Total Posts:8|Showing Posts:1-8
Jump to topic:

An analogy regarding sexual orientation

bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/13/2013 9:03:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
If you had a disease and the medicine needed to cure it within your grasp, would opting to not take the medicine mean that you "chose" to have the disease?

(By the way, I am in no way calling any sexual orientation a "disease" that should be cured.)
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
Andromeda_Z
Posts: 4,151
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/13/2013 9:11:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The implication of that is that there is a cure to homosexuality that is an option one could choose to take. I haven't seen that, and no, "conversion therapy" is not a cure.
bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/13/2013 9:17:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/13/2013 9:11:50 PM, Andromeda_Z wrote:
The implication of that is that there is a cure to homosexuality that is an option one could choose to take. I haven't seen that, and no, "conversion therapy" is not a cure.

I certainly don't think that there's a "cure" that's practical and worth the mental effort needed for it. I would think that overcoming these inherent biases would be akin to starving yourself.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
EvanK
Posts: 599
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/13/2013 9:56:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/13/2013 9:03:06 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
If you had a disease and the medicine needed to cure it within your grasp, would opting to not take the medicine mean that you "chose" to have the disease?

(By the way, I am in no way calling any sexual orientation a "disease" that should be cured.)

I'm not sure how this is an analogy to sexual orientation.

If you had the cure to the disease, and chose not to take it, then yes, you do, in a way, choose to have the disease.

However, your sexual orientation, whatever it may be, doesn't damage your health or life like a disease can. You can ruin your health and life by being too promiscuous with your orientation, but this is true of every orientation (both gays and straights can develope AIDs, herpes, etc) so I don't quiet see the analogy here. Plus, I have never heard of any "cure" for being gay, or straight for that matter.

I'm sorry, I just don't see the relationship.
The problem with socialism is that, sooner or later, you run out of people's money."_Margaret Thatcher

"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."_Thomas Jefferson

"The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."_Thomas Jefferson

"It is easier to fool someone than to convince them that they have been fooled."-Mark Twain
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/13/2013 10:05:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Bad analogy. No sexual orientation is better than another. Not having a disease is better than having one making one better than another. There is no "cure" for changing one sexual orientation to another, and even if there were, it wouldn't be called a cure since it does not make one better - there is no "better." All sexual orientations are equal.

Regarding choice, I agree with you that sexual orientation does not involve conscious choice but you didn't use a good analogy to prove this point.

Further, as others have mentioned, the analogy fails because sexual orientation cannot be changed either way through a "cure" whereas the condition of curable diseases (which you are referring to) can be changed by taking the relevant cure.
R0b1Billion
Posts: 3,720
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/13/2013 10:57:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/13/2013 9:03:06 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
If you had a disease and the medicine needed to cure it within your grasp, would opting to not take the medicine mean that you "chose" to have the disease?

Depends. If you are infected and take antibiotics, I'd say yeah. If you have ADHD and choose not to take Ritalin, I wouldn't put that in the same category. Modern medical practices have complexities which go beyond "healing versus not healing."

(By the way, I am in no way calling any sexual orientation a "disease" that should be cured.)

Your insinuation is beyond subtle, my friend.
Beliefs in a nutshell:
- The Ends never justify the Means.
- Objectivity is secondary to subjectivity.
- The War on Drugs is the worst policy in the U.S.
- Most people worship technology as a religion.
- Computers will never become sentient.
bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/14/2013 12:27:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/13/2013 9:56:29 PM, EvanK wrote:
At 5/13/2013 9:03:06 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
If you had a disease and the medicine needed to cure it within your grasp, would opting to not take the medicine mean that you "chose" to have the disease?

(By the way, I am in no way calling any sexual orientation a "disease" that should be cured.)

I'm not sure how this is an analogy to sexual orientation.

If you had the cure to the disease, and chose not to take it, then yes, you do, in a way, choose to have the disease.

This was the point of the analogy, not that any sexual orientation is more desirable than it's alternatives. In no way do I endorse that view. However, some people do, and I don't think that saying that it's not a choice is a good enough counter by itself.

Maybe a better analogy would be dropping a coin on the ground by accident. You certainly did not choose to drop it, but you can pick it back up if you so wish.
(Please ignore the fact that there would be no reason to leave the coin there)

Plus, I have never heard of any "cure" for being gay, or straight for that matter.

I figured that this would be the main point of contention. There's certainly no pill to take nor any chants to recite to change your preferences.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
Df0512
Posts: 966
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
5/14/2013 1:35:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/13/2013 9:03:06 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
If you had a disease and the medicine needed to cure it within your grasp, would opting to not take the medicine mean that you "chose" to have the disease?

(By the way, I am in no way calling any sexual orientation a "disease" that should be cured.)

If it isn't a disease why did you call it a cure? Sonds like x-men 3