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# How to learn math?

 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 1:02:29 PMPosted: 5 years agoWho would I learn math? I need to learn how to apply it rather than simply learn it abstractly- I've relearned the same concepts over the years and it won't stick. I also want to understand the logic behind the math instead of thinking of it as a bunch of 'number tricks.'"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 1:44:43 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 1:02:29 PM, MouthWash wrote:Who would I learn math? I need to learn how to apply it rather than simply learn it abstractly- I've relearned the same concepts over the years and it won't stick. I also want to understand the logic behind the math instead of thinking of it as a bunch of 'number tricks.'Where do you want to apply it?Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 9,512 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 1:56:14 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 1:02:29 PM, MouthWash wrote:Who would I learn math? I need to learn how to apply it rather than simply learn it abstractly- I've relearned the same concepts over the years and it won't stick. I also want to understand the logic behind the math instead of thinking of it as a bunch of 'number tricks.'Also, "applying math" isn't the same as "understanding the logic"--the latter is what "learning it abstractly is". Computational math, which is what application tends to be, is what all the tricks are for--use this equation, plug in some numbers, derive answer. Computational math is what you learn in hard disciplines--engineering, architecture, etc. Mathematics as a discipline is where you start to learn it as a grammar.
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 2:32:04 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 1:56:14 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:At 10/18/2012 1:02:29 PM, MouthWash wrote:Who would I learn math? I need to learn how to apply it rather than simply learn it abstractly- I've relearned the same concepts over the years and it won't stick. I also want to understand the logic behind the math instead of thinking of it as a bunch of 'number tricks.'Also, "applying math" isn't the same as "understanding the logic"--the latter is what "learning it abstractly is". Computational math, which is what application tends to be, is what all the tricks are for--use this equation, plug in some numbers, derive answer. Computational math is what you learn in hard disciplines--engineering, architecture, etc. Mathematics as a discipline is where you start to learn it as a grammar.I find it difficult to remember things unless I practice them in real life. I also want to understand the logic behind math. For instance, when my teacher taught me in first grade how to stack numbers and add them vertically to solve double digit or triple digit addition, I didn't understand why it worked. I just thought of it as a shortcut or trick that I couldn't comprehend. Now I do; not because anyone taught me but because as I got better at understanding numbers the process became clearer.Math would be a lot easier if I understood these things instead of just memorizing formulas (I have this problem with graph equations now). I never said that applying math and understanding it were the same thing- I want to do both."Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 2:53:57 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 2:32:04 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 1:56:14 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:At 10/18/2012 1:02:29 PM, MouthWash wrote:Who would I learn math? I need to learn how to apply it rather than simply learn it abstractly- I've relearned the same concepts over the years and it won't stick. I also want to understand the logic behind the math instead of thinking of it as a bunch of 'number tricks.'Also, "applying math" isn't the same as "understanding the logic"--the latter is what "learning it abstractly is". Computational math, which is what application tends to be, is what all the tricks are for--use this equation, plug in some numbers, derive answer. Computational math is what you learn in hard disciplines--engineering, architecture, etc. Mathematics as a discipline is where you start to learn it as a grammar.I find it difficult to remember things unless I practice them in real life. I also want to understand the logic behind math. For instance, when my teacher taught me in first grade how to stack numbers and add them vertically to solve double digit or triple digit addition, I didn't understand why it worked. I just thought of it as a shortcut or trick that I couldn't comprehend. Now I do; not because anyone taught me but because as I got better at understanding numbers the process became clearer.Math would be a lot easier if I understood these things instead of just memorizing formulas (I have this problem with graph equations now). I never said that applying math and understanding it were the same thing- I want to do both.Apply infinite regression analysis to anything and you won't understand how anything works. Eventually you have to go with the assumption that it is "self-evident" or that the proposition is unprovable and assumed to be true. I don't think that knowing the theory behind it will make it easier to understand. Sometimes memorization is the best root. I don't see the purpose of it either.In any event, in any event most people don't bother doing long multiplication or division. They just get a calculator to do it for them.Mathematics can be applied to many "real" concepts, but you have to first learn the background of these real concepts in order to apply it. Economics, physics, engineering, chemistry, and finance all require an understanding of math concepts. There are more subjects in the list, although they don't use mathematics as extensively.Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 5:18:23 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 2:53:57 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 2:32:04 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 1:56:14 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:At 10/18/2012 1:02:29 PM, MouthWash wrote:Who would I learn math? I need to learn how to apply it rather than simply learn it abstractly- I've relearned the same concepts over the years and it won't stick. I also want to understand the logic behind the math instead of thinking of it as a bunch of 'number tricks.'Also, "applying math" isn't the same as "understanding the logic"--the latter is what "learning it abstractly is". Computational math, which is what application tends to be, is what all the tricks are for--use this equation, plug in some numbers, derive answer. Computational math is what you learn in hard disciplines--engineering, architecture, etc. Mathematics as a discipline is where you start to learn it as a grammar.I find it difficult to remember things unless I practice them in real life. I also want to understand the logic behind math. For instance, when my teacher taught me in first grade how to stack numbers and add them vertically to solve double digit or triple digit addition, I didn't understand why it worked. I just thought of it as a shortcut or trick that I couldn't comprehend. Now I do; not because anyone taught me but because as I got better at understanding numbers the process became clearer.Math would be a lot easier if I understood these things instead of just memorizing formulas (I have this problem with graph equations now). I never said that applying math and understanding it were the same thing- I want to do both.Apply infinite regression analysis to anything and you won't understand how anything works. Eventually you have to go with the assumption that it is "self-evident" or that the proposition is unprovable and assumed to be true. I don't think that knowing the theory behind it will make it easier to understand. Sometimes memorization is the best root. I don't see the purpose of it either.In any event, in any event most people don't bother doing long multiplication or division. They just get a calculator to do it for them.Mathematics can be applied to many "real" concepts, but you have to first learn the background of these real concepts in order to apply it. Economics, physics, engineering, chemistry, and finance all require an understanding of math concepts. There are more subjects in the list, although they don't use mathematics as extensively.I just brute-force logic my way through math problems and I do them all in my head. Interestingly this has served me better than simply memorizing formulas because I actually understand the math.I would like to apply math to all of those subjects. Just at basic levels, and preferably something relevant to real life because otherwise it isn't any better than a word problem."Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PMPosted: 5 years agoBy the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound."Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 5:57:24 PMPosted: 5 years agoHold on, both of them are compound? Sorry, I misread. >.<"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 5:58:21 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PM, MouthWash wrote:By the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound.How about an annual interest rate of 6.8% vs. a compound interest rate of 6.7%.Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 5:59:00 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 5:57:24 PM, MouthWash wrote:Hold on, both of them are compound? Sorry, I misread. >.
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 5:59:54 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 5:55:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:Yea, you got that wrong either way. Your basing it on a linear interest rate. Compound interest rate is based on exponential increase. The formula is as followed for yearly compounding:P(i+1)^(t)P = principle, or initial amount. In this case 10,000i = interest rate. In this case, 6.8%, or 0.068t = time, in this case 5 years.I don't understand this. (i+1)^(t)? What does that even mean? Why add 1?"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:02:10 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 5:58:21 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PM, MouthWash wrote:By the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound.How about an annual interest rate of 6.8% vs. a compound interest rate of 6.7%.Easy. 3,400.Again, I can't figure the next one out."Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:02:49 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 5:59:54 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:Yea, you got that wrong either way. Your basing it on a linear interest rate. Compound interest rate is based on exponential increase. The formula is as followed for yearly compounding:P(i+1)^(t)P = principle, or initial amount. In this case 10,000i = interest rate. In this case, 6.8%, or 0.068t = time, in this case 5 years.I don't understand this. (i+1)^(t)? What does that even mean? Why add 1?Do you know what exponential functions are?Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:05:30 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 6:02:49 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:59:54 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:Yea, you got that wrong either way. Your basing it on a linear interest rate. Compound interest rate is based on exponential increase. The formula is as followed for yearly compounding:P(i+1)^(t)P = principle, or initial amount. In this case 10,000i = interest rate. In this case, 6.8%, or 0.068t = time, in this case 5 years.I don't understand this. (i+1)^(t)? What does that even mean? Why add 1?Do you know what exponential functions are?Of course I do. I just don't know how they are solved."Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:07:42 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 6:02:10 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:58:21 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PM, MouthWash wrote:By the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound.How about an annual interest rate of 6.8% vs. a compound interest rate of 6.7%.Easy. 3,400.Again, I can't figure the next one out.you realize you are getting these answers wrong right?I'll explain it to you.10,000*.068 = \$680 the first yearThis is added onto the next sum so that the next sum is:10,680*.068 = \$726.24 gained the second yearSame thing again.11,406.24*.068 = \$775.62 gained the thirdHowever there's a simplified way of doing this which I showed you. This is what you learn in high school math (algebra II), but you dropped out.Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:12:16 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 6:05:30 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:02:49 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:59:54 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:Yea, you got that wrong either way. Your basing it on a linear interest rate. Compound interest rate is based on exponential increase. The formula is as followed for yearly compounding:P(i+1)^(t)P = principle, or initial amount. In this case 10,000i = interest rate. In this case, 6.8%, or 0.068t = time, in this case 5 years.I don't understand this. (i+1)^(t)? What does that even mean? Why add 1?Do you know what exponential functions are?Of course I do. I just don't know how they are solved.the ^ means its an exponential function. For example 2^4 = 162*2*2*2 = 16, which is what 2^4 stands for. Multiplying 2, four times.Whenever you have exponential growth, you use the equation: (1+growth%)^t.t = time. So for example if growth rate is 2% a year, you will have (1.02)(1.02)*amount in two years.Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:19:19 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 6:07:42 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:02:10 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:58:21 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PM, MouthWash wrote:By the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound.How about an annual interest rate of 6.8% vs. a compound interest rate of 6.7%.Easy. 3,400.Again, I can't figure the next one out.you realize you are getting these answers wrong right?I'll explain it to you.10,000*.068 = \$680 the first yearThis is added onto the next sum so that the next sum is:10,680*.068 = \$726.24 gained the second yearSame thing again.11,406.24*.068 = \$775.62 gained the thirdHowever there's a simplified way of doing this which I showed you. This is what you learn in high school math (algebra II), but you dropped out.I am not learning that in high school. I was learning basic graphing, which I should have known before elementary school ended. As a first grader I found pre-algebra easy, which should tell you something about the education I get.I reduced the 10,000 to 100 in my head. I then multiplied 5 by 6 to get 30. I took the .8 and multiplied it by ten to give me 8 (38) then divided it in half to get .8 X 5 (34). So 134. I moved the decimal over and got 13,400 which is 10,000 + 3,400."Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
 Posts: 11,204 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:23:52 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 6:19:19 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:07:42 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:02:10 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:58:21 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PM, MouthWash wrote:By the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound.How about an annual interest rate of 6.8% vs. a compound interest rate of 6.7%.Easy. 3,400.Again, I can't figure the next one out.you realize you are getting these answers wrong right?I'll explain it to you.10,000*.068 = \$680 the first yearThis is added onto the next sum so that the next sum is:10,680*.068 = \$726.24 gained the second yearSame thing again.11,406.24*.068 = \$775.62 gained the thirdHowever there's a simplified way of doing this which I showed you. This is what you learn in high school math (algebra II), but you dropped out.I am not learning that in high school. I was learning basic graphing, which I should have known before elementary school ended. As a first grader I found pre-algebra easy, which should tell you something about the education I get.I reduced the 10,000 to 100 in my head. I then multiplied 5 by 6 to get 30. I took the .8 and multiplied it by ten to give me 8 (38) then divided it in half to get .8 X 5 (34). So 134. I moved the decimal over and got 13,400 which is 10,000 + 3,400.You dropped out, hence why you never learned it. Its something you learn in algebra II.Open borders debate: http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 2,607 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 10/18/2012 6:36:44 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 10/18/2012 6:23:52 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:19:19 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:07:42 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 6:02:10 PM, MouthWash wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:58:21 PM, darkkermit wrote:At 10/18/2012 5:55:26 PM, MouthWash wrote:By the way, it's pretty obvious that B would give me more money. This would be interesting if B had a lower interest rate but was compound.How about an annual interest rate of 6.8% vs. a compound interest rate of 6.7%.Easy. 3,400.Again, I can't figure the next one out.you realize you are getting these answers wrong right?I'll explain it to you.10,000*.068 = \$680 the first yearThis is added onto the next sum so that the next sum is:10,680*.068 = \$726.24 gained the second yearSame thing again.11,406.24*.068 = \$775.62 gained the thirdHowever there's a simplified way of doing this which I showed you. This is what you learn in high school math (algebra II), but you dropped out.I am not learning that in high school. I was learning basic graphing, which I should have known before elementary school ended. As a first grader I found pre-algebra easy, which should tell you something about the education I get.I reduced the 10,000 to 100 in my head. I then multiplied 5 by 6 to get 30. I took the .8 and multiplied it by ten to give me 8 (38) then divided it in half to get .8 X 5 (34). So 134. I moved the decimal over and got 13,400 which is 10,000 + 3,400.You dropped out, hence why you never learned it. Its something you learn in algebra II.I don't care; I don't need school to learn it. Now, what exactly is wrong with my solution?"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)