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Source of morality?

AlbinoBunny
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6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?
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StevenDixon
Posts: 178
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6/1/2013 6:28:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

We are

Depends on the morality one has

I judge it by reasoning out what is best based on my values. For instance, I value the well being of people, from this I believe a person ought not throw acid in the face of a girl because she wants to be educated.

Morality should have an end goal of human well being in some sense, if not...it's a pretty meaningless term.
AlbinoBunny
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6/1/2013 6:31:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:28:25 PM, StevenDixon wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

We are

Depends on the morality one has

In what way? Why?


I judge it by reasoning out what is best based on my values. For instance, I value the well being of people, from this I believe a person ought not throw acid in the face of a girl because she wants to be educated.

So do you place an axiomatic position on your values?


Morality should have an end goal of human well being in some sense, if not...it's a pretty meaningless term.

Should it? Do you place an axiomatic position on human well being?
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Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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6/1/2013 6:44:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

The Big Bang? Evolution? What do you mean by the "source"?


If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

Whichever morality conforms to societies subjective wants more. If we do not want to live in a society where people rape people, then which every morality deters this is better.


What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

More reproduction.
AlbinoBunny
Posts: 3,781
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6/1/2013 7:01:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:44:04 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

The Big Bang? Evolution? What do you mean by the "source"?

Why we created the concept, and why what the concept represents exists? Maybe you believe deities created it, or the Force created it, I have no idea.



If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

Whichever morality conforms to societies subjective wants more. If we do not want to live in a society where people rape people, then which every morality deters this is better.

So it's the sum total average of societies morality? Should it be based on what they believe morality should be as a whole? Or their core values, and extrapolated from there?



What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

More reproduction.

The continuation of the species / all life is the end goal of morality? Does the reduction of suffering come into it anywhere? Does suffering intrinsically affect reproduction, so is a necessary bi-product to reduce?
bladerunner060 | bsh1 , 2014! Presidency campaign!

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AlbinoBunny
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6/1/2013 7:01:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:44:49 PM, Bullish wrote:
Subjective.

Arbitrary?
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StevenDixon
Posts: 178
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6/1/2013 7:12:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:31:50 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:28:25 PM, StevenDixon wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

We are

Depends on the morality one has

In what way? Why?


I judge it by reasoning out what is best based on my values. For instance, I value the well being of people, from this I believe a person ought not throw acid in the face of a girl because she wants to be educated.

So do you place an axiomatic position on your values?


Morality should have an end goal of human well being in some sense, if not...it's a pretty meaningless term.

Should it? Do you place an axiomatic position on human well being?

We are as in without us morality wouldn't exist. I would say it depends on the morality one has whether or not everyone should have it because people may think it's moral to keep gays from getting married, that it's moral to throw acid in the face of young girls trying to get an education. I would rather these people not have these morals.

My values aren't axioms, I hold them for reasons but I wouldn't assert that they're objective by any means, but if we share common values then we can reason out what we ought do based on those, or I could try and convince you to hold the same values.

I think if we want to make morality a meaningful word then we should put some kind of qualification on it, if it's simply what a person ought do...this could lead to a lot of moral things that end in rape, murder, etc, depending on what the person values.

Right now, I'm addressing the simple "ought" definition.
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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6/1/2013 7:33:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
A code of morality is a set of concepts held by an individual which governs their behavior. There are many types, which can be picked up in various ways, either through cultural osmosis, indoctrination, willful adherence to given moral creed, or a synthesis of varying moral ideas. I think that the last one, if done in a reasonable manner, is best because it is the least prone to deleterious decisions.

I think that ideas of 'societal morality' don't make much sense; at that level things are dealt with on a legal, not a moral, basis. Such deliberations fall within the realm of political science and political philosophy, and deeming the morality which guides individual action as identical to the code of behavior which composes any given body of legislation is very misguided. It's the discrepancies between individual codes of morality which justify the adoption of laws, not the other way around.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
AlbinoBunny
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6/1/2013 7:42:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 7:33:51 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:

I think that ideas of 'societal morality' don't make much sense; at that level things are dealt with on a legal, not a moral, basis. Such deliberations fall within the realm of political science and political philosophy, and deeming the morality which guides individual action as identical to the code of behavior which composes any given body of legislation is very misguided. It's the discrepancies between individual codes of morality which justify the adoption of laws, not the other way around.

Clarify? The law has nothing to do with morality?
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Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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6/1/2013 7:54:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 7:42:20 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
At 6/1/2013 7:33:51 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:

I think that ideas of 'societal morality' don't make much sense; at that level things are dealt with on a legal, not a moral, basis. Such deliberations fall within the realm of political science and political philosophy, and deeming the morality which guides individual action as identical to the code of behavior which composes any given body of legislation is very misguided. It's the discrepancies between individual codes of morality which justify the adoption of laws, not the other way around.

Clarify? The law has nothing to do with morality?

Nothing to do with it? No, I wouldn't say that, only that it isn't based on it (as currently practiced in most countries) because there is no such thing as societal morality. It may correlate to morality, and I would expect it to, but it is not based upon it. One could argue that law in a theocracy is based on theocratic morality (morality derived from religious teachers) or that law in an autocracy is based on the morality of the autocrat. But in most republican forms of government, it is based on those principles which are necessary for society to function. Social contract theory and the political philosophy of rights delineate and justify the purview of the law's power, and the ability of a majority to impose commonly shared powers over the minority is deliberately curtailed precisely because it is not the role of those governments to impose widely shared moral values. It is to make sure that those disagreements over what is proper, morally, do not sabotage the mutually beneficial nature of society.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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6/1/2013 9:40:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 7:01:24 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:44:04 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

The Big Bang? Evolution? What do you mean by the "source"?

Why we created the concept, and why what the concept represents exists? Maybe you believe deities created it, or the Force created it, I have no idea.

It stems from subjective wants. If we did not want to live in a society where people killed all the time, it would not be "wrong". What is right or wrong is based on what we want. What we want is based on our emotions, and our emotions are based on chemical reactions. The chemical reactions are caused by x, x is caused by y, and we are right back at The Big Bang.




If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

Whichever morality conforms to societies subjective wants more. If we do not want to live in a society where people rape people, then which every morality deters this is better.

So it's the sum total average of societies morality? Should it be based on what they believe morality should be as a whole? Or their core values, and extrapolated from there?

Its only based on emotions and what we want. That's it. Do you want to live in a society where you have to worry about getting robbed? No? Then robbing is "wrong". If we had no such want to live in no such society, then no such rule would be needed.




What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

More reproduction.

The continuation of the species / all life is the end goal of morality? Does the reduction of suffering come into it anywhere? Does suffering intrinsically affect reproduction, so is a necessary bi-product to reduce?

Suffering and pain are biological deterrents from danger. If there was no pain, you could just sleep in a fire and burn to death and not care. You would die and not survive to spread your genes. If love did not feel good, you would have no reason to have sex (which also feels good) to reproduce. These things are naturally "wired" into us to we continue to our DNA. This is all we are here for.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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6/1/2013 9:42:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 7:01:24 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:44:04 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

Do you think we should have morality?

The Big Bang? Evolution? What do you mean by the "source"?

Why we created the concept, and why what the concept represents exists? Maybe you believe deities created it, or the Force created it, I have no idea.



If so, why?

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

Whichever morality conforms to societies subjective wants more. If we do not want to live in a society where people rape people, then which every morality deters this is better.

So it's the sum total average of societies morality? Should it be based on what they believe morality should be as a whole? Or their core values, and extrapolated from there?



What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

More reproduction.

The continuation of the species / all life is the end goal of morality? Does the reduction of suffering come into it anywhere? Does suffering intrinsically affect reproduction, so is a necessary bi-product to reduce?

Of course, many of us skip the love part and go to sex. This is just human intelligence finding short cuts haha
wiploc
Posts: 1,485
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6/2/2013 9:42:12 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 6/1/2013 6:14:43 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
What do you believe the source of morality is?

The question doesn't make sense. Do you ask what the source of curvature is?

Do you think we should have morality?

Of course.

If so, why?

Because we want that which morality facilitates.

How do you judge which morality is better than another form?

As a utilitarian, I judge other moralities by utilitarian principles.

What do you believe the end goal of morality is, if anything?

As a utilitarian, I believe that the goal of morality is increasing happiness.
Mysterious_Stranger
Posts: 1,562
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6/2/2013 11:26:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I believe the source of morality is other people, as when people are young they are taught or pick up morals from those around them. I also think that morals are necessary on most accounts as they prevent humans from falling among animals, however morality sometimes slows the process of things down greatly.
Turn around, go back.