Total Posts:16|Showing Posts:1-16
Jump to topic:

My Philosophy on Being Born Gay

Moroni23
Posts: 235
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?
DarthVitiosus
Posts: 624
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 11:07:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

How sex is dealt with is cultural. The actual attraction is where things get confusing and muddy. It would be all too simplistic to claim a gay or straight gene. If there is such a gene, in theory all women are lesbians or bisexual. There have been multiple studies and articles published on the phenomena how most men usually are attracted to either gay porn or straight porn but not both. While women on the other hand are attracted to both straight porn and lesbian porn.

http://www.womenshealthmag.com...
http://www.cosmopolitan.com...
http://www.dailydot.com...
http://www.nytimes.com...

I can go on and on and on with articles, studies, and even offer a few books..........
WILL NOT BE REMOVED UNTIL:
#1. I have met 10 people worth discussing with on DDO who are not interested in ideological or romantic visions of the world we all live in.
#2. 10 people admit they have no interest in any one else's opinion other than their own.
#3. 10 people admit they are products of their environment and their ideas derive from said environment rather than doing any serious critical thinking and search for answers themselves.
DarthVitiosus
Posts: 624
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 11:22:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

I think ultimately those boys may have sex with each other. The other thing is they have known each other for all their lives. Do you ever consider having sex with a family member or a best friend who you have spent so much time with? The boys may avoid sex altogether in order to preserve their personal relationship.
WILL NOT BE REMOVED UNTIL:
#1. I have met 10 people worth discussing with on DDO who are not interested in ideological or romantic visions of the world we all live in.
#2. 10 people admit they have no interest in any one else's opinion other than their own.
#3. 10 people admit they are products of their environment and their ideas derive from said environment rather than doing any serious critical thinking and search for answers themselves.
Moroni23
Posts: 235
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 11:35:45 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 11:22:36 AM, DarthVitiosus wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

I think ultimately those boys may have sex with each other. The other thing is they have known each other for all their lives. Do you ever consider having sex with a family member or a best friend who you have spent so much time with? The boys may avoid sex altogether in order to preserve their personal relationship.

Ohhhh very interesting thought. I think that if the only people I ever knew was my family, and if I wasnt influence by the cultural opinion that it is wrong (and I do agree with this that it is wrong for the record) then i might in this scenerio strive to fulfuill natual sextual desires through them yes. But it is an interesting thought that the boys might just not entertain sex at all in order to preserve personal relationships.
DarthVitiosus
Posts: 624
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 11:53:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 11:35:45 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 11:22:36 AM, DarthVitiosus wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

I think ultimately those boys may have sex with each other. The other thing is they have known each other for all their lives. Do you ever consider having sex with a family member or a best friend who you have spent so much time with? The boys may avoid sex altogether in order to preserve their personal relationship.

Ohhhh very interesting thought. I think that if the only people I ever knew was my family, and if I wasnt influence by the cultural opinion that it is wrong (and I do agree with this that it is wrong for the record) then i might in this scenerio strive to fulfuill natual sextual desires through them yes. But it is an interesting thought that the boys might just not entertain sex at all in order to preserve personal relationships.

I tend to think they would have sex as well. But we should also keep in mind that they would not be having sex because of love or romantic purposes either.
WILL NOT BE REMOVED UNTIL:
#1. I have met 10 people worth discussing with on DDO who are not interested in ideological or romantic visions of the world we all live in.
#2. 10 people admit they have no interest in any one else's opinion other than their own.
#3. 10 people admit they are products of their environment and their ideas derive from said environment rather than doing any serious critical thinking and search for answers themselves.
Moroni23
Posts: 235
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 12:00:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 11:53:06 AM, DarthVitiosus wrote:
At 3/5/2015 11:35:45 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 11:22:36 AM, DarthVitiosus wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

I think ultimately those boys may have sex with each other. The other thing is they have known each other for all their lives. Do you ever consider having sex with a family member or a best friend who you have spent so much time with? The boys may avoid sex altogether in order to preserve their personal relationship.

Ohhhh very interesting thought. I think that if the only people I ever knew was my family, and if I wasnt influence by the cultural opinion that it is wrong (and I do agree with this that it is wrong for the record) then i might in this scenerio strive to fulfuill natual sextual desires through them yes. But it is an interesting thought that the boys might just not entertain sex at all in order to preserve personal relationships.

I tend to think they would have sex as well. But we should also keep in mind that they would not be having sex because of love or romantic purposes either.

Very true as well. However it can be argued that through the act of sex one can naturally grow attached especially if the selection is very limited. So they may develop love or romanticism.
komododragon8
Posts: 405
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 12:12:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Genetics are not the only thing which affects peoples personality. Position in the womb and exposure to mothers immunesystem can also affect the baby.
DarthVitiosus
Posts: 624
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 12:25:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 12:00:38 PM, Moroni23 wrote:

Very true as well. However it can be argued that through the act of sex one can naturally grow attached especially if the selection is very limited. So they may develop love or romanticism.

Not so sure, I was talking about the idea of wooing people and trying to get them to let their guard down for sex. This is almost a must do in modern America in order to get sex, romantic love. Romantic love is a fairly recent concept in the last few hundred years. I don't think the boys would have to woo each other to get sex since they have known each other all their lives. Their sex may be similar to the ancient Greeks or how samurais had sex with their juniors in the Edo era. The sex would be based on their personal companionship.
WILL NOT BE REMOVED UNTIL:
#1. I have met 10 people worth discussing with on DDO who are not interested in ideological or romantic visions of the world we all live in.
#2. 10 people admit they have no interest in any one else's opinion other than their own.
#3. 10 people admit they are products of their environment and their ideas derive from said environment rather than doing any serious critical thinking and search for answers themselves.
Df0512
Posts: 966
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 1:18:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Well of course. Humans will adapt to their surroundings. But that wouldn't make him "naturally gay". No one would disagree with that scenario. I think you think sexuality is all about psyche. In some cases yes. maybe even most. But I believe that there are a small majority of people who are born gay. I see it as a mutation of some kind. There have been far worse. I don't see why it's so hard to believe some one can be born that way.
Moroni23
Posts: 235
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 1:42:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 1:18:17 PM, Df0512 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Well of course. Humans will adapt to their surroundings. But that wouldn't make him "naturally gay". No one would disagree with that scenario. I think you think sexuality is all about psyche. In some cases yes. maybe even most. But I believe that there are a small majority of people who are born gay. I see it as a mutation of some kind. There have been far worse. I don't see why it's so hard to believe some one can be born that way.

I mean i guess technically it is possible just like anything else that somebody can be born gay. But what I am trying to do is eliminate all of the variables and see what makes most sence. By the logic I have presented it makes most sence that being gay or sraight is 100% a psyche which stands for the total state of a humans mind. Is developed by your enviornment and your suroundings, and has absolutly nothing to do with genetics, or in other words the specific set of code you are born with.

To sugest that people are born gay or straight is to sugest that it is in fact a gene. Or as you put it a 'mutation of some kind' meaning a munipulaion of that DNA or Genetic Code.
Df0512
Posts: 966
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 2:00:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 1:42:28 PM, Moroni23 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 1:18:17 PM, Df0512 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Well of course. Humans will adapt to their surroundings. But that wouldn't make him "naturally gay". No one would disagree with that scenario. I think you think sexuality is all about psyche. In some cases yes. maybe even most. But I believe that there are a small majority of people who are born gay. I see it as a mutation of some kind. There have been far worse. I don't see why it's so hard to believe some one can be born that way.

I mean i guess technically it is possible just like anything else that somebody can be born gay. But what I am trying to do is eliminate all of the variables and see what makes most sence. By the logic I have presented it makes most sence that being gay or sraight is 100% a psyche which stands for the total state of a humans mind. Is developed by your enviornment and your suroundings, and has absolutly nothing to do with genetics, or in other words the specific set of code you are born with.

To sugest that people are born gay or straight is to sugest that it is in fact a gene. Or as you put it a 'mutation of some kind' meaning a munipulaion of that DNA or Genetic Code.

Yes I do believe it is genetic. As I believe the natural order of things is for a male to mate with a female. Every species on earth abides. Males are naturally attracted to females. Not saying every male will be attracted to a female. But it is how we were built to operate. By your logic it probably would be more likely that gay people are a of nurture and not nature. But that was your logic until you agreed its possible for people to be born gay. Which I agree with. I mean have you seen a siamese twin?

I think the problem is that you want a answer that would apply to all gay people. But you can't assume it is 100% psyche until you confirm that all gay people have experience some kind of homosexual influence in life. And we can't. Statistically I think it is safe to assume that not all gay people have.
Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/5/2015 9:08:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 11:07:30 AM, DarthVitiosus wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

How sex is dealt with is cultural. The actual attraction is where things get confusing and muddy. It would be all too simplistic to claim a gay or straight gene. If there is such a gene, in theory all women are lesbians or bisexual. There have been multiple studies and articles published on the phenomena how most men usually are attracted to either gay porn or straight porn but not both. While women on the other hand are attracted to both straight porn and lesbian porn.
Errr... The porn they're attracted to and their sexual orientation are not necessarily related, since I know a lot of girls who enjoy BL (gay hentai) - that doesn't mean they want to become boys and then have relationships with them...
The thing is, I hate relativism. I hate relativism more than I hate everything else, excepting, maybe, fibreglass powerboats... What it overlooks, to put it briefly and crudely, is the fixed structure of human nature. - Jerry Fodor

Don't be a stat cynic:
http://www.debate.org...

Response to conservative views on deforestation:
http://www.debate.org...

Topics I'd like to debate (not debating ATM): http://tinyurl.com...
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,238
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/6/2015 1:11:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 1:42:28 PM, Moroni23 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 1:18:17 PM, Df0512 wrote:
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Well of course. Humans will adapt to their surroundings. But that wouldn't make him "naturally gay". No one would disagree with that scenario. I think you think sexuality is all about psyche. In some cases yes. maybe even most. But I believe that there are a small majority of people who are born gay. I see it as a mutation of some kind. There have been far worse. I don't see why it's so hard to believe some one can be born that way.

I mean i guess technically it is possible just like anything else that somebody can be born gay. But what I am trying to do is eliminate all of the variables and see what makes most sence. By the logic I have presented it makes most sence that being gay or sraight is 100% a psyche which stands for the total state of a humans mind. Is developed by your enviornment and your suroundings, and has absolutly nothing to do with genetics, or in other words the specific set of code you are born with.

To sugest that people are born gay or straight is to sugest that it is in fact a gene. Or as you put it a 'mutation of some kind' meaning a munipulaion of that DNA or Genetic Code.

The word you are looking for is 'predisposed'. Through various factors and circumstances, behaviors are manifested or realized. That doesn't inherently make it a conscious decision (to be gay). This encompasses probable factors both genetic, and in utero development, and possibly even growth during infancy and picking things up as a toddler.

To wit: there is no specific high cholesterol gene, however your body may be predisposed through certain diet or daily regiment to make more HDL/LDL than others. Sexuality could very well be the same.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
wsmunit7
Posts: 1,318
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/6/2015 8:03:03 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
What the op describes is known as "situational homosexuality ". See link below.

It has been posited that homosexual men who bow to the pressures of family, religion, and society to enter into a heterosexual marriage are practicing "situational heterosexuality " Having been in that situation myself, I tend to agree.

http://www.soc.ucsb.edu...
SNP1
Posts: 2,406
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/6/2015 8:28:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Considering that brain scans show a different brain structure between heterosexuals and homosexual, considering the digit ratio theory, considering epigenetics, considering how epigenetics can be used to explain the development of pseudo-heraphrodites, and considering how epigenetics could possibly explain homosexuality and transexuality, I am going to take the position that people are born gay, most probably due to epigenetics.
#TheApatheticNihilistPartyofAmerica
#WarOnDDO
Student4Life1975
Posts: 57
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/24/2015 3:03:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/5/2015 4:56:43 AM, Moroni23 wrote:
I have often wondered if a child was taken at birth and locked in a room with only other boys his entire life. Would he naturally become Gay? If knowing and loving boys was the only thing you ever knew, I suspect it would seem completly normal to you. The reason I bring this up is to often I hear that you are either born straight or gay. I think this is a ridiculously silly thing to believe. Like almost everything else about the human psyche it is formed completly by our experiences. There is no known genetic gay or straight gene.

What are your thoughts?

Currently there is no known GAY Gene, but there are also many many other Genes that have not yet been identified for many other variables in the Human Body. That being said its dangerous to imply that just because Science hasnt identified something it never will (which I dont thing you did, but may be interpreted that way from others reading your post). Science is always progessing and in time it very well may find this Gene. Even having not yet (or ever) finding it, there are certain qualities in Gay people that suggest it is there. I for one bleieve environment plays a role, and genetics play a role. The ratio each contributes may never be known but that specific number may be irrelevent in the end anyways. I have a daughter that just finished pre-school and often talked of a boy who likes to wear dresses and makeup. He's 4 years old. And his parents said he was (from day one) more inclined to play with Dolls and barbie houses than GI Joe and toy cars. He was exposed to the same environment as his older brother who is a little boy through and through playing with guns and cars, etc. This suggests its genetic in this case, and i strongly believed this long before i met this family in person. Genetics control everything that resides within us, and sexual preference is one of those things. Gay friends have told me they were attracted to same sex at a very young age as i was attracted to opposite sex at the same age.

Your comment on boys being trapped in a room with other boys was interesting, but wouldnt prove anything, as male prisoners often resort to having sex with other male inmates not because they are gay, but because its all thats available to them. Once they are out of prison they again have sex with ex girlfriends and wives as usual. But they are not Gay in the sense we are talking about here. These kids would likely show sexual preference towards both men and women once exposed to society.

Interesting thoughts though, but if being Gay was nothing more than deciding to do so, there would be far more clear arguments supporting that which simply do not exist. I for one have no attraction to men whatsoever, and if it was a choice (as is suggested by many people for Gays) then it would also be a choice for me, and if it was I would at least be attracted to men somewhat so the choice would be feasible, but its not. Gay brains are no different than mine, except for that small portion that controls sexual preference. To say they are simply making the wrong choice is a huge cop out, and nothing more than a way to alleviate homophobic concerns for many people.
there is no progress without compromise"