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Is suicide a selfish act?

TheEmoWolfie
Posts: 3
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1/11/2016 7:13:16 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
This is my first post, so I hope I'm not doing anything wrong, but this is a question I often see circulating around (everywhere, not just here): is suicide selfish/cowardly/an easy way out? I will put my personal opinion out there: no, it is not. Suicide, for most, is a last resort, used only after everything else has failed. Depression and anxiety are emotionally and physically draining. It's NOT easy, at all. If someone says they want to commit suicide, saying things like "Why? That's selfish! You're just putting the pain off on everyone else! Killing yourself means you're weak!" is not going to help them. Suicide often occurs because a person has fought depression, anxiety, etc. for so long with no change, and can't handle it anymore; feels that the world and everyone around them would be better off when they're dead; or a combination of both. I don't understand why anyone could see it as selfish, if they truly understand what mental illnesses are like.
/\~*Wolfie*~/\
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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1/11/2016 8:57:28 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 7:13:16 PM, TheEmoWolfie wrote:
This is my first post, so I hope I'm not doing anything wrong, but this is a question I often see circulating around (everywhere, not just here): is suicide selfish/cowardly/an easy way out? I will put my personal opinion out there: no, it is not. Suicide, for most, is a last resort, used only after everything else has failed. Depression and anxiety are emotionally and physically draining. It's NOT easy, at all. If someone says they want to commit suicide, saying things like "Why? That's selfish! You're just putting the pain off on everyone else! Killing yourself means you're weak!" is not going to help them. Suicide often occurs because a person has fought depression, anxiety, etc. for so long with no change, and can't handle it anymore; feels that the world and everyone around them would be better off when they're dead; or a combination of both. I don't understand why anyone could see it as selfish, if they truly understand what mental illnesses are like.

Well, first a very straight answer. Yea, it fits the definition of selfish.
self"ish
adjective
(of a person, action, or motive) lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.

So, there you go. Now, I understand and respect peoples decision to do whatever they want to their own body so long as they are not harming others. You, well, you sound like you are talking a little bit about yourself. At 16 or so, the thoughts of suicide are normal. Thinking anyone in their teens has "lived with depression for a long time" is silly. Thinking they are desperate at the moment, completely real.
famousdebater
Posts: 3,943
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1/11/2016 9:11:59 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 7:13:16 PM, TheEmoWolfie wrote:

Hello welcome to the site. I'm not going to look at the definition here because technically it does fit in with it (as has already been pointed out) but the scenario is crucial to the analysis. If the person thinks that people will like it better without them, regardless if that is true or not, they are considering the thoughts or others - not their own. Therefore the act isn't selfish. If they are in pain, I don't like to consider it as selfish although if that is the sole reason then it is classified as selfish since they aren't considering others (unless others are being saddened by their pain and they are considering this). If you made it a bit more specific then the question would be easier to answer in more detail.
"Life calls the tune, we dance."
John Galsworthy
Chuz-Life
Posts: 1,789
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1/11/2016 9:18:30 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
As someone who has dealt with a lifetime of depression, I have to say that suicide is selfish in some BUT NOT ALL respects. Most acts of selfishness can be reduced down to a type of vanity or narcissism. In my opinion, suicide does not typically fit that mold.
"Sooner or later, the Supreme Court of the Unites States is going to have explain how a 'child in the womb' is a person enough to be recognized as a MURDER victim under our fetal homicide laws but how they are not persons enough to qualify for any other Constitutional protections" ~ Chuz Life

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ironslippers
Posts: 513
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1/11/2016 11:08:14 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
Suicide is a controlling act. Is personal control selfish?
Everyone stands on their own dung hill and speaks out about someone else's - Nathan Krusemark
Its easier to criticize and hate than it is to support and create - I Ron Slippers
Andromeda_Z
Posts: 4,151
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1/12/2016 4:39:51 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
Of course it's selfish. How could it be anything other than selfish? It's an act that you are doing that will benefit only yourself. But I don't think you're looking for a semantic discussion what what selfishness is, I think what you're trying to get at is whether it's wrong to kill oneself. I honestly believe mental illnesses can be just as terminal as physical ones in some cases. Sometimes people can have a mental illness and live a full, happy life, with the right help (more on that in a moment). Sometimes they can't. Sometimes they end up not living a life at all. It's incredibly sad when someone dies in such a way and I really wish it never had to happen, but I understand and I don't think it's wrong. However, I do think it is completely fair of people to be upset, especially if you don't do all you can to avoid getting to that point. I'd be fairly upset if a friend of mine knew they had cancer that might be treatable and avoided ever seeing an oncologist until they died of it. Same goes for a friend with a mental illness - psychiatrists and counselors can be unbelievably helpful. So, to anyone who may be thinking of suicide, please see one. Seriously.
TheEmoWolfie
Posts: 3
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1/12/2016 2:51:35 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 8:57:28 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 7:13:16 PM, TheEmoWolfie wrote:
This is my first post, so I hope I'm not doing anything wrong, but this is a question I often see circulating around (everywhere, not just here): is suicide selfish/cowardly/an easy way out? I will put my personal opinion out there: no, it is not. Suicide, for most, is a last resort, used only after everything else has failed. Depression and anxiety are emotionally and physically draining. It's NOT easy, at all. If someone says they want to commit suicide, saying things like "Why? That's selfish! You're just putting the pain off on everyone else! Killing yourself means you're weak!" is not going to help them. Suicide often occurs because a person has fought depression, anxiety, etc. for so long with no change, and can't handle it anymore; feels that the world and everyone around them would be better off when they're dead; or a combination of both. I don't understand why anyone could see it as selfish, if they truly understand what mental illnesses are like.

Well, first a very straight answer. Yea, it fits the definition of selfish.
self"ish
adjective
(of a person, action, or motive) lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.
So, there you go. Now, I understand and respect peoples decision to do whatever they want to their own body so long as they are not harming others. You, well, you sound like you are talking a little bit about yourself. At 16 or so, the thoughts of suicide are normal. Thinking anyone in their teens has "lived with depression for a long time" is silly. Thinking they are desperate at the moment, completely real.
So suicide is meant for only one's profit? Someone who tries suicide doesn't think about others at all? Actually, no. Honestly, I kind of am talking about myself here. I was 10 when I first thought about killing myself, and I tried committing suicide mainly because I thought I would be doing the world a favor. I wrote a letter saying how I was glad to be leaving, because I would never be a bother to anyone ever again. Does that sound selfish?
And please don't assume that people haven't been going through things for a long time, even if they're as young as me. I lived with an emotionally abusive mother for the first 10 years of my life, and since then I've been told that I'm weak because I can't "get over it". I only recently was given medication for every mental illness I have, but I've needed it for a long time. I tried because after all that, it was too much.
And someone who thinks like that is selfish?
/\~*Wolfie*~/\
TheEmoWolfie
Posts: 3
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1/12/2016 2:54:56 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 9:18:30 PM, Chuz-Life wrote:
As someone who has dealt with a lifetime of depression, I have to say that suicide is selfish in some BUT NOT ALL respects. Most acts of selfishness can be reduced down to a type of vanity or narcissism. In my opinion, suicide does not typically fit that mold.
In what respect would it be selfish then? Are you talking about someone who commits suicide to "get back at someone" or something like that? (Not trying to challenge you or anything; I just want to know where you're coming from)
/\~*Wolfie*~/\
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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1/12/2016 3:16:33 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:51:35 PM, TheEmoWolfie wrote:
At 1/11/2016 8:57:28 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 7:13:16 PM, TheEmoWolfie wrote:
This is my first post, so I hope I'm not doing anything wrong, but this is a question I often see circulating around (everywhere, not just here): is suicide selfish/cowardly/an easy way out? I will put my personal opinion out there: no, it is not. Suicide, for most, is a last resort, used only after everything else has failed. Depression and anxiety are emotionally and physically draining. It's NOT easy, at all. If someone says they want to commit suicide, saying things like "Why? That's selfish! You're just putting the pain off on everyone else! Killing yourself means you're weak!" is not going to help them. Suicide often occurs because a person has fought depression, anxiety, etc. for so long with no change, and can't handle it anymore; feels that the world and everyone around them would be better off when they're dead; or a combination of both. I don't understand why anyone could see it as selfish, if they truly understand what mental illnesses are like.

Well, first a very straight answer. Yea, it fits the definition of selfish.
self"ish
adjective
(of a person, action, or motive) lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.
So, there you go. Now, I understand and respect peoples decision to do whatever they want to their own body so long as they are not harming others. You, well, you sound like you are talking a little bit about yourself. At 16 or so, the thoughts of suicide are normal. Thinking anyone in their teens has "lived with depression for a long time" is silly. Thinking they are desperate at the moment, completely real.
So suicide is meant for only one's profit? Someone who tries suicide doesn't think about others at all? Actually, no. Honestly, I kind of am talking about myself here. I was 10 when I first thought about killing myself, and I tried committing suicide mainly because I thought I would be doing the world a favor. I wrote a letter saying how I was glad to be leaving, because I would never be a bother to anyone ever again. Does that sound selfish?

Yea, it does sound selfish. Now, as others have said, just making this about semantics is pointless. Suicidal feelings are real, depression is real, and clearly anyone who is suffering this is not trying to be selfish, they are in pain.

What you describe is incredibly typical teen emotions. Again, not denying the reality or severity of these feelings, only telling you it is like Monday - it is just something that happens.

And please don't assume that people haven't been going through things for a long time, even if they're as young as me. I lived with an emotionally abusive mother for the first 10 years of my life, and since then I've been told that I'm weak because I can't "get over it". I only recently was given medication for every mental illness I have, but I've needed it for a long time. I tried because after all that, it was too much.

I am very sorry. Please don't confuse what I am saying with lack of empathy. Now, when I say not a long time, what I am saying is, at 16 you are living each year as a large percentage of your life this far. When you are older, each year is much less. This is why time fly's for old people. If you have been dealing with depression for years when you are a teen, it seems like a very very long time.

Give therapy and medication time to work. It will.

And someone who thinks like that is selfish?

Yea.
Chuz-Life
Posts: 1,789
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1/12/2016 5:54:26 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:54:56 PM, TheEmoWolfie wrote:
At 1/11/2016 9:18:30 PM, Chuz-Life wrote:
As someone who has dealt with a lifetime of depression, I have to say that suicide is selfish in some BUT NOT ALL respects. Most acts of selfishness can be reduced down to a type of vanity or narcissism. In my opinion, suicide does not typically fit that mold.
In what respect would it be selfish then? Are you talking about someone who commits suicide to "get back at someone" or something like that? (Not trying to challenge you or anything; I just want to know where you're coming from)

In my view, the selfish aspects of a suicide are not at all significant in most cases. Indeed, they are barely worth mentioning. It's pretty obvious though that everyone has some need to be loved, accepted, appreciated, etc. Suicide is far less likely when someone feels like all those needs are met. It's when those needs are NOT met (real or imagined) and a person is driven towards suicide - that the persons begins to act "selfishly." They dwell on their self and their own feelings and needs and while doing so, they become less considerate of the needs for the same by others. Including those who are TRYING to reciprocate.

That's my observation of it, anyway.
"Sooner or later, the Supreme Court of the Unites States is going to have explain how a 'child in the womb' is a person enough to be recognized as a MURDER victim under our fetal homicide laws but how they are not persons enough to qualify for any other Constitutional protections" ~ Chuz Life

http://www.debate.org...
TUF
Posts: 21,310
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1/13/2016 7:50:40 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
Every action we do on this planet is selfish, no matter how we try to spin it.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227