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Is it ethical to intentionally harm oneself?

Jon1
Posts: 314
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9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?
Jon1
Posts: 314
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9/10/2011 5:52:50 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say no. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/10/2011 10:26:04 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Disagree. Self ownership= being able to do whatever you want to your own body, so long as you don't physically harm anyone else. You're fully within your rights to emotionally harm someone.
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: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
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: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
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Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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9/10/2011 10:41:20 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Oh, socialpinko... spoken like a good little ancap robot ;) Even though I agree, there is an argument that can be made pertaining to the ethics of self-ownership and when it may or may not apply. I don't recall it verbatim off the top of my head, but I remember it came up when J.Kenyon and I were discussing the ethics of perpetually using drugs. Basically he tried to provide an argument where it would be immoral to be inebriated all the time... I'll ask him to remind me of the context, but of course it doesn't matter if you believe ethical concepts ONLY pertain to rights (i.e., anything that does not violate another's rights is not immoral).
President of DDO
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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9/10/2011 10:54:41 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Some people like to be hurt.. Some people REALLY like to be hurt..

O.O
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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9/10/2011 10:56:25 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Is it unethical to go to a job everyday knowing full well you could be killed instantly by the nature of the work you do? I do it everyday and get injured in some way at least every two weeks. I have cheated death on more than 5 different occasions from falling granite slabs. I have to do this to pay the bills and feed the family. I don't expect anyone to give a rats behind about how I feel about it. Ya, I could get a safer job, but that would be boring and like being dead inside.

The key to getting over depression is to "get over it" No one ultimately really
cares about your petty narcissistic self absorbed cry baby problems. It is said that if everybody threw their problems in a big pile, everyone would grab their own problems back.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Jon1
Posts: 314
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9/10/2011 11:04:17 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 10:26:04 AM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Disagree. Self ownership= being able to do whatever you want to your own body, so long as you don't physically harm anyone else. You're fully within your rights to emotionally harm someone.

Within legal rights, but I doubt that legal rights equal moral rights.
Jon1
Posts: 314
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9/10/2011 11:09:04 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 10:56:25 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Is it unethical to go to a job everyday knowing full well you could be killed instantly by the nature of the work you do? I do it everyday and get injured in some way at least every two weeks. I have cheated death on more than 5 different occasions from falling granite slabs. I have to do this to pay the bills and feed the family. I don't expect anyone to give a rats behind about how I feel about it. Ya, I could get a safer job, but that would be boring and like being dead inside.

The key to getting over depression is to "get over it" No one ultimately really
cares about your petty narcissistic self absorbed cry baby problems. It is said that if everybody threw their problems in a big pile, everyone would grab their own problems back.

Eh, the word "harm" is complicated.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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9/10/2011 11:11:49 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 10:56:25 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Is it unethical to go to a job everyday knowing full well you could be killed instantly by the nature of the work you do? I do it everyday and get injured in some way at least every two weeks. I have cheated death on more than 5 different occasions from falling granite slabs. I have to do this to pay the bills and feed the family. I don't expect anyone to give a rats behind about how I feel about it. Ya, I could get a safer job, but that would be boring and like being dead inside.

The key to getting over depression is to "get over it" No one ultimately really
cares about your petty narcissistic self absorbed cry baby problems. It is said that if everybody threw their problems in a big pile, everyone would grab their own problems back.

I disagree. Depression involves a chemical imbalance--it's a disorder, not an emotion.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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9/10/2011 2:31:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.
How?

Anyway, disown or unfriend him if it's that much of a problem.


I know that this is not the most common view
That's probably false actually. It's probably the most common view, it's just that it's not commonly defended with a full argument, and so far this thread is no exception
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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9/10/2011 2:33:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Now, keep in mind, I'd say it's not ethical to intentionally harm oneself too. It contradicts the whole point of ethics, achieving one's goals (if something doesn't harm your goals how can you say it harms you anyway?)

But that has nothing to do with other people (and does not deny a right to self harm).
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
vbaculum
Posts: 1,274
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9/12/2011 1:45:54 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

If a teenager is cutting him or herself then this could be interpreted as a symptom of a more significant problem (likely depression). In that case, the harm would alert family and/or friends allowing them to do what they think is ethical (likely helping with the depression).

Risking your life or committing suicide could be unethical though those aren't examples of harm.
"If you claim to value nonviolence and you consume animal products, you need to rethink your position on nonviolence." - Gary Francione

THE WORLD IS VEGAN! If you want it
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/12/2011 4:31:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 10:41:20 AM, Danielle wrote:
Oh, socialpinko... spoken like a good little ancap robot ;) Even though I agree, there is an argument that can be made pertaining to the ethics of self-ownership and when it may or may not apply. I don't recall it verbatim off the top of my head, but I remember it came up when J.Kenyon and I were discussing the ethics of perpetually using drugs. Basically he tried to provide an argument where it would be immoral to be inebriated all the time... I'll ask him to remind me of the context, but of course it doesn't matter if you believe ethical concepts ONLY pertain to rights (i.e., anything that does not violate another's rights is not immoral).

I'm sorry, but I have to make up for Cody, Grape, Kenyon, Sieben, and Reasoning not being here anymore. ;)
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
ryan_thomas
Posts: 161
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9/12/2011 4:37:11 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 10:54:41 AM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Some people like to be hurt.. Some people REALLY like to be hurt..


O.O

Yes, they are called emo kids.
All Hail Lord Ryan!
PartamRuhem
Posts: 1,559
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9/12/2011 4:49:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/10/2011 11:11:49 AM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 9/10/2011 10:56:25 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Is it unethical to go to a job everyday knowing full well you could be killed instantly by the nature of the work you do? I do it everyday and get injured in some way at least every two weeks. I have cheated death on more than 5 different occasions from falling granite slabs. I have to do this to pay the bills and feed the family. I don't expect anyone to give a rats behind about how I feel about it. Ya, I could get a safer job, but that would be boring and like being dead inside.

The key to getting over depression is to "get over it" No one ultimately really
cares about your petty narcissistic self absorbed cry baby problems. It is said that if everybody threw their problems in a big pile, everyone would grab their own problems back.

I disagree. Depression involves a chemical imbalance-- it's a disorder, not an emotion.

I had a whole debate going off this. There is no "getting over it" unless you are being treated with the right combination of family/friend support, therapy, and drugs.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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9/12/2011 9:00:17 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 4:49:39 PM, PartamRuhem wrote:
At 9/10/2011 11:11:49 AM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 9/10/2011 10:56:25 AM, sadolite wrote:
At 9/10/2011 5:50:41 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Why or why not?

I'd say yes. An emotionally unstable teenager, for example, isn't just making life miserable for himself, but also for his parents and to a certain degree for his friends.

I know that this is not the most common view, so do you disagree? Why?

Is it unethical to go to a job everyday knowing full well you could be killed instantly by the nature of the work you do? I do it everyday and get injured in some way at least every two weeks. I have cheated death on more than 5 different occasions from falling granite slabs. I have to do this to pay the bills and feed the family. I don't expect anyone to give a rats behind about how I feel about it. Ya, I could get a safer job, but that would be boring and like being dead inside.

The key to getting over depression is to "get over it" No one ultimately really
cares about your petty narcissistic self absorbed cry baby problems. It is said that if everybody threw their problems in a big pile, everyone would grab their own problems back.

I disagree. Depression involves a chemical imbalance-- it's a disorder, not an emotion.

I had a whole debate going off this. There is no "getting over it" unless you are being treated with the right combination of family/friend support, therapy, and drugs.

THIS.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus