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Obama Bans Solitary Confinement for Minors

bsh1
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1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.
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1harderthanyouthink
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1/27/2016 5:33:30 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
Good
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And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

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The-Voice-of-Truth
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1/27/2016 2:59:15 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Read this yesterday. Solitary confinement for minors is unacceptable. Rehab is always better the for young, impressionable minds of minors.
Suh dude

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kevin24018
Posts: 1,804
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1/27/2016 9:16:12 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
federal prisons (only)
could no longer be used as a punishment for low-level infractions. (whatever that means)
He said the package of changes would include an expansion of treatment for mentally ill prisoners- (should have happened his first year)
"There are as many as 100,000 people held in solitary confinement in U.S. prisons - including juveniles and people with mental illnesses," Obama said. (so if you aren't a minor it's apparently ok)

watch the documentary about this, I have
http://time.com...

why be happy he has done this, which is a drop in the bucket imo, instead of being outraged it hasn't happened sooner and he hasn't done more?
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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1/28/2016 9:35:53 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
The criminal justice system pisses me off. The area I live is fighting to let kids who aren't a flight risk to go to trial without leg shackles, and it's like pulling teeth.
kevin24018
Posts: 1,804
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1/28/2016 1:49:06 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 9:35:53 AM, Wylted wrote:
The criminal justice system pisses me off. The area I live is fighting to let kids who aren't a flight risk to go to trial without leg shackles, and it's like pulling teeth.

and everyone should be pissed off, it's been getting worse not better, that's why I'm not sure why anyone would applaud him for doing almost nothing to change the system. we should expect and deserve more, from everyone in all levels of government.
Peepette
Posts: 1,237
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1/28/2016 3:05:07 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
Many prisons justify placing kids in solitary to keep them safe from the general population. But, minors should not be in adult prisons in the first place. Since the mass closings of state run mental health institutions in the 80's, the prison system has been the replacement vehicle for people who have metal health issues, young and old. Many of these minors suffer from psychological trauma or disorders; they not helped. It is a shame that it is seen better to stow people away rather than treat them.
kevin24018
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1/28/2016 4:36:22 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 3:05:07 PM, Peepette wrote:
Many prisons justify placing kids in solitary to keep them safe from the general population. But, minors should not be in adult prisons in the first place. Since the mass closings of state run mental health institutions in the 80's, the prison system has been the replacement vehicle for people who have metal health issues, young and old. Many of these minors suffer from psychological trauma or disorders; they not helped. It is a shame that it is seen better to stow people away rather than treat them.

well government knows best after all right? makes you wonder if they hadn't close the institutions down if some of these high profile murders would have happened. So yeah I don't think this decision is anything to cheer about, not at all.
Vox_Veritas
Posts: 7,068
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1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?
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Peepette
Posts: 1,237
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1/29/2016 7:45:00 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?

Firstly, I don't believe a 16 year old should be in an adult prison. The question is why is Johnny violent? When kids spend time in adult prisons their disposition gets worse, not better having to compete for power or get abused by adults. Juvenile detention with rehabilitation, education and psychological services, later moved into half-way housing is better than throwing a young life away.
Vox_Veritas
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1/29/2016 7:50:33 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 7:45:00 PM, Peepette wrote:
At 1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?

Firstly, I don't believe a 16 year old should be in an adult prison. The question is why is Johnny violent? When kids spend time in adult prisons their disposition gets worse, not better having to compete for power or get abused by adults. Juvenile detention with rehabilitation, education and psychological services, later moved into half-way housing is better than throwing a young life away.

If he's 16 then he's probably already in a juvenile prison.
But this still kind of fails to answer my question.
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Vox_Veritas
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1/29/2016 7:52:26 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
Peepette, are you suggesting that no punishment be allotted towards underage criminals who basically attempt to murder a guard or another prisoner?
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Peepette
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1/29/2016 8:23:56 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 7:52:26 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
Peepette, are you suggesting that no punishment be allotted towards underage criminals who basically attempt to murder a guard or another prisoner?

I was insufficient in fully flush out my response. Yes, attempted murder, even by a teen should have some sort of ramification, a term of time out of society. But the sentence should not be at the same standard of an adult committing the same crime; minimum sentencing rules. At present, juvenile detention centers are horrible places with few services offered, they are nothing more than holding facilities. Many of these kids commit crimes again and eventually end up in adult prisons. The point I was attempting to make was kids can be rehabilitated if given proper services. Each case should be evaluated at specific junctures to ascertain if the juvenile is capable of being reintegrated into society and monitored until becomes of adult legal age; maybe longer if warranted. It appears tax payers don't want to pay for the extensive services these kids need. But which is preferable, invest in services now to set a kid straight, who later becomes a productive law abiding citizen, or invest in repeatedly incarcerating kids into their adult hood.
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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1/29/2016 10:15:25 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?

I don't believe a 16 year old should ever been in an adult prison. But, you're also misunderstanding what solitary confinement is.

A person in solitary gets NO human contact at all. They can't see other people (literally), and the only contact they get is when food is dropped off for them or when a room inspection occurs. With Obama's order, they can be cordoned off from other inmates in an open-air cell where they can still interact with guards or here and see others.
Live Long and Prosper

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"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

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Vox_Veritas
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1/29/2016 10:52:39 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 10:15:25 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?

I don't believe a 16 year old should ever been in an adult prison. But, you're also misunderstanding what solitary confinement is.

A person in solitary gets NO human contact at all. They can't see other people (literally), and the only contact they get is when food is dropped off for them or when a room inspection occurs. With Obama's order, they can be cordoned off from other inmates in an open-air cell where they can still interact with guards or here and see others.

The question is...how long does solitary usually last? If it's just 24 hours long then that's nothing.
Call me Vox, the Resident Contrarian of debate.org.

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bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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1/29/2016 10:54:46 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 10:52:39 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/29/2016 10:15:25 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?

I don't believe a 16 year old should ever been in an adult prison. But, you're also misunderstanding what solitary confinement is.

A person in solitary gets NO human contact at all. They can't see other people (literally), and the only contact they get is when food is dropped off for them or when a room inspection occurs. With Obama's order, they can be cordoned off from other inmates in an open-air cell where they can still interact with guards or here and see others.

The question is...how long does solitary usually last? If it's just 24 hours long then that's nothing.

For a troubled kid, 24 hours can be an eternity. The risk of psychological harm is real. And, think of how many prisons who would--rather than actually work with a delinquent kid--just put them in solitary because it is easier and cheaper for them. There is a huge potential for abuse of the solitary system. This is a great decision by Obama.
Live Long and Prosper

I'm a Bish.


"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

Follow the DDOlympics
: http://www.debate.org...

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Peepette
Posts: 1,237
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1/30/2016 12:20:27 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/29/2016 10:54:46 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 1/29/2016 10:52:39 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/29/2016 10:15:25 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 1/29/2016 7:18:37 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:23:10 AM, bsh1 wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com...

This is excellent.

Okay, so let's say a 16 year old prisoner named Johnny suddenly turns violent and nearly puts one of the guards in a coma. What should be done to him?

I don't believe a 16 year old should ever been in an adult prison. But, you're also misunderstanding what solitary confinement is.

A person in solitary gets NO human contact at all. They can't see other people (literally), and the only contact they get is when food is dropped off for them or when a room inspection occurs. With Obama's order, they can be cordoned off from other inmates in an open-air cell where they can still interact with guards or here and see others.

The question is...how long does solitary usually last? If it's just 24 hours long then that's nothing.

For a troubled kid, 24 hours can be an eternity. The risk of psychological harm is real. And, think of how many prisons who would--rather than actually work with a delinquent kid--just put them in solitary because it is easier and cheaper for them. There is a huge potential for abuse of the solitary system. This is a great decision by Obama.

+1