Total Posts:7|Showing Posts:1-7
Jump to topic:

The existance of souls and afterlife

hauki20
Posts: 6
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/8/2011 7:14:40 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
As you'll see, I haven't perfected this argument, but this is a problematic question I discovered. So, can humans have an infinite amount of thoughts, or are the number of our thoughts limited? Answer this question in your mind before you continue reading.

I don't know what you may answer, but at least to me the idea of there being a limit on the number of thoughts we can have sounds illogical. If there were indeed a limit, what would the limit be? 10000? 1000000? 100000000000? And what happens when our thoughts get to this magic limit? We can no longer think/have thoughts?

Now, if you answered that we can, in fact, have an infinite amount of thoughts, you come to a paradox. For humans to have an infinite amount of thoughts, according to the naturalistic explanation, we would have to have an infinite amount of connections/pathways in our brain (english isn't my mother tongue, as you can see). So for us to have an infinite amount of thoughts, we would have to have an immaterial being, a sort of "soul" or "mind". And since this part of us is immaterial, what happens to it when we die? It would be illogical to think that since our material body dies our immaterial part would die along with it, so what happens to it after we die? From all previous conclusions it follows that this part of us continues to live on after we die. If all previous conclusions are correct, this immaterial part is responsible for our consciousness, a psyche, if you will. So it follows that after death, our consciousness lives on. Does it reincarnate? Does it walk the earth as a ghost? Does it go to a next level of existance?

As I said, this argument isn't perfect. I wait for your constructive (or less so) critiscism.
Arrogance and deception,
Torment and Bliss,
Oh, I envy your lack of justification
When mine is so sincere


[u]And btw, why can't I use [url=en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBCode]BBCode?[/url][/u]
Puck
Posts: 6,457
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/8/2011 7:39:33 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/8/2011 7:14:40 AM, hauki20 wrote:
I don't know what you may answer, but at least to me the idea of there being a limit on the number of thoughts we can have sounds illogical.

Not really, though judging by your argument, not the reasons you think. The size of the brain is limited. Neurons after firing have a 'cool down' period before they can fire again. Our brain activity is limited to its users life. All these limit, in gross terms, the function of the brain for infinite firing sequences.

If there were indeed a limit, what would the limit be? 10000? 1000000? 100000000000?

It's not a battery as such where each neuron firing is a -1 on some total.

And what happens when our thoughts get to this magic limit? We can no longer think/have thoughts?

No we check our premises on suspect arguments that rely on non sequiturs.

For humans to have an infinite amount of thoughts, according to the naturalistic explanation, we would have to have an infinite amount of connections/pathways in our brain (english isn't my mother tongue, as you can see).

No, each thought isn't a new pathway. Our brain is quite capable of refiring neurons. And quite readily needs to. No clue where your idea of use and die neurology comes from.

So for us to have an infinite amount of thoughts, we would have to have an immaterial being, a sort of "soul" or "mind".

No, immortality. And the rest of it is you into non sequitur fantasy land.
Justin_Chains
Posts: 623
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/8/2011 2:47:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/8/2011 7:14:40 AM, hauki20 wrote:
As you'll see, I haven't perfected this argument, but this is a problematic question I discovered. So, can humans have an infinite amount of thoughts, or are the number of our thoughts limited? Answer this question in your mind before you continue reading.




I don't know what you may answer, but at least to me the idea of there being a limit on the number of thoughts we can have sounds illogical. If there were indeed a limit, what would the limit be? 10000? 1000000? 100000000000? And what happens when our thoughts get to this magic limit? We can no longer think/have thoughts?

Now, if you answered that we can, in fact, have an infinite amount of thoughts, you come to a paradox. For humans to have an infinite amount of thoughts, according to the naturalistic explanation, we would have to have an infinite amount of connections/pathways in our brain (english isn't my mother tongue, as you can see). So for us to have an infinite amount of thoughts, we would have to have an immaterial being, a sort of "soul" or "mind". And since this part of us is immaterial, what happens to it when we die? It would be illogical to think that since our material body dies our immaterial part would die along with it, so what happens to it after we die? From all previous conclusions it follows that this part of us continues to live on after we die. If all previous conclusions are correct, this immaterial part is responsible for our consciousness, a psyche, if you will. So it follows that after death, our consciousness lives on. Does it reincarnate? Does it walk the earth as a ghost? Does it go to a next level of existance?

As I said, this argument isn't perfect. I wait for your constructive (or less so) critiscism.

The brain is only a tool for the soul to use, at goes for the rest of your body as well.. The experiences you have are ones through using these tools. Time changes, so experiences will change, even ones that are repeated. The body however, can only have a duration that is of finite time. The soul, being infinite to the perception of time, carries on forever and is free to use whatever too it desires.
Ogan
Posts: 407
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/8/2011 7:19:49 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Regarding the problem of Consciousness and the Brain, he - Professor Tyndall as long ago as the 19th century - quotes this question from Mr. Martineau:
A man can say, I feel, I think, I love; but how does consciousness infuse itself into the problem? And thus he answers:
The passage from the physics of the brain to the corresponding facts of consciousness is unthinkable. Granted that a definite thought and a molecular action in the brain occur simultaneously; we do not possess the intellectual organ nor apparently any rudiments of the organ, which would enable us to pass by a process of reasoning from one to the other. They appear together, but we do not know why. Were our minds and senses so expanded, strengthened and illuminated, as to enable us to see and feel the very molecules of the brain; were we capable of following all their motions, all their groupings, all their electric discharges, if such there be - science now knows them to be - and were we intimately acquainted with the corresponding states of thought and feeling, we should be as far as ever from the solution of the problem - How are these physical processes connected with the facts of consciousness? The chasm between the two classes of phenomena would still remain intellectually impassable.
And so it is unto this day. But not for those who have raised the sacred veil of the interior of Nature Herself. The rest must wait their turn!
Cliff.Stamp
Posts: 2,169
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/9/2011 7:53:20 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 6/8/2011 7:14:40 AM, hauki20 wrote:

So, can humans have an infinite amount of thoughts, or are the number of our thoughts limited?

Limited.

If there were indeed a limit, what would the limit be? 10000? 1000000? 100000000000?

Think much bigger. The number of ways you can assemble things is n^n, this gets large quickly. 2^2 = 4, this is

11
12
21
22

However 3^3 = 27 :

111
112
113
121
122
123
131
132
133

etc.

Note that even 50^50 is so large it is comparable to the age of the universe in seconds.

Thus even if all of your thoughts were limited to strings of just 50 connections which could come from 50 different firings then you could have been alive from the time the universe started and you would still not exhaust the possibilities today.

Note that your brain actually has billions of neurons and trillions of synapses so the actual upper limit is much higher you can not even write it in exponential notation, you would die before you could write all the zeros. It basically is a jillion kajillion.