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Why do people smoke?

000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon), and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
ShabShoral
Posts: 3,242
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12/11/2015 6:29:52 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
Rebellion against the inherent absurdity and bankruptcy of categorical imperatives.
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birdlandmemories
Posts: 4,141
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12/11/2015 6:49:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon), and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.

A lot of people I know who smoke see it as a stress reliever. That may be part of the reason.
Ashton
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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12/11/2015 11:27:10 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 6:49:31 AM, birdlandmemories wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon), and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.

A lot of people I know who smoke see it as a stress reliever. That may be part of the reason.

It's only viewed that way after the addiction sets in
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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12/11/2015 11:27:13 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
Why do people smoke weed or take drugs is a better question. Any arguments against smoking could be multiplied by 100 for weed and drugs.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Romanii
Posts: 4,863
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12/11/2015 1:50:31 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 11:27:13 AM, sadolite wrote:
Why do people smoke weed or take drugs is a better question. Any arguments against smoking could be multiplied by 100 for weed and drugs.

Not really... if I was forced to do any drug, I would definitely pick LSD or marijuana over tobacco.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/11/2015 4:52:28 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 6:29:52 AM, ShabShoral wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
Rebellion against the inherent absurdity and bankruptcy of categorical imperatives.

lol categorical imperatives are absurd indeed,... but the angle I'm taking is really one informed by the concept of self-interest; how does one rebel against himself/herself?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Furyan5
Posts: 1,228
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12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/11/2015 5:30:46 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?

lol well none of the other things you listed are as likely to kill you or make you suffer over many years. Also, presumably, you don't come to enjoy it until you've put in effort; smoke is, at once, repulsive to all the senses. So the question isn't why you continue to smoke, but why, knowing the enormous costs, you decided to initiate the habit -- actually train yourself to get over the initial repulsion in the first place.

It's not a stupid question if you understand what's being asked.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
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12/11/2015 5:55:49 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon), and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.

A lot of the time people do it because peer pressure coerce them into doing it, because they belong to a social group where smoking brings 'prestige' (for the lack of a better word - I'm borrowing the sense from sociolinguistics).
The thing is, I hate relativism. I hate relativism more than I hate everything else, excepting, maybe, fibreglass powerboats... What it overlooks, to put it briefly and crudely, is the fixed structure of human nature. - Jerry Fodor

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http://www.debate.org...

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Furyan5
Posts: 1,228
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12/11/2015 6:43:04 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 5:30:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?

lol well none of the other things you listed are as likely to kill you or make you suffer over many years. Also, presumably, you don't come to enjoy it until you've put in effort; smoke is, at once, repulsive to all the senses. So the question isn't why you continue to smoke, but why, knowing the enormous costs, you decided to initiate the habit -- actually train yourself to get over the initial repulsion in the first place.

It's not a stupid question if you understand what's being asked.

It's a stupid question if you don't live your life in fear of dying. I made the decision years ago that I would rather live 50 years doing whatever I enjoy than live a hundred years doing what other people want me to do. A person can slip on a piece of soap in the shower and crack their skull or be walking on the pavement and get hit by a drunk driver. Dying is inevitable, but enjoying life is a choice. A life lived in fear is a life wasted.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/11/2015 6:53:04 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 6:43:04 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:30:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?

lol well none of the other things you listed are as likely to kill you or make you suffer over many years. Also, presumably, you don't come to enjoy it until you've put in effort; smoke is, at once, repulsive to all the senses. So the question isn't why you continue to smoke, but why, knowing the enormous costs, you decided to initiate the habit -- actually train yourself to get over the initial repulsion in the first place.

It's not a stupid question if you understand what's being asked.

It's a stupid question if you don't live your life in fear of dying. I made the decision years ago that I would rather live 50 years doing whatever I enjoy than live a hundred years doing what other people want me to do. A person can slip on a piece of soap in the shower and crack their skull or be walking on the pavement and get hit by a drunk driver. Dying is inevitable, but enjoying life is a choice. A life lived in fear is a life wasted.

That's all absolutely correct, but the horror of smoking isn't entirely about dying; it's about poor health and the shackles of addicgtion, a gradual and excruciating physical and mental decline which diminishes the very quality of life you value so highly. It's not as though you're just sacrificing longevity for pleasure and good quality life. Rather, you're sacrificing pleasure and good quality life in the longer term for pleasure in short meaningless bursts of time. And this is a severely myopic exchange.

There's no point in living for the sake of living, you definitely have to enjoy yourself. But addiction (an immediate to intermediate harm) isn't enjoyable and respiratory illness, accelerated aging, heart disease and cancer (longer term harms) are not enjoyable...So the trade-off you think you've made by smoking isn't really accurate. You've made one that's far more destructive to your self-interest and happiness.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
thett3
Posts: 14,378
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12/11/2015 7:06:45 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

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"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

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"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Furyan5
Posts: 1,228
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12/11/2015 7:44:27 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 6:53:04 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 6:43:04 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:30:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?

lol well none of the other things you listed are as likely to kill you or make you suffer over many years. Also, presumably, you don't come to enjoy it until you've put in effort; smoke is, at once, repulsive to all the senses. So the question isn't why you continue to smoke, but why, knowing the enormous costs, you decided to initiate the habit -- actually train yourself to get over the initial repulsion in the first place.

It's not a stupid question if you understand what's being asked.

It's a stupid question if you don't live your life in fear of dying. I made the decision years ago that I would rather live 50 years doing whatever I enjoy than live a hundred years doing what other people want me to do. A person can slip on a piece of soap in the shower and crack their skull or be walking on the pavement and get hit by a drunk driver. Dying is inevitable, but enjoying life is a choice. A life lived in fear is a life wasted.

That's all absolutely correct, but the horror of smoking isn't entirely about dying; it's about poor health and the shackles of addicgtion, a gradual and excruciating physical and mental decline which diminishes the very quality of life you value so highly. It's not as though you're just sacrificing longevity for pleasure and good quality life. Rather, you're sacrificing pleasure and good quality life in the longer term for pleasure in short meaningless bursts of time. And this is a severely myopic exchange.

There's no point in living for the sake of living, you definitely have to enjoy yourself. But addiction (an immediate to intermediate harm) isn't enjoyable and respiratory illness, accelerated aging, heart disease and cancer (longer term harms) are not enjoyable...So the trade-off you think you've made by smoking isn't really accurate. You've made one that's far more destructive to your self-interest and happiness.

You seem to think tomorrow is a given. In time you will learn its not. I'm almost 50 and in the last 25 years I have taken 1 sick day from work. I don't drink water, I live on fast food, I drink 12 cups of coffee a day on average and don't exercise at all, yet I look 30 and my blood pressure and sugar level is normal. I have had friends who don't smoke and live healthy lifestyles drop dead of a stroke or die in accidents. My decision may not be right for everyone and you may not like it, but I don't give a shyt. It's my life. Contact me in another 20 years if we both alive and I may change my opinion. But I doubt it.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/11/2015 7:52:11 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 7:44:27 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
At 12/11/2015 6:53:04 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 6:43:04 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:30:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?

lol well none of the other things you listed are as likely to kill you or make you suffer over many years. Also, presumably, you don't come to enjoy it until you've put in effort; smoke is, at once, repulsive to all the senses. So the question isn't why you continue to smoke, but why, knowing the enormous costs, you decided to initiate the habit -- actually train yourself to get over the initial repulsion in the first place.

It's not a stupid question if you understand what's being asked.

It's a stupid question if you don't live your life in fear of dying. I made the decision years ago that I would rather live 50 years doing whatever I enjoy than live a hundred years doing what other people want me to do. A person can slip on a piece of soap in the shower and crack their skull or be walking on the pavement and get hit by a drunk driver. Dying is inevitable, but enjoying life is a choice. A life lived in fear is a life wasted.

That's all absolutely correct, but the horror of smoking isn't entirely about dying; it's about poor health and the shackles of addicgtion, a gradual and excruciating physical and mental decline which diminishes the very quality of life you value so highly. It's not as though you're just sacrificing longevity for pleasure and good quality life. Rather, you're sacrificing pleasure and good quality life in the longer term for pleasure in short meaningless bursts of time. And this is a severely myopic exchange.

There's no point in living for the sake of living, you definitely have to enjoy yourself. But addiction (an immediate to intermediate harm) isn't enjoyable and respiratory illness, accelerated aging, heart disease and cancer (longer term harms) are not enjoyable...So the trade-off you think you've made by smoking isn't really accurate. You've made one that's far more destructive to your self-interest and happiness.

You seem to think tomorrow is a given. In time you will learn its not. I'm almost 50 and in the last 25 years I have taken 1 sick day from work. I don't drink water, I live on fast food, I drink 12 cups of coffee a day on average and don't exercise at all, yet I look 30 and my blood pressure and sugar level is normal. I have had friends who don't smoke and live healthy lifestyles drop dead of a stroke or die in accidents. My decision may not be right for everyone and you may not like it, but I don't give a shyt. It's my life. Contact me in another 20 years if we both alive and I may change my opinion. But I doubt it.

If you say so. There's a difference however between doing things to sabotage your health (in effect guaranteeing a meeting with disaster), and having disaster happen or not happen by chance.

In any case, the function of my argument isn't to persuade you of anything, but to attack the rational basis of choosing to smoke, and expose it for the all-around dumb choice that it is.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Furyan5
Posts: 1,228
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12/11/2015 8:37:02 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 7:52:11 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 7:44:27 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
At 12/11/2015 6:53:04 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 6:43:04 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:30:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:24:20 PM, Furyan5 wrote:
For the same reason I have sex, eat pizza, swim in the ocean, ride a motorbike and a thousand other things I do. Because I enjoy it. My turn. Why do you ask stupid questions?

lol well none of the other things you listed are as likely to kill you or make you suffer over many years. Also, presumably, you don't come to enjoy it until you've put in effort; smoke is, at once, repulsive to all the senses. So the question isn't why you continue to smoke, but why, knowing the enormous costs, you decided to initiate the habit -- actually train yourself to get over the initial repulsion in the first place.

It's not a stupid question if you understand what's being asked.

It's a stupid question if you don't live your life in fear of dying. I made the decision years ago that I would rather live 50 years doing whatever I enjoy than live a hundred years doing what other people want me to do. A person can slip on a piece of soap in the shower and crack their skull or be walking on the pavement and get hit by a drunk driver. Dying is inevitable, but enjoying life is a choice. A life lived in fear is a life wasted.

That's all absolutely correct, but the horror of smoking isn't entirely about dying; it's about poor health and the shackles of addicgtion, a gradual and excruciating physical and mental decline which diminishes the very quality of life you value so highly. It's not as though you're just sacrificing longevity for pleasure and good quality life. Rather, you're sacrificing pleasure and good quality life in the longer term for pleasure in short meaningless bursts of time. And this is a severely myopic exchange.

There's no point in living for the sake of living, you definitely have to enjoy yourself. But addiction (an immediate to intermediate harm) isn't enjoyable and respiratory illness, accelerated aging, heart disease and cancer (longer term harms) are not enjoyable...So the trade-off you think you've made by smoking isn't really accurate. You've made one that's far more destructive to your self-interest and happiness.

You seem to think tomorrow is a given. In time you will learn its not. I'm almost 50 and in the last 25 years I have taken 1 sick day from work. I don't drink water, I live on fast food, I drink 12 cups of coffee a day on average and don't exercise at all, yet I look 30 and my blood pressure and sugar level is normal. I have had friends who don't smoke and live healthy lifestyles drop dead of a stroke or die in accidents. My decision may not be right for everyone and you may not like it, but I don't give a shyt. It's my life. Contact me in another 20 years if we both alive and I may change my opinion. But I doubt it.

If you say so. There's a difference however between doing things to sabotage your health (in effect guaranteeing a meeting with disaster), and having disaster happen or not happen by chance.

In any case, the function of my argument isn't to persuade you of anything, but to attack the rational basis of choosing to smoke, and expose it for the all-around dumb choice that it is.

Sorry to burst your little bubble, but nothing in life is guaranteed. My dad is 83 and smokes like a chimney. The only health issue he has is piles. Your question was, why do people smoke. The answer, I smoke because I enjoy smoking. In your opinion that's dumb, but as I clearly stated, your opinion is worthless. You are clearly miserable because you don't enjoy life and want others to be miserable too. Lol I actually pity people like you.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/11/2015 8:38:25 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
lol alrighty then
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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12/11/2015 8:38:55 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
Because I can, and to piss off people like you

But I drive really slow in the ultra fast lane
While people behind me are going insane

I use public toilets and I piss on the seat
I walk around in the summer time saying "how about this heat?"

Sometimes I park in handicapped spaces
While handicapped people make handicapped faces

You know what I'm gonna do?
I'm gonna get myself a 1967 Cadillac Eldorado convertible
Hot pink, with whale skin hubcaps
And all leather cow interior
And big brown baby seal eyes for head lights (yeah)
And I'm gonna drive in that baby at 115 miles per hour
Gettin' 1 mile per gallon,
Sucking down Quarter Pounder cheeseburgers from McDonald's
In the old fashioned non-biodegradable styrofoam containers
And when I'm done sucking down those greaseball burgers
I'm gonna wipe my mouth with the American flag
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
mrsatan
Posts: 429
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12/11/2015 9:11:18 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:38:55 PM, jharry wrote:
Because I can, and to piss off people like you

But I drive really slow in the ultra fast lane
While people behind me are going insane



I use public toilets and I piss on the seat
I walk around in the summer time saying "how about this heat?"


Sometimes I park in handicapped spaces
While handicapped people make handicapped faces



You know what I'm gonna do?
I'm gonna get myself a 1967 Cadillac Eldorado convertible
Hot pink, with whale skin hubcaps
And all leather cow interior
And big brown baby seal eyes for head lights (yeah)
And I'm gonna drive in that baby at 115 miles per hour
Gettin' 1 mile per gallon,
Sucking down Quarter Pounder cheeseburgers from McDonald's
In the old fashioned non-biodegradable styrofoam containers
And when I'm done sucking down those greaseball burgers
I'm gonna wipe my mouth with the American flag

Lol, I love that song. Denis Leary... Best ***hole ever.
To say one has free will, to have chosen other than they did, is to say they have will over their will... Will over the will they have over their will... Will over the will they have over the will they have over their will, etc... It's utter nonsense.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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12/11/2015 9:26:29 PM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 9:11:18 PM, mrsatan wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:38:55 PM, jharry wrote:
Because I can, and to piss off people like you

But I drive really slow in the ultra fast lane
While people behind me are going insane



I use public toilets and I piss on the seat
I walk around in the summer time saying "how about this heat?"


Sometimes I park in handicapped spaces
While handicapped people make handicapped faces



You know what I'm gonna do?
I'm gonna get myself a 1967 Cadillac Eldorado convertible
Hot pink, with whale skin hubcaps
And all leather cow interior
And big brown baby seal eyes for head lights (yeah)
And I'm gonna drive in that baby at 115 miles per hour
Gettin' 1 mile per gallon,
Sucking down Quarter Pounder cheeseburgers from McDonald's
In the old fashioned non-biodegradable styrofoam containers
And when I'm done sucking down those greaseball burgers
I'm gonna wipe my mouth with the American flag

Lol, I love that song. Denis Leary... Best ***hole ever.

Me too.....and to anybody that doesn't like it

There ain't a got damn thing anybody can do about it
You know why, because we've got the bomb, that's why
Two words, nuclear weapons, OK?
Russia, Germany, Romania, they can have all the democracy they want
They can have a big democracy cakewalk
Right through the middle of Tiananmen Square
And it won't make a lick of difference
Because we've got the bombs, OK?
John Wayne's not dead, he's frozen
And as soon as we find a cure for cancer
We're gonna thaw out the Duke and he's gonna be pretty pissed off
You know why
Have you ever taken a cold shower?
Well multiply that by 15 million times
That's how pissed off the Duke's gonna be!
I'm gonna get the Duke, and John Cassavetes
And Lee Marvin, and Sam Peckinpah, and a case of whiskey
And drive down to Texas and
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
mrsatan
Posts: 429
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12/12/2015 12:47:09 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon), and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.

Typically, I would guess, its a combination of social environment, curiosity, and either a flippancy for the risks, or a decision that the risks are worth it. That initial cigarette has a pretty intense effect, or it did for me, at least. Lasted a surprising amount of time, too. That of course wanes as your body builds a tolerance. Smoke too much and you don't get it at all, but abstaining for a significant period can bring it back.

There are pros and cons to smoking. Just because your values place the cons higher than the pros doesn't mean they are actually higher. In my case, I was under the impression that smoking is a stress reliever, which is something I very much needed. Smoking seemed worth the risk, and it did the job I wanted it to do. It still does, and it's a decision that I don't regret in the slightest.
To say one has free will, to have chosen other than they did, is to say they have will over their will... Will over the will they have over their will... Will over the will they have over the will they have over their will, etc... It's utter nonsense.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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12/12/2015 12:52:18 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/12/2015 12:47:09 AM, mrsatan wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon), and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.

Typically, I would guess, its a combination of social environment, curiosity, and either a flippancy for the risks, or a decision that the risks are worth it. That initial cigarette has a pretty intense effect, or it did for me, at least. Lasted a surprising amount of time, too. That of course wanes as your body builds a tolerance. Smoke too much and you don't get it at all, but abstaining for a significant period can bring it back.

There are pros and cons to smoking. Just because your values place the cons higher than the pros doesn't mean they are actually higher. In my case, I was under the impression that smoking is a stress reliever, which is something I very much needed. Smoking seemed worth the risk, and it did the job I wanted it to do. It still does, and it's a decision that I don't regret in the slightest.

That's a fair response. It just seems to make more sense, though, that you would find a stress-relieving alternative with essentially no cons, as there are many.

But I'm starting to get the sense that smoking may be mostly hereditary or at least dependent on social environment. Because it really has to be something that seems "normal" for someone to consider it.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
ShabShoral
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12/12/2015 12:52:54 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 4:52:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/11/2015 6:29:52 AM, ShabShoral wrote:
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
Rebellion against the inherent absurdity and bankruptcy of categorical imperatives.

lol categorical imperatives are absurd indeed,... but the angle I'm taking is really one informed by the concept of self-interest; how does one rebel against himself/herself?

By rebelling against your supposed argument against such rebellion, obviously.
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zmikecuber
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12/12/2015 3:29:08 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/11/2015 5:00:50 AM, 000ike wrote:
It's difficult for me to fathom. Most habits are formed by immoderate engagement in an activity whose necessity is otherwise exigent (e.g. overeating, overdosing on prescription medication). But this is a particularly unnatural habit - one that presumably requires conscious and deliberate effort. How exactly can someone be fully aware of the health risk (and risk is really too mild an adjective; it's not a matter of if it kills you but how soon),

This is absolutely not true.

and yet exert himself or herself, assiduously to become dependent on something lethal? What's worse, is that these people don't just voluntarily consign themselves to addiction and poor health but the social stigma that rightfully accompanies this foul habit -- contaminating the air left and right and provoking the rancor of passersby.

Second hand smoke is not nearly as evil as it's cracked up to be.


Is it stupidity? A collapse of rational judgment? Or curiosity? General flippancy toward the risk? Or perhaps norms of their particular social environment?

I just don't get it, and time and again, I'm reminded just how odd and unfathomable this behavior is.

Because it's very enjoyable. It calms you and gives you energy at the same time, while helping you focus and reduce stress. Not to mention, the smell of smoke is very pleasant.

I don't smoke often, but I use smoke-less tobacco on a regular basis. I really just enjoy everything about it. I enjoy having something that tastes good in my cheek, the bitterly pleasant flavor, the juices, the spitting, and the comfort it gives.

Sure, it's unhealthy, and I've been trying to quit, but it's really not that hard to understand. It's like anything else that you enjoy that isn't good for your health.
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BlueDreams
Posts: 199
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12/12/2015 3:41:44 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
Why do people smoke...what? We have to be specific here. You can smoke a variety of things. You can smoke crack, weed, or salvia. The implications and arguments would be different from case to case.
Romanii
Posts: 4,863
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12/12/2015 3:46:45 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/12/2015 3:41:44 AM, BlueDreams wrote:
Why do people smoke...what? We have to be specific here. You can smoke a variety of things. You can smoke crack, weed, or salvia. The implications and arguments would be different from case to case.

Based on context, I think he's referring to tobacco.
000ike
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12/12/2015 4:01:27 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/12/2015 3:41:44 AM, BlueDreams wrote:
Why do people smoke...what? We have to be specific here. You can smoke a variety of things. You can smoke crack, weed, or salvia. The implications and arguments would be different from case to case.

I am indeed chiefly referring to tobacco. But please feel free to explain those other ones too ... they perplex me as well.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
BlueDreams
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12/12/2015 4:27:59 AM
Posted: 12 months ago
At 12/12/2015 4:01:27 AM, 000ike wrote:
At 12/12/2015 3:41:44 AM, BlueDreams wrote:
Why do people smoke...what? We have to be specific here. You can smoke a variety of things. You can smoke crack, weed, or salvia. The implications and arguments would be different from case to case.

I am indeed chiefly referring to tobacco. But please feel free to explain those other ones too ... they perplex me as well.

Some people who smoke marijuana do so because they believe the benefits outweigh the drawbacks.