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Handcuffing at school

jharry
Posts: 4,984
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6/15/2011 9:35:47 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/15/2011 9:30:54 PM, Rob1_Billion wrote:
http://www.care2.com...

Does this really happen? I can't believe it...

Yep. There were several times when I should have been handcuffed at school. Now they generally have an officer assigned to each school, around where I live anyway.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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6/15/2011 11:03:51 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/15/2011 9:35:47 PM, jharry wrote:
At 6/15/2011 9:30:54 PM, Rob1_Billion wrote:
http://www.care2.com...

Does this really happen? I can't believe it...

Yep. There were several times when I should have been handcuffed at school. Now they generally have an officer assigned to each school, around where I live anyway.

What... to implement the cuffing?
kfc
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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6/17/2011 9:00:41 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/16/2011 12:40:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
If you cant punish a child by law then restraint is the only alternative.

... an alternative which will be abused. This article wasn't about kids, physically out of control, needing to be restrained. It's about kids wearing the wrong color shoes and getting hand-cuffed to a pole. The reason why kids shouldn't be physically punished or restrained is because this is what happens. We have school personel who will abuse the privilege.

I hate to say it, but the people I'm most concerned about are Christians in this regard. They have peculiar ideas about what it means to misbehave, based on peculiar metaphysical and moral beliefs (which aren't supported at all by Christ, IMO), and when you mix these beliefs into an institutional setting, it's a recipe for disaster. Southern schools are notoriously Christianized and is it any surprise that's where these examples come from?
kfc
Cliff.Stamp
Posts: 2,169
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6/17/2011 9:10:47 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/17/2011 9:00:41 AM, Rob1_Billion wrote:

The reason why kids shouldn't be physically punished or restrained is because this is what happens.

What would you suggest when the kids are acting out and creating a disturbance and otherwise not following school policy?
mongeese
Posts: 5,387
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6/17/2011 9:38:08 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/17/2011 9:00:41 AM, Rob1_Billion wrote:

I hate to say it, but the people I'm most concerned about are Christians in this regard. They have peculiar ideas about what it means to misbehave, based on peculiar metaphysical and moral beliefs (which aren't supported at all by Christ, IMO), and when you mix these beliefs into an institutional setting, it's a recipe for disaster. Southern schools are notoriously Christianized and is it any surprise that's where these examples come from?

I can't think of any Christian justification for handcuffing a kid for wearing the wrong color shoes.

On "Stossel," a little kid was throwing a tantrum, but her teacher couldn't physically touch her for fear of a lawsuit, so after a few minutes she called in the police to handcuff the child and take here away.
mongoose
Posts: 3,500
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6/20/2011 12:03:06 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Wait... are they not allowed to have scissors any more?
It is odd when one's capacity for compassion is measured not in what he is willing to do by his own time, effort, and property, but what he will force others to do with their own property instead.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,313
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6/27/2011 12:35:34 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/17/2011 9:00:41 AM, Rob1_Billion wrote:
At 6/16/2011 12:40:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
If you cant punish a child by law then restraint is the only alternative.

... an alternative which will be abused. This article wasn't about kids, physically out of control, needing to be restrained. It's about kids wearing the wrong color shoes and getting hand-cuffed to a pole. The reason why kids shouldn't be physically punished or restrained is because this is what happens. We have school personel who will abuse the privilege.

I hate to say it, but the people I'm most concerned about are Christians in this regard. They have peculiar ideas about what it means to misbehave, based on peculiar metaphysical and moral beliefs (which aren't supported at all by Christ, IMO), and when you mix these beliefs into an institutional setting, it's a recipe for disaster. Southern schools are notoriously Christianized and is it any surprise that's where these examples come from?

This situation only exists because of the ridiculous boosts of social rights to minors.
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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6/27/2011 2:10:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/27/2011 12:35:34 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
This situation only exists because of the ridiculous boosts of social rights to minors.

So we're going to have to use force against them somehow, if not in the form of physical abuse then by neglect.

When I was in fifth grade, my friend Ernie Perkins flipped off the teacher behind his back while he was in the back of the room. James Williams, a taddle-tale and a hugepussy, raised his hand and told him. Mr. Souza looked at Ernie and said "did you do that?" Ernie was a liar and a scumbag, and thought he could talk his way out of it. "I did this" he said. Ernie held up his ring-finger, obviously ignorant of the spirit of the gesture, as well as the fact that his previous history of deceit and misbehavior would implicate him anyway. Mr. Souza said "that's close enough, isn't it. Come here." Mr. Souza beckoned Ernie over with his finger. Ernie walked to the back of the room and stood in front of Mr. Souza. Mr. Souza, unable to comprehend the level of indignation of someone like Ernie, lost control of himself. He grabbed Ernie by the scruff of his shirt, swung him around 180 degrees, and slammed him up against the wall while berating him for a few moments. He put Ernie down and Ernie walked to his desk, shaken up and humiliated. As Ernie walked by my desk he mumbled something about having Mr. Souza jumped by his boys (Ernie like to maintain that he had gang-members in Providence that would stick up for him, but we all knew he was full of isht).

Mr. Souza was a good teacher. He had a good teaching style, was (usually) patient and was good at disciplining kids, in the sense that he would like to try to instill a sense of responsibility for our actions in us instead of just punishing. Mr. Souza fvcked up bad that day, though. Fate would have it that the legal system would not be brought to bear on him because Ernie was a criminal and not the type of person to invoke the law to his own advantage. If that had been any other kid then Mr. Souza would probably have seen his entire career crumble before his eyes. Despite his skill and care all these years of being an effective teacher, one of the 'good' ones, he would never have been able to be hired again with the stain of a physical abuse charge against him on his permanent record.

Furthermore, Ernie deserved what Mr. Souza did. Ernie doesn't value things like grades, criminal records, or other conventional non-violent means of discipline. Ernie knew burglary and that was about it. So in reality, Mr. Souza really didn't have much of a choice in the matter... that is, provided that he was genuinely interested in trying to shake some sense into Ernie through the only means which he could possibly manage.

So sometimes force is necessary against children. There's no other way to teach them sometimes, especially in extreme cases like Ernie where the existing scruples are so weak that you cannot hope to appeal to them. With current laws in place, good teachers like Mr. Souza can have their hands tied, restricting their effectiveness, or can even be destroyed by an understandable infraction like the one I just described. This is not good... at the same time, however, giving the green light to schools to use violence against children seems even worse. If there were only "good" teachers in the schools, then we wouldn't have anything to worry about. Unfortunately, Mr. Souza is the exception, not the rule. Many teachers and principles have warped senses of justice; they are unable to tell disobediance from evil.
kfc
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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6/28/2011 8:36:37 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/28/2011 7:28:57 AM, Thaddeus wrote:
James Williams is a massive douche.

He was this skinny black kid who physically resembled Steve Urkel. He was a very cowardly type, the type of kid that would say something snotty and then cower in a corner or tell a teacher the second you turned on him. He left town after elementary school, and I caught back up with him on facebook recently. He's got all these pics of himself like he's kanye west up there... and he talks like he is a thug. I reminded him of this story and he wrote "but I'm on the no snitchin-campaign now!... Apparently he is trying to maintain that he's hardcore now... I wish I could reach through the computer and hand him one just one more time...
kfc
David-Duke
Posts: 102
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6/28/2011 10:50:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/15/2011 9:30:54 PM, Rob1_Billion wrote:
http://www.care2.com...

Does this really happen? I can't believe it...

Yea...the Southern Poverty Law Center...I know of them extremely well, unfortunately.

Maybe the Southern Poverty Law Center should notice that its an "Alternative" school.

Hmm....

What does the word "alternative" bring to mind? (in this sense) Perhaps a school for children how have emotional problems or something!