Total Posts:8|Showing Posts:1-8
Jump to topic:

The 'golden rule' is illogical.

themohawkninja
Posts: 816
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

Therefore, while the golden rule may work for small children who have yet to develop a sense of self, the golden rule should not be applied to older children and adults.
"Morals are simply a limit to man's potential."~Myself

Political correctness is like saying you can't have a steak, because a baby can't eat one ~Unknown
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 10:58:17 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

This example is superficial and no one ever really things about the Golden Rule like that. In the example of the sadomasochist, who derives pleasure from pain, the Golden Rule wouldn't require that they hurt other people. The Golden Rule is not a template for specific actions, but rather a general method of behavior.

Therefore, while the golden rule may work for small children who have yet to develop a sense of self, the golden rule should not be applied to older children and adults.
themohawkninja
Posts: 816
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 11:02:37 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/29/2013 10:58:17 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

This example is superficial and no one ever really things about the Golden Rule like that. In the example of the sadomasochist, who derives pleasure from pain, the Golden Rule wouldn't require that they hurt other people. The Golden Rule is not a template for specific actions, but rather a general method of behavior.

Therefore, while the golden rule may work for small children who have yet to develop a sense of self, the golden rule should not be applied to older children and adults.

If it's a general method for behavior, than why aren't children taught that it should be taken 100% literally with no exceptions?
"Morals are simply a limit to man's potential."~Myself

Political correctness is like saying you can't have a steak, because a baby can't eat one ~Unknown
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 11:12:18 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/29/2013 11:02:37 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
At 10/29/2013 10:58:17 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

This example is superficial and no one ever really things about the Golden Rule like that. In the example of the sadomasochist, who derives pleasure from pain, the Golden Rule wouldn't require that they hurt other people. The Golden Rule is not a template for specific actions, but rather a general method of behavior.

Therefore, while the golden rule may work for small children who have yet to develop a sense of self, the golden rule should not be applied to older children and adults.

If it's a general method for behavior, than why aren't children taught that it should be taken 100% literally with no exceptions?

Because it shouldn't be taken literally with no exceptions. It should be used as a general guideline for behavior that it is.
themohawkninja
Posts: 816
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 11:29:04 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/29/2013 11:12:18 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 11:02:37 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
At 10/29/2013 10:58:17 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

This example is superficial and no one ever really things about the Golden Rule like that. In the example of the sadomasochist, who derives pleasure from pain, the Golden Rule wouldn't require that they hurt other people. The Golden Rule is not a template for specific actions, but rather a general method of behavior.

Therefore, while the golden rule may work for small children who have yet to develop a sense of self, the golden rule should not be applied to older children and adults.

If it's a general method for behavior, than why aren't children taught that it should be taken 100% literally with no exceptions?

Because it shouldn't be taken literally with no exceptions. It should be used as a general guideline for behavior that it is.

Is it too much of an assumption to say that the age at which children are taught the golden rule is probably be too young for them to understand non-literal speech?
"Morals are simply a limit to man's potential."~Myself

Political correctness is like saying you can't have a steak, because a baby can't eat one ~Unknown
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 11:38:37 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/29/2013 11:29:04 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
At 10/29/2013 11:12:18 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 11:02:37 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
At 10/29/2013 10:58:17 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

This example is superficial and no one ever really things about the Golden Rule like that. In the example of the sadomasochist, who derives pleasure from pain, the Golden Rule wouldn't require that they hurt other people. The Golden Rule is not a template for specific actions, but rather a general method of behavior.

Therefore, while the golden rule may work for small children who have yet to develop a sense of self, the golden rule should not be applied to older children and adults.

If it's a general method for behavior, than why aren't children taught that it should be taken 100% literally with no exceptions?

Because it shouldn't be taken literally with no exceptions. It should be used as a general guideline for behavior that it is.

Is it too much of an assumption to say that the age at which children are taught the golden rule is probably be too young for them to understand non-literal speech?

I thought you were saying it was the exact opposite.
The_Fool_on_the_hill
Posts: 6,071
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/29/2013 12:53:12 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/29/2013 10:58:17 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 10/29/2013 9:32:19 AM, themohawkninja wrote:
Golden Rule: Treat others as you would like to be treated.

This old adage that is considered a very basic, if not common sense way of looking at how we should treat people is illogical. While it may work for small children, once these kids begin to develop a sense of self (differing themselves from everyone else), the golden rule can quite easily break down.

Take the concept of what jokes we find funny. Some people, like my friends and I, will say highly offensive jokes to each other that would otherwise be a horrific insult to the others' ethnicity/appearance, however we view them as jokes, and not insults, and therefore we all laugh. If I were to see a random person who belongs to the demographic of one or more of the jokes that we make, the golden rule would tell me to make the joke towards this random person, as they may make the same back at me, however what may end up happening is that the person sees my as very rude and offensive, and is in no way amused.

Another way to look at this is sadomasochism. If a sadomasochist were to apply the golden rule to their life, they would most certainly be put in jail on charges of assault/physical harassment. Such people need to be responsible enough to know that what they like isn't always what other people like, and therefore they shouldn't do what pleases them to other people, as it won't please other people.

This example is superficial and no one ever really things about the Golden Rule like that. In the example of the sadomasochist, who derives pleasure from pain, the Golden Rule wouldn't require that they hurt other people. The Golden Rule is not a template for specific actions, but rather a general method of behavior.

The Fool: There's a better refutation than that.

The sadomasochist clich", doesn't work, because there's a difference between physical pain, and overall suffering, and physical pleasure, and overall well-being. So the person who is inviting the physical pain is not inviting, overall suffering. In the well-being sense. People who have the fantasy, and are turned on by that kind of sexual play, get an accentuated sense of pleasure which overrides, the physical pain, in that moment. So it doesn't amount to what we would call suffering.

So insofar as it is only temporarily, and not permanent, you are treating them like one would want to be treated, insofar as well-being is concerned. So doesn't really work.

For example, I've been with many woman, who like to have their hair pulled, from behind particularly when having orgasm, or getting close.

Where the overall pleasure and/or orgasm, covers up the negative sensation that would normally be caused from the physical pain, and instead, acts as a magnifier to the pleasure, if done, with the right amount of pressure, at the right time.

But it is like dancing, some people got it, and some people don't. And it may be teachable, to a small group of others, over time and practice .

But the Fool, himself, that is, myself, am natural dancer.

<(89)

For you have to know where she is @. And it might take some time, to get used finding those critical moments. And knowing your partner. What hurts one girl, the other girl loves, so it's not the simple.

But there's a general pattern. And it depends on how experienced they are. I would not advise that with a Virgin.. Unless she's very cool.

<(8D)

Straight from the hill
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL