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No time to think of God "

dattaswami
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10/7/2013 5:39:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Sometimes, I hear some people saying, "I have no time to think of God. I do not bother about God." Well. God is also not bothered about you either. If you care a pin for God, He will not care even a millionth pin for you, because in His eyes, this entire earth is not equal even to a pin-tip. It is you, who approach God every time for some favor. It is you, who always bother Him to break the legal way and protect you. Yes. He does it.

The kindest Lord pays [suffers] for your sins through His human form and protects both you and justice simultaneously. He wants your pure and real love for doing that. You may plead that you do not have that much pure and real love. No. No. No. You have it and you show it to your children. Give atleast a drop of it, proving that you really love God atleast a bit; even though not equal to your great child. Atleast stop this hypocritical love and stop asking Him for any favor.

Follow the path of justice and if you can still love Him without aspiring for any favour from Him, then that is real love or devotion. You love your child, even if he or she beats you. Don"t say that pure love is impossible. It is impossible only in the case of others, including God. First start loving and serving people who are other than your family, to get training in that path. Atleast do not grab the money of other people by cheating.

Business is also a licensed way of cheating others. Even if you are not loving and serving others, atleast do not grab their hard earned money by corruption. First, stop harming others. Then, start loving others. Then, start serving others. Now you are trained well and you are ready to love and serve God like Shaktuprastha.

Money is the root knot. It catches your throat. Therefore the Veda says "Dhanena tyagenaikena"" which means that sacrifice of money alone decides your love for God.
sdavio
Posts: 1,798
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10/7/2013 9:31:57 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'd find more convincing a proof of God derived from rationality rather than some non sequitur appeals to emotion like this. You must first define 'God' then justify belief in him before this stuff becomes philosophically interesting.
"Logic is the money of the mind." - Karl Marx
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/7/2013 10:26:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Creation of Life (God " Scientist)

When the energy, which is another form of matter, only does a special function, that special function or special mechanism or special technology is called as life. Thus, life is the special work of energy. The scientist is unable to make the energy to do this special work. The scientist is unable to know this special mechanism. Thus life is a special know-how or the knowledge of special technology. Since knowledge is power, the life can be called as special power.

Let me give you an example. A cook prepared a curry. With the same materials another cook prepared the same curry but with additional taste. This special taste is the life. The taste is not the extra material, which is hidden in the hand of second cook. The taste is only a special knowledge or talent of the second cook. The first cook is scientist and the second cook is God. God does not reveal this one special technology to human beings because the human being always wants to become God due to his inherent egoism and jealousy. Thus God saved the human being from its fall. One should constantly remember this point and constantly surrender to God.

At 10/7/2013 9:31:57 AM, sdavio wrote:
I'd find more convincing a proof of God derived from rationality rather than some non sequitur appeals to emotion like this. You must first define 'God' then justify belief in him before this stuff becomes philosophically interesting.
sdavio
Posts: 1,798
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10/7/2013 10:03:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 10:26:54 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Creation of Life (God " Scientist)

When the energy, which is another form of matter, only does a special function, that special function or special mechanism or special technology is called as life. Thus, life is the special work of energy. The scientist is unable to make the energy to do this special work. The scientist is unable to know this special mechanism. Thus life is a special know-how or the knowledge of special technology. Since knowledge is power, the life can be called as special power.

Let me give you an example. A cook prepared a curry. With the same materials another cook prepared the same curry but with additional taste. This special taste is the life. The taste is not the extra material, which is hidden in the hand of second cook. The taste is only a special knowledge or talent of the second cook. The first cook is scientist and the second cook is God. God does not reveal this one special technology to human beings because the human being always wants to become God due to his inherent egoism and jealousy. Thus God saved the human being from its fall. One should constantly remember this point and constantly surrender to God.

1. Can you provide a coherent definition of 'God'?

2. Can you define 'life' in the context you are using it?

3. What is it specifically about life which makes it unique?

4. How does the concept of God necessarily follow as the most logical consequence or explanation of this 'special ingredient' in life?
"Logic is the money of the mind." - Karl Marx
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/8/2013 12:32:29 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
1) God is completely unimaginable.

Proof for existence of unimaginable God beyond boundary of space:

The boundary of the Universe need not be made of the same material (five elements). A metallic wheel may have a plastic ring around its edge. Therefore, the boundary of the Universe need not be made of the same imaginable material. The boundary is unimaginable means that the boundary is made of unimaginable material i.e., God. Even if you say that the diameter of the Universe is some billions of light years, is there a compound wall in the edge of the boundary?

If there is such wall what is present beyond that wall? If you say that space is present beyond that wall, space is also a part of the Universe (one of the five elements). The theory of bending of the space around object proves that space is the most subtle energy. Therefore, the diameter of the Universe is infinite. The theory of constant expansion of Universe is also meaningless because expansion of any material requires the existence of space different from the material.

When space or subtle energy is the basic material of the Universe, the word "expansion" becomes ridiculous. The infinity of the Universe stands for the existence of unimaginable entity beyond the Universe existing from the boundary of Universe. Unless you accept the unimaginable region beyond the boundary of Universe, you cannot speak of the end of imaginable boundary of the Universe. All this discussion will clearly establish the existence of unimaginable region or God beyond the Universe.

2 & 3) Pure Awareness (Soul) requires existence of 2 items. One is inert energy that is obtained from digestion of food (Annat Purashah- Veda). Second is nervous system, which alone can convert this inert energy into awareness on functioning. So, awareness is dependent on these two items but God is independent & does not depend on any other item.

Life is Prana, or the oxygen maintained by the respiratory system, that is needed to oxidize the food taken by the digestive system. Life is present in plants. Mind requires a nervous system, which is developed in birds and animals. The main part of the nervous system is the brain, which is well developed in human beings. The plants have life but not awareness (awareness is negligible and can be treated as almost absent).

Life energy produced by the respiratory system exists even in plants, which do not have knowledge, love and bliss. But the same life energy associated with the nervous system becomes awareness, which is present in animals, birds and human beings.

Life energy is like the electricity produced from a turbine, which is like the respiratory system. This electricity enters a light bulb and is converted into light. Thus the life energy produced from the respiratory system is converted into awareness when it enters the "light bulb", which is the nervous system. So knowledge, love and bliss, which are the characteristics of awareness, exist in birds, animals and all human beings.

Plants can be included under the item of living beings but not under the item of awareness (soul).

At 10/7/2013 10:03:04 PM, sdavio wrote:
1. Can you provide a coherent definition of 'God'?

2. Can you define 'life' in the context you are using it?

3. What is it specifically about life which makes it unique?

4. How does the concept of God necessarily follow as the most logical consequence or explanation of this 'special ingredient' in life?
sdavio
Posts: 1,798
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10/9/2013 7:02:47 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/8/2013 12:32:29 AM, dattaswami wrote:
1) God is completely unimaginable.

I will assume this is the extent of your definition, unless / until you provide more characteristics.

It's unclear though, how this definition might function; there are a few possible interpretations:

1. The word "God" is a synonym for "completely unimaginable." Therefore it could simply function anywhere in language where one could otherwise coherently use that phrase.

Ie:

- "I find a square circle completely unimaginable."
- "I find a square circle God."

2. "God" could be the name of a set, and that anything "completely unimaginable" comes under the set named "God." For example, "fauna" is a set name, under which turtles, birds, bears, etc, fall. In the same way, "God" might be a set under which square circles, infinity, nothingness etc all fall.

3. "God" could be a being whose defining characteristic is that He is unimaginable. However, I can't imagine any perceivable difference where, in practical use, this interpretation would differ from the others.

Let's take your examples basically talking about the "edges of the universe."

I agree that we cannot conceive of what lies beyond the edges of the universe; but if you are arguing for the third interpretation of your definition, you must address the reason to say:

"The edges of the universe are a completely unimaginable being."

Rather than:

"The edges of the universe are completely unimaginable."

In other words, while you have presented very convincing evidence that the edges of the universe are unimaginable, you are yet to explain where God comes into this; as being separate from simply the phrase "completely unimaginable."
"Logic is the money of the mind." - Karl Marx
Orangatang
Posts: 442
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10/9/2013 5:23:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/7/2013 5:39:25 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Sometimes, I hear some people saying, "I have no time to think of God. I do not bother about God." Well. God is also not bothered about you either. If you care a pin for God, He will not care even a millionth pin for you, because in His eyes, this entire earth is not equal even to a pin-tip. It is you, who approach God every time for some favor. It is you, who always bother Him to break the legal way and protect you. Yes. He does it.

The kindest Lord pays [suffers] for your sins through His human form and protects both you and justice simultaneously. He wants your pure and real love for doing that. You may plead that you do not have that much pure and real love. No. No. No. You have it and you show it to your children. Give atleast a drop of it, proving that you really love God atleast a bit; even though not equal to your great child. Atleast stop this hypocritical love and stop asking Him for any favor.

Follow the path of justice and if you can still love Him without aspiring for any favour from Him, then that is real love or devotion. You love your child, even if he or she beats you. Don"t say that pure love is impossible. It is impossible only in the case of others, including God. First start loving and serving people who are other than your family, to get training in that path. Atleast do not grab the money of other people by cheating.

Business is also a licensed way of cheating others. Even if you are not loving and serving others, atleast do not grab their hard earned money by corruption. First, stop harming others. Then, start loving others. Then, start serving others. Now you are trained well and you are ready to love and serve God like Shaktuprastha.

Money is the root knot. It catches your throat. Therefore the Veda says "Dhanena tyagenaikena"" which means that sacrifice of money alone decides your love for God.

It seems like your message is pure and noble but you are arriving there for the wrong reason (God). You should be loving, caring, and non-corrupt because you recognize human empathy and solidarity. Doing all these things for some other supernatural being just denigrates yourself and your whole moral being. You are moral because it is innate in us, and you should never tell yourself you would not be moral if it wasn't for some God.
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dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/10/2013 12:42:03 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Kindness of God "

Souls [might] have done continuous sins and continuous good deeds and if the results are to be given in the same sequence and span of time, there will be continuous punishments for a long time and continuous happiness for another span of long time. It will be like summer for one whole year and winter for one whole year. But the kindest God has re-arranged our results in such a manner that our human life is made up of alternate good and bad results. Hence, we will have summer for two months and winter for two months so that the two years are made up of alternate couple of months of summer and winter. This way, neither summer nor winter gets boring due to continuity and the two one-year spans of summer and winter get exhausted.

The punishments are used to remove ignorance and happiness is given as an interval between punishments. The punishments are also selected in such a way that their intensity is suitable to the frequency of requirement for the transformation in the life again and again [God chooses the appropriate duration and intensity of punishment for a soul, repeatedly in his life, depending on the soul"s degree of ignorance, so as to achieve maximum transformation in the soul]. This means that a particular soul requires a particular punishment of a specific intensity, suitable to the degree of ignorance of the soul. Based on the same, the duration of the punishment also varies from one soul to another.

According to the requirement, a suitable portion from the sinful results is cut like a piece from a large cake. The size of the piece depends on the requirement based on the nature of the soul. The sizes of the pieces of the salty cake (bad result) and the sweet cake (good result) depend upon the duration and intensity of treatment required by the nature of the soul. The salt cake is a medicine for the soul"s ignorance and the sweet cake is the food that has to be given during the treatment to the patient-soul.

The leftover portions of both cakes are exhausted, by giving them to the soul in the external hell and heaven in the upper world. Whatever may be the place (hell, heaven or earth), the punishments are given for the treatment of ignorance alone. On earth, the punishments are used as medicines but in hell, the punishments are used as the final surgery for removing the ignorance. In any case, only the kindness of God is reflected. Thus, God can be seen as Father, Teacher or Doctor giving medicines or as a Surgeon doing an operation. In all angles His kindness alone is reflected.

At 10/9/2013 5:23:21 PM, Orangatang wrote:
It seems like your message is pure and noble but you are arriving there for the wrong reason (God). You should be loving, caring, and non-corrupt because you recognize human empathy and solidarity. Doing all these things for some other supernatural being just denigrates yourself and your whole moral being. You are moral because it is innate in us, and you should never tell yourself you would not be moral if it wasn't for some God.
Orangatang
Posts: 442
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10/10/2013 12:56:29 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/10/2013 12:42:03 AM, dattaswami wrote:
Kindness of God "

Souls [might] have done continuous sins and continuous good deeds and if the results are to be given in the same sequence and span of time, there will be continuous punishments for a long time and continuous happiness for another span of long time. It will be like summer for one whole year and winter for one whole year. But the kindest God has re-arranged our results in such a manner that our human life is made up of alternate good and bad results. Hence, we will have summer for two months and winter for two months so that the two years are made up of alternate couple of months of summer and winter. This way, neither summer nor winter gets boring due to continuity and the two one-year spans of summer and winter get exhausted.

The punishments are used to remove ignorance and happiness is given as an interval between punishments. The punishments are also selected in such a way that their intensity is suitable to the frequency of requirement for the transformation in the life again and again [God chooses the appropriate duration and intensity of punishment for a soul, repeatedly in his life, depending on the soul"s degree of ignorance, so as to achieve maximum transformation in the soul]. This means that a particular soul requires a particular punishment of a specific intensity, suitable to the degree of ignorance of the soul. Based on the same, the duration of the punishment also varies from one soul to another.

According to the requirement, a suitable portion from the sinful results is cut like a piece from a large cake. The size of the piece depends on the requirement based on the nature of the soul. The sizes of the pieces of the salty cake (bad result) and the sweet cake (good result) depend upon the duration and intensity of treatment required by the nature of the soul. The salt cake is a medicine for the soul"s ignorance and the sweet cake is the food that has to be given during the treatment to the patient-soul.

The leftover portions of both cakes are exhausted, by giving them to the soul in the external hell and heaven in the upper world. Whatever may be the place (hell, heaven or earth), the punishments are given for the treatment of ignorance alone. On earth, the punishments are used as medicines but in hell, the punishments are used as the final surgery for removing the ignorance. In any case, only the kindness of God is reflected. Thus, God can be seen as Father, Teacher or Doctor giving medicines or as a Surgeon doing an operation. In all angles His kindness alone is reflected.

Well, at this point I do not think we can have a meaningful conversation. You make too many analogies and generalities. Ambiguities are also present whenever one brings up the concept of souls. Good luck with whatever you are using to make sense of the world, I would just like to offer the knowledge that logic is better.
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dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/10/2013 4:36:39 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
The examples will make the concept to understand in an easy way.

The concept of soul is very simple and there need not be any ambiguities.

Human being consists of causal body (soul or pure awareness), subtle body (bundle of qualities or samskaras) and gross body. The combination of causal and subtle bodies is called the Jeevatman. This Jeevatman is different in different people.

Qualities are exhibited when awareness exists only.

Waves exist in water only. This is similar to qualities in awareness i.e., a man having awareness can only exhibit qualities. When awareness does not exist (like in inert objects or people in deep sleep) qualities are not exhibited.

Pure Awareness (Soul) requires existence of 2 items. One is inert energy that is obtained from digestion of food (Annat Purashah- Veda). Second is nervous system, which alone can convert this inert energy into awareness on functioning.

So, awareness is dependent on these two items but God is independent & does not depend on any other item.

At 10/10/2013 12:56:29 AM, Orangatang wrote:
Well, at this point I do not think we can have a meaningful conversation. You make too many analogies and generalities. Ambiguities are also present whenever one brings up the concept of souls. Good luck with whatever you are using to make sense of the world, I would just like to offer the knowledge that logic is better.