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Voting for revenge

TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 10:23:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Got the following in my inbox from Aperion.

My dear sir,

You may've noted that I voted on your debates. I stand to be convinced otherwise on my votes since they were tough cases.

If you agree to this, I ask that you would please reconsider your vote here,

http://www.debate.org......

The reason I ask is because I don't think it was fair, I think it was simply catering to Dakota's overly dramatic complaint. Dakota deserves conduct, I agree, however I presented a much better case despite my over the top pics. Dakota had only two questions against it, not objections, this is why he know his only hope of winning is to make a huge scene outcrying the conduct violation. You'll notice others not falling for it as they don't consider it a big deal. Nevertheless I still think Dakota shouldn't have received convincing arguments. I had more sources and certainly had better arguments, So that equates to you either lifting your vote or voting more fairly.. IMO.

That being said, I should hope you reconsider your vote. You don't have to lift it, you don't have to vote for me, but neither do I have to reconsider that for you. And I've been very intrigued to see you debating something in my field of expertise,

http://www.debate.org......

... I have it on my voting calendar, just so you know.


Anyone else have this problem?
Thank you for voting!
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 10:25:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Note what I said,

"I stand to be convinced otherwise on my votes since they were tough cases....If you agree to this, I ask that you would please reconsider your vote...You don't have to lift it, you don't have to vote for me, but neither do I have to reconsider that for you."

I also alluded to another debate,

"I've been very intrigued to see you debating something in my field of expertise...I have it on my voting calendar, just so you know."

Now obviously you took this as a threat and a barter, but that would be to go beyond what the evidence shows. A sound exegesis of what I wrote says nothing of my intent other than to discuss issues that we're interested in, in terms of our opinions we gave through voting.

No one can actually counter my votes in good sense since I justified them and gave a chance for you to help me to reconsider, a common practice on this site for tough issues.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 10:26:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
From HitchSlap,

My dear sir,

It turns out I actually have our DDO president on here as a friend. Even worse, silly you made a grave mistake. I've sent this to him, and apparently he's been watching you for quite some time now.

Congratulations, your incompetence to not only 1) inform me of voting the way you did simply because of your violating the rules and 2) threaten to do the same to a future one and 3) to not only do it to me but several others in which you votebombed like crazy has resulted in a case being built against you by Juggle.

You have several choices, as do I.

1) remove your blatant VB's against me, and I forgive you.
2) Keep them there, continue the proof against yourself for Juggle to remove your account, and then I send this on a forum to have the users counter your VB's as well, meaning your not only gone from here, but your votes count for sht

With all the other VB's you've sent, do you think for a second that the people on here wouldn't like to counter your votes? Or for that matter see you gone?

My vote will stay the same, it turned into petty squabbling yes, however, you violated the rules to circumvent the texts limits, does that require conduct? Without question, but he also made a good case against you in terms of why you should be voted against due to that violation. You forget the masses control this site more than anyone, and when you crossed that boundry illegally, yes I think you should have lost the arguments, because if you need more character space to make a case, you obviously suck at debating, the whole point of it was to make those compelling arguments and for fairness.

With that being said. I hope you look at yourself and see that your overreacting to a site that was intended for fun. You've taken the fun right out of it, all because a little bit of your pride got hurt. You sir, are rediculous.

I don;t care if you refuse to change your votes, but I ain't changing mine. Espescially not after this!

Cheers!
dylancatlow
Posts: 12,255
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5/17/2013 10:27:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Just point out, neither one of your hyperlinks are full. You'll need to individually copy each one if you want people to check them out.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 10:27:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think it's blatantly obvious Hitch is the one who turned this into a barter for votes, he even said,

"So does this mean you never intended to re-think your votes?"
dylancatlow
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5/17/2013 10:27:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 10:27:24 PM, dylancatlow wrote:
Just point out, neither one of your hyperlinks are full. You'll need to individually copy each one if you want people to check them out.

to*
TheHitchslap
Posts: 1,231
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5/17/2013 10:28:48 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 10:27:28 PM, Apeiron wrote:
I think it's blatantly obvious Hitch is the one who turned this into a barter for votes, he even said,

"So does this mean you never intended to re-think your votes?"

Hey check this out! He's stalking me now too! Awe! How cute! :)
Thank you for voting!
TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 10:36:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 10:27:28 PM, Apeiron wrote:
I think it's blatantly obvious Hitch is the one who turned this into a barter for votes, he even said,

"So does this mean you never intended to re-think your votes?"

Interesting, then why revenge vote against me and then tell me you'll rethink yours if i rethink mine?

Dude, no one is going to believe your bullsh!t. It's pretty obvious what you were trying to do.
Thank you for voting!
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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5/17/2013 11:01:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
@ Hitch, you did the right thing informing Airmax about it.

Apeiron has previously mentioned (implicitly) in another forum that he believe trading votes is okay. On a debate tournament, he proposed that the winner of the tournament can receive a "charitable vote" which in other words is a votebomb. His PM with you is consistent with that belief.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 11:09:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:01:46 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
@ Hitch, you did the right thing informing Airmax about it.

Apeiron has previously mentioned (implicitly) in another forum that he believe trading votes is okay. On a debate tournament, he proposed that the winner of the tournament can receive a "charitable vote" which in other words is a votebomb. His PM with you is consistent with that belief.

You see it as a vote-bomb, that's small and close-mindedness. Votes, if you didn't noticed, are not only truth evaluable, but can also be discussed as they were in the past. This is all just a popularity contest at this point, but I still stand by my offer, which is discussing the content of our votes, not bartering. I'm a layman in the issues I voted on, so that's why I'd like a discussion.

But do continue the popularity contest. I'll be over here if anyone wants to find out what reality and boobs feel like.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 11:09:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 10:36:28 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 10:27:28 PM, Apeiron wrote:
I think it's blatantly obvious Hitch is the one who turned this into a barter for votes, he even said,

"So does this mean you never intended to re-think your votes?"

Interesting, then why revenge vote against me and then tell me you'll rethink yours if i rethink mine?

Dude, no one is going to believe your bullsh!t. It's pretty obvious what you were trying to do.

Like I care what others think. I'm not on trial here. And I never said I'll re-think mine if you re-think yours. That would be to go beyond what the evidence shows. A sound exegesis of what I wrote says nothing of my intent other than to discuss issues that we're interested in, in terms of our opinions we gave through voting. That's all I was interested in, it gave for good discussion and I was considering debating you on the kCA.

Now what I did say was,

"I stand to be convinced otherwise on my votes since they were tough cases....If you agree to this, I ask that you would please reconsider your vote...You don't have to lift it, you don't have to vote for me, but neither do I have to reconsider that for you."

I also alluded to another debate,

"I've been very intrigued to see you debating something in my field of expertise...I have it on my voting calendar, just so you know."
TheHitchslap
Posts: 1,231
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5/17/2013 11:20:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever herd, he's already indicated in the message he's already voting for you before the debate is even over. Just because he worships your old account does not mean he's right by default.
This is blatant retributive voting, on the basis of something stupid he did in his own debate. Not.My.Problem. Besides even if I did take them away, he still wouldn't win.
Thank you for voting!
Smithereens
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5/17/2013 11:21:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What Apeiron is doing is wrong, but beware that you don't simply ignore what he has to say. If anyone takes issue with something you did, ignoring them turns this site into a rage-house of closed-minded bigots. We don't want that, so you should make sure any problems people take up with you are properly sorted out.
Music composition contest: http://www.debate.org...
TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 11:21:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:01:46 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
@ Hitch, you did the right thing informing Airmax about it.

Apeiron has previously mentioned (implicitly) in another forum that he believe trading votes is okay. On a debate tournament, he proposed that the winner of the tournament can receive a "charitable vote" which in other words is a votebomb. His PM with you is consistent with that belief.

Thanks F-16, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one having this issue with him!
Thank you for voting!
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 11:23:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:20:15 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever herd,

How surprising, you're certainly not making it easy to consider you an intellectual.

he's already indicated in the message he's already voting for you before the debate is even over.

More words into my message, I expressed interest in your guys' debate. You're doing that thing wherein you go beyond the evidence, once more. This then is anti-intellectualism. Well done.

This is blatant retributive voting, on the basis of something stupid he did in his own debate. Not.My.Problem. Besides even if I did take them away, he still wouldn't win.

I offered you a platform for discussing an impending debate I was hoping to offer you on the kalam. You, as an anti-intellectual, saw this as a domestic. Big surprise.
TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 11:24:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:21:11 PM, Smithereens wrote:
What Apeiron is doing is wrong, but beware that you don't simply ignore what he has to say. If anyone takes issue with something you did, ignoring them turns this site into a rage-house of closed-minded bigots. We don't want that, so you should make sure any problems people take up with you are properly sorted out.

I don't have issues with someone voting on the basis of the debate it's self, but already telling me your going to vote against me because your simply butt-hurt about the way I voted is nonsense.
For instance, in my Iraq War debate Ron Paul didn't vote for me, I didn't have a problem with that, I never coerced him into changing his vote.
At the same time he didn't claim it was because of the way I previously voted either, it was on the debate it's self. Unlike this dumb@$$
Thank you for voting!
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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5/17/2013 11:24:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

Trading votes violates the integrity of the site. Voting on a debate ought to be done regardless of external factors. No matter what the circumstances, the vote must be on the debate alone. This is the only way to ensure voting integrity.

Saying "I will vote for you if you vote for me" is unfair to the other debater and lowers the quality of the site as a whole. More subtle forms of doing this such as "I'll re-evaluate my vote if you re-evaluate yours also fall under the same blanket. It is not okay to do this.

Once a vote has been cast, I believe it should not be re-evaluated (some others disagree but it is always based on whether the voter thinks he misvoted). Doing a one for one trade causes the votes to be based on something other than the debate.

Imagine you were debating in real life with lay judges (maybe parents). What if one parent said to another, "I'll vote for your kid ABC if you vote for mine." Would you consider that fair? What if ABC was your opponent?

A lot of people need to get out of the mindset that this behavior is acceptable.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 11:25:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:21:11 PM, Smithereens wrote:
What Apeiron is doing is wrong, but beware that you don't simply ignore what he has to say. If anyone takes issue with something you did, ignoring them turns this site into a rage-house of closed-minded bigots. We don't want that, so you should make sure any problems people take up with you are properly sorted out.

Again, I'm not bartering for votes, I'm giving chance for discussion on stuff that revolve around votes.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 11:25:45 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:24:25 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:21:11 PM, Smithereens wrote:
What Apeiron is doing is wrong, but beware that you don't simply ignore what he has to say. If anyone takes issue with something you did, ignoring them turns this site into a rage-house of closed-minded bigots. We don't want that, so you should make sure any problems people take up with you are properly sorted out.

I don't have issues with someone voting on the basis of the debate it's self, but already telling me your going to vote against me because your simply butt-hurt about the way I voted is nonsense.
For instance, in my Iraq War debate Ron Paul didn't vote for me, I didn't have a problem with that, I never coerced him into changing his vote.
At the same time he didn't claim it was because of the way I previously voted either, it was on the debate it's self. Unlike this dumb@$$

Haha, I would wreck you in anything academic.
Smithereens
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5/17/2013 11:26:29 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:24:35 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

Trading votes violates the integrity of the site. Voting on a debate ought to be done regardless of external factors. No matter what the circumstances, the vote must be on the debate alone. This is the only way to ensure voting integrity.

Saying "I will vote for you if you vote for me" is unfair to the other debater and lowers the quality of the site as a whole. More subtle forms of doing this such as "I'll re-evaluate my vote if you re-evaluate yours also fall under the same blanket. It is not okay to do this.

Once a vote has been cast, I believe it should not be re-evaluated (some others disagree but it is always based on whether the voter thinks he misvoted). Doing a one for one trade causes the votes to be based on something other than the debate.

Imagine you were debating in real life with lay judges (maybe parents). What if one parent said to another, "I'll vote for your kid ABC if you vote for mine." Would you consider that fair? What if ABC was your opponent?

A lot of people need to get out of the mindset that this behavior is acceptable.

We first need a rule against it. Otherwise its just your opinion.
Music composition contest: http://www.debate.org...
Vulpes_Inculta
Posts: 42
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5/17/2013 11:27:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:20:15 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
That's the dumbest thing I've ever herd
he's already indicated in the message he's already voting for you before the debate is even over. Just because he worships your old account does not mean he's right by default.
This is blatant retributive voting, on the basis of something stupid he did in his own debate. Not.My.Problem. Besides even if I did take them away, he still wouldn't win.

1: Where did he indicate such a thing?
2: He doesn't worship my old account. His ode to me was simply a joke about how I reference him in my KCA debates.
3: Besides, when did I say the fact that he worships my old account means he's right?
4: Apeiron has never said that he'll recall his vote if you do the same. He's only asking if you can both agree to reconsider.
TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 11:28:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:23:46 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:20:15 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever herd,

How surprising, you're certainly not making it easy to consider you an intellectual.

And you are?? When have I ever made this claim exactly?


he's already indicated in the message he's already voting for you before the debate is even over.

More words into my message, I expressed interest in your guys' debate. You're doing that thing wherein you go beyond the evidence, once more. This then is anti-intellectualism. Well done.

Yeah .. after voting against me in not one but TWO debates in which I was 1) tied and 2) winning, to which both I am now losing, and then try to go about it by claiming if you rethink yours I'll rethink mine. And then threaten me with another debate? Hmmm ..... I wonder what your hinting at? The intent of the message is clear. and claiming I'm "anti-intellectual" because the basis of your voting is obviously for revenge is again blatantly incompetent.


This is blatant retributive voting, on the basis of something stupid he did in his own debate. Not.My.Problem. Besides even if I did take them away, he still wouldn't win.

I offered you a platform for discussing an impending debate I was hoping to offer you on the kalam. You, as an anti-intellectual, saw this as a domestic. Big surprise.

On what? Me changing my vote out of fear of you voting against me? please continue to tell me how much of an anti-intellectual I am ..
Thank you for voting!
Vulpes_Inculta
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5/17/2013 11:29:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:24:25 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At the same time he didn't claim it was because of the way I previously voted either, it was on the debate it's self. Unlike this dumb@$$

I'm sorry, it's hard to understand you when you're sucking on Hitchens's penis.
TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 11:30:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:25:45 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:24:25 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:21:11 PM, Smithereens wrote:
What Apeiron is doing is wrong, but beware that you don't simply ignore what he has to say. If anyone takes issue with something you did, ignoring them turns this site into a rage-house of closed-minded bigots. We don't want that, so you should make sure any problems people take up with you are properly sorted out.

I don't have issues with someone voting on the basis of the debate it's self, but already telling me your going to vote against me because your simply butt-hurt about the way I voted is nonsense.
For instance, in my Iraq War debate Ron Paul didn't vote for me, I didn't have a problem with that, I never coerced him into changing his vote.
At the same time he didn't claim it was because of the way I previously voted either, it was on the debate it's self. Unlike this dumb@$$

Haha, I would wreck you in anything academic.

HAHA! You willing to bet on that? I pick topic?
Thank you for voting!
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
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5/17/2013 11:31:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:26:29 PM, Smithereens wrote:

We first need a rule against it. Otherwise its just your opinion.

Well, it is part of DDO's "How to vote" article." From the article:

Remember, the basis for decision should NOT include:
- Conversation with any persons during or after the debate round.
- Comments made by other members of the site.


http://www.debate.org...
Vulpes_Inculta
Posts: 42
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5/17/2013 11:31:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:24:35 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

Trading votes violates the integrity of the site. Voting on a debate ought to be done regardless of external factors. No matter what the circumstances, the vote must be on the debate alone. This is the only way to ensure voting integrity.

Saying "I will vote for you if you vote for me" is unfair to the other debater and lowers the quality of the site as a whole. More subtle forms of doing this such as "I'll re-evaluate my vote if you re-evaluate yours also fall under the same blanket. It is not okay to do this.

Once a vote has been cast, I believe it should not be re-evaluated (some others disagree but it is always based on whether the voter thinks he misvoted). Doing a one for one trade causes the votes to be based on something other than the debate.

Imagine you were debating in real life with lay judges (maybe parents). What if one parent said to another, "I'll vote for your kid ABC if you vote for mine." Would you consider that fair? What if ABC was your opponent?

A lot of people need to get out of the mindset that this behavior is acceptable.

All of this assumes that Apeiron is trying to trade votes.

Apeiron is just saying that they should talk over their respective votes and see if there's anything they would change. None of it suggests that the conclusion has to be Apeiron withdrawing his vote, and Hitchens voting for Apeiron or withdrawing his vote.
TheHitchslap
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5/17/2013 11:32:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:29:42 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:24:25 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At the same time he didn't claim it was because of the way I previously voted either, it was on the debate it's self. Unlike this dumb@$$

I'm sorry, it's hard to understand you when you're sucking on Hitchens's penis.

I'm sorry, if I wanted lip from a little b!tch like you I'd unzip my pants.
Have a nice day.
Thank you for voting!
Vulpes_Inculta
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5/17/2013 11:33:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:32:03 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:29:42 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:24:25 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At the same time he didn't claim it was because of the way I previously voted either, it was on the debate it's self. Unlike this dumb@$$

I'm sorry, it's hard to understand you when you're sucking on Hitchens's penis.

I'm sorry, if I wanted lip from a little b!tch like you I'd unzip my pants.
Have a nice day.

Did I touch a nerve because I insulted the person you fantasize about? It's ok to have sexual dreams about dead British people, but you don't need to insult me because of it.
Apeiron
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5/17/2013 11:34:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 5/17/2013 11:28:58 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:23:46 PM, Apeiron wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:20:15 PM, TheHitchslap wrote:
At 5/17/2013 11:16:26 PM, Vulpes_Inculta wrote:
Apeiron is simply offering to reevaluate his vote, provided that you do the same. There's nothing wrong with that all.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever herd,

How surprising, you're certainly not making it easy to consider you an intellectual.

And you are?? When have I ever made this claim exactly?

On most days, yes.. I get paid for it at least.



he's already indicated in the message he's already voting for you before the debate is even over.

More words into my message, I expressed interest in your guys' debate. You're doing that thing wherein you go beyond the evidence, once more. This then is anti-intellectualism. Well done.

Yeah .. after voting against me in not one but TWO debates in which I was 1) tied and 2) winning, to which both I am now losing, and then try to go about it by claiming if you rethink yours I'll rethink mine. And then threaten me with another debate? Hmmm ..... I wonder what your hinting at? The intent of the message is clear. and claiming I'm "anti-intellectual" because the basis of your voting is obviously for revenge is again blatantly incompetent.

It's, again, anti-intellectual to base your assumptions of my intent off of anything other than what was said. You can take it as a hint all you like, that doesn't mean that's what my intent was.. My intent was and still is to open up discussion and possibly future interaction regarding a debate on the KCA.



This is blatant retributive voting, on the basis of something stupid he did in his own debate. Not.My.Problem. Besides even if I did take them away, he still wouldn't win.

I offered you a platform for discussing an impending debate I was hoping to offer you on the kalam. You, as an anti-intellectual, saw this as a domestic. Big surprise.

On what? Me changing my vote out of fear of you voting against me? please continue to tell me how much of an anti-intellectual I am ..

You are, and you'll most likely; stay that way unless you do exactly as I say, 1) justify your assertion that I intended to barter and not discuss votes, 2) be less of a Dwight and change your profile picture to someone less hideous. You're breaking the ugly law. That warrants 2 bags over your head in your next profile pic. The ugly law.