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Luck, personal identity, and determinism

socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/15/2012 11:34:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
A big thing that I've seen from people (mostly from highly prosperous Western countries seeing as I don't know anyone from Uganda) is the idea that we're lucky to have been born in our specific situations; that we were born lucky and starving children in Ethiopia were simply born unlucky. From this a sort of guilty derivation of the need or responsibility for charity is conjured up.

I'm not saying charity is bad or that I don't feel charitable at times. I just have a problem with the initial premise, that there is any sort of luck which allows for whatever situation someone is born into. I'm not arguing about the non-existence of luck when we step back and actually analyze every factor that lead up to something either. What I mean is that there's not any way that the situation could have been any different in regards to one's life situation and one still be justified in calling the outcome of those differences *them* in any real sense.

Not that the world is necessarily deterministic (I'm honestly drawn a blank on the issue). But if what constitutes the self is only the sum of our parts (interests, preferences, beliefs, etc.) then if we were born in any other possible situation then some of those things would be different. And if they're different then we can't say that we are *them*. It seems to me that bundle theory implies a form of self determinism if that makes sense.

So for example, I had an extremely religious upbringing and as a consequence am made uneasy by being in churches sometimes. Bundle theory would say my self is constituted by this along with all of my other characteristics and nothing else. But if say I was raised in a more moderate religious tone I might still be a Christian or find organized religion totally normal. But then that wouldn't be me would it? If we're the sum of our parts and you change the parts then the sum necessarily changes too.

So there's no possible way for say me to have had a moderate religious upbringing and still be *me*, just as there's no way someone in Uganda could have instead been born to a wealthy American family and still be themselves. Luck just doesn't seem to be a factor from this perspective.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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9/16/2012 5:28:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Pretty thoughts.

Is this applicable in any practical way?

I'd say the meaning of an idea is weighed in what it actually accomplishes.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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9/16/2012 9:10:12 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Luck?

You were born here as part of the future one of your predecessors manufactured for his or her descendants. People in Third World countries suffer, because First World countries exploit them and their resources.
Ervin
Posts: 6
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9/16/2012 2:40:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/16/2012 5:28:06 AM, FREEDO wrote:
Pretty thoughts.

Is this applicable in any practical way?

I'd say the meaning of an idea is weighed in what it actually accomplishes.
lol, why?
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/17/2012 2:34:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Perhaps I should have put this in the stoner thread.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.