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# Is an object the same object if...

 Posts: 1,633 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PMPosted: 3 years agoAll parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?A True Work of Art: http://www.debate.org... Atheist Logic: http://www.debate.org... Bulproof formally admits to being a troll (Post 16): http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 7,126 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/27/2014 9:27:28 PMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?http://en.wikipedia.org...Assistant moderator to airmax1227. PM me with any questions or concerns!
 Posts: 1,633 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/27/2014 9:28:54 PMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/27/2014 9:27:28 PM, bladerunner060 wrote:At 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?http://en.wikipedia.org...Crap. Original discussion is nearly impossible.A True Work of Art: http://www.debate.org... Atheist Logic: http://www.debate.org... Bulproof formally admits to being a troll (Post 16): http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 24,668 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/27/2014 9:54:53 PMPosted: 3 years agoI would ecentially say that you have a new chair.-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-Lannan13'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- "If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill "No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt "Sometimes it is hell, trying to get to heaven."- Undertaker Keep a Positive Mental Attitude! DDO Hall of Famer
 Posts: 9,470 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/27/2014 10:08:55 PMPosted: 3 years agoIt all depends on how you are defining the object. If you define the chair specifically as the tool for sitting that is in space X, and you change all the part, if it remains in space X; it is still the same object by definition. If you define it as the chair as an object with certain particular parts, and you change them, then it isn't the same object.It boils down to semantics.
 Posts: 1,172 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/28/2014 2:54:35 AMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/27/2014 10:08:55 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:It all depends on how you are defining the object. If you define the chair specifically as the tool for sitting that is in space X, and you change all the part, if it remains in space X; it is still the same object by definition. If you define it as the chair as an object with certain particular parts, and you change them, then it isn't the same object.It boils down to semantics.What if someone replace totally, Honda (parts) with Mercedes (parts) from your Garage (space X), it won't be as same as you defined. The "Object" itself contains the definition to specify both, its Space as well as its particular Parts.Remove the "I want", remainder is the "peace". ~Al-Ghazali~ "This time will also pass", a dose to cure both; the excitement & the grievance. ~Ayaz~
 Posts: 2,460 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/28/2014 10:41:10 AMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?It's still a chair, but obviously not the same chair, you have replaced it.
 Posts: 5,700 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/30/2014 11:03:53 AMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?I'd say its essence stays the same - that is to say, it was a chair and still remains a chair. The question arises though if it is the same chair. I'd have to say no, based solely on the fact that to say it is the same chair would mean it is of the same parts. Can we place an image of the chair with it's old legs next to a picture of the chair with it's new legs and say they are the same image? No, we cannot. Hence, while it is still a chair, it is not the same chair. Debate.org Deputy Vote Moderator ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ DDO Voting Guide: http://www.debate.org... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Need a judge on your debate? Nominate me! http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 480 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/31/2014 6:58:20 PMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?What objective test would you use to settle the matter?
 Posts: 1,633 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/31/2014 7:02:02 PMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/31/2014 6:58:20 PM, apb4y wrote:At 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?What objective test would you use to settle the matter?I don't know; I'm asking you.A True Work of Art: http://www.debate.org... Atheist Logic: http://www.debate.org... Bulproof formally admits to being a troll (Post 16): http://www.debate.org...
 Posts: 480 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/31/2014 11:39:51 PMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/31/2014 7:02:02 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:At 8/31/2014 6:58:20 PM, apb4y wrote:At 8/27/2014 9:15:58 PM, LogicalLunatic wrote:All parts are replaced?For instance, let's say you have a chair. An old chair.One of the legs breaks. So you replace that chair leg with a new one.After you're done, you think about it and each leg of the chair except for the one that you just replaced looks weak, fragile, cracked. So, you replace every leg of the chair.A month later, you're sitting on the chair and your butt falls through it. So, you replace the part that you sit on.Then, just because you've already replaced all the other parts, you replace the part that you rest your back against.Is it the same chair that it was before you started replacing parts?What objective test would you use to settle the matter?I don't know; I'm asking you.Answer: there isn't one. Therefore the debate is moot and we should all do something else with our time.
 Posts: 5,215 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/31/2014 11:53:29 PMPosted: 3 years agoIt would not be the same object. You replaced the entire chair. If you put the original pieces to the side, after you were done replacing every single piece, you can build two chairs. They are two different chairs.Victory is ours: https://www.youtube.com... The Battle Is On: ttps://www.youtube.com... Heros: https://www.youtube.com... Battle for Europe: https://www.youtube.com... Wait for Me: https://www.youtube.com...
 Posts: 3,749 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 9/2/2014 3:31:53 AMPosted: 3 years agoAt 8/31/2014 11:53:29 PM, SamStevens wrote:It would not be the same object. You replaced the entire chair. If you put the original pieces to the side, after you were done replacing every single piece, you can build two chairs. They are two different chairs.Between 98% and 99% of the atoms in your body are exchanged every year, and over five years they all change, not a single atom in your body was there five years ago.The question becomes, are you and person you were five years ago two different people?"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater