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Has every sentence been spoken.

Mhykiel
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12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.
Chuz-Life
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12/28/2014 12:33:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.


That might have been a new one. :)

https://www.bing.com...
"Sooner or later, the Supreme Court of the Unites States is going to have explain how a 'child in the womb' is a person enough to be recognized as a MURDER victim under our fetal homicide laws but how they are not persons enough to qualify for any other Constitutional protections" ~ Chuz Life

http://www.debate.org...
Mhykiel
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12/28/2014 12:52:47 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:33:37 AM, Chuz-Life wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.


That might have been a new one. :)

https://www.bing.com...

Dang good catch. Surely someone has pondered the same tho.
Chuz-Life
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12/28/2014 1:05:19 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:52:47 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:33:37 AM, Chuz-Life wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.


That might have been a new one. :)

https://www.bing.com...

Dang good catch. Surely someone has pondered the same tho.

Maybe not though. :)
"Sooner or later, the Supreme Court of the Unites States is going to have explain how a 'child in the womb' is a person enough to be recognized as a MURDER victim under our fetal homicide laws but how they are not persons enough to qualify for any other Constitutional protections" ~ Chuz Life

http://www.debate.org...
dylancatlow
Posts: 12,242
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1/1/2015 4:17:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

It's very easy to come up with a sentence that has never been said anywhere on the web. Obviously a web search not a complete survey of everything that has been said, but I think this indicates that relatively normal-sounding sentences are actually far more unique than you'd think. In all likelihood, the previous sentence has never been said word for word.
PeacefulChaos
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1/1/2015 11:44:41 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

This is really bothering me now lol
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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1/1/2015 2:01:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I don't think so, considering that it is possible to make absolutely enormous, yet still grammatically sound sentences. There is literally no limit.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
Skepsikyma
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1/1/2015 2:11:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
An example would be this absurdly long sentence from Faulkner's Absalom, Absalom!:

"Just exactly like father if father had known as much about it the night before I went out there as he did the day after I came back thinking Mad impotent old man who realized at last that there must be some limit even to the capabilities of a demon for doing harm, who must have seen his situation as that of the show girl, the pony, who realizes that the principle tune she prances comes not from horn and fiddle and drum but from a clock and calendar, must have seen himself as the old wornout cannon which realizes that it can deliver just one more fierce shot and crumble to dust in its own furious blast and recoil, who looked about upon the scene which was still within his scope and compass and saw son gone, vanished, more insuperable to him now than if the son were dead since now (if the son still lived) his name would be different and those to call him by it strangers, and whatever dragon's outcropping of Sutpen blood the son might sow on the body of whatever strange woman would therefore carry on the tradition, accomplish the hereditary evil and harm under another name and upon and among people who will never have heard the right one; daughter doomed to spinsterhood who had chosen spinsterhood already before there was anyone named Charles Bon since the aunt who came to succor her in bereavement and sorrow found neither but instead that calm absolutely impenetrable face between a homespun dress and sunbonnet seen before a closed door and again in a cloudy swirl of chickens while Jones was building the coffin and which she wore during the next year while the aunt lived there and the three women wove their own garments and raised their own food and cut the wood they cooked it with (excusing what help they had from Jones who lived with his granddaughter in the abandoned fishing camp with its collapsing roof and rotting porch against which the rusty scythe which Sutpen was to lend him, make him borrow to cut away the weeds from the door"at last forced him to use though not to cut weeds, at least not vegetable weeds"would lean for war years) and wore still after the aunt's indignation had swept her back to town to live on stolen garden truck and out of anonymous baskets left on her front steps at night, the three of them, the two daughters Negro and white and the aunt twelve miles away watching from her distance as the two daughters watched from theirs the old demon, the ancient varicose and despairing Faustus fling his final main now with the Creditor's hand already on his shoulder, running his little country store now for his bread and meat, haggling tediously over nickels and dimes with rapacious and poverty-stricken whites and Negroes, who at one time could have galloped for ten miles in any direction without crossing his own boundary, using out of his meager stock the cheap ribbons and beads and the stale violently colored candy with which even an old man can seduce a fifteen-year-old country girl, to ruin the granddaughter of his partner, this Jones"this gangling malaria-ridden white man whom he had given permission fourteen years ago to squat in the abandoned fishing camp with the year-old grandchild"Jones, partner porter and clerk who at the demon's command removed with his own hand (and maybe delivered too) from the showcase the candy beads and ribbons, measured the very cloth from which Judith (who had not been bereaved and did not mourn) helped the granddaughter to fashion a dress to walk past the lounging men in, the sidelooking and the tongues, until her increasing belly taught her embarrassment"or perhaps fear"Jones who before '62 had not even been allowed to approach the front of the house and who during the next four years got no nearer than the kitchen door and that only when he brought the game and fish and vegetables on which the seducer-to-He's wife and daughter (and Clytie too, the one remaining servant, Negro, the one who would forbid him to pass the kitchen door with what he brought) depended on to keep life in them, but who now entered the house itself on the (quite frequent now) afternoons when the demon would suddenly curse the store empty of customers and lock the door and repair to the rear and in the same tone in which he used to address his orderly or even his house servants when he had them (and in which he doubtless ordered Jones to fetch from the showcase the ribbons and beads and candy) direct Jones to fetch the jug, the two of them (and Jones even sitting now who in the old days, the old dead Sunday afternoons of monotonous peace which they spent beneath the scuppernong arbor in the backyard, the demon lying in the hammock while Jones squatted against a post, rising from time to time to pour for the demon from the demijohn and the bucket of spring water which he had fetched from the spring more than a mile away then squatting again, chortling and chuckling and saying 'Sho, Mister Tawm' each time the demon paused)"the two of them drinking turn and turn about from the jug and the demon not lying down now nor even sitting but reaching after the third or second drink that old man's state of impotent and furious undefeat in which he would rise, swaying and plunging and shouting for his horse and pistols to ride single-handed into Washington and shoot Lincoln (a year or so too late here) and Sherman both, shouting, 'Kill them! Shoot them down like the dogs they are!" and Jones."

Sho, Kernel; sho now' and catching him as he fell and commandeering the first passing wagon to take him to the house and carry him up the front steps and through the pointless formal door beneath its fanlight imported pane by pane from Europe which Judith held open for him to enter with no change, no alteration in that calm frozen face which she had worn for four years now, and on up the stairs and into the bedroom and put him to bed like a baby and then lie down himself on the floor beside the bed though not to sleep since before dawn the man on the bed would stir and groan and Jones would say, ' Hyer I am, Kernel. Hit's all right. They aint whupped us yit, air they?" "this Jones who after the demon rode away with the regiment when the granddaughter was only eight years old would tell people that he 'was looking after Major's place and niggers' even before they had time to ask him why he was not with the troops and perhaps in time came to believe the lie himself, who was among the first to greet the demon when he returned, to meet him at the gate and say, ' Well, Kernel, they kilt us but they aint whupped us yit, air they?" who even worked, labored, sweat at the demon's behest during that first furious period while the demon believed he could restore by sheer indomitable willing the Sutpen's Hundred which he remembered and had lost, labored with no hope of pay or reward who must have seen long before the demon did (or would admit it) that the task was hopeless"blind Jones who apparently saw still in that furious lecherous wreck the old fine figure of the man who once galloped on the black thoroughbred about that domain two boundaries of which the eye could not see from any point."
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
dylancatlow
Posts: 12,242
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1/1/2015 7:01:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 2:11:07 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
An example would be this absurdly long sentence from Faulkner's Absalom, Absalom!:

"Just exactly like father if father had known as much about it the night before I went out there as he did the day after I came back thinking Mad impotent old man who realized at last that there must be some limit even to the capabilities of a demon for doing harm, who must have seen his situation as that of the show girl, the pony, who realizes that the principle tune she prances comes not from horn and fiddle and drum but from a clock and calendar, must have seen himself as the old wornout cannon which realizes that it can deliver just one more fierce shot and crumble to dust in its own furious blast and recoil, who looked about upon the scene which was still within his scope and compass and saw son gone, vanished, more insuperable to him now than if the son were dead since now (if the son still lived) his name would be different and those to call him by it strangers, and whatever dragon's outcropping of Sutpen blood the son might sow on the body of whatever strange woman would therefore carry on the tradition, accomplish the hereditary evil and harm under another name and upon and among people who will never have heard the right one; daughter doomed to spinsterhood who had chosen spinsterhood already before there was anyone named Charles Bon since the aunt who came to succor her in bereavement and sorrow found neither but instead that calm absolutely impenetrable face between a homespun dress and sunbonnet seen before a closed door and again in a cloudy swirl of chickens while Jones was building the coffin and which she wore during the next year while the aunt lived there and the three women wove their own garments and raised their own food and cut the wood they cooked it with (excusing what help they had from Jones who lived with his granddaughter in the abandoned fishing camp with its collapsing roof and rotting porch against which the rusty scythe which Sutpen was to lend him, make him borrow to cut away the weeds from the door"at last forced him to use though not to cut weeds, at least not vegetable weeds"would lean for war years) and wore still after the aunt's indignation had swept her back to town to live on stolen garden truck and out of anonymous baskets left on her front steps at night, the three of them, the two daughters Negro and white and the aunt twelve miles away watching from her distance as the two daughters watched from theirs the old demon, the ancient varicose and despairing Faustus fling his final main now with the Creditor's hand already on his shoulder, running his little country store now for his bread and meat, haggling tediously over nickels and dimes with rapacious and poverty-stricken whites and Negroes, who at one time could have galloped for ten miles in any direction without crossing his own boundary, using out of his meager stock the cheap ribbons and beads and the stale violently colored candy with which even an old man can seduce a fifteen-year-old country girl, to ruin the granddaughter of his partner, this Jones"this gangling malaria-ridden white man whom he had given permission fourteen years ago to squat in the abandoned fishing camp with the year-old grandchild"Jones, partner porter and clerk who at the demon's command removed with his own hand (and maybe delivered too) from the showcase the candy beads and ribbons, measured the very cloth from which Judith (who had not been bereaved and did not mourn) helped the granddaughter to fashion a dress to walk past the lounging men in, the sidelooking and the tongues, until her increasing belly taught her embarrassment"or perhaps fear"Jones who before '62 had not even been allowed to approach the front of the house and who during the next four years got no nearer than the kitchen door and that only when he brought the game and fish and vegetables on which the seducer-to-He's wife and daughter (and Clytie too, the one remaining servant, Negro, the one who would forbid him to pass the kitchen door with what he brought) depended on to keep life in them, but who now entered the house itself on the (quite frequent now) afternoons when the demon would suddenly curse the store empty of customers and lock the door and repair to the rear and in the same tone in which he used to address his orderly or even his house servants when he had them (and in which he doubtless ordered Jones to fetch from the showcase the ribbons and beads and candy) direct Jones to fetch the jug, the two of them (and Jones even sitting now who in the old days, the old dead Sunday afternoons of monotonous peace which they spent beneath the scuppernong arbor in the backyard, the demon lying in the hammock while Jones squatted against a post, rising from time to time to pour for the demon from the demijohn and the bucket of spring water which he had fetched from the spring more than a mile away then squatting again, chortling and chuckling and saying 'Sho, Mister Tawm' each time the demon paused)"the two of them drinking turn and turn about from the jug and the demon not lying down now nor even sitting but reaching after the third or second drink that old man's state of impotent and furious undefeat in which he would rise, swaying and plunging and shouting for his horse and pistols to ride single-handed into Washington and shoot Lincoln (a year or so too late here) and Sherman both, shouting, 'Kill them! Shoot them down like the dogs they are!" and Jones."

Sho, Kernel; sho now' and catching him as he fell and commandeering the first passing wagon to take him to the house and carry him up the front steps and through the pointless formal door beneath its fanlight imported pane by pane from Europe which Judith held open for him to enter with no change, no alteration in that calm frozen face which she had worn for four years now, and on up the stairs and into the bedroom and put him to bed like a baby and then lie down himself on the floor beside the bed though not to sleep since before dawn the man on the bed would stir and groan and Jones would say, ' Hyer I am, Kernel. Hit's all right. They aint whupped us yit, air they?" "this Jones who after the demon rode away with the regiment when the granddaughter was only eight years old would tell people that he 'was looking after Major's place and niggers' even before they had time to ask him why he was not with the troops and perhaps in time came to believe the lie himself, who was among the first to greet the demon when he returned, to meet him at the gate and say, ' Well, Kernel, they kilt us but they aint whupped us yit, air they?" who even worked, labored, sweat at the demon's behest during that first furious period while the demon believed he could restore by sheer indomitable willing the Sutpen's Hundred which he remembered and had lost, labored with no hope of pay or reward who must have seen long before the demon did (or would admit it) that the task was hopeless"blind Jones who apparently saw still in that furious lecherous wreck the old fine figure of the man who once galloped on the black thoroughbred about that domain two boundaries of which the eye could not see from any point."

But you see, I said that just yesterday.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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1/1/2015 8:20:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I've pondered this as well. I think that maybe no one has ever said certain things that come out in breaking news before it's reported. Names, places and events. But on the subject of philosophy I'm afraid it's all been said over and over again and nothing is new. It's partly why I find it boring. Meh... why am I even in this forum? ;)
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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1/1/2015 8:29:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:20:42 PM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I've pondered this as well. I think that maybe no one has ever said certain things that come out in breaking news before it's reported. Names, places and events. But on the subject of philosophy I'm afraid it's all been said over and over again and nothing is new. It's partly why I find it boring. Meh... why am I even in this forum? ;)

That's what I find so amazing about philosophy and other things. We can look back in history and long before Copernicus see a sun centered solar system. There are so many ideas with roots that stretch far back into the past.

Sometimes I think ancient text is just ancient people describing things in their cultural terms. But that the causes effects and reasoning are just as similar to things Science speaks of today.

But I would say the forum is still interesting because it exposes oneself to the history and stuff that's been said.

"Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings, so that you shall gain easily what others have labored hard for." - Socrates
That1User
Posts: 1,064
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1/1/2015 8:40:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

Hmm... Well as there are more people being born, more sentences are being used. However, as more people are being born, more words are created, as there are new things and ideas. As there are more words, there are more sentence possibilities, which makes it highly unlikely that every sentence has been spoken. With human civilization being increasingly globalized, words and phrases are increasingly borrowed from other languages. For example, "The kame was very lindo." ("The turtle was very cute.) This combination of words and phrases from other languages makes it statiscally less likely for every sentence to be spoken. On the issue of thought, there may be thoughts or concepts that are unique to a culture, such as the Japanese samurai code of bushido. Since there are most likely no samurai left in Japan, it can be concluded that boshido is lost. (More about this topic here: http://matadornetwork.com...) There are also written records of sentences, and not every word that has been written done was spoke, especially in the case of languages that have been extinct. Because of these reasons, it is statiscally unlikely that every sentence has been spoken.
"Our life is what our thoughts make it."
R13; Marcus Aurelius
"When you arise in the morning, think of what a precious privilege it is to be alive - to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love." -Marcus Aurelius
"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire
"Every man is guilty of all the good he did not do. "-Voltaire
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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1/1/2015 8:45:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:29:09 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 1/1/2015 8:20:42 PM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I've pondered this as well. I think that maybe no one has ever said certain things that come out in breaking news before it's reported. Names, places and events. But on the subject of philosophy I'm afraid it's all been said over and over again and nothing is new. It's partly why I find it boring. Meh... why am I even in this forum? ;)

That's what I find so amazing about philosophy and other things. We can look back in history and long before Copernicus see a sun centered solar system. There are so many ideas with roots that stretch far back into the past.

Definitely anything profound that needs to be said has already been said before. Centuries in the past. That's why Eastern Philosophy is so well respected. As are the words of men like Socrates.

Sometimes I think ancient text is just ancient people describing things in their cultural terms. But that the causes effects and reasoning are just as similar to things Science speaks of today.

There was a time when the great thinkers were the scientists and they did have some great ideas that have inspired generations to expand in those concepts. And now we have science. Even the physicists of today get together and talk to see where their conversations and ideas might lead them. It's a great asset. Einstein said that intelligence needs creativity and that is a great example of intelligent minds coming together in a creative way.
But I would say the forum is still interesting because it exposes oneself to the history and stuff that's been said.

"Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings, so that you shall gain easily what others have labored hard for." - Socrates

Which actually answers my above question as to why I'm in this forum. I read more posts than I comment on. I like diversity and hearing what other people have to say. It takes people watching to a whole new level.
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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1/1/2015 9:02:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:40:42 PM, That1User wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

Hmm... Well as there are more people being born, more sentences are being used. However, as more people are being born, more words are created, as there are new things and ideas. As there are more words, there are more sentence possibilities, which makes it highly unlikely that every sentence has been spoken. With human civilization being increasingly globalized, words and phrases are increasingly borrowed from other languages. For example, "The kame was very lindo." ("The turtle was very cute.) This combination of words and phrases from other languages makes it statiscally less likely for every sentence to be spoken. On the issue of thought, there may be thoughts or concepts that are unique to a culture, such as the Japanese samurai code of bushido. Since there are most likely no samurai left in Japan, it can be concluded that boshido is lost. (More about this topic here: http://matadornetwork.com...) There are also written records of sentences, and not every word that has been written done was spoke, especially in the case of languages that have been extinct. Because of these reasons, it is statiscally unlikely that every sentence has been spoken.

Thanks for the math break down. And the intermingling of languages good addition.

I'll concede no. But it's such a curious thought isn't it? there are only a finite sounds a human can make, a finite manner in which they can be combined, a finite structure to follow to form meaningful sentences, finite time and finite people. But the way you look at it seems like "No, because the possibilities are limitless" but they are not limitless are they.
Mhykiel
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1/1/2015 9:04:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:45:13 PM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 1/1/2015 8:29:09 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 1/1/2015 8:20:42 PM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I've pondered this as well. I think that maybe no one has ever said certain things that come out in breaking news before it's reported. Names, places and events. But on the subject of philosophy I'm afraid it's all been said over and over again and nothing is new. It's partly why I find it boring. Meh... why am I even in this forum? ;)

That's what I find so amazing about philosophy and other things. We can look back in history and long before Copernicus see a sun centered solar system. There are so many ideas with roots that stretch far back into the past.

Definitely anything profound that needs to be said has already been said before. Centuries in the past. That's why Eastern Philosophy is so well respected. As are the words of men like Socrates.

Sometimes I think ancient text is just ancient people describing things in their cultural terms. But that the causes effects and reasoning are just as similar to things Science speaks of today.

There was a time when the great thinkers were the scientists and they did have some great ideas that have inspired generations to expand in those concepts. And now we have science. Even the physicists of today get together and talk to see where their conversations and ideas might lead them. It's a great asset. Einstein said that intelligence needs creativity and that is a great example of intelligent minds coming together in a creative way.
But I would say the forum is still interesting because it exposes oneself to the history and stuff that's been said.

"Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings, so that you shall gain easily what others have labored hard for." - Socrates

Which actually answers my above question as to why I'm in this forum. I read more posts than I comment on. I like diversity and hearing what other people have to say. It takes people watching to a whole new level.

OMG I like soo luv people watching. I can't believe you said that.
That1User
Posts: 1,064
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1/1/2015 9:05:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 9:02:25 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 1/1/2015 8:40:42 PM, That1User wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

Hmm... Well as there are more people being born, more sentences are being used. However, as more people are being born, more words are created, as there are new things and ideas. As there are more words, there are more sentence possibilities, which makes it highly unlikely that every sentence has been spoken. With human civilization being increasingly globalized, words and phrases are increasingly borrowed from other languages. For example, "The kame was very lindo." ("The turtle was very cute.) This combination of words and phrases from other languages makes it statiscally less likely for every sentence to be spoken. On the issue of thought, there may be thoughts or concepts that are unique to a culture, such as the Japanese samurai code of bushido. Since there are most likely no samurai left in Japan, it can be concluded that boshido is lost. (More about this topic here: http://matadornetwork.com...) There are also written records of sentences, and not every word that has been written done was spoke, especially in the case of languages that have been extinct. Because of these reasons, it is statiscally unlikely that every sentence has been spoken.

Thanks for the math break down. And the intermingling of languages good addition.

I'll concede no. But it's such a curious thought isn't it? there are only a finite sounds a human can make, a finite manner in which they can be combined, a finite structure to follow to form meaningful sentences, finite time and finite people. But the way you look at it seems like "No, because the possibilities are limitless" but they are not limitless are they.

The possibilities are not limitless, but rather they are virtually limitless, as the various finite combinations combine to make possibilities that get closer to infinity, but they cannot get to infinity as there is a finite amount of possibilities. (Which may be so large that it is beyond human thought.)
"Our life is what our thoughts make it."
R13; Marcus Aurelius
"When you arise in the morning, think of what a precious privilege it is to be alive - to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love." -Marcus Aurelius
"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire
"Every man is guilty of all the good he did not do. "-Voltaire
AnDoctuir
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1/1/2015 9:07:32 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:50:12 PM, airmax1227 wrote:
Vsauce considered a similar concept as it relates to music:



Interesting video. Did you watch the 'Everything is a Remix' videos? I was recently arguing that on another site primarily with regard to fashion.
AnDoctuir
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1/1/2015 9:09:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 9:07:32 PM, AnDoctuir wrote:
At 1/1/2015 8:50:12 PM, airmax1227 wrote:
Vsauce considered a similar concept as it relates to music:



Interesting video. Did you watch the 'Everything is a Remix' videos? I was recently arguing that on another site primarily with regard to fashion.

...and how people post pictures on image boards, which is also absolutely fascinating.
jodybirdy
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1/1/2015 9:12:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:50:12 PM, airmax1227 wrote:
Vsauce considered a similar concept as it relates to music:



I've seen this and I was fascinated because it's a question that came to me as a teen. Similar bass lines, similar riffs. Is it Under Pressure or Ice Ice Baby? Lady Gaga seems to rip off Madonna on a regular basis as well, or does she?
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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1/1/2015 9:17:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 8:50:12 PM, airmax1227 wrote:
Vsauce considered a similar concept as it relates to music:


yeah same concept applied to a small sample space. I hear very similar rifts in a lot of music. And most people learning music, learn it by copying other musicians. So from bottom to top a musician has a bag of repeatable examples to pull from.
LifeMeansGodIsGood
Posts: 2,744
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1/1/2015 9:20:27 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

There is nothing new under the sun. The only thing that is ever new in this world, and always is new moment by moment is God's mercy. He has not dealt with us according to our wrongdoings. His mercy is always new, it is new every morning. Usually, the first thing I say whenever I wake up is "Thank you for your mercy" to God. I know I do not deserve to live. I know that any time I have it is only in God's mercy, so I thank Him for everything I have even if it seems hard for me to understand why God lets me have things that hurt.....like being forced to face the death of loved ones.
Mhykiel
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1/1/2015 9:23:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 9:20:27 PM, LifeMeansGodIsGood wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

There is nothing new under the sun. The only thing that is ever new in this world, and always is new moment by moment is God's mercy. He has not dealt with us according to our wrongdoings. His mercy is always new, it is new every morning. Usually, the first thing I say whenever I wake up is "Thank you for your mercy" to God. I know I do not deserve to live. I know that any time I have it is only in God's mercy, so I thank Him for everything I have even if it seems hard for me to understand why God lets me have things that hurt.....like being forced to face the death of loved ones.

Don't love anyone, don't live longer than the ones you do love. Simple way to avoid the pain of seeing dieing loved ones.

Unless of course the suffering is a greater value than the other 2 options.
LifeMeansGodIsGood
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1/1/2015 9:33:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 9:23:03 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 1/1/2015 9:20:27 PM, LifeMeansGodIsGood wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

There is nothing new under the sun. The only thing that is ever new in this world, and always is new moment by moment is God's mercy. He has not dealt with us according to our wrongdoings. His mercy is always new, it is new every morning. Usually, the first thing I say whenever I wake up is "Thank you for your mercy" to God. I know I do not deserve to live. I know that any time I have it is only in God's mercy, so I thank Him for everything I have even if it seems hard for me to understand why God lets me have things that hurt.....like being forced to face the death of loved ones.

Don't love anyone, don't live longer than the ones you do love. Simple way to avoid the pain of seeing dieing loved ones.

Unless of course the suffering is a greater value than the other 2 options.

There is a hope you can have that is stronger than any pain, your own pain or the suffering you see in others. I have this hope, hope in a sure promise of eternal life from God. I want everybody to have it. I know the One who gives it. God loves you and it grieves Him to see you hurting. He knows when a sparrow falls from it's nest, and He grieves when He sees it die. You are much more than many sparrows to Him.

He suffered and died in your place, took your punishment on Himself, so He is satisfied your punishment was executed and He lives to forgive all who will believe on His resurrection and receive Him as their Saviour. If you will receive him as your Saviour, you will not be punished in death, you will be forgiven now and have eternal life now. This is the promise of God, and God cannot lie.
bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
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1/2/2015 12:58:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/1/2015 2:11:07 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
An example would be this absurdly long sentence from Faulkner's Absalom, Absalom!:

"Just exactly like father if father had known as much about it the night before I went out there as he did the day after I came back thinking Mad impotent old man who realized at last that there must be some limit even to the capabilities of a demon for doing harm, who must have seen his situation as that of the show girl, the pony, who realizes that the principle tune she prances comes not from horn and fiddle and drum but from a clock and calendar, must have seen himself as the old wornout cannon which realizes that it can deliver just one more fierce shot and crumble to dust in its own furious blast and recoil, who looked about upon the scene which was still within his scope and compass and saw son gone, vanished, more insuperable to him now than if the son were dead since now (if the son still lived) his name would be different and those to call him by it strangers, and whatever dragon's outcropping of Sutpen blood the son might sow on the body of whatever strange woman would therefore carry on the tradition, accomplish the hereditary evil and harm under another name and upon and among people who will never have heard the right one; daughter doomed to spinsterhood who had chosen spinsterhood already before there was anyone named Charles Bon since the aunt who came to succor her in bereavement and sorrow found neither but instead that calm absolutely impenetrable face between a homespun dress and sunbonnet seen before a closed door and again in a cloudy swirl of chickens while Jones was building the coffin and which she wore during the next year while the aunt lived there and the three women wove their own garments and raised their own food and cut the wood they cooked it with (excusing what help they had from Jones who lived with his granddaughter in the abandoned fishing camp with its collapsing roof and rotting porch against which the rusty scythe which Sutpen was to lend him, make him borrow to cut away the weeds from the door"at last forced him to use though not to cut weeds, at least not vegetable weeds"would lean for war years) and wore still after the aunt's indignation had swept her back to town to live on stolen garden truck and out of anonymous baskets left on her front steps at night, the three of them, the two daughters Negro and white and the aunt twelve miles away watching from her distance as the two daughters watched from theirs the old demon, the ancient varicose and despairing Faustus fling his final main now with the Creditor's hand already on his shoulder, running his little country store now for his bread and meat, haggling tediously over nickels and dimes with rapacious and poverty-stricken whites and Negroes, who at one time could have galloped for ten miles in any direction without crossing his own boundary, using out of his meager stock the cheap ribbons and beads and the stale violently colored candy with which even an old man can seduce a fifteen-year-old country girl, to ruin the granddaughter of his partner, this Jones"this gangling malaria-ridden white man whom he had given permission fourteen years ago to squat in the abandoned fishing camp with the year-old grandchild"Jones, partner porter and clerk who at the demon's command removed with his own hand (and maybe delivered too) from the showcase the candy beads and ribbons, measured the very cloth from which Judith (who had not been bereaved and did not mourn) helped the granddaughter to fashion a dress to walk past the lounging men in, the sidelooking and the tongues, until her increasing belly taught her embarrassment"or perhaps fear"Jones who before '62 had not even been allowed to approach the front of the house and who during the next four years got no nearer than the kitchen door and that only when he brought the game and fish and vegetables on which the seducer-to-He's wife and daughter (and Clytie too, the one remaining servant, Negro, the one who would forbid him to pass the kitchen door with what he brought) depended on to keep life in them, but who now entered the house itself on the (quite frequent now) afternoons when the demon would suddenly curse the store empty of customers and lock the door and repair to the rear and in the same tone in which he used to address his orderly or even his house servants when he had them (and in which he doubtless ordered Jones to fetch from the showcase the ribbons and beads and candy) direct Jones to fetch the jug, the two of them (and Jones even sitting now who in the old days, the old dead Sunday afternoons of monotonous peace which they spent beneath the scuppernong arbor in the backyard, the demon lying in the hammock while Jones squatted against a post, rising from time to time to pour for the demon from the demijohn and the bucket of spring water which he had fetched from the spring more than a mile away then squatting again, chortling and chuckling and saying 'Sho, Mister Tawm' each time the demon paused)"the two of them drinking turn and turn about from the jug and the demon not lying down now nor even sitting but reaching after the third or second drink that old man's state of impotent and furious undefeat in which he would rise, swaying and plunging and shouting for his horse and pistols to ride single-handed into Washington and shoot Lincoln (a year or so too late here) and Sherman both, shouting, 'Kill them! Shoot them down like the dogs they are!" and Jones."

Sho, Kernel; sho now' and catching him as he fell and commandeering the first passing wagon to take him to the house and carry him up the front steps and through the pointless formal door beneath its fanlight imported pane by pane from Europe which Judith held open for him to enter with no change, no alteration in that calm frozen face which she had worn for four years now, and on up the stairs and into the bedroom and put him to bed like a baby and then lie down himself on the floor beside the bed though not to sleep since before dawn the man on the bed would stir and groan and Jones would say, ' Hyer I am, Kernel. Hit's all right. They aint whupped us yit, air they?" "this Jones who after the demon rode away with the regiment when the granddaughter was only eight years old would tell people that he 'was looking after Major's place and niggers' even before they had time to ask him why he was not with the troops and perhaps in time came to believe the lie himself, who was among the first to greet the demon when he returned, to meet him at the gate and say, ' Well, Kernel, they kilt us but they aint whupped us yit, air they?" who even worked, labored, sweat at the demon's behest during that first furious period while the demon believed he could restore by sheer indomitable willing the Sutpen's Hundred which he remembered and had lost, labored with no hope of pay or reward who must have seen long before the demon did (or would admit it) that the task was hopeless"blind Jones who apparently saw still in that furious lecherous wreck the old fine figure of the man who once galloped on the black thoroughbred about that domain two boundaries of which the eye could not see from any point."

See: the last sentence of James Joyce's Ulysses.
http://en.wikipedia.org...
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"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
xXCryptoXx
Posts: 5,000
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1/2/2015 8:22:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I highly doubt it.
Nolite Timere
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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1/2/2015 8:27:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/2/2015 8:22:36 PM, xXCryptoXx wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

I highly doubt it.

America is built around this premise that you can do it, and there are an awful lot of people who are unlikely to have done it who did.
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com...
intellectuallyprimitive
Posts: 1,000
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1/5/2015 11:29:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:20:23 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
barring any nonsensical sentences that are valid sentence structure and word usage, is it statistically possible that every sentence to convey a thought has already been said?

I wonder if I could go through the day just quoting other people.

Possible, but probable I would consider not. If you are also referring to the variation of word implementation, then the probability seems to be scant.