Total Posts:8|Showing Posts:1-8
Jump to topic:

The fourth dimension.

Kryptic
Posts: 30
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.
Ajabi
Posts: 1,504
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 3:26:41 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

The fourth dimension is time in classical relativity, with a 3+1 dimensional ontology.
In Neo-Lorentzian relativity (and some other modern types) the fourth dimension is an additional "objective" space with a 4 dimensional ontology.
Ajabi
Posts: 1,504
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 3:26:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

The fourth dimension is time in classical relativity, with a 3+1 dimensional ontology.
In Neo-Lorentzian relativity (and some other modern types) the fourth dimension is an additional "objective" space with a 4 dimensional ontology.
nac
tejretics
Posts: 6,089
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 8:06:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 3:26:41 AM, Ajabi wrote:
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

The fourth dimension is time in classical relativity, with a 3+1 dimensional ontology.
In Neo-Lorentzian relativity (and some other modern types) the fourth dimension is an additional "objective" space with a 4 dimensional ontology.

I don't think four-dimensional ontologies are specific to LET. Non-LET four-dimensional interpretations exist, where persistence through time is seen as similar to extension through space.[http://en.wikipedia.org...]
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
tarkovsky
Posts: 212
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 9:01:45 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

The space of all continuous real-valued functions of a real variable is infinite dimensional and is bigger than aleph. The shadows are called projection maps and whether or not they exist in the physical world is another story entirely. The mathematics works though just fine.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 1:59:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

Sounds plausible, but such a creature would be from a different dimension that as are we, so I do not see how we would ever be able to see, or perceive this "3D shadow."

As far as "us" being "shadows" of a 4D entity, you are edging perilously close to the whole "Is the Universe Really Just a Giant Hologram?" hypothesis. Which, amazingly, has been given some actual credence by some pretty hefty Cosmologists, like Steve Hawking and Paul Davies.

But why stop at a measly four dimensions? "M-Brane" and "Super Symmetry" Theories posit worlds imbued with as many as !! Dimensions.

All of which usually makes my head hurt after thinking about it for more than five minutes or so. LOL
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Ajabi
Posts: 1,504
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/10/2015 2:03:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 8:06:29 AM, tejretics wrote:
At 7/10/2015 3:26:41 AM, Ajabi wrote:
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

The fourth dimension is time in classical relativity, with a 3+1 dimensional ontology.
In Neo-Lorentzian relativity (and some other modern types) the fourth dimension is an additional "objective" space with a 4 dimensional ontology.

I don't think four-dimensional ontologies are specific to LET. Non-LET four-dimensional interpretations exist, where persistence through time is seen as similar to extension through space.[http://en.wikipedia.org...]

Note the usage of the word "classic" when talking about relativity.
tejretics
Posts: 6,089
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
7/13/2015 11:41:10 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/10/2015 2:03:00 PM, Ajabi wrote:
At 7/10/2015 8:06:29 AM, tejretics wrote:
At 7/10/2015 3:26:41 AM, Ajabi wrote:
At 7/10/2015 2:36:58 AM, Kryptic wrote:
If we are 3d and create a 2d shadow, could there be a creature in the 4th dimension that results in us being a shadow? And so on?
I was watching a video on the fourth dimension and it involved a 4d object that we could not possibly perceive, however there is a 3d 'model' of it, which is classed as the shadow of the 4d model. It is called the Klein bottle.

The fourth dimension is time in classical relativity, with a 3+1 dimensional ontology.
In Neo-Lorentzian relativity (and some other modern types) the fourth dimension is an additional "objective" space with a 4 dimensional ontology.

I don't think four-dimensional ontologies are specific to LET. Non-LET four-dimensional interpretations exist, where persistence through time is seen as similar to extension through space.[https://en.wikipedia.org...]

Note the usage of the word "classic" when talking about relativity.

Agreed. Didn't see that.
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass