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A tournament for DDO Elites

Blade-of-Truth
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4/27/2014 4:22:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I am asking this out of pure curiosity. Has there ever been a tournament held for only members with an Elo of 5,000 or higher?

The thought occurred to me during an exchange I was having with a fellow member and it struck me as something that I think would be extremely beneficial to lesser members. They'd get to see how the higher ranked members carry themselves in debates and it would allow the elite members to prove themselves amongst their peers.

So, has this ever happened before? And if not, what is the likelihood that such a tournament would come to fruition?
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Blade-of-Truth
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4/27/2014 4:24:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Before anyone says anything, I'd count myself as one of those lesser members who could potentially gain a great amount from watching such a tournament unfold.
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philochristos
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4/27/2014 4:24:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
You could always propose the debate on the DDO main forum and see if you can get people to sign up for it.

I'd like to see a single elimination tournament featuring only people who have a perfect win record with no ties or losses, and at least 15 debates.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
Blade-of-Truth
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4/27/2014 4:28:09 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/27/2014 4:24:35 PM, philochristos wrote:
You could always propose the debate on the DDO main forum and see if you can get people to sign up for it.

I'd like to see a single elimination tournament featuring only people who have a perfect win record with no ties or losses, and at least 15 debates.

That is another really great idea for a tournament. I was cautious about posting this in the main forum without having some form of pre-determined structure that those higher Elo members would agree with. With summer right around the corner, I know that I'm personally planning on doing the Pokemon Badge system challenge. Overall, I think we have a great opportunity to get some awesome tournaments going. I'll propose both tournaments (one for elites, one for undefeated members) once I can form a structure and have the time to organize such things!
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Romanii
Posts: 4,851
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4/27/2014 9:15:21 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/27/2014 4:24:35 PM, philochristos wrote:
You could always propose the debate on the DDO main forum and see if you can get people to sign up for it.

I'd like to see a single elimination tournament featuring only people who have a perfect win record with no ties or losses, and at least 15 debates.

So far that would be... (out of the active members on the site)

-Sargon
-Blade-of-Truth
-Ragnar
-Maikuru

Not really enough for a tournament...
Blade-of-Truth
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4/29/2014 5:39:01 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/27/2014 9:15:21 PM, Romanii wrote:
At 4/27/2014 4:24:35 PM, philochristos wrote:
You could always propose the debate on the DDO main forum and see if you can get people to sign up for it.

I'd like to see a single elimination tournament featuring only people who have a perfect win record with no ties or losses, and at least 15 debates.

So far that would be... (out of the active members on the site)

-Sargon
-Blade-of-Truth
-Ragnar
-Maikuru

Not really enough for a tournament...

True. Although the elite tournament would still be viable! I would really enjoy seeing the 5,000 + Elo members taking each other on.
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Romanii
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4/29/2014 5:41:50 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/29/2014 5:39:01 PM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 4/27/2014 9:15:21 PM, Romanii wrote:
At 4/27/2014 4:24:35 PM, philochristos wrote:
You could always propose the debate on the DDO main forum and see if you can get people to sign up for it.

I'd like to see a single elimination tournament featuring only people who have a perfect win record with no ties or losses, and at least 15 debates.

So far that would be... (out of the active members on the site)

-Sargon
-Blade-of-Truth
-Ragnar
-Maikuru

Not really enough for a tournament...

True. Although the elite tournament would still be viable! I would really enjoy seeing the 5,000 + Elo members taking each other on.

We could do that this summer. I know that bluesteel is already planning on going against Roy and Mikal, and Thett has also said that he wants to do a lot of debating in the summer, so a lot of them would probably be open to the idea, I think.
ClassicRobert
Posts: 2,487
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4/29/2014 6:06:40 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
You're conflating elo with elite status. Lately, elo has started to be more of an indicator of how many debates a slightly above average debater has done against noobs. STALIN, for example, has an elo over 5000, and I don't think anybody who's read his debates would consider him elite. Many would also argue, for example, that Raisor is right up there as a close second to Bluesteel, and his elo is far below 5000.
Debate me: Economic decision theory should be adjusted to include higher-order preferences for non-normative purposes http://www.debate.org...

Do you really believe that? Or not? If you believe it, you should man up and defend it in a debate. -RoyLatham

My Pet Fish is such a Douche- NiamC

It's an app to meet friends and stuff, sort of like an adult club penguin- Thett3, describing Tinder
Blade-of-Truth
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4/29/2014 8:04:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/29/2014 6:06:40 PM, ClassicRobert wrote:
You're conflating elo with elite status. Lately, elo has started to be more of an indicator of how many debates a slightly above average debater has done against noobs. STALIN, for example, has an elo over 5000, and I don't think anybody who's read his debates would consider him elite. Many would also argue, for example, that Raisor is right up there as a close second to Bluesteel, and his elo is far below 5000.

So how can we get an organized list of the top tier debaters so that I may organize a tournament for them this summer?

I believe there is alot that can be gained from seeing the best really go at it. It sets the bar higher for those watching, and might be good references in the future for newer members to see a proper debate structure in use. I know I'd gain from seeing a tournament like that. But as you said, Elo might not be the best determinant for who qualifies as elite or top tier. What would you propose as a better system? Perhaps if you end up with the time you might organize something since you'd have a better understanding of who qualifies as elite or top tier?
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ClassicRobert
Posts: 2,487
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4/29/2014 8:05:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/29/2014 8:04:33 PM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 4/29/2014 6:06:40 PM, ClassicRobert wrote:
You're conflating elo with elite status. Lately, elo has started to be more of an indicator of how many debates a slightly above average debater has done against noobs. STALIN, for example, has an elo over 5000, and I don't think anybody who's read his debates would consider him elite. Many would also argue, for example, that Raisor is right up there as a close second to Bluesteel, and his elo is far below 5000.

So how can we get an organized list of the top tier debaters so that I may organize a tournament for them this summer?

I believe there is alot that can be gained from seeing the best really go at it. It sets the bar higher for those watching, and might be good references in the future for newer members to see a proper debate structure in use. I know I'd gain from seeing a tournament like that. But as you said, Elo might not be the best determinant for who qualifies as elite or top tier. What would you propose as a better system? Perhaps if you end up with the time you might organize something since you'd have a better understanding of who qualifies as elite or top tier?

I'd be willing to help out, sure. The best metric, really, is just reading people's debates.
Debate me: Economic decision theory should be adjusted to include higher-order preferences for non-normative purposes http://www.debate.org...

Do you really believe that? Or not? If you believe it, you should man up and defend it in a debate. -RoyLatham

My Pet Fish is such a Douche- NiamC

It's an app to meet friends and stuff, sort of like an adult club penguin- Thett3, describing Tinder
Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,020
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4/29/2014 8:09:35 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/29/2014 8:05:48 PM, ClassicRobert wrote:
At 4/29/2014 8:04:33 PM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 4/29/2014 6:06:40 PM, ClassicRobert wrote:
You're conflating elo with elite status. Lately, elo has started to be more of an indicator of how many debates a slightly above average debater has done against noobs. STALIN, for example, has an elo over 5000, and I don't think anybody who's read his debates would consider him elite. Many would also argue, for example, that Raisor is right up there as a close second to Bluesteel, and his elo is far below 5000.

So how can we get an organized list of the top tier debaters so that I may organize a tournament for them this summer?

I believe there is alot that can be gained from seeing the best really go at it. It sets the bar higher for those watching, and might be good references in the future for newer members to see a proper debate structure in use. I know I'd gain from seeing a tournament like that. But as you said, Elo might not be the best determinant for who qualifies as elite or top tier. What would you propose as a better system? Perhaps if you end up with the time you might organize something since you'd have a better understanding of who qualifies as elite or top tier?

I'd be willing to help out, sure. The best metric, really, is just reading people's debates.

Okay. I'll compile a list throughout the next few weeks while reviewing people from top down on the debate leaderboards. If I don't go insane in the process, I'll PM you a list of like the top 20 and get your opinion on those individuals before moving forward by contacting them for possible participation.
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