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Nietzsche

socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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10/23/2011 10:42:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/23/2011 10:37:56 PM, Johnicle wrote:
I'm about to dive into reading Nietzsche. Does anyone who's read it have any suggestions/comments?

He's a weird writer, nit at all like a lot of other philosophers who adhere to a rigorous system of sorts. He's a very enjoyable read though illgivr him that. Read Antichrist if nothing at least.
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Johnicle
Posts: 888
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10/24/2011 2:30:03 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/24/2011 1:39:47 AM, BlackVoid wrote:
Running dem kritiks?

lol yeah... but it's also helpful for the LD resolution. I.E. we should not help people because it interferes with them embracing their suffering.

But I'm also reading it because I think I would really enjoy it.
Johnicle
Posts: 888
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10/24/2011 2:31:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/23/2011 10:42:06 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 10/23/2011 10:37:56 PM, Johnicle wrote:
I'm about to dive into reading Nietzsche. Does anyone who's read it have any suggestions/comments?

He's a weird writer, nit at all like a lot of other philosophers who adhere to a rigorous system of sorts. He's a very enjoyable read though illgivr him that. Read Antichrist if nothing at least.

Alright... noted. Nice to see you back by the way. I've sort of been MIA lately and must have missed your come back.
JustCallMeTarzan
Posts: 1,922
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10/24/2011 2:38:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/23/2011 10:37:56 PM, Johnicle wrote:
I'm about to dive into reading Nietzsche. Does anyone who's read it have any suggestions/comments?

Read On the Genealogy of Morals, Beyond Good and Evil, and the Antichrist. But skip his damn poems - they are just dumb. Skip also his little aphorisms unless you like the comedic value....
vbaculum
Posts: 1,274
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10/24/2011 4:03:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The only Nietzche I've read was The Gay Science. I didn't get much out of it. I've browsed some of his other books and they looked much more interesting.
"If you claim to value nonviolence and you consume animal products, you need to rethink your position on nonviolence." - Gary Francione

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Raisor
Posts: 4,462
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10/24/2011 6:34:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/24/2011 2:30:03 PM, Johnicle wrote:
At 10/24/2011 1:39:47 AM, BlackVoid wrote:
Running dem kritiks?

lol yeah... but it's also helpful for the LD resolution. I.E. we should not help people because it interferes with them embracing their suffering.

But I'm also reading it because I think I would really enjoy it.

Im no expert on Nietzsche, but he almost certainly would not say outright "we should no help people because is interferes with them embracing their suffering." Yes, he was reacting to Schopenhauer and has a good deal to say against the uncritical sympathy that Schopenhauer advocates in his ethics. However, there are very few virtues or values that Nietzsche outright rejects. Usually he sort of prunes and qualifies the values he is critiquing.

You are probably hoping to go in this direction because of some hing N. says along the lines of suffering is necessary for the overman and that suffering underlies all human greatness (Im really reaching in my memory for this so correct me if that isnt his argument). But this isnt to say that suffering is GOOD. Lots of people dont react to suffering by overcoming it or by valiantly developing traits of stoicism and courage or whatever. For these people suffering isnt going to develop them. In fact, one of the ways suffering creates greatness is by pushing some individuals to great feats of sympathy -e.g. Gandhi. The point is suffering is not good in an unqualified sense.

Really to say "dont help people because its good that they suffer" could be subject to a lot of the same criticisms Nietzsche makes or other ethical systems.

The better way to approach the K is that the other side uncritically accepts that suffering is bad. THIS is what N. has a problem with. Honestly this approach has a better link to pre-fiat solvency anyways, though I think you said you are LD and Im not really sure how K's work in LD.
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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10/24/2011 7:02:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/23/2011 10:37:56 PM, Johnicle wrote:
I'm about to dive into reading Nietzsche. Does anyone who's read it have any suggestions/comments?

Don't let him bum you out too much.
Raisor
Posts: 4,462
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10/24/2011 7:08:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/24/2011 7:02:25 PM, Wnope wrote:
At 10/23/2011 10:37:56 PM, Johnicle wrote:
I'm about to dive into reading Nietzsche. Does anyone who's read it have any suggestions/comments?

Don't let him bum you out too much.

I found him to actually be pretty motivating. Especially Zarathustra.

Actually by way of suggestions/comments: for the love of god find a good commentator to help you work through some of his stuff. Kauffman is always phenomenal when it comes to existentialism. Dont forget that nobody agrees on interpreting Nietzsche though- he is very challenging, but that is what draws people to him.
Johnicle
Posts: 888
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10/25/2011 1:37:44 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/24/2011 6:34:29 PM, Raisor wrote:
At 10/24/2011 2:30:03 PM, Johnicle wrote:
At 10/24/2011 1:39:47 AM, BlackVoid wrote:
Running dem kritiks?

lol yeah... but it's also helpful for the LD resolution. I.E. we should not help people because it interferes with them embracing their suffering.

But I'm also reading it because I think I would really enjoy it.

Im no expert on Nietzsche, but he almost certainly would not say outright "we should no help people because is interferes with them embracing their suffering." Yes, he was reacting to Schopenhauer and has a good deal to say against the uncritical sympathy that Schopenhauer advocates in his ethics. However, there are very few virtues or values that Nietzsche outright rejects. Usually he sort of prunes and qualifies the values he is critiquing.

You are probably hoping to go in this direction because of some hing N. says along the lines of suffering is necessary for the overman and that suffering underlies all human greatness (Im really reaching in my memory for this so correct me if that isnt his argument). But this isnt to say that suffering is GOOD. Lots of people dont react to suffering by overcoming it or by valiantly developing traits of stoicism and courage or whatever. For these people suffering isnt going to develop them. In fact, one of the ways suffering creates greatness is by pushing some individuals to great feats of sympathy -e.g. Gandhi. The point is suffering is not good in an unqualified sense.

Really to say "dont help people because its good that they suffer" could be subject to a lot of the same criticisms Nietzsche makes or other ethical systems.

The better way to approach the K is that the other side uncritically accepts that suffering is bad. THIS is what N. has a problem with. Honestly this approach has a better link to pre-fiat solvency anyways, though I think you said you are LD and Im not really sure how K's work in LD.

Well the argument is more of a criticism of pity. We never say suffering is good, but rather that pitying is bad.
Raisor
Posts: 4,462
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10/25/2011 9:18:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/25/2011 1:37:44 PM, Johnicle wrote:

Well the argument is more of a criticism of pity. We never say suffering is good, but rather that pitying is bad.

Mmmm, I still think that doesnt quite work- I have a hard time seeing that argument being convincing and I think there are much stronger ways to run Nietzsche K's. But what do I know, Im just some strange person on the internet. Talk to your coach about it.
JustCallMeTarzan
Posts: 1,922
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10/27/2011 8:17:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/27/2011 8:09:01 PM, GodSands wrote:
"A poster read: 'God is dead' - Nietzche.
The graffiti underneath read: 'Nietzche is dead' - God.".

Don't take comments like this one very seriously... anyone who thinks the "God is dead" quote actually refers to God has either never read Nietzsche, or did not understand it.
Raisor
Posts: 4,462
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10/27/2011 9:55:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/27/2011 8:17:22 PM, JustCallMeTarzan wrote:
At 10/27/2011 8:09:01 PM, GodSands wrote:
"A poster read: 'God is dead' - Nietzche.
The graffiti underneath read: 'Nietzche is dead' - God.".

Don't take comments like this one very seriously... anyone who thinks the "God is dead" quote actually refers to God has either never read Nietzsche, or did not understand it.

Well it does actually refer to God (as well as metaphorically refer to a bunch of metaphorically represented ideas). It just doenst mean "they existed but now theyre dead."
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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10/29/2011 11:24:24 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/23/2011 10:37:56 PM, Johnicle wrote:
I'm about to dive into reading Nietzsche. Does anyone who's read it have any suggestions/comments?:

Yeah, do you suffer from clinical depression? If so, don't read it.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)