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A small moral scenario. What do you think?

ben2974
Posts: 767
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5/2/2015 6:42:16 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Me and 2 of my family members went to the park to play some tennis. At the park there are three tennis courts enclosed by fences. The first one, closest to the entry/exit of the courts, has many cracks. Then there's the court in the middle, and the last one at the end. We always go to this last one for several reasons:

1. It doesn't have any obvious cracks that can have an impact on our play or our safety.
2. Choosing between the far-end one and the middle one, we choose the far-end one because while playing tennis, a fence on our end makes it so that the balls we hit (and miss or hit out of range) don't go too far from us.
3. The far-end court is an all-around superior court to the other two.

It is expressly stated that one cannot do various things on these tennis courts, including: cycling, skateboarding, and rollerblading.

HOWEVER - Assume for this scenario, though, that none of these were explicitly stated to be forbidden.

Today, me and two family members wanted to play tennis in our usual spot (that is, the far-end court) but when we got there there was a teenager skateboarding (around the age of 14). As we began to play, we had to confront the teenager. The teen left and we got to play tennis where we wanted to play tennis.

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

Reasons for him to leave the court we wanted to play on (under the condition that it was never forbidden to skateboard):
1. The tennis courts are tennis courts - their purpose is for tennis (and in this sense are perpetually reserved for those who wish to play tennis).
2. The teen could have skateboarded around the other 2/3 of the tennis courts area, or anywhere else at the park for that matter.
3. The specific court the teenager was on was the best court

Reasons for the teen to stay:
1. The teen was there first!
2. It doesn't say the teen can't skateboard

So, what's the verdict?
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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5/2/2015 7:48:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 6:42:16 PM, ben2974 wrote:
Me and 2 of my family members went to the park to play some tennis. At the park there are three tennis courts enclosed by fences. The first one, closest to the entry/exit of the courts, has many cracks. Then there's the court in the middle, and the last one at the end. We always go to this last one for several reasons:

1. It doesn't have any obvious cracks that can have an impact on our play or our safety.
2. Choosing between the far-end one and the middle one, we choose the far-end one because while playing tennis, a fence on our end makes it so that the balls we hit (and miss or hit out of range) don't go too far from us.
3. The far-end court is an all-around superior court to the other two.

It is expressly stated that one cannot do various things on these tennis courts, including: cycling, skateboarding, and rollerblading.

HOWEVER - Assume for this scenario, though, that none of these were explicitly stated to be forbidden.


Today, me and two family members wanted to play tennis in our usual spot (that is, the far-end court) but when we got there there was a teenager skateboarding (around the age of 14). As we began to play, we had to confront the teenager. The teen left and we got to play tennis where we wanted to play tennis.

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

Reasons for him to leave the court we wanted to play on (under the condition that it was never forbidden to skateboard):
1. The tennis courts are tennis courts - their purpose is for tennis (and in this sense are perpetually reserved for those who wish to play tennis).
2. The teen could have skateboarded around the other 2/3 of the tennis courts area, or anywhere else at the park for that matter.
3. The specific court the teenager was on was the best court


Reasons for the teen to stay:
1. The teen was there first!
2. It doesn't say the teen can't skateboard

So, what's the verdict?

If you were skateboarding how would you feel about your actions being done to you.
ben2974
Posts: 767
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5/2/2015 7:50:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 7:01:28 PM, Death23 wrote:
How did you cause him to leave?

Well I just tried explaining to her (yup, she was a tom boy) using the above reasons. Of course in reality you aren't allowed to skateboard on the courts, which was what she was doing... so that was part of my explanation as well. She was quite insistent that she should stay because she was there first and that there were other courts to play on.
ben2974
Posts: 767
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5/2/2015 7:56:27 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 7:48:07 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/2/2015 6:42:16 PM, ben2974 wrote:
Me and 2 of my family members went to the park to play some tennis. At the park there are three tennis courts enclosed by fences. The first one, closest to the entry/exit of the courts, has many cracks. Then there's the court in the middle, and the last one at the end. We always go to this last one for several reasons:

1. It doesn't have any obvious cracks that can have an impact on our play or our safety.
2. Choosing between the far-end one and the middle one, we choose the far-end one because while playing tennis, a fence on our end makes it so that the balls we hit (and miss or hit out of range) don't go too far from us.
3. The far-end court is an all-around superior court to the other two.

It is expressly stated that one cannot do various things on these tennis courts, including: cycling, skateboarding, and rollerblading.

HOWEVER - Assume for this scenario, though, that none of these were explicitly stated to be forbidden.


Today, me and two family members wanted to play tennis in our usual spot (that is, the far-end court) but when we got there there was a teenager skateboarding (around the age of 14). As we began to play, we had to confront the teenager. The teen left and we got to play tennis where we wanted to play tennis.

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

Reasons for him to leave the court we wanted to play on (under the condition that it was never forbidden to skateboard):
1. The tennis courts are tennis courts - their purpose is for tennis (and in this sense are perpetually reserved for those who wish to play tennis).
2. The teen could have skateboarded around the other 2/3 of the tennis courts area, or anywhere else at the park for that matter.
3. The specific court the teenager was on was the best court


Reasons for the teen to stay:
1. The teen was there first!
2. It doesn't say the teen can't skateboard

So, what's the verdict?

If you were skateboarding how would you feel about your actions being done to you.

No big deal. Tennis courts are made for tennis and you can only play tennis on tennis courts. Skateboarding is done virtually anywhere, and there is plenty of space elsewhere in the park to skateboard. If I was skateboarding I would have realized that me trying to keep to my little corner on the tennis courts (rendering said court inoperable) was somewhat selfish and just looking to cause unnecessary tension. Obviously I feel this way because I'm defending my side. Aside from these things, though, I'm a particularly evasive/passive person, so usually i'll submit to things like this. I dislike causing trouble in general.
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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5/2/2015 7:58:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 7:56:27 PM, ben2974 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:48:07 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/2/2015 6:42:16 PM, ben2974 wrote:
Me and 2 of my family members went to the park to play some tennis. At the park there are three tennis courts enclosed by fences. The first one, closest to the entry/exit of the courts, has many cracks. Then there's the court in the middle, and the last one at the end. We always go to this last one for several reasons:

1. It doesn't have any obvious cracks that can have an impact on our play or our safety.
2. Choosing between the far-end one and the middle one, we choose the far-end one because while playing tennis, a fence on our end makes it so that the balls we hit (and miss or hit out of range) don't go too far from us.
3. The far-end court is an all-around superior court to the other two.

It is expressly stated that one cannot do various things on these tennis courts, including: cycling, skateboarding, and rollerblading.

HOWEVER - Assume for this scenario, though, that none of these were explicitly stated to be forbidden.


Today, me and two family members wanted to play tennis in our usual spot (that is, the far-end court) but when we got there there was a teenager skateboarding (around the age of 14). As we began to play, we had to confront the teenager. The teen left and we got to play tennis where we wanted to play tennis.

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

Reasons for him to leave the court we wanted to play on (under the condition that it was never forbidden to skateboard):
1. The tennis courts are tennis courts - their purpose is for tennis (and in this sense are perpetually reserved for those who wish to play tennis).
2. The teen could have skateboarded around the other 2/3 of the tennis courts area, or anywhere else at the park for that matter.
3. The specific court the teenager was on was the best court


Reasons for the teen to stay:
1. The teen was there first!
2. It doesn't say the teen can't skateboard

So, what's the verdict?

If you were skateboarding how would you feel about your actions being done to you.

No big deal. Tennis courts are made for tennis and you can only play tennis on tennis courts. Skateboarding is done virtually anywhere, and there is plenty of space elsewhere in the park to skateboard. If I was skateboarding I would have realized that me trying to keep to my little corner on the tennis courts (rendering said court inoperable) was somewhat selfish and just looking to cause unnecessary tension. Obviously I feel this way because I'm defending my side. Aside from these things, though, I'm a particularly evasive/passive person, so usually i'll submit to things like this. I dislike causing trouble in general.

Well that's your reaction, but how would you feel about being treated the way you treated the skateboarder.
Death23
Posts: 784
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5/2/2015 7:58:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 7:50:30 PM, ben2974 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:01:28 PM, Death23 wrote:
How did you cause him to leave?

Well I just tried explaining to her (yup, she was a tom boy) using the above reasons. Of course in reality you aren't allowed to skateboard on the courts, which was what she was doing... so that was part of my explanation as well. She was quite insistent that she should stay because she was there first and that there were other courts to play on.

Well, it sounds you just talked to her and then she left on her own. You didn't make her leave. You don't have the authority to do that. They aren't your tennis courts. As long as you didn't threaten her or touch her, then I don't see that you did anything wrong.
ben2974
Posts: 767
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5/2/2015 8:02:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 7:58:04 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:56:27 PM, ben2974 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:48:07 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/2/2015 6:42:16 PM, ben2974 wrote:
Me and 2 of my family members went to the park to play some tennis. At the park there are three tennis courts enclosed by fences. The first one, closest to the entry/exit of the courts, has many cracks. Then there's the court in the middle, and the last one at the end. We always go to this last one for several reasons:

1. It doesn't have any obvious cracks that can have an impact on our play or our safety.
2. Choosing between the far-end one and the middle one, we choose the far-end one because while playing tennis, a fence on our end makes it so that the balls we hit (and miss or hit out of range) don't go too far from us.
3. The far-end court is an all-around superior court to the other two.

It is expressly stated that one cannot do various things on these tennis courts, including: cycling, skateboarding, and rollerblading.

HOWEVER - Assume for this scenario, though, that none of these were explicitly stated to be forbidden.


Today, me and two family members wanted to play tennis in our usual spot (that is, the far-end court) but when we got there there was a teenager skateboarding (around the age of 14). As we began to play, we had to confront the teenager. The teen left and we got to play tennis where we wanted to play tennis.

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

Reasons for him to leave the court we wanted to play on (under the condition that it was never forbidden to skateboard):
1. The tennis courts are tennis courts - their purpose is for tennis (and in this sense are perpetually reserved for those who wish to play tennis).
2. The teen could have skateboarded around the other 2/3 of the tennis courts area, or anywhere else at the park for that matter.
3. The specific court the teenager was on was the best court


Reasons for the teen to stay:
1. The teen was there first!
2. It doesn't say the teen can't skateboard

So, what's the verdict?

If you were skateboarding how would you feel about your actions being done to you.

No big deal. Tennis courts are made for tennis and you can only play tennis on tennis courts. Skateboarding is done virtually anywhere, and there is plenty of space elsewhere in the park to skateboard. If I was skateboarding I would have realized that me trying to keep to my little corner on the tennis courts (rendering said court inoperable) was somewhat selfish and just looking to cause unnecessary tension. Obviously I feel this way because I'm defending my side. Aside from these things, though, I'm a particularly evasive/passive person, so usually i'll submit to things like this. I dislike causing trouble in general.

Well that's your reaction, but how would you feel about being treated the way you treated the skateboarder.

I'm saying that if I were the skateboarder, I'd understand where the tennis player was coming from, get off the court, and continue to skateboard. Nobody likes being told what to do. But if you stay quiet, nothing gets done. Gotta send a message somehow.
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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5/2/2015 8:05:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 8:02:34 PM, ben2974 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:58:04 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:56:27 PM, ben2974 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:48:07 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/2/2015 6:42:16 PM, ben2974 wrote:
Me and 2 of my family members went to the park to play some tennis. At the park there are three tennis courts enclosed by fences. The first one, closest to the entry/exit of the courts, has many cracks. Then there's the court in the middle, and the last one at the end. We always go to this last one for several reasons:

1. It doesn't have any obvious cracks that can have an impact on our play or our safety.
2. Choosing between the far-end one and the middle one, we choose the far-end one because while playing tennis, a fence on our end makes it so that the balls we hit (and miss or hit out of range) don't go too far from us.
3. The far-end court is an all-around superior court to the other two.

It is expressly stated that one cannot do various things on these tennis courts, including: cycling, skateboarding, and rollerblading.

HOWEVER - Assume for this scenario, though, that none of these were explicitly stated to be forbidden.


Today, me and two family members wanted to play tennis in our usual spot (that is, the far-end court) but when we got there there was a teenager skateboarding (around the age of 14). As we began to play, we had to confront the teenager. The teen left and we got to play tennis where we wanted to play tennis.

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

Reasons for him to leave the court we wanted to play on (under the condition that it was never forbidden to skateboard):
1. The tennis courts are tennis courts - their purpose is for tennis (and in this sense are perpetually reserved for those who wish to play tennis).
2. The teen could have skateboarded around the other 2/3 of the tennis courts area, or anywhere else at the park for that matter.
3. The specific court the teenager was on was the best court


Reasons for the teen to stay:
1. The teen was there first!
2. It doesn't say the teen can't skateboard

So, what's the verdict?

If you were skateboarding how would you feel about your actions being done to you.

No big deal. Tennis courts are made for tennis and you can only play tennis on tennis courts. Skateboarding is done virtually anywhere, and there is plenty of space elsewhere in the park to skateboard. If I was skateboarding I would have realized that me trying to keep to my little corner on the tennis courts (rendering said court inoperable) was somewhat selfish and just looking to cause unnecessary tension. Obviously I feel this way because I'm defending my side. Aside from these things, though, I'm a particularly evasive/passive person, so usually i'll submit to things like this. I dislike causing trouble in general.

Well that's your reaction, but how would you feel about being treated the way you treated the skateboarder.

I'm saying that if I were the skateboarder, I'd understand where the tennis player was coming from, get off the court, and continue to skateboard. Nobody likes being told what to do. But if you stay quiet, nothing gets done. Gotta send a message somehow.

I would do the same.
ben2974
Posts: 767
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5/2/2015 8:09:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 7:58:08 PM, Death23 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:50:30 PM, ben2974 wrote:
At 5/2/2015 7:01:28 PM, Death23 wrote:
How did you cause him to leave?

Well I just tried explaining to her (yup, she was a tom boy) using the above reasons. Of course in reality you aren't allowed to skateboard on the courts, which was what she was doing... so that was part of my explanation as well. She was quite insistent that she should stay because she was there first and that there were other courts to play on.

Well, it sounds you just talked to her and then she left on her own. You didn't make her leave. You don't have the authority to do that. They aren't your tennis courts. As long as you didn't threaten her or touch her, then I don't see that you did anything wrong.

They aren't my tennis courts (they are public) but I did want to play tennis. If she had refused to leave, what would I do? The question remains: is she in the right to continue to skateboard on a court I wished to play tennis on?

You have to ask yourself the question: why do people make rules that involve disallowing people to bike, rollerblade, and skateboard?
Death23
Posts: 784
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5/2/2015 8:40:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/2/2015 8:09:28 PM, ben2974 wrote:
They aren't my tennis courts (they are public) but I did want to play tennis. If she had refused to leave, what would I do? The question remains: is she in the right to continue to skateboard on a court I wished to play tennis on?

You have to ask yourself the question: why do people make rules that involve disallowing people to bike, rollerblade, and skateboard?

Ah, well your original question was this:

Am I morally culpable for having the teenager leave the premise so that we could play tennis?

These are new questions.

No, she is not right to skate board. The owner communicated, apparently through signage, that using the court in such a fashion is prohibited. If there was no indication of the owner's will, then I wouldn't see her skateboarding as wrong even if it precluded other people from playing tennis.

I don't see that you would have much recourse if she refused to leave and continued to skateboard, other than to perhaps contact the authorities. Questions about recourse would be legal ones as opposed to a moral ones.

As far as justifying the prohibition against the use of skateboards: The reason for the rule wasn't apparent, and it didn't really matter. The owner's rules should be respected even in the absence of explicit justification. I could imagine a few reasonable justifications (e.g. The owner might be concerned about premises liability had someone gotten hurt while skateboarding or rollerblading; The owner probably wanted to provide people a place to play tennis, and allowing people to use the courts for purposes other than that would frustrate the owner's intent.)