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Grading debates

YYW
Posts: 36,289
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5/7/2013 9:56:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think on the debates I judge from now on, I'll grade them. A, B (+/-), C (+/-), D (+/-) and F. What do you all think of that proposition?
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thett3
Posts: 14,348
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5/7/2013 10:01:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Sounds cool. I might try that as well if you dont mind.

I want a grade :p
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
thett3
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5/7/2013 10:03:34 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Or maybe grade each debater by their performance
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
YYW
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5/7/2013 10:04:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/7/2013 10:01:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
Sounds cool. I might try that as well if you dont mind.

I want a grade :p

Even if it means nothing on the ratings, I don't think win/loss is fair because it does nothing to address the quality of arguments presented -to a considerable extent. Grading seems to be a way to rectify that.
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YYW
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5/7/2013 10:05:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/7/2013 10:03:34 PM, thett3 wrote:
Or maybe grade each debater by their performance

Perhaps a DDO GPA? lol I love it.
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Lucky_Luciano
Posts: 4,350
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5/8/2013 2:15:51 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'm sure that Ore_Ele could create a system to determine the average strength of our opponents. For example, if somebody debated 5 people with over 4000 elo, their strength value would be higher than somebody who noob sniped for 200 debates while slowly grinding their elo points. Obviously this wouldn't be indicative of the quality of any one debate, but I think it would be a good way to display the effort they put into their debates.
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RyuuKyuzo
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5/8/2013 8:49:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
What a funny coincidence, I do the same thing with threads!

C.
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YYW
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5/8/2013 4:54:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/8/2013 2:15:51 AM, Lucky_Luciano wrote:
I'm sure that Ore_Ele could create a system to determine the average strength of our opponents. For example, if somebody debated 5 people with over 4000 elo, their strength value would be higher than somebody who noob sniped for 200 debates while slowly grinding their elo points. Obviously this wouldn't be indicative of the quality of any one debate, but I think it would be a good way to display the effort they put into their debates.

That would be pretty cool.
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000ike
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5/8/2013 5:05:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Maybe I'd feel differently if someone else suggested this, but I perceive a strong sense of assumed preeminence in the suggestion of grading debates. What makes you think your opinion is so objective and informed that you should be able to stamp a hard and fast judgement like a grade, on someone's debate?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
YYW
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5/8/2013 5:20:05 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/8/2013 5:05:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
Maybe I'd feel differently if someone else suggested this, but I perceive a strong sense of assumed preeminence in the suggestion of grading debates. What makes you think your opinion is so objective and informed that you should be able to stamp a hard and fast judgement like a grade, on someone's debate?

lol... I don't think my opinion is anything even close to objective. I'm not sure what you mean by "strong sense of assumed preeminence" though; perhaps you'd like to explain what you mean by that. But anyway, grading isn't just a process of hard and fast judgement -if it was, then the exercise would be worthless. I could just do 1-9 though... on the AP scale. That might be more familiar for everyone here.

This is what I'm talking about:

http://mrtdavis.edublogs.org...

I've never taught AP courses though... I tutored students (high school and college) while I was an undergrad, but that's it.

The reason why I think grading is a good idea is because a win/loss system doesn't address the quality of the debate beyond where it stands relative to that opposite of it, rather, a win/loss just states who was better. It's an effort to give credit where credit is due, where a mere win/loss is -in my view- an insufficient metric. But idk... while even though I like the 1-9 scale, there are limitations. For example, some debates (like music debates or rap battles) couldn't and shouldn't be graded. They're about having fun.

In any case, I would never assert that my opinion is anything more than my opinion. Do I think I'm more qualified to judge the quality of members' writing than some members? Yes. Do I think I'm the best or the only one who should judge? Hardly. The best judge who has ever been on this site was Cliff.Stamp... He's gone now, but I digress.

Do you think I would grade unfairly, Ike? If so, why?
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dylancatlow
Posts: 12,245
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5/8/2013 5:41:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I would like to see some feature developed where people can request members whom they think are objective to individually grade the quality of their arguments, but have this not tied with ELO or any official ranking. I suppose people can already do this, but I think having the option backed by an official method would make it more available.
dylancatlow
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5/8/2013 5:51:36 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Also, I think the DDO voting rubric is heavily flawed. The criterion "Made more convincing arguments" should be changed to "Argued their position more effectively," or something along those lines. As it is now, technically someone who is for abortion rights, for example, could properly give the side supporting abortion rights 'convincing arguments' even if said arguments were horribly argued, because 'convincing arguments' just entails 'which side's arguments are more convincing.' Of course someone who is for abortion rights will find arguments supporting abortion rights more convincing - those arguments already convinced them!
YYW
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5/8/2013 6:08:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/8/2013 5:51:36 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
Also, I think the DDO voting rubric is heavily flawed. The criterion "Made more convincing arguments" should be changed to "Argued their position more effectively," or something along those lines.

I agree.
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