist for quite a while.

I'm confused now. "A while" as in 10 minutes? lol

.

No, clearly more than that. I would say a few years now.
wonderwoman
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11/2/2009 10:28:48 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 10:22:37 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
For example if someone harms you on purpose, our instinct is to harm them the same way or far worse. Where as the good tells us not to but we override it because of our lust for revenge.

Which is exactly what Christianity teaches, an eye for an eye. Thus making Christianity evil.

.

never thought of it that way, valid point
GeoLaureate8
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11/2/2009 10:31:56 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 10:28:22 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
At 11/2/2009 10:27:03 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 11/2/2009 10:12:35 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
Lucky for us God sent his son to save us
I've been atheist for quite a while.

I'm confused now. "A while" as in 10 minutes? lol

.

No, clearly more than that. I would say a few years now.

Oh, ok. I always thought you were Atheist, until I saw your profile said "Christian." Well, it seems you reached the age of reason before me then, lol.

.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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11/3/2009 7:41:23 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
I don't understand... Why are you writing a speech about this? And why does religion have to be a factor? Is it for a debate or something?
President of DDO
comoncents
Posts: 5,647
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11/3/2009 7:52:26 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
evils of slavery, abuse, war, and countless other things, we are a vile, disgusting, undeserving race. :


That stuffs not evil........ It is what makes us America, gosh, so unpatriotic.
tkubok
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11/3/2009 7:59:21 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
I do believe there is some good in us as the human race. But if are to look at our past I would say with the evils of slavery, abuse, war, and countless other things, we are a vile, disgusting, undeserving race. Lucky for us God sent his son to save us or we would, well to put blankly , we would be screwed over hardcore. Honestly, the evil definitely outways the good in us. For example if someone harms you on purpose, our instinct is to harm them the same way or far worse. Where as the good tells us not to but we override it because of our lust for revenge. The internet is another example. The pornographic material one can find just by typing in a website wrong, or by googling a word that was spelt wrong or even correctly. What was supposed to be used for information and communication has become a highway to hell. I fear that as a civilization and race we are evil. Our evil desires overpower our good a lot of the time. I mean honestly I can use countless and boundless examples of when I should've done something and didn't or when I shouldn't of done something but did. Our concious's work to some degree but after a while we are able to override them and make excuses to make everything evil just ok. As humans we are doomed to this evil nature because we took the apple from the snake. . Look at the evil deeds in the bible even, just pick up a newspaper, sure the media is focusing on the evil of the world but maybe that is just because the evil outweighs the good?


Obviosouly this needs to be refined but any other Ideas I could incorporate into a speech or touching up on I should do?

Human nature is not evil at all. Infact, its a mixture of Good and Evil.

If you saw a man on the street, who was bleeding from his leg, what would you do? What would most of us Do? If we were all evil, we wouldnt need the 911 Hotline, because no one would bother calling.

Count the number of times you have done something good in your life. Cant? Thats because youve done so many good things, that you could not possibly remember them all. How many people have done so few good things in their life, that they can memorize and list them all? None of us. We are all good AND evil.
Vi_Veri
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11/3/2009 8:58:46 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
http://www.ted.com...

That link leads to a TED video by Steven Pinker called : On the Myth of Violence. We, as a human race, are becoming more "good" as time passes. The "evils" of the natural world trying to destroy us are thinning off (because, yes, that's the main hub of reasons why we consider things evil: that they will destroy us).

I love Steven Pinker. This should make you think, wonderwoman. And the rest of you, I am sure, will enjoy it very much.
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
wonderwoman
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11/3/2009 9:19:33 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 7:41:23 AM, theLwerd wrote:
I don't understand... Why are you writing a speech about this? And why does religion have to be a factor? Is it for a debate or something?

religion doesn't haven't to be a factor. This is for a class I am taking at school. It's rather stupid but whatever. I have to pick a side, I chose inherently evil, because it in my mind was easier.
wonderwoman
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11/3/2009 9:20:09 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 7:52:26 AM, comoncents wrote:
At 11/2/2009 8:36:13 PM, wonderwoman wrote:
evils of slavery, abuse, war, and countless other things, we are a vile, disgusting, undeserving race. :



That stuffs not evil........ It is what makes us America, gosh, so unpatriotic.

Heh you sound like Megatron
wonderwoman
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11/3/2009 9:23:13 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 7:59:21 AM, tkubok wrote:
If you saw a man on the street, who was bleeding from his leg, what would you do? What would most of us Do? If we were all evil, we wouldnt need the 911 Hotline, because no one would bother calling.

In all honesty I would do nothing. I have no duty to do anything.
tkubok
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11/3/2009 9:27:12 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 9:23:13 AM, wonderwoman wrote:

In all honesty I would do nothing. I have no duty to do anything.

So, if you were in the same situation, you would like other people not to do anything too?
wonderwoman
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11/3/2009 9:35:28 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 9:27:12 AM, tkubok wrote:
At 11/3/2009 9:23:13 AM, wonderwoman wrote:

In all honesty I would do nothing. I have no duty to do anything.

So, if you were in the same situation, you would like other people not to do anything too?

I would like them to do something but they are not bound by any duty to anything
tkubok
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11/3/2009 10:55:55 AM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 9:35:28 AM, wonderwoman wrote:
I would like them to do something but they are not bound by any duty to anything

So, you would like them to do something.

Now, if we live in a society, does it benefit us all if we each look out for each other, help each other? Or is helping each other, detrimental to society?
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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11/3/2009 12:04:21 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 9:35:28 AM, wonderwoman wrote:
At 11/3/2009 9:27:12 AM, tkubok wrote:
At 11/3/2009 9:23:13 AM, wonderwoman wrote:

In all honesty I would do nothing. I have no duty to do anything.

So, if you were in the same situation, you would like other people not to do anything too?

I would like them to do something but they are not bound by any duty to anything

No, they're not. But that doesn't mean that they wouldn't or shouldn't.
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feverish
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11/3/2009 12:21:48 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 10:55:55 AM, tkubok wrote:

Now, if we live in a society, does it benefit us all if we each look out for each other, help each other? Or is helping each other, detrimental to society?

You sir, are clearly an evil socialist.

Destroy the altruists before they enslave us all!
Vi_Veri
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11/3/2009 1:57:33 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
There are some things that everyone knows are right and wrong, unless their brain is deformed : )
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.
leet4A1
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11/3/2009 2:06:05 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 1:57:33 PM, Vi_Veri wrote:
There are some things that everyone knows are right and wrong, unless their brain is deformed : )

I think I agree with you on this (things like rape are, in my opinion, objectively wrong). What I can't seem to reason is just why they're "wrong". According to whom?

For example, I am quite certain that if I was raised in an isolated society where it was rite of passage to rape a virgin on my 18th birthday, I would think nothing of it, despite how disgusting (and "wrong") it seems to me now. So if it's something as trivial as the piece of land on which I was born that makes me conclude that rape is "wrong", is it really "wrong"?
"Let me tell you the truth. The truth is, 'what is'. And 'what should be' is a fantasy, a terrible terrible lie that someone gave to the people long ago. The 'what should be' never did exist, but people keep trying to live up to it. There is no 'what should be,' there is only what is." - Lenny Bruce

"Satan goes to church, did you know that?" - Godsands

"And Genisis 1 does match modern science... you just have to try really hard." - GR33K FR33K5
Volkov
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11/3/2009 2:16:06 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
Things are only "wrong" based upon the social code you grow up in, or adhere to. For Western society, something like rape is seen as wrong because our culture has integrated such thoughts into the "moral fiber of society."

In a place like Saudi Arabia, where rape is not seen as such a questionable issue, it is much different. Rape is not only permissive, it is positively reinforced in some aspects.

But that being said, where we obtain our morality from is based on our evolutionary disposition. The idea that it is wrong to kill another without due cause (self defense) is inherent in our species, because such things are seen as bad for not only self-preservation of your own self, but for continued progeny as well.

So there is a base for our morality, but it is foolish to assume that there is really one standard of right and wrong in the world.
Vi_Veri
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11/3/2009 2:30:10 PM
Posted: 7 years ago
At 11/3/2009 2:06:05 PM, leet4A1 wrote:
At 11/3/2009 1:57:33 PM, Vi_Veri wrote:
There are some things that everyone knows are right and wrong, unless their brain is deformed : )

I think I agree with you on this (things like rape are, in my opinion, objectively wrong). What I can't seem to reason is just why they're "wrong". According to whom?

For example, I am quite certain that if I was raised in an isolated society where it was rite of passage to rape a virgin on my 18th birthday, I would think nothing of it, despite how disgusting (and "wrong") it seems to me now. So if it's something as trivial as the piece of land on which I was born that makes me conclude that rape is "wrong", is it really "wrong"?

This might answer your question, leet4A1....

There really is only one "right" that everyone is adament about, and no matter how brain washed your culture is, this right still gnaws at your bones when it is taken from you. This is the main right that made slavery so hated and finally help over turn it: The right to your own life.

All other rights stem from it.

So, I would assume a person with some rational thought would know that rape (a clear violation of this right) was wrong.

I guess right and wrong stems from us having individualism. Ayn Rand said it best:

"The source of man's rights is not divine law or congressional law, but the law of identity. A is A—and Man is Man. Rights are conditions of existence required by man's nature for his proper survival. If man is to live on earth, it is right for him to use his mind, it is right to act on his own free judgment, it is right to work for his values and to keep the product of his work. If life on earth is his purpose, he has a right to live as a rational being: nature forbids him the irrational. Any group, any gang, any nation that attempts to negate man's rights, is wrong, which means: is evil, which means: is anti-life."

To wonderwoman:

You might want to get rid of the pornography section (and the god talk) in your speech. The former makes you not understand that sometimes porn isn't inherently wrong, and the latter makes the entire speech sound like you're preaching and no one will really take you seriously if your backing is based on the bible.
I could give a f about no haters as long as my ishes love me.