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What fallacy is this?

Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
bsh1
Posts: 27,503
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11/3/2014 6:29:14 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
It's circular logic, plus it seems like a bare assertion fallacy.
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emospongebob527
Posts: 790
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11/3/2014 6:39:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It's a mix of the bare assertion fallacy, circular reasoning, and an argument from authority.
"not to toot my own horn (it aint need no tooin if u know what im saying), but my writings on "viciousness: the one true viture (fancy spelling for virtue)" and my poem "A poem I wrote about DDO" put me in a class of my damn own. im just an UNRECONGIZED geniuse" -bananafana
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/3/2014 7:05:46 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:39:11 PM, emospongebob527 wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It's a mix of the bare assertion fallacy, circular reasoning, and an argument from authority.

Okay thank you. I did not know you could commit more than one fallacy.
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/3/2014 7:06:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:29:14 PM, bsh1 wrote:
It's circular logic, plus it seems like a bare assertion fallacy.

Thank you. I do hate thus fallacy so. My father used it all the time.
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?
dylancatlow
Posts: 12,242
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11/3/2014 7:23:56 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It's primarily an argument from authority, since the second half does nothing to advance the argument. "It is true because I believe it" would supposedly be enough (but, of course, it's not).
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/3/2014 7:40:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?

That depends on how you define relativism.

If relativism is the belief that there's no absolute truth, then I am not a relativist because I happen to believe absolute truth does exist.

If relativism is the belief that different people can have different views about what's true and not true then I am a relativist.

I think truth itself is objective but what people think about the truth is subjective. Whether people believe the truth or not is also subjective.

Examples of absolute truth.
Humans can be found on Earth.
The sun emits heat and light.
Humans all die eventually.

You are free to decide if you wish to see me as a relativist or not. It makes no difference to what I believe.
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/3/2014 7:50:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 7:40:11 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?

That depends on how you define relativism.

If relativism is the belief that there's no absolute truth, then I am not a relativist because I happen to believe absolute truth does exist.

If relativism is the belief that different people can have different views about what's true and not true then I am a relativist.

I think truth itself is objective but what people think about the truth is subjective. Whether people believe the truth or not is also subjective.

Examples of absolute truth.
Humans can be found on Earth.
The sun emits heat and light.
Humans all die eventually.

You are free to decide if you wish to see me as a relativist or not. It makes no difference to what I believe.
Okay, that makes sense. I like how you said that. Thank you for helping me.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/3/2014 8:32:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 7:50:33 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:40:11 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?

That depends on how you define relativism.

If relativism is the belief that there's no absolute truth, then I am not a relativist because I happen to believe absolute truth does exist.

If relativism is the belief that different people can have different views about what's true and not true then I am a relativist.

I think truth itself is objective but what people think about the truth is subjective. Whether people believe the truth or not is also subjective.

Examples of absolute truth.
Humans can be found on Earth.
The sun emits heat and light.
Humans all die eventually.

You are free to decide if you wish to see me as a relativist or not. It makes no difference to what I believe.
Okay, that makes sense. I like how you said that. Thank you for helping me.

You're welcome.
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/3/2014 8:48:51 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 8:32:23 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:50:33 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:40:11 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?

That depends on how you define relativism.

If relativism is the belief that there's no absolute truth, then I am not a relativist because I happen to believe absolute truth does exist.

If relativism is the belief that different people can have different views about what's true and not true then I am a relativist.

I think truth itself is objective but what people think about the truth is subjective. Whether people believe the truth or not is also subjective.

Examples of absolute truth.
Humans can be found on Earth.
The sun emits heat and light.
Humans all die eventually.

You are free to decide if you wish to see me as a relativist or not. It makes no difference to what I believe.
Okay, that makes sense. I like how you said that. Thank you for helping me.

You're welcome.

You up for a friendly debate? I want to improve my debate skills.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/3/2014 9:05:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 8:48:51 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 8:32:23 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:50:33 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:40:11 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?

That depends on how you define relativism.

If relativism is the belief that there's no absolute truth, then I am not a relativist because I happen to believe absolute truth does exist.

If relativism is the belief that different people can have different views about what's true and not true then I am a relativist.

I think truth itself is objective but what people think about the truth is subjective. Whether people believe the truth or not is also subjective.

Examples of absolute truth.
Humans can be found on Earth.
The sun emits heat and light.
Humans all die eventually.

You are free to decide if you wish to see me as a relativist or not. It makes no difference to what I believe.
Okay, that makes sense. I like how you said that. Thank you for helping me.

You're welcome.

You up for a friendly debate? I want to improve my debate skills.

That depends what you want to debate about. My debate skills are not great either.
I prefer informal discussions.
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/3/2014 10:02:53 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 9:05:18 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 8:48:51 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 8:32:23 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:50:33 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:40:11 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 7:07:52 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:28:22 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It is a misconception based on faulty reasoning.
"X" is not true or false because someone believes it is true or false.
"X" simply is what it is regardless of whether people believe it is true or false.

Any judgment regarding whether something is true or false is subjective.
I agree, are you a relativist?

That depends on how you define relativism.

If relativism is the belief that there's no absolute truth, then I am not a relativist because I happen to believe absolute truth does exist.

If relativism is the belief that different people can have different views about what's true and not true then I am a relativist.

I think truth itself is objective but what people think about the truth is subjective. Whether people believe the truth or not is also subjective.

Examples of absolute truth.
Humans can be found on Earth.
The sun emits heat and light.
Humans all die eventually.

You are free to decide if you wish to see me as a relativist or not. It makes no difference to what I believe.
Okay, that makes sense. I like how you said that. Thank you for helping me.

You're welcome.

You up for a friendly debate? I want to improve my debate skills.

That depends what you want to debate about. My debate skills are not great either.
I prefer informal discussions.

I like your honesty. When you get better, lemme know so we can debate.
philochristos
Posts: 2,614
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11/4/2014 12:05:42 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

At first glance, it looks like the fallacy of circular reasoning. But upon closer inspection, it may be the fallacy of equivocation. The word being equivocated on is "because." The first use of "because" appears to being using the cause/effect sense of "because." Me believing it causes it to be true. The second use of "because" appears to be using the ground/consequent sense of "because." It being true is the grounds upon which I believe it.

If there is an equivocation on the two uses of "because," then the statement is not circular reasoning.
"Not to know of what things one should demand demonstration, and of what one should not, argues want of education." ~Aristotle

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~Aristotle
SitaraMusica
Posts: 1,060
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11/4/2014 3:40:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 12:05:42 AM, philochristos wrote:
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

At first glance, it looks like the fallacy of circular reasoning. But upon closer inspection, it may be the fallacy of equivocation. The word being equivocated on is "because." The first use of "because" appears to being using the cause/effect sense of "because." Me believing it causes it to be true. The second use of "because" appears to be using the ground/consequent sense of "because." It being true is the grounds upon which I believe it.

If there is an equivocation on the two uses of "because," then the statement is not circular reasoning.

Thank you for helping me. There are so many fallacies to learn about.
Wocambs
Posts: 1,505
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11/4/2014 6:24:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/3/2014 6:12:50 PM, SitaraMusica wrote:
It is true because I believe it, and I believe it because it is true.

It's pure self-contradiction to assert that there reason something is true is because you believe it, but you only believe things that have already been established to be true. That's the formal fallacy being committed. 'It's true because I say it is' is the informal fallacy of appealing to authority, but it's not a bare assertion because the assertions are qualified, and it's not circular reasoning because it's not actually an argument but a conjunction of two propositions, which is why it's self-contradictory. The circular arguments would be:

Everything I assert is true, therefore anything I assert is true
I believe only what is true, therefore everything I believe is true

It's not equivocation either because ambiguity is not being abused. It would only look like equivocation because two mutually contradictory things are being asserted.